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Post by metaldaze on May 2, 2018 15:28:00 GMT -5
Hi everyone,
Current owner of an XPA-4 Gen 3 being used in my living room for mostly music, but games/movies/TV as well.
I recently moved and was able to find the space for my Ohm Walsh 2's in a separate room. They spec at 4 ohm, 88db recommended amplifier of 125 watts.
I Have a UMC-1 on the way & am now in the market for another power amp. Pricing would be best below $500 but even there I feel its pushing it. So as the subject line reads I'm wondering between the A150, A300 or something from Crown audio. Either the XLS 1002 or XLS 1502. Class AB vs D, more power with the Crown but maybe a more inviting sound with the Emotiva? I have read until my eyes bled for specs on all of these amps, watched Zeo's review of the Crown 1502 amp on his youtube channel and he liked it quite a bit. I'm waffling so some input from those here at the forum is appreciated. Many thanks.
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Post by garbulky on May 2, 2018 15:55:41 GMT -5
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Post by Cory Cooper on May 2, 2018 17:02:35 GMT -5
Hello,
There's a blast from my past. I used to sell tons of Ohm speakers at Tech Hifi back in the day. I actually had a pair of Walsh 2s up until about 10 years ago. I agree with garbulky...the XPA-200 Gen 2 for sale here would be a nice match with the UMC-1 and the Walsh 2s. It will run at 240 watts per channel into 4 ohms.
C
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Post by Jean Genie on May 3, 2018 7:00:39 GMT -5
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Post by davidl81 on May 3, 2018 8:06:01 GMT -5
I also have a XPA-2 Gen2 for sale for $700 shipped to the CONUS. Still has warranty for two more years.
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Post by wiskers on May 3, 2018 11:32:05 GMT -5
Testing a crown XLS1502 and it sound good to me.
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Post by 405x5 on May 3, 2018 13:14:58 GMT -5
Hi everyone, Current owner of an XPA-4 Gen 3 being used in my living room for mostly music, but games/movies/TV as well. I recently moved and was able to find the space for my Ohm Walsh 2's in a separate room. They spec at 4 ohm, 88db recommended amplifier of 125 watts. I Have a UMC-1 on the way & am now in the market for another power amp. Pricing would be best below $500 but even there I feel its pushing it. So as the subject line reads I'm wondering between the A150, A300 or something from Crown audio. Either the XLS 1002 or XLS 1502. Class AB vs D, more power with the Crown but maybe a more inviting sound with the Emotiva? I have read until my eyes bled for specs on all of these amps, watched Zeo's review of the Crown 1502 amp on his youtube channel and he liked it quite a bit. I'm waffling so some input from those here at the forum is appreciated. Many thanks. Either will get the job done. Bill |
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Post by metaldaze on May 3, 2018 18:43:44 GMT -5
Hey thanks for the feedback! Would've responded sooner but work has been kinda crazy the last couple days. I did entertain the idea of an XPA-3 and just using two channels. I saw one for sale but always wary of buying second hand out of warranty. Though I would if i could I think the better half would kill me if I dropped more than several hundred bucks on a second amp =P I appreciate the links though and will look into the xpa-200. TBH I didn't even know this amp existed. Emotiva has only been on my radar for the last few years. The specs look promising and the price is right so here's hoping!
