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Post by hsamwel on Apr 9, 2023 14:59:05 GMT -5
I have now installed ASIO4ALL. It seems to work fine. First I could get any sound at all. After a few tries I got an error in the ASIO control panel for my HDMI audio output. It seemed to complain about the driver being too old or too new. Gave me a few suggestion about turning off other outputs. I also turned on support for 7.1 for my HDMI audio. I did a reboot. This time it didn’t complain. I get 8 speakers in the list, ACX HD Audio Speaker 1 to 8. In ASIO control panel it says the output supports 8x 48khz 16bits audio. However, no sound from speakers 3 to 8. Only from front L/R. Also there’s distortion coming from it when REW sends out the measuring signal. This from both left and right speaker. Can I change output? I saw Marc used JRiver.. I use JRiver as my audio device and to play audio files from the PC. In the DSP Studio I have the output set up as 7.1. If it's not set up like that then it will only play stereo ... L/R are channels 1 and 2 from REW. View AttachmentIs DSP Studio a part of JRiver? Do I need to use an external player to get REW going in multi channel? REW seems very overcomplicated in this regard (choosing soundcard).. Probably a Java limitation I guess. Why if it says I have support for 8 channels do I only get 2ch? And what’s up with the distortion? It gives some crackles during the measuring like a speaker driver is broken. But it isn’t. I get the exact same crackles on the other side. |
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Post by marcl on Apr 9, 2023 15:33:28 GMT -5
I use JRiver as my audio device and to play audio files from the PC. In the DSP Studio I have the output set up as 7.1. If it's not set up like that then it will only play stereo ... L/R are channels 1 and 2 from REW. View AttachmentIs DSP Studio a part of JRiver? Do I need to use an external player to get REW going in multi channel? REW seems very overcomplicated in this regard (choosing soundcard).. Probably a Java limitation I guess. Why if it says I have support for 8 channels do I only get 2ch? And what’s up with the distortion? It gives some crackles during the measuring like a speaker driver is broken. But it isn’t. I get the exact same crackles on the other side. Yes DSP Studio is part of JRiver. I should have mentioned earlier, have you looked at Austin Jerry's tutorial on setting up REW? www.dropbox.com/s/51jpnxet3bvew2k/REW%20101%20HTS%20Current%20Version.pdf?dl=1Maybe this will help. And, whatever your sound output device is in your PC, it has to be configured for 7.1 |
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Post by hsamwel on Apr 11, 2023 4:33:00 GMT -5
Is DSP Studio a part of JRiver? Do I need to use an external player to get REW going in multi channel? REW seems very overcomplicated in this regard (choosing soundcard).. Probably a Java limitation I guess. Why if it says I have support for 8 channels do I only get 2ch? And what’s up with the distortion? It gives some crackles during the measuring like a speaker driver is broken. But it isn’t. I get the exact same crackles on the other side. Yes DSP Studio is part of JRiver. I should have mentioned earlier, have you looked at Austin Jerry's tutorial on setting up REW? www.dropbox.com/s/51jpnxet3bvew2k/REW%20101%20HTS%20Current%20Version.pdf?dl=1Maybe this will help. And, whatever your sound output device is in your PC, it has to be configured for 7.1 I looked t it a long time ago. I actually had REW up’n going a few years ago. No problem then. I noticed my laptop, although having a Nvidia graphics chip is running on the Intel internal graphics. This also means internal HDMI audio output. But there seems no way in Windows 11 that I can change this as I could in Windows 10. They have removed the energy settings for graphics output. On my previous laptop I set it to always use the high performance graphics when I’m on power and internal when on battery. I’m asking ASUS support and checking the internet for suggestions. I have my output device set to 7.1. I have had this now for a while. REW recognises that I have 8 channels but I don’t get any sound from them and distortion from L/R. I’m guessing there is something wrong with the driver for the internal graphics. Or compatiblity issues with REW and this driver. I just bought a new laptop early december last year. I do get sound from all 8 channels when testing the settings in Windows though. Guessing also that’s why I had some issues with Java in REW somehow. I’m going to try to change to the Nvidia output instead. |
