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Post by Boomzilla on Jul 30, 2022 8:42:30 GMT -5
Speaker selection for low-volume dynamics? I don't care about bass extension, frequency flatness, treble extension, or looks. I can supply a "good" power amplifier match with as much power as desired for either of the contenders.
I understand that few have heard either of these speakers (unless you were at the Texas Audio Show), but the previous generation Klipsch RP8000F has been out for quite a while and I've owned the Emotiva T2 speakers (two or three times). The T2 models didn't particularly impress me at low volumes (which is why I sold them and currently run a pair of Klipsch RP600m bookshelf speakers with a subwoofer).
Since shipping is going to be impressive for either of the speakers I'm considering, I'm less than enthusiastic about getting both here and then having to return one or the other.
Suggestions?
Thanks - Boomzilla
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Post by creimes on Jul 30, 2022 9:15:58 GMT -5
Bass extension and treble extension, that pretty much is dynamics, I find more volume typically gives you more dynamics to a certain point haha, I do know what you mean though. I'm not sure how to explain it but it's like owning a large tower and a smaller bookshelf, at most any volume(even lower volume) you need to set the volume dial a bit higher for the smaller speaker(less drivers and smaller cabinet) than into the larger speaker with more drivers and larger cabinet, so for me the smaller speaker can sound more alive than a much larger one at the same volume setting maybe because of this, this is why I think listeners that listen at lower volumes in smaller room prefer a stand mounted speaker. Like I said, I'm not sure if that is the correct wording or not, if you look up the meaning of "Dynamics for music" you get this "the varying levels of volume of sound in different parts of a musical performance" which can be hard to achieve without actually turning it up the volume IMO but that's just me haha. Also I vote Chane 753 but I haven't heard the others  Chad |
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Post by Boomzilla on Jul 30, 2022 9:43:19 GMT -5
A Klipsch La Scala, for example, will sound dynamic at background levels. I think it's the horn loading, but I could be wrong...
Two things tie together to make this happen: High sensitivity and low distortion. The first mostly causes the second. The higher the sensitivity of the speaker, the less the driver displacement that is required at any given SPL. Lower driver displacement causes less intermodulation distortion. Since horns couple the driver to the room air so efficiently, very little driver displacement is required to provide the same SPL that would cause a low sensitivity speaker to have far, far higher driver displacement.
I haven't heard Chane products.
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Post by creimes on Jul 30, 2022 10:32:35 GMT -5
A Klipsch La Scala, for example, will sound dynamic at background levels. I think it's the horn loading, but I could be wrong... Two things tie together to make this happen: High sensitivity and low distortion. The first mostly causes the second. The higher the sensitivity of the speaker, the less the driver displacement that is required at any given SPL. Lower driver displacement causes less intermodulation distortion. Since horns couple the driver to the room air so efficiently, very little driver displacement is required to provide the same SPL that would cause a low sensitivity speaker to have far, far higher driver displacement. I haven't heard Chane products. I do really enjoy the horns in my 753's, they employ the 18 Sound HD1030 tweeter in a 60/40 horn configuration, I've never been a fan of horn loaded tweeters till owning these, but I haven't had the chance to hear something like the La Scala's either just the lower end Klipsch stuff which I didn't personally enjoy.  |
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Post by mgbpuff on Aug 1, 2022 9:46:49 GMT -5
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Post by Boomzilla on Aug 2, 2022 23:09:08 GMT -5
Well... Klipsch is sending me some RP-8000f II speakers for review. Should I simultaneously order some Emotiva T3+ ones for comparative review?
Yes? No? Maybe? Any of you going to come calm my wife down when she finds out I ordered and paid for those T3+ ones?
Boomzilla
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Post by creimes on Aug 3, 2022 9:22:45 GMT -5
Well... Klipsch is sending me some RP-8000f II speakers for review. Should I simultaneously order some Emotiva T3+ ones for comparative review? Yes? No? Maybe? Any of you going to come calm my wife down when she finds out I ordered and paid for those T3+ ones? Boomzilla So no to the Chanes then, just more Emotiva's haha, I guess you already have more Klipsch coming. |
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Post by Boomzilla on Aug 3, 2022 9:26:42 GMT -5
Once the Klipsch review is done, if I still haven't settled on the Klipsch or Emotiva speakers, I'll definitely ask to review some Chane speakers.
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Post by creimes on Aug 3, 2022 9:34:37 GMT -5
Once the Klipsch review is done, if I still haven't settled on the Klipsch or Emotiva speakers, I'll definitely ask to review some Chane speakers. He will be sold out by then, the current 700 series is on it's final run which is arriving to them this weekend, was actually supposed to be two weeks ago but delays as usual, afaik it is almost sold through again with a few units remaining, he will have a Gen 2 series next but will not be a sealed bass section so a few changes due to part shortages is what I heard. That's the only issue with Chane speakers, he only can or does make so many and they sell quickly, there will be a new A series so those towers have sold through, the L7 in the L series hasn't even hit production due to part shortages and the 700 series is almost sold through again  if I was closer I would borrow you the 753's but I'm about a million miles away haha This is Jon's latest post... "Quick final update for Aug first. 753, 752, and 740s product was to arrive last week but we've been told to now expect it one week forward. To repeat: We expect the container this coming weekend, more or less. I'm going to attempt a firm date and should we get one before mid-week, we'll plan to process orders accordingly. If we're on track we'll start processing orders mid-week as usual. From there all orders will generate a bill of lading and we'll update all of your accounts.
