Magnepan LRS-power with PA-1’s or XPA-100’s?

[pdaddy]

I worried Creimes. Looking for feedback on XPA HC-1’s in case I come across a pair, vs xpa 2.

[pdaddy]

Re-reading specs on HC-1 and a bit worried about “ Minimum Recommended Load Impedance: 4 Ohms”. Might be an issue for LRS with 4 ohm nominal load.

[wje2]

Whew! I've done quite a bit of experimenting with Magnepans over the past month. Glenn made some good comments about the pro amps with a built-in DSP built as class "D" amplifiers. I sold the Crown XLS1502 off a few weeks ago with my Magnepan LRS and MG .7 speakers. I loved the sound of the .7 - the 5 Hz of additional bass in the frequency response made for a better listening experience, in my scenario. Though, I'm also using 2 10" Monolith subs, too. But, the slightly deeper dig of the .7 was what impressed me. Though, the LRS is still a very good bargain at it's $650 price point.

Now, more about amps based on my testing and listening. The Crown XLS1502 was not a bad amplifier, but I suspect, may not be as good as some of the other non-DSP offerings. But, where the Magnepans really changed, in noticeable ways was when I moved from the Crown XLS1502 to the Parasound A23+. The Parasound works for me, but not indicating it's the only option, but more evidence that a good, high current amplifier is what makes the Magnepans reach their potential. I only opted for the A23+ because a local seller was upgrading and the price was right for me. However, the Magnepan LRS didn't seem to benefit as much from the Parasound A23+ as the MG .7 speakers did. Again, not sure if that's where the higher current amplifier really paid off when driving the speakers in the mid-range and the lower 45 - 50 Hz range, where the LRS isn't specd to. Though, I'm still kicking myself for selling the Emotiva SA-250 to a local guy a few months back for $500. That was one of the dumbest moves I made, but had too much gear at the time and was starting to lose space to walk in my living room.

In summary, the LRS is a great speaker, but didn't benefit as much as the MG .7 when going from the Crown XLS1502 amp to the Parasound A23+ amplifier. To my ears, the MG .7, after implementing the Parasound amp, was my "Keepers". If I had kept the XLS1502, I'd be hard pressed to describe large differences between the LRS and MG.7 in my living room as far as sound goes. I had both the LRS and MG .7 speakers listed for sale, because I knew I could only keep one pair. The guy that reached out to me on the LRS also indicated he was interested in buying both pair of speakers. I wasn't sure how I felt having to go without the MG .7 since the introduction of Parasound made me really enjoy what I was hearing. But, A pair of like new 1.7i speakers came on the market with the $550 Mye stands, so I couldn't resist at that point.

[donh50]

One thing to consider is that, if you like Maggie sound, you may want to upgrade and while their load remains mostly resistive (benign) as you move to the true-ribbon models (3.x/20.x/30/x) the HF impedance does dip below 3 ohms. And they are not really any more sensitive as you go up the line so you still need a fair amount of power to drive them. That premise leads to favoring an amplifier with higher power and the ability to drive at least 4 ohm loads with aplomb. Since the load is not "bad", just low impedance, an amplifier rated for 4-ohm loads should be fine. A number of AVRs will overheat and shut down, however, when driving Maggies hard.

FWIWFM - Don

[pdaddy]

THANK YOU WJE2. Your suspicions and experiences have proven out for me too. I had the PA-1’s running the LRS for a few hours of testing. Then I found a local deal for a Bryston 3BST. They really do need that extra current. The Bryston really cleared up the sound stage and tightened up the bass.

[pedrocols]

Aug 31, 2020 11:57:22 GMT -5 pdaddy said:

THANK YOU WJE2. Your suspicions and experiences have proven out for me too. I had the PA-1’s running the LRS for a few hours of testing. Then I found a local deal for a Bryston 3BST. They really do need that extra current. The Bryston really cleared up the sound stage and tightened up the bass.

I have powered my maggies with a Bryston 4B St amp and I still prefer the tube amp. Then again that is based on my listening habits and music preferences.

