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Post by daveczski65 on Feb 7, 2021 12:02:56 GMT -5
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Post by 405x5 on Feb 7, 2021 15:50:54 GMT -5
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butchgo
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The Dark Side rules
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Post by butchgo on Feb 7, 2021 17:06:04 GMT -5
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Post by daveczski65 on Feb 8, 2021 6:58:09 GMT -5
Thank you ,I did look at madison,but prices too high. Trying to keep it on the cheap side. |
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Post by 405x5 on Feb 8, 2021 8:58:56 GMT -5
Thank you ,I did look at madison,but prices too high. Trying to keep it on the cheap side. Proper restoration of vintage equip. takes a few bucks.....exactly how much are you willing to part with.?....then your options will be known. Bill |
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DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Feb 8, 2021 9:51:11 GMT -5
If you are not planning to replace the original speaker with an exact copy (restoration) then start by looking at the capabilities of the amplifier, and then you can choose a speaker to replace it (refurbishment.)
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on Feb 8, 2021 9:51:46 GMT -5
The design criteria for modern speakers tend to be quite different than for vintage speakers.
By modern standards your old speaker has: - a very light cone - a relatively weak magnet - relatively high efficiency - relatively high distortion - it was originally very cheap to manufacture
This is a combination that will not be easy to find in a modern speaker....
Most large diameter modern speakers have heavier cones, larger magnets, lower efficiency, and a more limited frequency range.
(Most modern full range speakers are smaller for several reasons... )
The real question is going to be whether you are trying to do "an accurate restoration"... Or whether you are trying to repair the TV to sound good...
Thank you ,I did look at madison,but prices too high. Trying to keep it on the cheap side. Proper restoration of vintage equip. takes a few bucks.....exactly how much are you willing to part with.?....then your options will be known. Bill |
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on Feb 8, 2021 9:57:46 GMT -5
Incidentally... if you're really trying to do this on the cheap... have you considered REPAIRING the original speaker.
It's obvious from the picture that the cone is badly torn. However the voice coil is held in alignment by the spider... which is underneath. If the spider and the voice coil are still OK then it can be successfully repaired.
If the speaker still moves in and out without rubbing, and the voice coils in intact, it CAN be repaired.
You can use tissue paper and something like urethane floor coatingto rebuild the cone. And you can rebuild the edging with tissue paper and a mixture of silicone rubber and some sort of solvent. (You want something that will soak into the cone and harden... and something that will soak into the edging and turn it rubbery.)
I've done it... and it can be done.
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Post by leonski on Feb 8, 2021 15:24:30 GMT -5
Keith is technically correct. A DIY fix can be done. But getting your 2 essentially 'artifact' speakers to match may be more difficult. I'd replace the PAIR with something from the Fostex line. www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/approx-8-fullrange/fostex-fe206nv-8-full-range/I know that 300$ the pair SOUNDS like a lot of $$ but now is not the time to cheap out. Besides? You will NEVER have to do this again. speaker of is high sensitivity so the amp doesn't have to work as hard. This is a far more sensitive speaker than tha Pioneer, which I suspect is some kind of Car Speaker. |
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DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Feb 8, 2021 15:37:24 GMT -5
And I say again, what is the amplifier? Many of these old speaker systems were 16-ohms and the amp is designed to drive that. You really need to know what the amp in the system is before you start slapping random replacement speakers into something.
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Post by daveczski65 on Feb 8, 2021 17:45:05 GMT -5
And I say again, what is the amplifier? Many of these old speaker systems were 16-ohms and the amp is designed to drive that. You really need to know what the amp in the system is before you start slapping random replacement speakers into something. Just want to replace both speakers,,they are 8in size,there is a tube amp that says 100watts. Partsexpress has a fullrange speaker that I was looking at.Just need it too play sound,the person doesn't care about quality sound. www.parts-express.com/GRS-8FR-8-Full-Range-8-Speaker-Pioneer-Type-B20FU20-51FW-292-430 |
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Post by daveczski65 on Feb 8, 2021 18:12:56 GMT -5
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Post by daveczski65 on Feb 8, 2021 18:15:26 GMT -5
And I say again, what is the amplifier? Many of these old speaker systems were 16-ohms and the amp is designed to drive that. You really need to know what the amp in the system is before you start slapping random replacement speakers into something. I have too pull the amp sect out,have too clean all the contacts for the knobs,,having issues trying to find info on unit. I will definitely wait till I do that. Thank you! |
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Post by daveczski65 on Feb 8, 2021 18:19:22 GMT -5
The design criteria for modern speakers tend to be quite different than for vintage speakers.
