Klipschorns or 3.7i’s

[pallpoul]

For my La Scala's II, I use a set of tube mono's by Dennis Had with the matching tube pre. They can get plenty loud, but the sound is amazing and clear at any level.

[novisnick]

Apr 23, 2019 22:25:30 GMT -5 pallpoul said:

For my La Scala's II, I use a set of tube mono's by Dennis Had with the matching tube pre. They can get plenty loud, but the sound is amazing and clear at any level.

Audio Porn! At its best! 😲

thanks for the pics!

[widespreadpanic]

So I found an ad on Craigslist in Minneapolis for a pair of 3.7’s for $3200. The guy is 15 minutes away from Magnepan and he is going to drop them off and I’m having the “i” upgrade done and then having them shipped from Magnepan. I’m so excited and can’t wait!

[bootman]

Your room will determine which will sound best.

The horns will go in the corners while the Maggies need room to breathe.

[badsarge]

Bootman,
Uh,....love the decor...the Maggies really stand out.Do they still sell carpet in that shade?

[badsarge]

Creimes,

"I really want to try these one day

www.tektondesign.com/double-impact.html

??"

I've had the Double Impacts about two years. Love them. Before you invest, I would suggest building a mock up to appreciate their dimensions.

In black, they do tend to dominate the space.

Wish my room was a little bigger to allow them to breathe a bit more.

The XPA-5 drives them sufficiently that the neighbors are well aware when I'm rockin' the house.

Just sayin'.

[bootman]

May 2, 2019 7:08:41 GMT -5 badsarge said:

Bootman,
Uh,....love the decor...the Maggies really stand out.Do they still sell carpet in that shade?

Got something against fuchsia?

I wish those Maggies were mine though.

[Boomzilla]

Maggies, Thiel's, and Klipsch - Oh My!



Do what any self-respecting audiophiliac would do - get them ALL!

LOL

[KeithL]

OK.... we're talking PERSONAL PREFERENCES here.

For my tastes, Magneplanars all sound very open and airy; however, to me, they sound a bit too open and airy.

Music sounds like "it's coming from the air in front of you" - but it DOESN'T sound like it's coming from a singer or instrument sitting right there in front of you.

I have never yet heard a set of Magneplanars set up in such a way that they present a concise, solid, pinpoint image.

(They are also extremely fussy about room placement and room acoustics - and can sound really bad if not set up just so.)

Also, for my tastes, I really dislike Klipsch horns (including the original Klipschhorns themselves).

I've heard them sound pretty good playing... well... horns...

And they most certainly are incredibly efficient... and very dynamic...

But, to me, they always sound unnatural and "honky" or "shouty" with voice and harsh with lots of things - especially when turned up loud.

(I've never heard natural sounding female vocals come from a Klipschhorn.)

And, since I listen mostly to vocals, to me that is a deal breaker.

(And, yes, the big horns also need a really big room to work well at all.)

(I didn't like the original Heresy's when they were current either - at all - so I doubt I'd like the new ones much better.)

Klipsch's newer models of speakers sound far more normal... but I still don't rate them anywhere near my top picks.

Apr 23, 2019 21:21:28 GMT -5 DavidR said:

Wow, you probably couldn't pick two more different styles of speakers.

I haven't heard Maggies but have heard Martin-Logan. Step an inch off center and you lose it. Thin sounding (no pun intended).

I haven't heard the Horns but did buy my son a pair of original Heresys for his first stereo system. Very easy to drive, nice bass but not very deep. Nice sounding and accurate at low volumes. The horns were too harsh for my ears with volume.

It's all about what it sounds like to you.

[ttocs]

So, maybe something like this??

[pedrocols]

May 3, 2019 9:07:33 GMT -5 KeithL said:

OK.... we're talking PERSONAL PREFERENCES here.

For my tastes, Magneplanars all sound very open and airy; however, to me, they sound a bit too open and airy.

Music sounds like "it's coming from the air in front of you" - but it DOESN'T sound like it's coming from a singer or instrument sitting right there in front of you.

I have never yet heard a set of Magneplanars set up in such a way that they present a concise, solid, pinpoint image.

(They are also extremely fussy about room placement and room acoustics - and can sound really bad if not set up just so.)

Also, for my tastes, I really dislike Klipsch horns (including the original Klipschhorns themselves).

I've heard them sound pretty good playing... well... horns...

And they most certainly are incredibly efficient... and very dynamic...

But, to me, they always sound unnatural and "honky" or "shouty" with voice and harsh with lots of things - especially when turned up loud.