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Post by metaldaze on May 3, 2018 18:47:19 GMT -5
Hello, There's a blast from my past. I used to sell tons of Ohm speakers at Tech Hifi back in the day. I actually had a pair of Walsh 2s up until about 10 years ago. I agree with garbulky...the XPA-200 Gen 2 for sale here would be a nice match with the UMC-1 and the Walsh 2s. It will run at 240 watts per channel into 4 ohms. C My dad had them and still does which is what got me hooked. Here's a link to my setup before I moved. The walsh's are in this picture but what isn't shown are the stacked C2's in parallel on the rear. That's where the XPA-4 comes in  http://instagram.com/p/Bgoev8ug1EB |
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Post by leonski on May 4, 2018 1:37:43 GMT -5
Does running the OHMs up against the rack interfere with them at all? I'd experiment with ridding myself of the big boxes, whatever THEY are and move the OHMs further apart........  |
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Post by metaldaze on May 4, 2018 9:46:28 GMT -5
Does running the OHMs up against the rack interfere with them at all? I'd experiment with ridding myself of the big boxes, whatever THEY are and move the OHMs further apart...... I don't run them where they sit or sat in that photo. I've since moved, but in that set up I would pull the Walsh's out so they can "see" one another. Run them about 14'' from the back wall and 6 feet apart creating a triangle between the speakers and the listening position. Leaving them insitu (I've tried when feeling lazy) blurs the imaging and doesn't allow them the dispersion they can achieve with the semi omni-directional design. I also never ran them simultaneously with the other speakers. It was always exclusive two channel listening with those. I particularly like listening to Haley Reinhart from Post Modern Jukebox on them. Her voice is amazing and the Walsh 2's make it as though she's in the room. As far as the "big boxes" are concerned- are you referring to my Ohm H's? Every speaker I own is Ohm Acoustics. Those are my mains & yeah.. they're not going anywhere. Ever. I looked far and wide for a long time and finally found a pair that were factory upgraded. The sounds from the same company (Conventional vs Omni to Semi-Omnidirectional) are different but I have always preferred the conventional speakers- for now. Once I upgrade the Walsh's to the 2.2000 I'm sure they'll see more use than they do now. Don't let the appearance of the speaker fool you into thinking that -because it's a box, it sounds like a box. That couldn't be further from the truth. Ohm has always been a company that employs science into their designs, even these vintage speakers (with updated Ohm drivers). Their dispersion and sound stage is incredible and the frequency range is impressive. 32Hz-20,000Hz but mind you that 32Hz is coming from an acoustic suspension speaker! Yes is has a 12'' passive radiator but its presentation is so clean yet authoritative. If you can't tell by now I'm sort of infatuated with them which does make me bias. Suffice to say if you ever heard them (also being run by an XPA-4 Gen 3) you'd be surprised & impressed. |
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Post by leonski on May 4, 2018 13:18:07 GMT -5
My ONLY experience is with the orignal OHM F back in the late 70s. It is STILL unlike any speaker ever made, regardless of advertising or adverts. The 'driver' was NOT operated in 'piston' mode but instead 'waves' traveled down it and radiated outward in a 360 degree pattern. Well, maybe MBL would be similar, but the PRICE is off-scale www.ecoustics.com/reviews/mbl-101-x-treme-omnidirectional-floorstanding/They DID sound real good, but by the time I heard them, I couldn't afford them! I wish the boxes were symetrical Left and Right. Enjoy: |
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Post by metaldaze on May 4, 2018 14:00:13 GMT -5
My ONLY experience is with the orignal OHM F back in the late 70s. It is STILL unlike any speaker ever made, regardless of advertising or adverts. The 'driver' was NOT operated in 'piston' mode but instead 'waves' traveled down it and radiated outward in a 360 degree pattern. Well, maybe MBL would be similar, but the PRICE is off-scale www.ecoustics.com/reviews/mbl-101-x-treme-omnidirectional-floorstanding/They DID sound real good, but by the time I heard them, I couldn't afford them! I wish the boxes were symetrical Left and Right. Enjoy: Indeed they did, I have not had an opportunity to hear an original pair of F's or A's but I did hear the new 5000's at their location in Brooklyn. In a word they were - Awesome. Ran off a modest NAD preamp/amp set up and the sound was just a warm blanket of amazing. Since then or so I believe the Walsh 2 was their first implementation of the 'semi-omnidirectional' style where the super tweeter added to the top of the inverted driver, which propagates the sound waves as you said down the side of the cone outward in a 360 degree fashion. Such a cool design from an engineering perspective and successful to boot. This helped with the particularities accompanied by the fully omnidirectional driver, and of course increased marketing availability to the average consumer. Hence my plan to update the 2's with Ohm's latest driver for that size cabinet. I became aware of MBL and immediately ran away once I saw the price. There's a cool how its made on youtube though featuring their speakers and its understandable why the price is where it is, materials, labor, niche market and all. Ohm is very down to Earth and very easy to approach. I love them. Their speakers & the company are wonderful and they consistently win Best In show for price at the NY audio show. The fact that they still take trades, upgrade and service their speakers from 30+ years ago says it all by itself. The only speakers they no longer service are the F's & A's. However I do believe they'll still take them in for trade or up to 25% towards a new model or updated conventional. |
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Post by metaldaze on May 22, 2018 23:06:08 GMT -5
Just updating the thread now that equipment has come in - I was able to locate a UPA-2 in excellent shape inside & out for a fair price. It matches with the UMC-1 nicely.