[pdaddy]

Pedrocols. I would LOVE to get a tube amp here but it appeared that getting one that would drive these well was going to be cost prohibitive. I wish I could afford some Bob monoblocks or even a stereo amp but not in the budget.

[leonski]

XPA-100 is at least 8 years old. If it were absolutely bargain priced, might be worth an experiment. It's a mono amp, right?

The PA-1 should provide enough power but not in a large space or a the highest levels.

Maggies benefit from LOTS of good power. They are not a 'difficult' load from the electrical side, but ARE of very low sensitivity.

If you want an amp for decades to come, you might even consider a REAL budget busting sum NOW and not have to 'upgrade' in coming years.

The upgrade every couple years path can be very expensive in the longer run. I'm not about to make any particular suggestions, but maybe go

to a Maggie forum, like Audio Asyum, and just read thru some posts. You CAN spend an absolutely Profane amount of money but don't need to.

[wje2]

Aug 31, 2020 13:59:23 GMT -5 pdaddy said:

Pedrocols. I would LOVE to get a tube amp here but it appeared that getting one that would drive these well was going to be cost prohibitive. I wish I could afford some Bob monoblocks or even a stereo amp but not in the budget.

You could still keep the solid state Bryston and purchase a tube preamplifier to change the sound characteristics.

[donh50]

I drove my Maggies with 35 W/ch and 75 W/ch tube amps (old Eico EL34, ARC D-79) in addition to hybrid (Counterpoint) and a myriad of various SS amps over the years. In addition to the ones I owned I was able to try a number of tube amps up to ~200 W/ch and all sorts of SS amps via the dealer I worked for back in the late 1970's/early 1980's. While a tube amp's distortion and microphonics lend a special "warmth" to the midrange I usually preferred SS for the tighter bass and better ability to handle the ribbon tweeter. The last time I had a tube amp driving mine is going on ten years ago now, and flipping between the old ARC and newer Emotiva XPA-2, it fairly quickly became apparent that I much preferred the cleaner, tighter SS sound and I finally sold (for a song) my old ARC D-79. I've always been fond of tube amps, even knowing their limitations, but setting up my system again after a few years in storage maybe my taste had changed but the SS sounded much better to me.

I have since changed speakers but haven't been able to part with all the Maggies so they are stored downstairs -- one of my sons is interested, gotta' pass 'em on down.

[leonski]

With different speakers you may have gotten different results.

White Bear Lake had the demo panels in the fron reception area powered with a 35 watt tube amp.   but it was apparently not 'pushed'.

AR tube amps were once the show choice for magnepan demos.    by Magnepan.     

Virtually ALL amps have fans and detractors when paired with Magnepan.   Mcintosh?   Bryston?    Pass Labs?    Even Parasound.   Listening values vary across wide
groups of listeners.
Some guys swear by those Crown 'D' amps.   I know a guy who ran some big EMO mono bloc on the bass and a tube amp for mid / highs.   (Marchand Crossover).

So it depends.....and depends.....

Here where I'm living now?   I'd NEVER have a tube amp for maybe 6 or more months per year.   I couldn't get this place cool......While I might welcome the 'waste heat' 
during the cooler months of what passes for 'winter' around here.    I think a high powered very high bias class 'A' amp might be just as bad.    

[Chris]

I use Mytek Brooklyn Amp with my LRS and they sound great. I would also recommend either class D amps using either Purifi or Hypex modules. I have also used the Benchmark AHB2 amps which is currently the leading SINAD Amp (THD+N) but it's a little pricey at $3K. The Hypex and Purif based amps can be had for around $1k.

[jackeroo]

I use an XPA-2 gen 1 with my Maggie 3.7's and I have been very happy.

[pedrocols]

Aug 31, 2020 13:59:23 GMT -5 pdaddy said:

Pedrocols. I would LOVE to get a tube amp here but it appeared that getting one that would drive these well was going to be cost prohibitive. I wish I could afford some Bob monoblocks or even a stereo amp but not in the budget.