(I've never heard natural sounding female vocals come from a Klipschhorn.)

And, since I listen mostly to vocals, to me that is a deal breaker.

(And, yes, the big horns also need a really big room to work well at all.)

(I didn't like the original Heresy's when they were current either - at all - so I doubt I'd like the new ones much better.)

Klipsch's newer models of speakers sound far more normal... but I still don't rate them anywhere near my top picks.

Apr 23, 2019 21:21:28 GMT -5 DavidR said:

Wow, you probably couldn't pick two more different styles of speakers.

I haven't heard Maggies but have heard Martin-Logan. Step an inch off center and you lose it. Thin sounding (no pun intended).

I haven't heard the Horns but did buy my son a pair of original Heresys for his first stereo system. Very easy to drive, nice bass but not very deep. Nice sounding and accurate at low volumes. The horns were too harsh for my ears with volume.

It's all about what it sounds like to you.

So based on your assessment on Magnepan speakers I can assume you don't like headphones.

[tropicallutefisk]

I've listened to a lot of speakers over the years and there are a handful I really like. However, only Magnepans were in my price range for the sound quality I wanted. I love Wilsons, but I don't think they have a model I like as much as my maggies till you spend north of $10K. Same can be said of another fave of mine, Focal. I would never expect any single speaker to be loved and chosen by everyone. I believe choosing a speaker is about the most personal and subjective choice of all hifi components. So... to each their own and I never take offense to people preferring brands and models that differ from my tastes.

[tchaik]

May 3, 2019 9:07:33 GMT -5 KeithL said:

OK.... we're talking PERSONAL PREFERENCES here.

For my tastes, Magneplanars all sound very open and airy; however, to me, they sound a bit too open and airy.

Music sounds like "it's coming from the air in front of you" - but it DOESN'T sound like it's coming from a singer or instrument sitting right there in front of you.

I have never yet heard a set of Magneplanars set up in such a way that they present a concise, solid, pinpoint image.

(They are also extremely fussy about room placement and room acoustics - and can sound really bad if not set up just so.)

Also, for my tastes, I really dislike Klipsch horns (including the original Klipschhorns themselves).

I've heard them sound pretty good playing... well... horns...

And they most certainly are incredibly efficient... and very dynamic...

But, to me, they always sound unnatural and "honky" or "shouty" with voice and harsh with lots of things - especially when turned up loud.

(I've never heard natural sounding female vocals come from a Klipschhorn.)

And, since I listen mostly to vocals, to me that is a deal breaker.

(And, yes, the big horns also need a really big room to work well at all.)

(I didn't like the original Heresy's when they were current either - at all - so I doubt I'd like the new ones much better.)

Klipsch's newer models of speakers sound far more normal... but I still don't rate them anywhere near my top picks.

Apr 23, 2019 21:21:28 GMT -5 DavidR said:

Wow, you probably couldn't pick two more different styles of speakers.

I haven't heard Maggies but have heard Martin-Logan. Step an inch off center and you lose it. Thin sounding (no pun intended).

I haven't heard the Horns but did buy my son a pair of original Heresys for his first stereo system. Very easy to drive, nice bass but not very deep. Nice sounding and accurate at low volumes. The horns were too harsh for my ears with volume.

It's all about what it sounds like to you.

Wow Keith. You have expressed EXACTLY how I feel about these two speaker technologies. years back I owned Maggies. we probably don't like the same music but we certainly like a similar sound... (maybe).......

tchaik......

[pallpoul]

May 3, 2019 9:07:33 GMT -5 KeithL said:

OK.... we're talking PERSONAL PREFERENCES here.

For my tastes, Magneplanars all sound very open and airy; however, to me, they sound a bit too open and airy.

Music sounds like "it's coming from the air in front of you" - but it DOESN'T sound like it's coming from a singer or instrument sitting right there in front of you.

I have never yet heard a set of Magneplanars set up in such a way that they present a concise, solid, pinpoint image.

(They are also extremely fussy about room placement and room acoustics - and can sound really bad if not set up just so.)

Also, for my tastes, I really dislike Klipsch horns (including the original Klipschhorns themselves).

I've heard them sound pretty good playing... well... horns...

And they most certainly are incredibly efficient... and very dynamic...

But, to me, they always sound unnatural and "honky" or "shouty" with voice and harsh with lots of things - especially when turned up loud.

(I've never heard natural sounding female vocals come from a Klipschhorn.)

And, since I listen mostly to vocals, to me that is a deal breaker.