Once I got the settings correct and where I wanted on the pre-amp the Walsh's just get better and better as more power goes to them. I'm always surprised at their party piece which is making it seem as though the artist you're hearing is in the room. Vocal reproduction is so life like, its really unlike anything else I've heard. It's late now so I've called it a night but more fine tuning to come.
I do have a question though for some of you who may know & I have yet to look it up -> The UPA-2 has a gain knob on the back. What level should this be set to? My XPA Gen 3 is fixed at 29db, So Is all the way clockwise 32db and all the way counter clockwise 29db? It was set all the way to the right (clockwise) when it arrived and that's how I left it during the on screen set up for the pre-amp & listening. Thanks!
Cheers, Ian
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Post by cheapthryl on May 23, 2018 19:41:54 GMT -5
You can leave it all the way right or adjust it for the volume control on your pre/pro. It will go all the way to 0 fully left. The UPA 2 is a favorite SS amp of mine. I have 2 (right behind my RPA-1). Sounds great with every speaker I have connected to it including my Ohm Walsh 2. That will be a very nice combination. You should get plenty of enjoyment.
I also ran the Ohm's with Sherbourne and crown. (next will be a couple outlaw mono's). The only amp that I really didn't like hooked to the Ohm's was my Glow Amp 1 tube amp. Those 2 did not get along to my ears.
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Post by metaldaze on May 24, 2018 14:37:24 GMT -5
You can leave it all the way right or adjust it for the volume control on your pre/pro. It will go all the way to 0 fully left. The UPA 2 is a favorite SS amp of mine. I have 2 (right behind my RPA-1). Sounds great with every speaker I have connected to it including my Ohm Walsh 2. That will be a very nice combination. You should get plenty of enjoyment. I also ran the Ohm's with Sherbourne and crown. (next will be a couple outlaw mono's). The only amp that I really didn't like hooked to the Ohm's was my Glow Amp 1 tube amp. Those 2 did not get along to my ears. Good deal. Thank you for the input. It sounds good all the way up so I'll keep it there  It's always cool to find other Ohm Acoustics owners - especially when the amplification brand & model speaker is the same too! This is my first toroid amp from Emotiva. It's the same depth as my XPA but much thinner, however as soon as I picked it up & got a look inside through the vents I was impressed. I've seen pictures but holding it is different. I agree that the X line has more 'robust' build quality but seriously, for a two channel amp (in my application) this thing is a little tank. I'm interested to see how the Walsh's respond (If noticeably better or not) with mono's. They really soak up the juice for only being a 6.5''? driver. I have them on full range now with the attenuate adjustment on normal for both channels. Do you run yours with a sub? I'm Thinking that's my next move. Making it 2.1 with a sealed 10 or 12 inch driver. That's probably the cheaper route as opposed to upgrading them from the factory. I would love to & it's definitely more cost effective then buying the 2000's brand new, but I don't have $1400 just laying around either  As for the tubes- yeah I've read that they aren't the best choice for them. I think it's because there just isn't enough power to get them to really open up even though they're rated at 88db. & high power tubes are $$$$. If I had the option I would like to try Mcintosh Mono tubes like the MC 275 just to see if there's enough headroom. Maybe one day.. when I win lotto haha |
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Post by leonski on May 24, 2018 17:21:01 GMT -5
2 things:
Speakers are almolst ALL horrible things. Rarely more than 2% efficient, and frequently below 1%. That means that 98% PLUS of power applied turns into heat or is wasted due to power factor.