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Post by marcl on Apr 11, 2023 4:39:48 GMT -5
I looked t it a long time ago. I actually had REW up’n going a few years ago. No problem then. I noticed my laptop, although having a Nvidia graphics chip is running on the Intel internal graphics. This also means internal HDMI audio output. But there seems no way in Windows 11 that I can change this as I could in Windows 10. They have removed the energy settings for graphics output. On my previous laptop I set it to always use the high performance graphics when I’m on power and internal when on battery. I’m asking ASUS support and checking the internet for suggestions. I have my output device set to 7.1. I have had this now for a while. REW recognises that I have 8 channels but I don’t get any sound from them and distortion from L/R. I’m guessing there is something wrong with the driver for the internal graphics. Or compatiblity issues with REW and this driver. I just bought a new laptop early december last year. I do get sound from all 8 channels when testing the settings in Windows though. Guessing also that’s why I had some issues with Java in REW somehow. I’m going to try to change to the Nvidia output instead. So there seems to be an issue with enabling HDMI audio output. I've struggled with this a couple times, but I do have a Dell laptop with Win11 and Nvidia. I've only ever used REW with it for stereo output at a friend's house. The stereo output was fine, but I wasn't able to try 7.1. I'm headed to AXPONA tomorrow so I may not get a chance to try it today. But at some point I'll run the laptop into my system and see if I can figure anything out. |
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Post by hsamwel on Apr 11, 2023 4:47:40 GMT -5
I looked t it a long time ago. I actually had REW up’n going a few years ago. No problem then. I noticed my laptop, although having a Nvidia graphics chip is running on the Intel internal graphics. This also means internal HDMI audio output. But there seems no way in Windows 11 that I can change this as I could in Windows 10. They have removed the energy settings for graphics output. On my previous laptop I set it to always use the high performance graphics when I’m on power and internal when on battery. I’m asking ASUS support and checking the internet for suggestions. I have my output device set to 7.1. I have had this now for a while. REW recognises that I have 8 channels but I don’t get any sound from them and distortion from L/R. I’m guessing there is something wrong with the driver for the internal graphics. Or compatiblity issues with REW and this driver. I just bought a new laptop early december last year. I do get sound from all 8 channels when testing the settings in Windows though. Guessing also that’s why I had some issues with Java in REW somehow. I’m going to try to change to the Nvidia output instead. So there seems to be an issue with enabling HDMI audio output. I've struggled with this a couple times, but I do have a Dell laptop with Win11 and Nvidia. I've only ever used REW with it for stereo output at a friend's house. The stereo output was fine, but I wasn't able to try 7.1. I'm headed to AXPONA tomorrow so I may not get a chance to try it today. But at some point I'll run the laptop into my system and see if I can figure anything out. Thanks. I found some settings tips in the PDF that will be useful. I already had an older version of it in my ipad. But generally nothing that would change me from getting any sound. My guess is I will get it working if I can change it to use Nvidia instead if the Intel graphics. |
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Post by hsamwel on May 18, 2023 9:27:40 GMT -5
I looked t it a long time ago. I actually had REW up’n going a few years ago. No problem then. I noticed my laptop, although having a Nvidia graphics chip is running on the Intel internal graphics. This also means internal HDMI audio output. But there seems no way in Windows 11 that I can change this as I could in Windows 10. They have removed the energy settings for graphics output. On my previous laptop I set it to always use the high performance graphics when I’m on power and internal when on battery. I’m asking ASUS support and checking the internet for suggestions. I have my output device set to 7.1. I have had this now for a while. REW recognises that I have 8 channels but I don’t get any sound from them and distortion from L/R. I’m guessing there is something wrong with the driver for the internal graphics. Or compatiblity issues with REW and this driver. I just bought a new laptop early december