XSP-1 Matching DSD DAC / CDPlayer

[mcvt2k1]

I posted this on the other thread.  I guess I'm still searching for the right DAC to match my XSP-1 Gen 2 + XPA 5 Gen 2 setup:


I was also looking for a DSD DAC for my xsp1-xpa5 combo. I thought the UDP-205 was the perfect choice since it has a dlna and universal disc player. But the 205 is around 40% more expensive where I am, so I settled for a used BDP-105. I connected it as such:



laptop(Jriver/spotify) > USB > Oppo105 USB Dac input > xlr balance > xsp-1 > xpa-5 > B&W Speakers



It sounded awful



My current set up sounded WAY better:
Laptop(Jriver/Spotify) > HDMI > Denon AVR > RCA > xsp-1(ht bypass) > xpa-5 > B&W speakers.



Although this connection made the xsp-1 an expensive buffer.



I will try to connect my laptop to the oppo 105 via HDMI and see if it will improve. But this will defeat my intention to use the oppo as a USB DAC.

Anyone here can help suggest a better DSD DAC?
Considerations: Balance XLR Output, DLNA, DSD 128++.  I am looking at the CXN for its balance out and DLNA...plus it has spotify

Thanks!

[Gary Cook]

Feb 15, 2018 0:51:02 GMT -5 mcvt2k1 said:

It sounded awful

"Awful" is a bit too non specific for me to comment, what exactly do you mean by "awful". Personally I don't like the Sabre DAC sound from the Oppo's, but I would never categorise them as sounding "awful". "Not to may taste" maybe but no worse a description than that.

Some prompters (it doesn't have to be flowery, audiophile speak);
Is the sound "distorted"?
Sounds "unnatural", fake, a trumpet sounds like a trombone?
Too fast or too slow?
Too quiet to too loud?
Lacking in sound stage?
Too much treble?
Too much bass?
Too much mid range?
Does it sound OK any volume, low volume = OK, high volume = awful?

Any clues you can give will be worthwhile.

Cheers
Gary

[mcvt2k1]

Hi Gary, thanks for your reply. I didn’t bother explaining too much, cuz it didnt really sound good. It sounded bright and like my spekaers are covered with something.

I tried to connect my laptop directly to the oppo via hdmi. And oppo to xsp-1 via xlr, and it sounded the same

When Its on my hdmi>denon receiver>xsp-1 rca (ht bypass) connection, the sound is just more open, detailed and you can really feel the tightness of the bass.

Its kinda frustrating to hear my surround receiver sound better on stereo than my xsp-1. Maybe its the oppo? I hope im just doing something wrong...

Feb 15, 2018 17:05:05 GMT -5 Gary Cook said:

Feb 15, 2018 0:51:02 GMT -5 mcvt2k1 said:

It sounded awful

"Awful" is a bit too non specific for me to comment, what exactly do you mean by "awful". Personally I don't like the Sabre DAC sound from the Oppo's, but I would never categorise them as sounding "awful". "Not to may taste" maybe but no worse a description than that.

Some prompters (it doesn't have to be flowery, audiophile speak);
Is the sound "distorted"?
Sounds "unnatural", fake, a trumpet sounds like a trombone?
Too fast or too slow?
Too quiet to too loud?
Lacking in sound stage?
Too much treble?
Too much bass?
Too much mid range?
Does it sound OK any volume, low volume = OK, high volume = awful?

Any clues you can give will be worthwhile.

Cheers
Gary

[Gary Cook]

Feb 15, 2018 22:59:16 GMT -5 mcvt2k1 said:

Hi Gary, thanks for your reply. I didn’t bother explaining too much, cuz it didnt really sound good. It sounded bright and like my spekaers are covered with something.
I tried to connect my laptop directly to the oppo via hdmi. And oppo to xsp-1 via xlr, and it sounded the same
When Its on my hdmi>denon receiver>xsp-1 rca (ht bypass) connection, the sound is just more open, detailed and you can really feel the tightness of the bass.
Its kinda frustrating to hear my surround receiver sound better on stereo than my xsp-1. Maybe its the oppo? I hope im just doing something wrong...

Unfortunately this is going to be a basic fault finding exercise, which means trying a number of combinations in an attempt to eliminate the cause. At the moment you have a lot of variables between the two "system" that you are comparing. As a result identifying which one (or more) it is is impossible.
Oppo DAC versus AVR DAC
RCA Cables versus XLR cables
AVR pre amp versus XSP-1 pre amp
Which 1, 2 or all 3 of these is the issue?

Elimination 1 - Does everything via the XSP-1 sound like that or only stuff via the Oppo?