By modern standards your old speaker has: - a very light cone - a relatively weak magnet - relatively high efficiency - relatively high distortion - it was originally very cheap to manufacture
This is a combination that will not be easy to find in a modern speaker....
Most large diameter modern speakers have heavier cones, larger magnets, lower efficiency, and a more limited frequency range.
(Most modern full range speakers are smaller for several reasons... )
The real question is going to be whether you are trying to do "an accurate restoration"... Or whether you are trying to repair the TV to sound good...
Proper restoration of vintage equip. takes a few bucks.....exactly how much are you willing to part with.?....then your options will be known. Bill Just looking for it to play records from the Garrard turntable, and the fm section,,there's no TV anymore in unit. Doesn't have to be accurate, just need good sound. Going to remove the tube amp section to get more details and to clean contacts on knobs, thank you Keith for info! |
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DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Feb 8, 2021 19:39:27 GMT -5
And I say again, what is the amplifier? Many of these old speaker systems were 16-ohms and the amp is designed to drive that. You really need to know what the amp in the system is before you start slapping random replacement speakers into something. I have too pull the amp sect out,have too clean all the contacts for the knobs,,having issues trying to find info on unit. I will definitely wait till I do that. Thank you! What is the make and model of the unit you are trying to make work? |
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Post by leonski on Feb 8, 2021 20:03:33 GMT -5
The foxtex I note will work well with an amp with high output impedance.....like tubes....and doesnt' need a damping factor over 5. If that.
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Post by daveczski65 on Feb 9, 2021 5:56:47 GMT -5
I have too pull the amp sect out,have too clean all the contacts for the knobs,,having issues trying to find info on unit. I will definitely wait till I do that. Thank you! What is the make and model of the unit you are trying to make work? Sylvania model 23 H30 consule. I tryed numerous Google searches, but couldn't find any specific info,,there are labels on the unit,but just diagram of the tube numbers and wiring. I have to get more pics,unit is not at my disposal right now, Thanks DYohn |
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DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Feb 9, 2021 9:09:00 GMT -5
Hmm. Vintage Sylvania consoles usually had a model number starting with sc. Here is a Sylvania SC-152W  If it has a Garrard turntable it is likely from the mid 1960's. |
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on Feb 9, 2021 13:41:07 GMT -5
Most older consoles were limited to somewhere between a few clean watts per channel and twenty or so watts per channel...
With tubes you can generally get a pretty good idea about more or less how much power an amplifier can deliver by looking at what's there.
What tube number are the output tubes? (with a console they'll most likely be 6BQ5, 6V6, or 6L6, or maybe 6CA7.. or European equivalents). And are there one output tube per channel or a pair? (a pair will be push-pull which gives you significantly more power and lower distortion).
And how big are the output transformers? (or, if they're sealed in metal cans, how heavy are they, or how heavy is the entire amp)
You can get the tube numbers and types from the diagram...
And, for example, there isn't all that much difference between vintage amps that use a pair of 6BQ5 or 6V6 tubes...
(Post some pictures of the whole amplifier... or just readable pictures of the diagram.)
What is the make and model of the unit you are trying to make work? Sylvania model 23 H30 consule. I tryed numerous Google searches, but couldn't find any specific info,,there are labels on the unit,but just diagram of the tube numbers and wiring. I have to get more pics,unit is not at my disposal right now, Thanks DYohn |
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Post by 405x5 on Feb 9, 2021 15:06:02 GMT -5
Incidentally... if you're really trying to do this on the cheap... have you considered REPAIRING the original speaker.
It's obvious from the picture that the cone is badly torn. However the voice coil is held in alignment by the spider... which is underneath. If the spider and the voice coil are still OK then it can be successfully repaired.
If the speaker still moves in and out without rubbing, and the voice coils in intact, it CAN be repaired.
You can use tissue paper and something like urethane floor coatingto rebuild the cone. And you can rebuild the edging with tissue paper and a mixture of silicone rubber and some sort of solvent. (You want something that will soak into the cone and harden... and something that will soak into the edging and turn it rubbery.)
I've done it... and it can be done.
Exactly why I put Simply Speakers out here for consideration. Very reasonable and honest in what they do with existing woofer restoration/repair and peace of mind knowing the speakers match the need of that original amp. Bill |
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