last year. I do get sound from all 8 channels when testing the settings in Windows though. Guessing also that’s why I had some issues with Java in REW somehow. I’m going to try to change to the Nvidia output instead. So there seems to be an issue with enabling HDMI audio output. I've struggled with this a couple times, but I do have a Dell laptop with Win11 and Nvidia. I've only ever used REW with it for stereo output at a friend's house. The stereo output was fine, but I wasn't able to try 7.1. I'm headed to AXPONA tomorrow so I may not get a chance to try it today. But at some point I'll run the laptop into my system and see if I can figure anything out. A little update.. After a lengthy conversation with several people at ASUS I got the information that Nvidia graphics is not possible through the HDMI output or the internal display. Only through the USB-C/thunderbolt output. This really sucks, and no information anywhere about this. I ordered a USB-C to HDMI adapter.. First got the wrong one (for Displayport).. Then just last week I got the right one. Sure it uses Nvidia, and no distortion at all in REW.. Although no multi channel output. Only stereo. I can set it to supporting 7.1 in audio settings in Windows. Even REW see this and says I have 8 channel output. But no sound from any speaker other than the fronts. This is frustrating. |
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Post by marcl on May 18, 2023 9:39:33 GMT -5
So there seems to be an issue with enabling HDMI audio output. I've struggled with this a couple times, but I do have a Dell laptop with Win11 and Nvidia. I've only ever used REW with it for stereo output at a friend's house. The stereo output was fine, but I wasn't able to try 7.1. I'm headed to AXPONA tomorrow so I may not get a chance to try it today. But at some point I'll run the laptop into my system and see if I can figure anything out. A little update.. After a lengthy conversation with several people at ASUS I got the information that Nvidia graphics is not possible through the HDMI output or the internal display. Only through the USB-C/thunderbolt output. This really sucks, and no information anywhere about this. I ordered a USB-C to HDMI adapter.. First got the wrong one (for Displayport).. Then just last week I got the right one. Sure it uses Nvidia, and no distortion at all in REW.. Although no multi channel output. Only stereo. I can set it to supporting 7.1 in audio settings in Windows. Even REW see this and says I have 8 channel output. But no sound from any speaker other than the fronts. This is frustrating. I understand. My new Dell laptop only has USB-C ... one for power and two for whatever else. So I had to buy a hub just to use my mouse dongle and connect HDMI or ethernet if I need to. I have not had a chance to try to see if I can get 8 channel to work. |
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on May 18, 2023 9:43:05 GMT -5
I should just note, for other folks having similar issues, that this sort of thing depends on the specific computer and graphics card you have. NVidia makes a lot of different models of graphics cards... And, depending on your computer, they may be in the form of "motherboard graphics" or "a separate graphics card"... And the exact capabilities and limitations of different ones are often quite different. When you use a USB output you are bypassing the internal graphics processing entirely... and the device you're connected to becomes "an external graphics and/or sound card". (So this generally bypasses any limitations of the internal graphics or audio hardware.) As one example of typical limitations... Some computers with NVidia graphics cards can play HCDP protected video content from an internal 4k UHD disc drive. However, with many older systems, including one I have, you can play this content from the "Intel motherboard HDMI output" but NOT from the HDMI output on the NVidia Graphics card. It requires a specific combination of 4k UHD drive, CPU model, and graphics chipset, as well as an HDCP-capable monitor or TV, to enable you to play HDCP protected content. (Most NVidia graphics cards older than three or four years will NOT fulfill this requirement... specifically for 4k discs.) So there seems to be an issue with enabling HDMI audio output. I've struggled with this a couple times, but I do have a Dell laptop with Win11 and Nvidia. I've only ever used REW with it for stereo output at a friend's house. The stereo output was fine, but I wasn't able to try 7.1. I'm headed to AXPONA tomorrow so I may not get a chance to try it today. But at some point I'll run the