Elimination 2 - Have you got the XSP-1 set up for full range LF and RF (which is how I run mine)? Have you got a sub woofer and where have you got its cross over set at?

That is enough to start off with. Some comfort, I have had too many AVR's to count, some very expensive ones, and none of them come close to an XSP-1. Hang in there.


Cheers
Gary

[mcvt2k1]

Yes, full range. No sub when i do stereo.

Ok, maybe i got carried away when i said awful. Overall, it was kinda muddy, less detailed and i lost a lot of bass on the oppo.

Almost same results on:
laptop>usb>oppo105>RCA or XLR>xsp1>xlr>xpa5
laptop>HDMI>oppo105>RCA or XLR >xsp1>xlr>xpa5

So basically, everything that comes out of the oppo is the same. Except when i play CDs which is far better than USB DAC, DLNA and direct USB HDD.

Does this mean the oppo's DAC is not a good match with xsp-1?

[klinemj]

I don't think the issue is that one of the DAC's "matches" the XSP-1 and the other does. The difference is most likely driven either by a fundamental difference in the DAC's being used or a settings difference within the source.

I have the Oppo 105 and frankly - for 2 channel I don't like its sound. Sounds bright and harsh to me. The 105 uses Sabre chips and while some like the sound, I don't.

Mark

[mcvt2k1]

Feb 16, 2018 4:04:58 GMT -5 klinemj said:

I don't think the issue is that one of the DAC's "matches" the XSP-1 and the other does. The difference is most likely driven either by a fundamental difference in the DAC's being used or a settings difference within the source.

I have the Oppo 105 and frankly - for 2 channel I don't like its sound. Sounds bright and harsh to me. The 105 uses Sabre chips and while some like the sound, I don't.

Mark

Thanks for writing Mark. If i didn’t hear my hdmi>denon avr for comparison, id say it sounded “ok”. So i would conclude that its not a good match... I would now ask for suggestions on DACs from xsp-1 users...

[novisnick]

Feb 16, 2018 4:59:42 GMT -5 mcvt2k1 said:

Feb 16, 2018 4:04:58 GMT -5 klinemj said:

I don't think the issue is that one of the DAC's "matches" the XSP-1 and the other does. The difference is most likely driven either by a fundamental difference in the DAC's being used or a settings difference within the source.

I have the Oppo 105 and frankly - for 2 channel I don't like its sound. Sounds bright and harsh to me. The 105 uses Sabre chips and while some like the sound, I don't.

Mark

Thanks for writing Mark. If i didn’t hear my hdmi>denon avr for comparison, id say it sounded “ok”. So i would conclude that its not a good match... I would now ask for suggestions on DACs from xsp-1 users...

DC-1 an the XSP-1 have always been a winner IMHO!

[brutiarti]

I would try playing a cd using the oppo vs playing a cd in another player connected to the oppo's digital in and check for differences. Also trying a cd in another player connected directly to the preamp. If everything sounds the same, the laptop settings can be at fault. If the oppo CD player sounds good but not the digital in then the oppo settings are off.

[mountain]

I run usb in to the Oppo 105 dac running tidal/Roon and out to the umc-200 (via rca two channel out from Oppo two rca analog in of umc-200).  Sounds great, as good as cd, etc.  No lack of bass, nice mids and highs.  I, unlike some on this thread, like the Oppo 105 Sabre dac’s.  I would closely check settings in computer and audio equipment.

[mcvt2k1]

Feb 16, 2018 9:24:14 GMT -5 mountain said:

I run usb in to the Oppo 105 dac running tidal/Roon and out to the umc-200 (via rca two channel out from Oppo two rca analog in of umc-200).  Sounds great, as good as cd, etc.  No lack of bass, nice mids and highs.  I, unlike some on this thread, like the Oppo 105 Sabre dac’s.  I would closely check settings in computer and audio equipment.

Thanks for writing mountain. I brought my oppo to a friend’s place with the same hardware. With 2 seasonal audiophile ears and got a good feedback. Probably my newbie ears... But i will be the one listening, so...

[mcvt2k1]

Feb 16, 2018 7:22:06 GMT -5 novisnick said:

Feb 16, 2018 4:59:42 GMT -5 mcvt2k1 said:

Thanks for writing Mark. If i didn’t hear my hdmi>denon avr for comparison, id say it sounded “ok”. So i would conclude that its not a good match... I would now ask for suggestions on DACs from xsp-1 users...

DC-1 an the XSP-1 have always been a winner IMHO!

Thanks Nick.  Hopefully they would release a dac with DSD support.