Sayer
Sensei
Chasing better sound.
Posts: 139
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Post by Sayer on Nov 10, 2023 15:01:33 GMT -5
I've noticed on some (not all) stereo recordings (including the music I produce), when auto mode is selected on my XMC-2, it plays back as surround... and it sounds pretty good! I would not use this for critical listening, but it offers a nice immersive experience for casual listening. I'm thinking that even the height speakers are producing sound, but not sure. Some stereo material plays back as stereo in this mode. It makes me wonder if it comes down to the mixing/mastering used for the recording. I'm also curious if this is something that the Emotiva processing is doing, or is it more of a standard thing that all processors will due based on the Dolby Surround format. If it is Emotiva processing, will it still occur with the next gen processors? I'm quite enjoying it.  |
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Post by 405x5 on Nov 10, 2023 15:18:28 GMT -5
I've noticed on some (not all) stereo recordings (including the music I produce), when auto mode is selected on my XMC-2, it plays back as surround... and it sounds pretty good! I would not use this for critical listening, but it offers a nice immersive experience for casual listening. I'm thinking that even the height speakers are producing sound, but not sure. Some stereo material plays back as stereo in this mode. It makes me wonder if it comes down to the mixing/mastering used for the recording. I'm also curious if this is something that the Emotiva processing is doing, or is it more of a standard thing that all processors will due based on the Dolby Surround format. If it is Emotiva processing, will it still occur with the next gen processors? I'm quite enjoying it. Yes, that auto setting makes for strange bedfellow…… You’ve already alluded to it it has more to do with that RIAA standard than anything else. |
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KeithL
Administrator 
Posts: 9,945
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Post by KeithL on Nov 10, 2023 15:27:23 GMT -5
On the XMC-2 and RMC-1 (and most of our other processors), when you play something in AUTO mode, the processor "tries to match the source to the speakers you have". So, for example, if you play a stereo recording, and have a 7.1.4 system, the processor will use its surround sound capabilities to "expand the source content to fill all your speakers". And, if you play a 5.1 channel recording, it will also do so (assuming you have more than 5.1 channels). However, exactly what happens will depend on several things. In AUTO mode, we will generally try to expand the source to fill all of your speakers, including your subs. In REFERENCE STEREO mode we will play the source exactly as we receive it. Certain other settings may do this "partway". On our processors we do this using the "standard decoders" - so the DSU (the Dolby Surround Upmixer) and the equivalent DTS upmixer. You will also note some limitations. (For example, when it upmixes content, the version of the DSU currently used in our processors doesn't send sound to the Front Wide speakers, if you have them... but an upcoming version will.) We base our decisions on certain flags included in the audio data. (So, if your cable company says that it's sending 5.1 channel audio, we treat it that way - even if they're really just sending an old stereo movie using only the front two channels.) And, yes, the current Dolby Surround Upmixer does an excellent job with lots of content... But exactly how well it works will depend on the content itself. (You'll find that it works especially well with live content and other content that contains lots of "ambience information".) I've noticed on some (not all) stereo recordings (including the music I produce), when auto mode is selected on my XMC-2, it plays back as surround... and it sounds pretty good! I would not use this for critical listening, but it offers a nice immersive experience for casual listening. I'm thinking that even the height speakers are producing sound, but not sure. Some stereo material plays back as stereo in this mode. It makes me wonder if it comes down to the mixing/mastering used for the recording. I'm also curious if this is something that the Emotiva processing is doing, or is it more of a standard thing that all processors will due based on the Dolby Surround format. If it is Emotiva processing, will it still occur with the next gen processors? I'm quite enjoying it. |
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Post by AudioHTIT on Nov 10, 2023 15:52:43 GMT -5
… Some stereo material plays back as stereo in this mode. … First, I agree, the DSU that is normally invoked with Auto, is very good, Neural:X (which typically has to be chosen), is also good; the two are the best upmixers I’ve heard. Though I don’t remember the last time I saw Stereo chosen for a stereo source, when the input was set to Auto. Do you have an example where you see this? (it likely depends on the source as well). |
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KeithL
Administrator
Posts: 9,945
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Post by KeithL on Nov 10, 2023 17:04:04 GMT -5
I think you misunderstand how these modes work. You're never going to see a source played in stereo with AUTO selected... unless you actually only have two speakers. (That would equate to "upmixing the source to use all of your speakers"... even though, in this case, "all" is just 2.) If you have more than two speakers, and you want to play something in stereo, you need to choose some other mode... like Stereo or Direct. The processor actually displays the format of the incoming signal and its mode setting... (It does NOT actually tell you how many channels it is decoding that source TO.) So, for example, if you see that the source is "PCM 2.0" and the mode is AUTO or SURROUND... Your incoming signal is stereo (PCM 2.0)... And, being in AUTO mode, the processor will attempt to play that source "using all your speakers" (So, as long as you have more than two speakers, it won't play anything in stereo.) If you want the processor to play something in Stereo then YOU need to CHOOSE Stereo Mode. And, after you do so, the processor will play whatever source you feed it in Stereo. Or, if you CHOOSE Direct Mode... Rather than force anything the processor will simply play the source in however many channels it comes in with... … Some stereo material plays back as stereo in this mode. … First, I agree, the DSU that is normally invoked with Auto, is very good, Neural:X (which typically has to be chosen), is also good; the two are the best upmixers I’ve heard. Though I don’t remember the last time I saw Stereo chosen for a stereo source, when the input was set to Auto. Do you have an example where you see this? (it likely depends on the source as well). |
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Post by AudioHTIT on Nov 10, 2023 18:26:57 GMT -5
I think you misunderstand how these modes work. You're never going to see a source played in stereo with AUTO selected... unless you actually only have two speakers. (That would equate to "upmixing the source to use all of your speakers"... even though, in this case, "all" is just 2.) If you have more than two speakers, and you want to play something in stereo, you need to choose some other mode... like Stereo or Direct. The processor actually displays the format of the incoming signal and its mode setting... (It does NOT actually tell you how many channels it is decoding that source TO.) So, for example, if you see that the source is "PCM 2.0" and the mode is AUTO or SURROUND... Your incoming signal is stereo (PCM 2.0)... And, being in AUTO mode, the processor will attempt to play that source "using all your speakers" (So, as long as you have more than two speakers, it won't play anything in stereo.) If you want the processor to play something in Stereo then YOU need to CHOOSE Stereo Mode. And, after you do so, the processor will play whatever source you feed it in Stereo. Or, if you CHOOSE Direct Mode... Rather than force anything the processor will simply play the source in however many channels it comes in with... First, I agree, the DSU that is normally invoked with Auto, is very good, Neural:X (which typically has to be chosen), is also good; the two are the best upmixers I’ve heard. Though I don’t remember the last time I saw Stereo chosen for a stereo source, when the input was set to Auto. Do you have an example where you see this? (it likely depends on the source as well). I agree, and asked how the OP saw that condition (you quoted the wrong person). |
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Sayer
Sensei
Chasing better sound.
Posts: 139
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Post by Sayer on Nov 11, 2023 22:00:20 GMT -5
Interesting... thanks for all of the info.
I have played stereo files several times that seemed to only have sound coming from the front L & R speakers, it caught my attention. Not sure what the display on the XMC-2 showed, seems it must have said "Surround" after what has been said above. Will have to test it out again. and pay closer attention.
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