Post by jazzman on Jan 3, 2010 8:22:33 GMT -5
Let me start by saying that I had very high expectations for the ERC-1 when I made the decision to purchase this CD player. I was fairly convinced before I auditioned it in my own home system that any product that could produce such high praise in audio forums such as this and yet produce such fervent disrespect from the "self-anointed experts and the Nazi testing and measurement police" in the AVS forum that this unit had to be one incredible CD player. However, my high expectations were dashed fairly quickly once I had actually connected the ERC-1 into my system.
My experience has prompted me to inquire of the members of this forum to determine if my experience is unique or if others have experienced the same problems. My system consists of the following. My listening room is a dedicated home theater room that is approximately 12' wide by 27' deep. I have treated my home theater room with what I consider to be adequate acoustical treatments for elimination of all the first reflection points in the primary listening position and also have bass traps in all four corners of the room to minimize "sloppy bass". The room is not an ideal listening environment, but for viewing movies I have found it more than adequate and actually have come to truly love the sonic characteristics of this room.
For my equipment I am using a Denon 3808CI receiver as my pre-pro, Emotiva XPA-5 for my amplification, Emotiva XRCA interconnects, Belden PF60 for power management, AV123 RS850 Rocket speakers for front transducers, a SVS PC Ultra for my subwoofer (not engaged while auditioning the ERC-1) Canare 4S11 speaker cable and Sony PS3 as my previous Red Book player. My system has been calibrated with Denon's Audyssey Calibration and then fine-tuned with my Radio Shack decibel meter. My listening material was Jazz and they were all recordings that I was very familiar with and had listened to extensively on my PS3.
I used every possible connections I could find to connect the ERC-1 into my Denon 3808CI: Ext In, CD input, coaxial digital input and optical digital input. At first I found the "Ext In" to over accentuate the mid bass frequencies, but once I tweaked with the 2 channel subwoofer setting in the "EXT-IN" setup of the Denon 3808CI so it was so it was set at +15db, I found the "EXT In" input the most desirable input of all inputs for listening to the ERC-1. (I am not exactly sure why the subwoofer setting made any difference, because I heard absolutely no output from SVS PC Ultra regardless of which setting I used 0db, +7.5db or +15db, but the +15db setting definitely tamed the over accentuated mid bass I was hearing.
When using any of the digital inputs into the 3808 from the ERC-1, I found the sound to be less satisfying than any of the analog connections into the 3808. So I am convinced from my experience that the DAC in the ERC-1 is superior to the DAC in my Denon 3808, but this is where it starts to get interesting. While using the analog connections into the 3808, I found that the ERC-1 was quite musical at low to medium low listening levels. The soundstage was fairly wide and all the instruments were fixed in their locations on the soundstage, not floating around like they appeared to do while using the digital outputs of the ERC-1. However, I was very disappointed to discover that there was no real depth to the soundstage when using the ERC-1 analog outputs to the 3808, sporadically, I thought I could hear some depth to the soundstage, but it was only temporary and never anything distinctive or of substantial depth. I am not sure what pscho-acoustically creates the impression of sound stage depth with 2-channel , but I could not hear it with any authority in my setup using the ERC-1 analog outputs. I suppose, I could have moved my RS850 speakers in front of my projector screen instead of having it aligned directly beside and even with the front of the screen. However, the RS850 speakers are monsters and are very difficult to move and I really don't want to move my speakers every time I want to listen to music. Plus my soundstage is very deep when I listen to movies, so I don't think it is strictly speaker positioning causing this problem. I actually felt the depth of the soundstage was much better when using the digital output of my PS3. Although, I am sure much of my perception of soundstage depth when viewing movies is created by my AXIOM QS8 surrounds so perhaps I am mistaken about the speaker positioning.
The other very disappointing thing about the ERC-1 in my system is the fatigue I experience when I listen to the ERC-1 at anything above medium to medium low listening levels. Since connecting the XPA5 to my system, I do not experience fatigue at loud levels when viewing movies. However, as soon as I turn up the volume with the ERC-1 to comparable level of a movie, I can only listen to it for very few minutes before I go running for the remote to turn down the volume to a more acceptable level. So I am wondering if the analog output of the ERC-1 may be too hot for my Denon 3808 to handle at higher listening levels.
If any of the members of this forum have a similar system configuration, can you answer a couple of questions for me. 1) Have you experienced the same issues? 2) Is there anything you did to rectify the problem. 3) Am I expecting too much of Red Book performance?
My position at this point is that If I don't hear some realistic constructive criticism on how to rectify these issues, the ERC-1 will be going back to Emotiva.