(And, yes, the big horns also need a really big room to work well at all.)

(I didn't like the original Heresy's when they were current either - at all - so I doubt I'd like the new ones much better.)

Klipsch's newer models of speakers sound far more normal... but I still don't rate them anywhere near my top picks.

Apr 23, 2019 21:21:28 GMT -5 DavidR said:

Wow, you probably couldn't pick two more different styles of speakers.

I haven't heard Maggies but have heard Martin-Logan. Step an inch off center and you lose it. Thin sounding (no pun intended).

I haven't heard the Horns but did buy my son a pair of original Heresys for his first stereo system. Very easy to drive, nice bass but not very deep. Nice sounding and accurate at low volumes. The horns were too harsh for my ears with volume.

It's all about what it sounds like to you.

TG it is, like you said Keith, a matter of personal preferences... To each his/her own ears. To my ears and taste, the Klipsch Heritage series of speakers sound the best. They will honestly sound harsh with most SS amps. However, driving them with some class A, SET tube amps and pre amps, they produce the best sound that IMHO, and to my own ears and taste, beats all other speakers.
&
To Klipsch's credit, their Heritage speakers series have been around for 70 + years, and more and more people are loving their sound and buying them for a reason, and they do hold well their value.

If they were so harsh I would have thought that they would be discontinued by now, like other brands often do....! 

Again, what sound harsh, and barky to your ears sir, sound the opposite mine.

[KeithL]

That's a more interesting question.

I don't actually place a high priority on accurate or correct sound stage.

I have no idea exactly where the violin section of a real orchestra is supposed to be - and I don't care much about the specifics of the sound stage.

And, while I recognize that some speakers or headphone seem to have a "3D sound stage with different things at different distances", I can't say I care very much about that either.

Likewise, while some speakers produce "a sound stage that extends way past the speakers to the sides" and others do not, I don't especially prefer one over the other.

However, I do prefer that each instrument and sound seem to be coming from a particular location, rather than simply being part of "a pleasant airy swirl of sound".

(I guess you could say that I don't care if each instrument sis in the right place - but I do want to be able to close my eyes and point to it.)

In terms of being able to hear the finest details, I very much prefer electrostatic headphones, over any type of speaker, and any other type of headphone.

I've never heard ANYTHING that comes close to electrostatic headphones in terms of detail and smoothness.

However, I tend to find the "in your head imaging" you get from headphones to eventually become annoying, and I simply find all headphones somewhat uncomfortable to wear for very long.

(I just plain don't like the feel of something on my head - no matter how comfortable it otherwise is.)

So, all that said, I do the vast majority of my listening using speakers.

If you're curious, I have a small house, with a small living room, and at the moment I listen to an XMC-1, a pair of our Stealth 8's, and one of our small subs.

Before I moved into this house, and before I worked for Emotiva, I had a pair of Vandersteen 4's, an Aragon 28k preamp, and a vintage Aragon 8008 power amp.

(I had lots of other equipment - but that was the system I actually listened to most of the time.)

I would say that the best sounding thing I currently own is a pair of Koss ESP/950 electrostatic headphones - but I rarely actually listen to them.

(I would also say that the Stealth 8's are the closest thing I've heard to them in a speaker lately.)

May 3, 2019 10:51:18 GMT -5 pedrocols said:

May 3, 2019 9:07:33 GMT -5 KeithL said:

OK.... we're talking PERSONAL PREFERENCES here.

For my tastes, Magneplanars all sound very open and airy; however, to me, they sound a bit too open and airy.

Music sounds like "it's coming from the air in front of you" - but it DOESN'T sound like it's coming from a singer or instrument sitting right there in front of you.

I have never yet heard a set of Magneplanars set up in such a way that they present a concise, solid, pinpoint image.

(They are also extremely fussy about room placement and room acoustics - and can sound really bad if not set up just so.)

Also, for my tastes, I really dislike Klipsch horns (including the original Klipschhorns themselves).

I've heard them sound pretty good playing... well... horns...

And they most certainly are incredibly efficient... and very dynamic...

But, to me, they always sound unnatural and "honky" or "shouty" with voice and harsh with lots of things - especially when turned up loud.

(I've never heard natural sounding female vocals come from a Klipschhorn.)

And, since I listen mostly to vocals, to me that is a deal breaker.

(And, yes, the big horns also need a really big room to work well at all.)

(I didn't like the original Heresy's when they were current either - at all - so I doubt I'd like the new ones much better.)

