DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Aug 23, 2018 12:59:25 GMT -5
In general, you want the three front speakers to be as closely matched as possible. If you can use three identical speakers that is the best match you can attain. A horizontal MTM center channel is a compromise design for HTs that do not use an acoustically transparent screen.
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Post by novisnick on Aug 23, 2018 13:18:57 GMT -5
In general, you want the three front speakers to be as closely matched as possible. If you can use three identical speakers that is the best match you can attain. A horizontal MTM center channel is a compromise design for HTs that do not use an acoustically transparent screen. There is always an exception to your statement Dave. I give you the Paradigm CC-690. It is a tower reconfigured to optimize center channel music and HT audio.  screen shot in windows |
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DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Aug 23, 2018 13:32:24 GMT -5
It's a horizontal MTM designed for use under a screen, which is exactly what I am talking about. It may be "matched" to their tower speakers but it will never sound exactly the same. For best results, I reiterate that three identical speakers should be used for L-C-R. Anything else is not necessarily bad (I use a horizontal MTM) but it is a compromise.
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Post by emofrmcgy on Aug 23, 2018 13:43:19 GMT -5
In general, you want the three front speakers to be as closely matched as possible. If you can use three identical speakers that is the best match you can attain. A horizontal MTM center channel is a compromise design for HTs that do not use an acoustically transparent screen. There is always an exception to your statement Dave. I give you the Paradigm CC-690. It is a tower reconfigured to optimize center channel music and HT audio. [/url] [/quote][ Some light reading Nick. www.audioholics.com/loudspeaker-design/vertical-vs-horizontal-speaker-designs |
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Post by novisnick on Aug 23, 2018 13:49:28 GMT -5
It's a horizontal MTM designed for use under a screen, which is exactly what I am talking about. It may be "matched" to their tower speakers but it will never sound exactly the same. For best results, I reiterate that three identical speakers should be used for L-C-R. Anything else is not necessarily bad (I use a horizontal MTM) but it is a compromise. OP, I apologize for taking your thread sideways. Dave, I respect your opinion and even agree that for music and concerts an identical tower would be optimal, but for HT a horizontal MTM and engineered center channel optimized for speech and dialogue is best. Behind a screen an horizontal will distribute sound more evenly as well IMHO. 🎼🎼🎼 |
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Post by novisnick on Aug 23, 2018 13:53:22 GMT -5
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Post by rossandwendy on Aug 23, 2018 14:51:17 GMT -5
I agree with Chad and others... since they will be behind a screen, I would go with 3 identical speakers and not use a horizontal orientation for the center. My plan is to build a new enclosure for my current center speaker, check my forum avatar, so all three mains are identical (see below) as we will have a dedicated room when we move into out new home. Will I add a third sub as a "stand" for the center channel... time will tell.  I appreciate all the feedback everyone. I have not been on this forum for quite some time (registered in 2009) and it is a friendly place compared to what often happens at AVS. So as an update, this whole process of trying to find the right seating location and speaker placement that sounds best, along with trying to mesh that with the viewing distance, angle, and screen size that works best for my vision, is getting quite complicated. This is my 12th year of setting up about 5 home theaters in various places we lived (not construction, just using an existing room) and it's actually getting harder because I have grown more particular about things. The 144" wide Constant Image Are screen size that I want to go with is dictating where I would need to sit, and when I add on 3 feet to create room for front stage behind screen it pushes me too far back into the room where the speakers don't sound as good (room reflections, and/or bass nulls, vs. being more near-field to speakers which I prefer). I have tested smaller screen and closer viewing distance to so that I'm not having seating pushed so far back from speakers, but honestly my eyes really struggle to focus comfortably below 13', and also the 144" image size is pure magic for me that smaller sizes are not producing (even with sitting closer to keep angle of view the same). Further, after 3 weeks of testing with 4 different brands of speakers, I mostly prefer the sound of a phantom center - it produces a bigger, more open sound for my tastes (despite all the known issues stated for doing phantom) that best fits the big 12-foot image. A single center placed between the mains behind a screen (don't have that AT screen yet but am testing that exact placement while projecting on the wall behind) is more localizable then I wish - meaning I can easily tell the sound is coming from that speaker as a point source, and that is not as convincing to my ear/brain combo on a 12-foot wide image, compared to running phantom center. Sounds that to my