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Post by kauai82 on Jun 12, 2018 18:07:11 GMT -5
I am coming to the end of my audio system upgrade. Since I have combined my office and media room audio/video system I have sold a lot of redundant equipment just keeping the best of each type of equipment. I am now (see signature) mainly an Emotiva based audio system for two channel. I had a tough decision on which turntable to sell of the two. I decided to keep the Music Hall 5.0 MMF with an Ortofon Blue 2m Moving Magnet cartridge. I had zeroed in on a very nice priced Pro-ject 2 expression with a Beatle Limited edition (which I could care less about ) that had a damaged box for $760. Normal retail on this particular model is $1299. However my Windows 10 laptop took a dump and I decided to get a Mac mini for $600 taking away the funds for the turntable.
I like the sound of the Ortofon Blue but I think that I can do better SQ wise. I have always used MM cartridges in my turntables. I have been in this audio hobby for almost 50 years and I have always had a turntable in my systems. I must admit that during the Cd dominate years that the LP's did not get played that often. However, although I did cut down my LP collection from over 2000 down to the current 1200 I still love listening to LP's.
Since I now have limited funds I am wondering if a MC phono cartridge would upgrade the SQ of my Music Hall 5.0 ? I see a lot of people like the Denon DL103 discontinued phono cartridge that I can get for $229 on Amazon. The new model DL103r runs $379. Does anyone know if the new one is that much better than the original ? I am open to getting other models but my budget is limited to about $450 at the most.
In general terms what would I be gaining going to a MC cartridge over my current MM one ? Thanks in advance for your input. Matthew
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Post by adaboy on Jun 12, 2018 19:39:14 GMT -5
I am coming to the end of my audio system upgrade. Since I have combined my office and media room audio/video system I have sold a lot of redundant equipment just keeping the best of each type of equipment. I am now (see signature) mainly an Emotiva based audio system for two channel. I had a tough decision on which turntable to sell of the two. I decided to keep the Music Hall 5.0 MMF with an Ortofon Blue 2m Moving Magnet cartridge. I had zeroed in on a very nice priced Pro-ject 2 expression with a Beatle Limited edition (which I could care less about ) that had a damaged box for $760. Normal retail on this particular model is $1299. However my Windows 10 laptop took a dump and I decided to get a Mac mini for $600 taking away the funds for the turntable. I like the sound of the Ortofon Blue but I think that I can do better SQ wise. I have always used MM cartridges in my turntables. I have been in this audio hobby for almost 50 years and I have always had a turntable in my systems. I must admit that during the Cd dominate years that the LP's did not get played that often. However, although I did cut down my LP collection from over 2000 down to the current 1200 I still love listening to LP's. Since I now have limited funds I am wondering if a MC phono cartridge would upgrade the SQ of my Music Hall 5.0 ? I see a lot of people like the Denon DL103 discontinued phono cartridge that I can get for $229 on Amazon. The new model DL103r runs $379. Does anyone know if the new one is that much better than the original ? I am open to getting other models but my budget is limited to about $450 at the most. In general terms what would I be gaining going to a MC cartridge over my current MM one ? Thanks in advance for your input. Matthew If you want to dip your toes into MC, give the Hana EL a shot very nice and within your budget. |
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klinemj
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Post by klinemj on Jun 12, 2018 21:05:50 GMT -5
I've had MC's for years...first a high output MC then a low output. I had various MM's before that. My Dynavector 10x3 was a big jump up from the Ortofon MMs of the day, and I still love the Denon Low Output MC I bought over 33 years ago. I can't compare the ones you mention, though.
Mark
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Post by AudioHTIT on Jun 13, 2018 7:27:54 GMT -5
At some point ‘upgrade’ becomes preference. You’ve had some good cartridges, and if you listen to a lot of vinyl then they are an extremely significant part of the sound. One of the advantages of moving coils is the lower mass of moving a coil as opposed to a magnet, which might result in better tracking, transients, and overall fidelity. I think the best phono systems I’ve heard have had MCs, but they can be fussy since (the low output ones) require the introduction of another gain stage or transformer (does anyone use those any more?) The Grado Sonata I’m currently using confuses things further by being a moving iron design. Which is to say that they can all sound good. Like klinemj I used to love the Denon 103, I think mine was a ‘D’, but I also loved the Fidelity Research and Supex before it. Sorry, not helping, other than say Moving Coils can sound really great, I might consider another when I finish my current project, but it’s been a while since I’ve had one. Reading reviews and paying attention to the tonearm used would be the best advice I could offer, not all cartridges will sound great with all tonearms. |
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Post by mgbpuff on Jun 13, 2018 8:04:38 GMT -5
I have only had mm type cartridges, but if I went mc, I would consider the Zu cartridge, which is based on the Denon 103.