Klipsch's newer models of speakers sound far more normal... but I still don't rate them anywhere near my top picks.

So based on your assessment on Magnepan speakers I can assume you don't like headphones.

[Bonzo]

May 3, 2019 15:17:49 GMT -5 KeithL said:

That's a more interesting question.

I don't actually place a high priority on accurate or correct sound stage.

I have no idea exactly where the violin section of a real orchestra is supposed to be - and I don't care much about the specifics of the sound stage.

And, while I recognize that some speakers or headphone seem to have a "3D sound stage with different things at different distances", I can't say I care very much about that either.

Likewise, while some speakers produce "a sound stage that extends way past the speakers to the sides" and others do not, I don't especially prefer one over the other.

However, I do prefer that each instrument and sound seem to be coming from a particular location, rather than simply being part of "a pleasant airy swirl of sound".

(I guess you could say that I don't care if each instrument sis in the right place - but I do want to be able to close my eyes and point to it.)

In terms of being able to hear the finest details, I very much prefer electrostatic headphones, over any type of speaker, and any other type of headphone.

I've never heard ANYTHING that comes close to electrostatic headphones in terms of detail and smoothness.

However, I tend to find the "in your head imaging" you get from headphones to eventually become annoying, and I simply find all headphones somewhat uncomfortable to wear for very long.

(I just plain don't like the feel of something on my head - no matter how comfortable it otherwise is.)

So, all that said, I do the vast majority of my listening using speakers.

If you're curious, I have a small house, with a small living room, and at the moment I listen to an XMC-1, a pair of our Stealth 8's, and one of our small subs.

Before I moved into this house, and before I worked for Emotiva, I had a pair of Vandersteen 4's, an Aragon 28k preamp, and a vintage Aragon 8008 power amp.

(I had lots of other equipment - but that was the system I actually listened to most of the time.)

I would say that the best sounding thing I currently own is a pair of Koss ESP/950 electrostatic headphones - but I rarely actually listen to them.

(I would also say that the Stealth 8's are the closest thing I've heard to them in a speaker lately.)

May 3, 2019 10:51:18 GMT -5 pedrocols said:

So based on your assessment on Magnepan speakers I can assume you don't like headphones.

I think you are blurring the lines between 2 different things. Although related, soundstage and imaging are 2 different things. Being able to point out an instrument is imaging. I prefer a large soundstage, but don't care too much about imaging when it comes to music. IMO, imaging is mostly "fakery." It's something "created" by a recording engineer, but most of the time it's not reality. Unless you are sitting in the front rows of a classical concert, all the other seats have no imaging. The orchestra sounds as one. Even when there is a solo, if you are in the front row of the balcony, it just sounds like it's coming from in front of you, not a particular point. There is no imaging at a rock concert unless panning is applied, and any imaging from typical studio recordings is "made up" with channel levels and pans etc. But enough about that, as it's a topic that we could go on about forever.

I happen to agree with you about the Klipsch sound. Not a fan. I love the sound of Maggies, but I do have 2 beefs with them. Too small a sweet spot (not good for movies or my room), and that they sound so airy (as you described) that they do not sound real. They sound beyond real. They sound other worldly. The sound is fantastic, but it's not life like to me.

So you mention a few other speakers you have had. But what others have you heard that you have liked?

As for me (off the top of my head, missing some I'm sure):
Fan: Wilson, Dynaudio, PSB, Maggies (for 2 channel), and obviously Def Tech. Oh, and I really like my Emotiva 3bs for what they are.

Not a fan: Klipsch, Thiel, Paradigm, B&W, McIntosh, Sonus Faber

Undecided: Focal, Golden Ear, Martin Logan (2 channel only)

Would like to hear: Tekton, Legacy, Revel, and many others I'm forgetting.

[Bonzo]

Forgot to point out, I am strongly of the belief that not only do people have differing opinions and personal preferences as to what sounds good, I also believe people actually hear differently.

For one example, I have smallish size ears, very flat against my head, and small ear canals. I can't imagine some guy with huge ears sticking out from his head and large ear canals hears the same.

I also want it made clear, I am in no way bashing anyone for the speakers they like or don't like. Speakers are all about preference, what you need, where you are using them, what you are listening to, and how much money you want to spend. There is no perfect speaker, nor is there a best speaker. There is only a best speaker for you.

[ttocs]

May 3, 2019 15:17:49 GMT -5 KeithL said:

(I just plain don't like the feel of something on my head - no matter how comfortable it otherwise is.)

What about the hat?