laptop into my system and see if I can figure anything out. A little update.. After a lengthy conversation with several people at ASUS I got the information that Nvidia graphics is not possible through the HDMI output or the internal display. Only through the USB-C/thunderbolt output. This really sucks, and no information anywhere about this. I ordered a USB-C to HDMI adapter.. First got the wrong one (for Displayport).. Then just last week I got the right one. Sure it uses Nvidia, and no distortion at all in REW.. Although no multi channel output. Only stereo. I can set it to supporting 7.1 in audio settings in Windows. Even REW see this and says I have 8 channel output. But no sound from any speaker other than the fronts. This is frustrating. |
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Post by hsamwel on May 18, 2023 15:41:22 GMT -5
I should just note, for other folks having similar issues, that this sort of thing depends on the specific computer and graphics card you have. NVidia makes a lot of different models of graphics cards... And, depending on your computer, they may be in the form of "motherboard graphics" or "a separate graphics card"... And the exact capabilities and limitations of different ones are often quite different. When you use a USB output you are bypassing the internal graphics processing entirely... and the device you're connected to becomes "an external graphics and/or sound card". (So this generally bypasses any limitations of the internal graphics or audio hardware.) As one example of typical limitations... Some computers with NVidia graphics cards can play HCDP protected video content from an internal 4k UHD disc drive. However, with many older systems, including one I have, you can play this content from the "Intel motherboard HDMI output" but NOT from the HDMI output on the NVidia Graphics card. It requires a specific combination of 4k UHD drive, CPU model, and graphics chipset, as well as an HDCP-capable monitor or TV, to enable you to play HDCP protected content. (Most NVidia graphics cards older than three or four years will NOT fulfill this requirement... specifically for 4k discs.) A little update.. After a lengthy conversation with several people at ASUS I got the information that Nvidia graphics is not possible through the HDMI output or the internal display. Only through the USB-C/thunderbolt output. This really sucks, and no information anywhere about this. I ordered a USB-C to HDMI adapter.. First got the wrong one (for Displayport).. Then just last week I got the right one. Sure it uses Nvidia, and no distortion at all in REW.. Although no multi channel output. Only stereo. I can set it to supporting 7.1 in audio settings in Windows. Even REW see this and says I have 8 channel output. But no sound from any speaker other than the fronts. This is frustrating. Thanks for your input on the matter.. I have pretty modern Nvidia 3050 card/chipset on my laptop. While using the ”external” Nvidia the internal screen still uses the Intel internal graphics. So it’s double graphics output not a simple mirror. My laptop is a mid end 2021 generation, ASUS FX506HC. The USB-C works internally like a Display port connector. Most manufacturers has gone to USB-C because this is a multi purpose connector. This is something I have found out while searching this issue I just found out the reason I had no sound. Windows defaulted to 120hz refresh rate to my projector. I thought I could just try with 60hz. And sure enough now REW works as expected. The strange thing though, while using 120hz Windows setup plays all channels but REW won’t. |
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ttocs
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Post by ttocs on Oct 30, 2023 12:53:45 GMT -5
I've tested All Stereo BM before, and as before, there is no practical way to field test All Stereo in general, but there are ways of showing some things that are going on with the elevated Bass Management stuff. All Stereo shows up as a selection choice when more than stereo channels is configured. I tested all configs I could have up to 7.1.4, but there was no difference in how the L channel was measured with the caveat being that other channels are active even when measuring a single channel, such as all of the Left side channels when measuring L. So the fix here is to just turn off the amps going to other channels. But to make it even simpler I just setup a 3.1 system and only kept the Left speaker amp on, all others are off, and that includes the subwoofer. In the plot below it should be noted that Red is when L is setup with a 40Hz