ears are obviously emanating from a speaker take me out of the illusion of those sounds coming naturally from the characters and events. Not only am I preferring the sound of a phantom center, but if I eliminate the center channel speaker then I no longer have to use an AT screen with extra space for stage behind it so no longer have to push my seating too far back into the room, plus I enjoy the wider soundstage with L/R speakers placed next to the screen rather than behind. As far as the Emotiva T1's, my initial impression is that they are VERY transparent, with a sense of natural sound coming from a 'black' background of silence (if that makes any sense, hard for me to describe). They are leaner in the bass then what I have been used to (I have Emp Tek towers and center/surround, and sometimes revert to my old Onix Rocket RS850 huge towers and Bigfoot center which I still enjoy, and also tested last week my Elac B6's). I just received an NAD receiver with Dirac Live and next step is to get that set up and calibrated and then see how it all sounds. I will try once again the setup of front stage with 3 T1's behind where AT screen would be, and compare it again to phantom. And apologies for rambling on so much! Cheers, Ross |
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Post by emofrmcgy on Aug 23, 2018 15:17:09 GMT -5
[/url] [/quote][ Some light reading Nick. www.audioholics.com/loudspeaker-design/vertical-vs-horizontal-speaker-designs[/quote]ccChris like myself and others has an opinion, one in which I don’t agree. And now theres that. LOL[/quote] Sadly its not opinion nick. But then again physics don’t exist in the world of audiophiles..... so there’s that too. Oh and btw... if I said my personal thoughts on Mr.seymour I’d be shown the door so.... yeah. |
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DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Aug 23, 2018 16:10:57 GMT -5
It's a horizontal MTM designed for use under a screen, which is exactly what I am talking about. It may be "matched" to their tower speakers but it will never sound exactly the same. For best results, I reiterate that three identical speakers should be used for L-C-R. Anything else is not necessarily bad (I use a horizontal MTM) but it is a compromise. OP, I apologize for taking your thread sideways. Dave, I respect your opinion and even agree that for music and concerts an identical tower would be optimal, but for HT a horizontal MTM and engineered center channel optimized for speech and dialogue is best. Behind a screen an horizontal will distribute sound more evenly as well IMHO. 🎼🎼🎼 That is just not the case. And I say that as a certified THX cinema designer.  |
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Post by novisnick on Aug 23, 2018 17:30:46 GMT -5
OP, I apologize for taking your thread sideways. Dave, I respect your opinion and even agree that for music and concerts an identical tower would be optimal, but for HT a horizontal MTM and engineered center channel optimized for speech and dialogue is best. Behind a screen an horizontal will distribute sound more evenly as well IMHO. 🎼🎼🎼 That is just not the case. And I say that as a certified THX cinema designer. Love to get to know what you’ve forgotten! See my new thread. Thank you to the OP, rossandwendy , your tolerance has been generous.! 👍🎶🎶🎶🎶 |
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Post by rossandwendy on Aug 23, 2018 17:37:26 GMT -5
In general, you want the three front speakers to be as closely matched as possible. If you can use three identical speakers that is the best match you can attain. A horizontal MTM center channel is a compromise design for HTs that do not use an acoustically transparent screen. I've frequently read exactly this advice and have longed to try it, but with using a projector and not having an AT screen for the last decade I've had to resort to a variety of models of horizontal center speakers below my screen. A few weeks ago I finally got fed up with the disconnect from voices not emanating from screen level and decided to experiment with a complete rearrangement of my basement to see if I could accommodate an AT screen (and also larger than what I have been using) plus the required space behind for L/C/R. I just finished another trial run with an experimental setup of the three T1's up front, but this time I kept the L and R just outside the screen area to keep the wider stage width I enjoy, and the T1 as center behind screen area. Recalibrated with Audyssey XT32 and watched scenes from a few discs I'm well acquainted with, and it is by far the most seamless front stage I've ever had. Looking forward to trying Dirac Live next as I have read many folks getting even better results with it compared to Audyssey. Cheers, Ross |
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bink
Seeker Of Truth
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Post by bink on Jan 9, 2021 11:53:21 GMT -5
Thanks everyone for the responses. I have read of the SQ issues with horizontal centers, and recommendations to go with 3 identical (normal, vertically oriented) speakers whenever possible, but the raves for the C2 had me wondering. I did confirm with Emotiva that they will sell a single. I am still pondering whether or not I need T2's, but I have 3 T1's arriving today to test out. Cheers, Ross They will sell you a single? I chatted with Nick and he told me they would not split up the T Zeros... |
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