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Post by qdtjni on Jun 13, 2018 8:24:35 GMT -5
The DL103R is a bit different than the original DL103 and IMHO it sounds better. Both have a good price/performance ratio. The DL103 is a good start into the amazing world of MC and should work well with your Music Hall 5.0 MMF.  Most of the Ortofon MCs will also work well, should you decide to upgrade. What phono preamp will you use? BTW, you can upgrade your 2M Blue to Black by replacing the needle. |
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Post by kauai82 on Jun 13, 2018 14:09:58 GMT -5
Thanks for the info. I will look into upgrading the Blue to the black. I think that it might not be in the budget. Matthew
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Post by adaboy on Jun 13, 2018 15:12:36 GMT -5
The DL103R is a bit different than the original DL103 and IMHO it sounds better. Both have a good price/performance ratio. The DL103 is a good start into the amazing world of MC and should work well with your Music Hall 5.0 MMF. Most of the Ortofon MCs will also work well, should you decide to upgrade. What phono preamp will you use? BTW, you can upgrade your 2M Blue to Black by replacing the needle. You are brilliant, however I'd highly recommend the the op get the cartridge body for the bronze and the black vs just upgrading the stylus. The bronze and black both have upgraded silver wire in which the red and the blue don't share. Id hate for him to get a shibata stylus and not get all of the benefits. Anyway you are a nice fella and look forward to hearing from you boss thank you thank sir. |
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Post by kauai82 on Jun 14, 2018 13:50:54 GMT -5
I am now looking into a Ortofon Bronze , but the $229 Denon DL103 sure is tempting. Will decided in next couple of weeks. Matthew
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Post by thrillcat on Jun 14, 2018 14:45:17 GMT -5
If you want to dip your toes into MC, give the Hana EL a shot very nice and within your budget. This is my next purchase. Had it in a cart for weeks now, after hearing it on a friend's system. |
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Post by adaboy on Jun 14, 2018 17:34:53 GMT -5
If you want to dip your toes into MC, give the Hana EL a shot very nice and within your budget. This is my next purchase. Had it in a cart for weeks now, after hearing it on a friend's system. I've heard great things about it, even that it is superior to my Quintet Blue. It is my next cartridge. What were your thoughts after hearing it yourself? |
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Post by thrillcat on Jun 14, 2018 20:37:11 GMT -5
This is my next purchase. Had it in a cart for weeks now, after hearing it on a friend's system. I've heard great things about it, even that it is superior to my Quintet Blue. It is my next cartridge. What were your thoughts after hearing it yourself? I'm currently using a ProJect RM1.3 with the Sumiko Pearl that comes with it. About a month and a half ago I took my table to a friend's place, who has the Hana. Setup was a Parasound phono pre into an XMC-1, one of the Emo power amps, and the speakers were Tritons with an SVS sub. The difference between the two just opened things up. Similar to the difference between going from a Dolby Digital track to a Dolby TrueHD. More depth, smoother. Honestly the best I've heard vinyl sound. |
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Post by geeqner on Jun 15, 2018 0:18:01 GMT -5
I really don’t know how much of a difference would be noticed when going from one type of high quality cartridge to another, but it seems that most of the High-End product emphasis is going to MC these days...
If I WERE considering dipping my toes into the MC world - I have heard several good reports of experience with units from Sumiko and Dynavector. I used to be quite active on “The Vinyl Engine” website, and comparing notes on our favorite cartridges was often a favorite topic. One member there, who went by Blue Angel, out of South Africa, made his own MCCs. If you are SERIOUS about taking this particular plunge - you might want to pose your question / ask for guidance there. That forum has a GREAT bunch of Vinyl Geeks at all different levels.
At the upper end of your budget would be the Blue Point Series, from Sumiko, which seems to get pretty decent reviews.
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Post by Priapulus on Jun 15, 2018 8:15:50 GMT -5
There is a wonderful joy in buying new things. Buy it, if you want it; it's good for the economy.
However, given the quality of well-made things these days, if you can hear an audible difference between two items of similar price and providence, one of them is likely defective. And given the law of diminishing returns, you will have to spend a lot, to get a little...
Sincerely
/blair
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