[teaman]

May 3, 2019 16:02:35 GMT -5 Bonzo said:

May 3, 2019 15:17:49 GMT -5 KeithL said:

That's a more interesting question.

I don't actually place a high priority on accurate or correct sound stage.

I have no idea exactly where the violin section of a real orchestra is supposed to be - and I don't care much about the specifics of the sound stage.

And, while I recognize that some speakers or headphone seem to have a "3D sound stage with different things at different distances", I can't say I care very much about that either.

Likewise, while some speakers produce "a sound stage that extends way past the speakers to the sides" and others do not, I don't especially prefer one over the other.

However, I do prefer that each instrument and sound seem to be coming from a particular location, rather than simply being part of "a pleasant airy swirl of sound".

(I guess you could say that I don't care if each instrument sis in the right place - but I do want to be able to close my eyes and point to it.)

In terms of being able to hear the finest details, I very much prefer electrostatic headphones, over any type of speaker, and any other type of headphone.

I've never heard ANYTHING that comes close to electrostatic headphones in terms of detail and smoothness.

However, I tend to find the "in your head imaging" you get from headphones to eventually become annoying, and I simply find all headphones somewhat uncomfortable to wear for very long.

(I just plain don't like the feel of something on my head - no matter how comfortable it otherwise is.)

So, all that said, I do the vast majority of my listening using speakers.

If you're curious, I have a small house, with a small living room, and at the moment I listen to an XMC-1, a pair of our Stealth 8's, and one of our small subs.

Before I moved into this house, and before I worked for Emotiva, I had a pair of Vandersteen 4's, an Aragon 28k preamp, and a vintage Aragon 8008 power amp.

(I had lots of other equipment - but that was the system I actually listened to most of the time.)

I would say that the best sounding thing I currently own is a pair of Koss ESP/950 electrostatic headphones - but I rarely actually listen to them.

(I would also say that the Stealth 8's are the closest thing I've heard to them in a speaker lately.)

I think you are blurring the lines between 2 different things. Although related, soundstage and imaging are 2 different things. Being able to point out an instrument is imaging. I prefer a large soundstage, but don't care too much about imaging when it comes to music. IMO, imaging is mostly "fakery." It's something "created" by a recording engineer, but most of the time it's not reality. Unless you are sitting in the front rows of a classical concert, all the other seats have no imaging. The orchestra sounds as one. Even when there is a solo, if you are in the front row of the balcony, it just sounds like it's coming from in front of you, not a particular point. There is no imaging at a rock concert unless panning is applied, and any imaging from typical studio recordings is "made up" with channel levels and pans etc. But enough about that, as it's a topic that we could go on about forever.

I happen to agree with you about the Klipsch sound. Not a fan. I love the sound of Maggies, but I do have 2 beefs with them. Too small a sweet spot (not good for movies or my room), and that they sound so airy (as you described) that they do not sound real. They sound beyond real. They sound other worldly. The sound is fantastic, but it's not life like to me.

So you mention a few other speakers you have had. But what others have you heard that you have liked?

As for me (off the top of my head, missing some I'm sure):
Fan: Wilson, Dynaudio, PSB, Maggies (for 2 channel), and obviously Def Tech. Oh, and I really like my Emotiva 3bs for what they are.

Not a fan: Klipsch, Thiel, Paradigm, B&W, McIntosh, Sonus Faber

Undecided: Focal, Golden Ear, Martin Logan (2 channel only)

Would like to hear: Tekton, Legacy, Revel, and many others I'm forgetting.

You and I have nearly exact opposite taste in speakers. Almost everything in your "fan" category, I am not a fan of, and everything in your "not a fan" category I like.

[Bonzo]

May 3, 2019 16:56:50 GMT -5 teaman said:

You and I have nearly exact opposite taste in speakers. Almost everything in your "fan" category, I am not a fan of, and everything in your "not a fan" category I like.

I was going to use your love of Klipsch as an example in the post before but decided to cut it short.

I think that really says something. We have consistently opposite tastes. Interesting. Sort of helps prove my point. I would theorize that if we consistently pick the opposite speaker, that we must definitely hear something differently. Whether its because our ears are shaped differently, our ear parts work differently, our brains perceive the information differently, or we just like a different sound, is up for the scientists here.

I must say your loyalty to Klipsch says a lot too. I have found that even with lesser not as good sounding Def Techs, they still have a signature that I like.

Again, there is no right or wrong here.

You obviously love tea. I can't stand the stuff. Not only do I hate the taste, but my body literally rejects it, as in hurling. Yuck!