This is a big order and we have some spaces left so grab 752 and 753 while you can. 752 will sell through first while 740s will continue as Gen 2 product, as planned. Please remember that this is the best deal we'll ever offer on a 700-class speaker in either of the two larger sizes. We can only raise prices to reflect costs from here on out and I don't want to shock new customers later this year and next." |
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Post by Boomzilla on Aug 3, 2022 10:19:04 GMT -5
In general, manufacturers prefer to have new models reviewed rather than discontinued ones...
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Post by ttocs on Aug 3, 2022 14:35:50 GMT -5
Well... Klipsch is sending me some RP-8000f II speakers for review. Should I simultaneously order some Emotiva T3+ ones for comparative review? Yes? No? Maybe? Yes. Any of you going to come calm my wife down when she finds out I ordered and paid for those T3+ ones? Boomzilla If she's upset, make a nice hot beverage for her, like some hot cocoa. It's what Sheldon would do. (Big Bang Theory) |
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Post by Boomzilla on Aug 5, 2022 12:48:13 GMT -5
Well hold the horses! There seems to be a contender or two that I'd overlooked in the "inexpensive full-range" speaker market. For about ¾ the price of the Emotiva T3+, there is the Heco Aurora 1000 with a -3dB rating of 22 Hz. and a stated sensitivity of 93dB. The Heco has two 8" woofers rather than the T3+'s three and but one midrange vs. the T3+'s two. The Heco tweeter is a soft dome rather than the ribbon. But they're well reviewed and come with a light color finish rather than black only. The MSRP is $1,500 / pair. For ½ the price of the Emotiva T3+, there is the Heco Aurora 700 with a -3dB rating of 25 Hz. and a stated sensitivity of 92dB. This Heco has two 6.5" woofers, one midrange, and a soft-dome tweeter. Also well reviewed, these are also available in light wood. MSRP is $900 / pair. |
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Post by 405x5 on Aug 5, 2022 13:31:52 GMT -5
99 percent of readership is unable to answer this poll so what’s the point?
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Post by simpleman68 on Aug 5, 2022 13:37:25 GMT -5
Well hold the horses! There seems to be a contender or two that I'd overlooked in the "inexpensive full-range" speaker market. For about ¾ the price of the Emotiva T3+, there is the Heco Aurora 1000 with a -3dB rating of 22 Hz. and a stated sensitivity of 93dB. The Heco has two 8" woofers rather than the T3+'s three and but one midrange vs. the T3+'s two. The Heco tweeter is a soft dome rather than the ribbon. But they're well reviewed and come with a light color finish rather than black only. The MSRP is $1,500 / pair. For ½ the price of the Emotiva T3+, there is the Heco Aurora 700 with a -3dB rating of 25 Hz. and a stated sensitivity of 92dB. This Heco has two 6.5" woofers, one midrange, and a soft-dome tweeter. Also well reviewed, these are also available in light wood. MSRP is $900 / pair. Nice to see competitors out there trying their best to turn out a great product for an affordable (by the masses) price point.
I think almost any well implemented ribbon tweet is going to outshine soft domes in the budget price range. I could be wrong but I'd be surprised. Scott
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Post by Boomzilla on Aug 5, 2022 13:44:43 GMT -5
Since few have heard the Klipsch RP-8000f II and even fewer have heard the Emotiva T3+, I think that 0% of readership is able to answer the poll (including me). I am asking not for answers based on personal experience with the two different speakers, but rather for answers based on experience with the speakers' predecessors - The Klipsch RP-8000 and the Emotiva T2+. Hopefully, since the Klipsch is a very popular speaker and since the Emotiva has been in production for some time, there will be posters here who have heard both. Barring that, I'm essentially asking if the majority of Loungers agree with me that Klipsch products, generally speaking, are more dynamic at very low volumes than are Emotiva speakers. I have owned the Emotiva T2 (not the T2+) and although it was a great speaker, it did have a "volume threshold" that had to be exceeded before the speaker began to sound dynamic. I have also owned Klipsch Heresy, Cornwall, La Scala, and RP-600m models, and although they did sound more dynamic at very low volumes, their frequency response was not as flat as my Emotiva speakers.
However... Both Klipsch AND Emotiva have new models that I haven't heard. I'm asking which of these new models might sound best at very low volumes. It's likely than nobody will have heard both at very low volumes, but if anyone were to know, I'd expect to find them here.
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Post by Boomzilla on Aug 6, 2022 4:39:44 GMT -5
Another question that is pertinent is "what amplifiers sound dynamic at low power outputs?" Back in the day, I played my Dahlquist DQ-10 speakers (relatively low sensitivity) with an Adcom GFA-1 power cube amplifier (lots of watts). For some reason, the pairing sounded almost as dynamic as my Klipsch horn-loaded speakers even at VERY low volumes. If I could find an amplifier that would sound equally dynamic with Emotiva's T3+ speakers, I'd have a winner! KeithL - What properties make a power amplifier sound more dynamic at very low output wattage (like one watt or less)? Is there an advantage to specific topologies (Class-A? Class AB? Class D?) Is there any spec to compare that will correlate with low power dynamics? And finally, is there any reason to consider replacing my current PA-1 Emotiva amplifiers with the new BasX mono blocks, the HC-1 high current mono blocks, or the XPA-1 mono blocks? Could I be assured of better low-volume dynamics with any of these other available Emotiva alternatives? Thanks - Boomzilla Asked another way, will a 1KW power amplifier sound "more dynamic" at <1 watt than will a 10W amplifier? I'm pretty sure I already know the answer to this one (my flea-watt Heathkit tube amp sounds more dynamic than any other amp I own at the moment). But that's empirical evidence - what does theory say? |
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if I was closer I would borrow you the 753's but I'm about a million miles away haha