I hear you. They are not terribly expensive but several grands for a pair isn't pocket change either. I saved up for maybe a year and sold some gear before I was able to buy them.

[quattroll]

I haven't visited the site in a little bit, but I did want to share my thoughts. I have .7s in a medium/large size room (one side open) and I currently use XPA-1Ls with them, and I think it is a great match. The few times I compared them with XPA-100s, I felt that though not far behind, the 1Ls had the edge both in lower volumes, especially in class A bias, and higher volumes where the 1Ls seemed slightly more resolving and had better heft in the lower and lowest areas.

Now I did post that I tried PA-1s on these .7s and initially in a very brief few songs was unimpressed. I mainly wanted them in another set up driving Sonus Faber Toy Towers, where they sounded awesome right away. Later I became so impressed that I decided to sell 3 XPA-100s and 1 XPA-200, in favor of 5 PA1s. I like the speed and detail that they offer, as well as the obvious benefits in size, weight, and heat (lack of). I also have a mini 100 that I find to be perfectly fine for rears in this set up, so the 4th and 5th PA-1 I bought are really a back up pair for the .7s, should the XPA-1Ls fail. (I did have to send one back which started this all). Before I made the decision to buy these extra two, I went back the the pairing of PA-1s with the .7s.

Well, you know what happened, and my answer was that yes they perform with the Magnepans, which bing a little larger than an LRS, probably are slightly harder to drive, which means they could be that little bit better. If your room isn't huge, and you don't listen at ridiculous levels, I say try them. Being smaller and lighter, the return shipping is much less. Also you will have fully balanced, and 5 years of warranty.

And, the final advantage is that you can place them between the feet of the LRS for an extremely short speaker wire connection. A few people here like that I know, though I haven't tried.

I hope this helps, and if you do get them, let us know what you think when you have let them play together for awhile.

[pdaddy]

Found an XPA-2 GEN 3 local. Very pleased.

[mgbpuff]

I drive my Maggie 3.7R's (true ribbon) speakers with Emotiva XPA-1 Gen 1 monoblocks and they (with subwoofer support) rival the sound of my Revel Ultra Salon 2 towers driven by 500w Musical Fidelity monoblocks. I have noticed that the Maggies seem to flow through other rooms in the house better at the same volume for what ever reason. But when i listen to them I am camped out in the MLP chair.

[leonski]

Sept 21, 2020 9:46:16 GMT -5 mgbpuff said:

I drive my Maggie 3.7R's (true ribbon) speakers with Emotiva XPA-1 Gen 1 monoblocks and they (with subwoofer support) rival the sound of my Revel Ultra Salon 2 towers driven by 500w Musical Fidelity monoblocks. I have noticed that the Maggies seem to flow through other rooms in the house better at the same volume for what ever reason. But when i listen to them I am camped out in the MLP chair.

I've noticed the same thing with my panels....ever since I owned MG-1s made maybe late 70s or so?      A Telarc disc (remember them?) of classical piano sounded REAL from a room away.   Frightening.  
The illusion breaks down for groups or orchestral, but for a solo instrument?    Very real sounding.   
I'd like to find a pair of the 3.6 for some mods.    Change to an ACTIVE crossover and biamp......
You can't do that with ANY of the X.7 series Maggies.    That pesky Series Crossover, to start.

[jeffrey40sw]

I run an XPA-3 Gen 2 with a pair of 1.6QR's and it will drive them to ear bleeding levels. I am considering the LRS's because the 1.6's are just a tad too big for living room we are currently in.  I have tried my my 1990's Adcom GFA 535II on the maggies and it actually does quite well as long as the room is not huge, and your not trying for metal concert sound pressure levels.  However, my older Onkyo 809 receiver chokes trying to drive them even though its rated at twice the power of the little Adcom. It just cant do it. 

[Jean Genie]

I drive 1.7s with a 1st generation XPA-2 and consider it a 'cold dead hands ' situation!😎 YMMV.