Right now, it is just not worth the shelf space or dollar investment for kind of performance I am currently reaping from the ERC-1 for it to continue to stay in my system. Thank you in advance to all of who take the time to reply to this post and thanks again for taking the time to read this rather lengthy commentary.
My experience has prompted me to inquire of the members of this forum to determine if my experience is unique or if others have experienced the same problems. My system consists of the following. My listening room is a dedicated home theater room that is approximately 12' wide by 27' deep. I have treated my home theater room with what I consider to be adequate acoustical treatments for elimination of all the first reflection points in the primary listening position and also have bass traps in all four corners of the room to minimize "sloppy bass". The room is not an ideal listening environment, but for viewing movies I have found it more than adequate and actually have come to truly love the sonic characteristics of this room.
For my equipment I am using a Denon 3808CI receiver as my pre-pro, Emotiva XPA-5 for my amplification, Emotiva XRCA interconnects, Belden PF60 for power management, AV123 RS850 Rocket speakers for front transducers, a SVS PC Ultra for my subwoofer (not engaged while auditioning the ERC-1) Canare 4S11 speaker cable and Sony PS3 as my previous Red Book player. My system has been calibrated with Denon's Audyssey Calibration and then fine-tuned with my Radio Shack decibel meter. My listening material was Jazz and they were all recordings that I was very familiar with and had listened to extensively on my PS3.
I used every possible connections I could find to connect the ERC-1 into my Denon 3808CI: Ext In, CD input, coaxial digital input and optical digital input. At first I found the "Ext In" to over accentuate the mid bass frequencies, but once I tweaked with the 2 channel subwoofer setting in the "EXT-IN" setup of the Denon 3808CI so it was so it was set at +15db, I found the "EXT In" input the most desirable input of all inputs for listening to the ERC-1. (I am not exactly sure why the subwoofer setting made any difference, because I heard absolutely no output from SVS PC Ultra regardless of which setting I used 0db, +7.5db or +15db, but the +15db setting definitely tamed the over accentuated mid bass I was hearing.
When using any of the digital inputs into the 3808 from the ERC-1, I found the sound to be less satisfying than any of the analog connections into the 3808. So I am convinced from my experience that the DAC in the ERC-1 is superior to the DAC in my Denon 3808, but this is where it starts to get interesting. While using the analog connections into the 3808, I found that the ERC-1 was quite musical at low to medium low listening levels. The soundstage was fairly wide and all the instruments were fixed in their locations on the soundstage, not floating around like they appeared to do while using the digital outputs of the ERC-1. However, I was very disappointed to discover that there was no real depth to the soundstage when using the ERC-1 analog outputs to the 3808, sporadically, I thought I could hear some depth to the soundstage, but it was only temporary and never anything distinctive or of substantial depth. I am not sure what pscho-acoustically creates the impression of sound stage depth with 2-channel , but I could not hear it with any authority in my setup using the ERC-1 analog outputs. I suppose, I could have moved my RS850 speakers in front of my projector screen instead of having it aligned directly beside and even with the front of the screen. However, the RS850 speakers are monsters and are very difficult to move and I really don't want to move my speakers every time I want to listen to music. Plus my soundstage is very deep when I listen to movies, so I don't think it is strictly speaker positioning causing this problem. I actually felt the depth of the soundstage was much better when using the digital output of my PS3. Although, I am sure much of my perception of soundstage depth when viewing movies is created by my AXIOM QS8 surrounds so perhaps I am mistaken about the speaker positioning.
The other very disappointing thing about the ERC-1 in my system is the fatigue I experience when I listen to the ERC-1 at anything above medium to medium low listening levels. Since connecting the XPA5 to my system, I do not experience fatigue at loud levels when viewing movies. However, as soon as I turn up the volume with the ERC-1 to comparable level of a movie, I can only listen to it for very few minutes before I go running for the remote to turn down the volume to a more acceptable level. So I am wondering if the analog output of the ERC-1 may be too hot for my Denon 3808 to handle at higher listening levels.
If any of the members of this forum have a similar system configuration, can you answer a couple of questions for me. 1) Have you experienced the same issues? 2) Is there anything you did to rectify the problem. 3) Am I expecting too much of Red Book performance?
My position at this point is that If I don't hear some realistic constructive criticism on how to rectify these issues, the ERC-1 will be going back to Emotiva.
Right now, it is just not worth the shelf space or dollar investment for kind of performance I am currently reaping from the ERC-1 for it to continue to stay in my system. Thank you in advance to all of who take the time to reply to this post and thanks again for taking the time to read this rather lengthy commentary.