crossover, Blue is with L at 200Hz crossover, Dotted lines are when Stereo is the audio mode, Solid lines is when ALL STEREO audio mode is active. All traces except the TEAL trace are with L setup as Small with 40Hz or 200Hz crossover settings, the TEAL trace is with L setup as LARGE. Disregard the huge difference in Output Level between Stereo and All Stereo, that's for another discussion. This post is to point out a theory of mine regarding how the BM is being handled with All Stereo. This All Stereo BMbug has been around for a long time now, and it's been worse, so it's a bit better these days. I don't recall the firmware versions, and frankly I don't care enough anymore to want to verify what happened and when. I just want to point out something that shouldn't be happening in a Small Channel below the Crossover Point. The top pair of traces are with Stereo engaged and show how the L speaker is affected with 40Hz and 200Hz crossover settings. The bottom three traces are with ALL STEREO engaged. Notice how the Red trace, with a 40Hz XO follows well with the L-Large Teal trace until the 40Hz XO takes effect at around 80Hz. BUTTTT. The solid Blue trace in ALL STEREO with a 200Hz XO starts dropping off as expected below 300Hz or so, but when it drops to about 90Hz it BUMPS WAY UP to almost the same as when L is Large! This leads me to believe that there is something messed up in the code with respect to how the crossover is being handled in ALL STEREO. The subwoofer is OFF, all other channels are OFF, so this BUMP is NOT supposed to be there below the XO in a channel setup as SMALL. What's causing it? Something is allowing a massive amount of bass signal to leak into a Small Channel far below the XO. Yes, I could show what happens when the subwoofer is active, but that doesn't explain the simple fact that there is a BMbump below the XO in a Small Channel. It seems to me that BM is working ok by the fact that the level starts dropping at around 300Hz when the XO=200Hz, and continues to drop until around 90Hz when it suddenly increases and peaks around 55Hz and then drops again. Is there a BM LOWER LIMIT somewhere that is missing, or possibly something else that's allowing bass to be leaked into the channel? Now, I should point out, that this is with one of the Fronts channels. I'll test a Surround channel next to see if things are similar, but it may not show up as easily being that my Surrounds are a lot more limited in the bass region. But I'll give it a try. So to recap about the TEAL, Blue, and Red solid traces for when ALL STEREO is engaged, the TEAL trace is with the L Channel setup as Large and shows how this speaker would naturally look in a plot. The Red trace is with a 40Hz XO. The Blue trace is with a 200Hz XO.  |
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ttocs
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Post by ttocs on Oct 30, 2023 15:51:17 GMT -5
I just did a quick test using Surround Right channel, no sub, 200XO, and no matter how high I raised the volume level, the bass frequencies under 60Hz remained low. So the All Stereo bass boost only seems to only affect Front Channels.
I'll check the C Channel tonight.
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thx2023
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Post by thx2023 on Oct 30, 2023 18:12:01 GMT -5
I just did a quick test using Surround Right channel, no sub, 200XO, and no matter how high I raised the volume level, the bass frequencies under 60Hz remained low. So the All Stereo bass boost only seems to only affect Front Channels. I'll check the C Channel tonight. |
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thx2023
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Post by thx2023 on Oct 30, 2023 18:15:12 GMT -5
Thanks for checking ttocs! Perhaps firmware 3.3X will fix this, or, the great pumpkin will rise over the pumpkin patch, and the RMC-1+ will fix everything all at once! (likely not...)
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ttocs
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Post by ttocs on Oct 30, 2023 21:52:32 GMT -5
Thanks for checking ttocs! Perhaps firmware 3.3X will fix this, or, the great pumpkin will rise over the pumpkin patch, and the RMC-1+ will fix everything all at once! (likely not...) I doubt this will be fixed soon. I tested the Center channel and found it acts the same as the Surrounds. So this part is good. As the week goes on I'll do some better structured testing of the L&R Fronts with All Stereo to see if anything can show what's going on here. |
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