T2+ ... Help!

[dough]

Hi,

I'm trying to figure out what to do here. I recently moved into a house with a basement where I could set up a 2-channel stereo in a good sized room. Had a pair of bookshelf speakers that, while good, were too small for the room.
After some research, I bought a pair of the T2+ speakers.

The good: Great bass.
The bad: Treble harsh, shrill, overbearing, airless.

I've tried room rearrangement, biwiring, a newer amp. Nothing helps. By the time I went through all this, the 30-day trial period came and went.
What to do now? I hate to say this here, but I can't keep them when they sound like this.

Thank you,
dough

Parasound P/FET 900 preamp
Parasond 2125 power amp
Onkyo 6-disc changer

[routlaw]

Don't own the T2+ but do have a pair of B1+ in my studio system and they are anything but what you're describing. What is the rest of the room like? You say basement, so is it possible your walls are concrete or cinder block untreated? That would certainly make for a very reverberant room. Is the floor still untreated concrete?

[brutiarti]

I will blame the preamp. I run a pair of T2 with a TA-100 and it sound great.

[cawgijoe]

Everything routlaw asked about....plus, how far away from the walls are the speakers? The tweeters in the T2+ are excellent....I have a pair of B1+ in a dining room two channel system (drywall/carpeted floor) and they sound great.

Any chance you can post a few pics of the room and setup?

[doc1963]

I have the original T2s and would agree with the other posters above me... they sound the total opposite of what you're describing. I also agree that it could be a result of your room furnishings/treatements (or a lack thereof).

You could try experimenting with your on/off axis positioning. I have found that, to my ears, "my" T2s sound best with very (and I mean very) little "toe-in". Since these are a tower speaker, with the tweeter positioned at your seated ear level, you might also try tilting the front of the speakers up slightly.

No speaker sounds the same in every room (or to every listener) and, unfortunately, these just might not be the speaker for "you". But try all of these recommendations (here and above) and see if they help you.

[vcautokid]

What is the room treatment condition. You say this is a basement. If the room is live to begin with, that could be a source of difficulty and I would look at that closely as any speaker with terrific highs may be a bit much without addressing that first.

[pallpoul]

I also own a pair of T2+, driven by a combination of XPA-2,-Gen-3 and PT-100. They don't sound harsh at all. Their maybe a slightly on the bright side, but the highs are never harsh at all.
Try a different pre amp, SS or maybe tubes?, and see what happens.
As others have mentioned, check for room treatment too.

[tchaik]

I agree with all the comments before about room treatment and the like. the preamp and amp you have are of excellent quality and reputation. I am wondering about the CD player. Maybe, just maybe it could be improved by the use of a separate DAC. I don't know enough about the player, but I do wonder if it might be the weak link.

I have the T2's also and do not experience anything that you describe. happy audio journey to you. may your search be a fun one.


tchaik............

[JKCashin]

Another B1+ owner here, two pairs actually, one pair driven with a very cheap Chinese mini-amp. Also an ownew of a C2+ center speaker. All of these have the exact same tweeter as the T1+, and all of them sound amazing. Treble is crisp without being tiring, clear, and not fatiguing at all. One of my B2+ sets is used near-field on my office desk, daily.

[JKCashin]

I just did some searching on the preamp.... most reviews are very favourable.... no mention of harshness in the treble at all, so I'd say that's ruled out, and you already tried another amp. Can you try them in a different room?

[dough]

Thank you for your suggestions. It is an unfinished basement, and I have put a carpet down and there are recliners, a sofa, and other furnishings around the area. The speakers are 8 feet apart and I sit around 10 feet from them. The "sweet spot" is indeed a little closer. I had a pair of Paradigm monitors, around 5-6 years old, and the treble was much better. No, I don't have anywhere else to try them. I have tried a DAC on the CD player, no difference. I'm starting to think, at this point, the speakers won't work with the room, or my ears.

[dough]

Oh, also, the speakers are facing straight ahead now. Toe-in makes no difference. I'd try a newer preamp, but affordable ones are about nonexistent these days, and the ones I've found don't have provisions for tape decks anymore.