The other thing is kind of a side note. The 'adjustaible' gain would be of use to MATCH amps in a multi amp, biamp or surround situation where no other means existed to make 'levels' match between amps.
Magnepans, which are among the lowest 'efficiency' (really, sensitivity) speakers you can get are VERY tube friendly. Why? Because they are NOT a wacky load. They look mostly like a resistor to the partnering amp as opposed to
either an inductor (basically a coil of wire) or a Capacitor. That is a measure of 'reactance'. If OHM is reactive enough, it'll be difficult to find a tube amp which will work well, along with huge swings in impedance can cause frequency 'shifts'.
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Post by cheapthryl on May 24, 2018 17:57:07 GMT -5
I have a few tube amps. The glow is 5 watts per channel. I don't think power was the issue, the speakers had a very weird sound signature when run from the tube amp. They sound really good on SS amps. I found I really didn't need a sub with them. I think I paid $80 for them at an antique store. Goods worth price paid.
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Post by leonski on May 24, 2018 19:24:19 GMT -5
Weird frequency response is probably due to large impedance swings which react to the relatively HIGH output impedance of a tube amp. Think of high damping factor Vs LOW. Kind of a 'thick' article, but the essentials are there. www.transcendentsound.com/Amplifier_Output_Impedance.htmlQuite some time ago, speakers changed in a fundamental way. Small, insensitive box speakers, the dawn of 'acoustic suspension' took the place of the huge ported stuff. Amplifier watts became much less expensive and more available. Low output SS became the norm. A speaker best for a lot of SS power or with huge impedance and reactance swings will generally NOT be best on even the most robust TUBE amp. |
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Post by metaldaze on May 24, 2018 23:05:38 GMT -5
I know the published impedance of the Walsh's is 4ohm. Probably less than that at certain frequencies as you said, which coupled with the low efficiency will eat the power. Heck even their conventional speakers are rated nominally right on the front as IEEE 8/6 8/4. It depends on what position the treble adjustment attenuator is in for the high & low tweeter (0db, -3db, -6db). I've never had experience with maggies so I had assumed since I've heard they were difficult for some amps- that the impedance was low. But if its a steady 6 or 8ohm across it's frequency range then I can see how a tube amp wouldn't be strained driving that. Just need a few good clean watts to bring them up to snuff since the sensitivity is so low.
Also $80 for a clean pair of original Walsh 2's is a steal! Good find.
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It's always cool to find other Ohm Acoustics owners - especially when the amplification brand & model speaker is the same too! This is my first toroid amp from Emotiva. It's the same depth as my XPA but much thinner, however as soon as I picked it up & got a look inside through the vents I was impressed. I've seen pictures but holding it is different. I agree that the X line has more 'robust' build quality but seriously, for a two channel amp (in my application) this thing is a little tank. I'm interested to see how the Walsh's respond (If noticeably better or not) with mono's. They really soak up the juice for only being a 6.5''? driver. I have them on full range now with the attenuate adjustment on normal for both channels. Do you run yours with a sub? I'm Thinking that's my next move. Making it 2.1 with a sealed 10 or 12 inch driver. That's probably the cheaper route as opposed to upgrading them from the factory. I would love to & it's definitely more cost effective then buying the 2000's brand new, but I don't have $1400 just laying around either 