[housetech]

dough,
I own the T2+, bought when they first came out and my impression was similar to yours. I really wanted to like them.
The first week listening, the Mrs asked to do A-B test, the T2+ lost to our M.A.s BIGLY.
So I moved them around, used different electronics, still not impressed. REGRETTED the purchase.
The tone settings ended up very different than any other speakers to make them listenable. (is that a word?)
I recently bought (& returned) a Denon DRA-800H and changed my systems (multiple) around- change players, amps, speakers to different configurations & areas.
The T2+ ended up in our smaller second living area 14x17 with a lower ceiling (9 ft?), closer listening position and using the same Integra receiver. Honestly I feared they could sound worse, but what the hell.
WOW big difference.
They found a home and I'm enjoying them.
You have a room acoustics issue.

[dough]

Aug 18, 2021 11:41:47 GMT -5 housetech said:

dough,
I own the T2+, bought when they first came out and my impression was similar to yours. I really wanted to like them.
The first week listening, the Mrs asked to do A-B test, the T2+ lost to our M.A.s BIGLY.
So I moved them around, used different electronics, still not impressed. REGRETTED the purchase.
The tone settings ended up very different than any other speakers to make them listenable. (is that a word?)
I recently bought (& returned) a Denon DRA-800H and changed my systems (multiple) around- change players, amps, speakers to different configurations & areas.
The T2+ ended up in our smaller second living area 14x17 with a lower ceiling (9 ft?), closer listening position and using the same Integra receiver. Honestly I feared they could sound worse, but what the hell.
WOW big difference.
They found a home and I'm enjoying them.
You have a room acoustics issue.

At this point, thinking all the factors over, I'm inclined to agree. So, after the 30 days, are they returnable at all? Or do I have to sell them myself?

[housetech]

Emotiva is a good company to work with.
Call them and explain the situation, willing to bet they will work with you.
I am 100% satisfied with their customer service & support. Call them, they can't eat you. lol

[drtrey3]

Mine are daily drivers and the only time I mess with the tone is on a rolled off YouTube video or goosing the bass a little cause I can. They are more treble forward with the tweeters pointing at your ears, but that is easily dealt with. Sorry you are having difficulties, best wishes.

Trey

[dough]

Aug 18, 2021 13:04:40 GMT -5 housetech said:

Emotiva is a good company to work with.
Call them and explain the situation, willing to bet they will work with you.
I am 100% satisfied with their customer service & support. Call them, they can't eat you. lol

Contacted them...they won't let me return them. This is really terrible.

[teaman]

At this point I would try an Emotiva preamp and see what you think. Worse case scenario you have thirty day trial, and return it if not happy. I know of no manufacturers that agree to take speakers back months later because of personal preference or room acoustic issues. To me the preamp or processor is the biggest sound barrier in the link of importance.

[housetech]

For the past year the T2+ is used for background music listening, not sit down, don't play them much, I'm spoiled.
When I bought the T2+, I was looking at KLIPSCH 8000F but they were 50% more (& not 3-way).
I went back to some reviews of the T2+ no one mentioned the tweeter being overly bright, but graphs do show a rise in treble
I did some 'sit-down' listening to the T2+ today, various genres.
Sony DVP S7700 (old but very good for music) DVD/CD disc played
2 Denons- DRA 385 80w/ch & AVR 485 75w/ch (8 ohm) There was little difference between them sound-wise, DRA was a bit better 'analogue in' with Sony DAC, neither are Parasound or XMC quality obviously. I can play them through Monitor Audio and sound good. M.A.s are very particular with up-stream electronics. I did not want to move the speakers or disconnect and bring in the Integra (135 w/ch with EQ)
As I stated before, T2 are in a smaller room now. Speakers are 1 ft from wall, 7 ft apart.  Sitting 9-10 away the tweeters are ear level and too bright. Everything was "shouty", I dropped treble down to -4db then -6db before the issue was less noticeable. At -6 db the speaker started loosing over-all presence and at -4db, it wasn't enough attenuation.
When I was listening (direct mode) in another room (30 ft away) they seemed to blend better.
Don't know if a tube amp would mellow them down some. I do like the mid range & woofers.
I'm questioning the crossover (maybe bad parts from a vender?). I'm sure Emotiva won't resign it to attenuate the tweeter... but maybe an upgrade accessory??? (hint, hint) 
It took me us a while to confirm what we don't like, so I understand dough's situation.
I too may list them on the local 'for sale' website.

edit- T2 do sound better in the room they're in now., still not satisfactory & wondering if the ERT8.3 is better vs T2+

[drtrey3]

My best bud has a pair of the ERT8.3s. They are fine speakers and I love listening to them. As a personal preference, that Heil tweeter really works for me, so I prefer my T2s, but those are lovely and smooth speakers.

Trey