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Post by dougc on Aug 18, 2013 21:03:53 GMT -5
Alright a much needed change in additude, went camping for a week. Crabbing, fishing, and way to much drinking !! Anyway my wife went to this rummage sale yesterday and came home with a older Onkyo 2ch. receiver for $10.00. Perfect timming because 1 ch. on my Proton receiver went out the night before. Anyway it's a Onkyo TX-8211, for 2ch. stereo the sound on this thing is incredible. Awsome find. gotta go, Doug.
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Post by dougc on Aug 19, 2013 21:12:47 GMT -5
Alright I'm back bragging about my wifes $10.00 find. It's a Onkyo TX- 8211 amplifier with a am/fm receiver. Like I posted previously, the sound on this thing is absolutely incredible. Tight, precise bass and brilliantly clear midrange and highs. I forgot how good 2ch. stereo could sound, and it's in my back room hooked up to a mediocre set of speakers and coponents. It's only rated @ 50wpc. @ 8ohms and 90wps. @ 4ohms with 110wpc. dynamic power. No power house by any means, but what it does it does well with absolutely NO auditable distortion. The reason I am writing this is because, it has given me a new love for 2ch. stereo that I lost 13 yrs. ago when I bought my Yamaha RX-V 596 receiver that is feeding my main system along with the UPA-700. I was already planning on replacing my Yamaha with the UMC-200 for multichannel, now I can only hope it does as well in 2ch. stereo mode.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2013 16:27:13 GMT -5
That is really awesome, what a "steal" at 10 bucks . That is incredible. Oh I completely feel you on the 2ch situation being amazing. I have had nothing sound more enveloping than vinyl yet. So alot has changed since we last had a chat. I sold the Denon 3312CI, ran my audio card right into my power amps, the gain stage on the Denon I guess is what KILLED the clarity and airi-ness feel of being open sounding. I then dinked around with my audio card audio creation mode and had 4 parametric eq options on each pair of speakers. I then took the Denon sales money, as well as from selling a few other things lying around for many years, and got two of the DBX 231's, and have another on the way. Trying to sell some other stuff to pay rent and what not. The DBX units are 31 bands graphic eq. I don't have balanced cables from my audio card, and for some reason a ton of noise was injected into the unit that I have not heard when direct into the power amps beforehand. I lowered the input on the DBX itself, and gained the Audio card at +10db on the fronts which removed the noises, and now I just have an air sound constantly that can be overran by sound. I then ran Room EQ Wizard aka REW, used the audyssey microphone on a tripod, and charted all responses and flattened the best I could. The sound is unbelievably better. I have FL/FR/C/SW already finished, and I can also see how they chart out in frequencies as opposed to just regular pink noise, and they are all pinched together beautifully. I will finish up the rear channels soon when the last one arrives. I am going from 7.1 down to 5.1. Things are sounding, unbelievable, and in many instances in movies, the center channel dialogue seems like you are in the recording room depending on the quality of mic they used etc. The fluidity from the same brand FL/C/FR after EQ, is just like butter right across the entire front without that extra artificial flavoring
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2013 16:32:34 GMT -5
Not sure if this picture link is working. Each vertical box is 2dB, frequencies 15hz test to 24khz. Black lines is FL/C/FR/SW with no eq, and speaker level trimmed. The red lines are with 31 band eq per channel, and speaker level was never trimmed again, they happened to line up naturally, minus I did lower the sub as it was too loud before the tests anyways.
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Post by dougc on Aug 25, 2013 16:05:51 GMT -5
It looks like the DBX's definitely did the trick! Good job that last graph looks really good. I have been really tempted to buy those same eq's for years. I am really getting excited about buying the UMC-200. hopefully by the time I am able to buy it they will have all the software problems fixed. I never realized how crappy my Yamaha sounded with music until I got the Onkyo. It's to bad the Onkyo doesn't have pre-outs, I would really like to hear it hooked up to the UPA 700. Movies sound awesome on the Yamaha how did they get the music part so wrong?? Oh yea, why are you going from 7.1 down to 5.1??
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novisnick
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Post by novisnick on Aug 25, 2013 16:18:02 GMT -5
It looks like the DBX's definitely did the trick! Good job that last graph looks really good. I have been really tempted to buy those same eq's for years. I am really getting excited about buying the UMC-200. hopefully by the time I am able to buy it they will have all the software problems fixed. I never realized how crappy my Yamaha sounded with music until I got the Onkyo. It's to bad the Onkyo doesn't have pre-outs, I would really like to hear it hooked up to the UPA 700. Movies sound awesome on the Yamaha how did they get the music part so wrong?? Oh yea, why are you going from 7.1 down to 5.1?? Yamaha 3020 11.2 sounds just fine in HT and SQ, dont know what your talking about.Oh yeah pre - outs all the way around.
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Post by dougc on Aug 25, 2013 16:20:30 GMT -5
Did you order your DBX 231 from Partsexpress ? That's where I buy all my drivers from for my custom built speakers.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2013 16:32:36 GMT -5
Nice . Yeah that Yamaha vs Onkyo ordeal you have there, is pretty much an exact replica only I removed the Denon and am not replacing it due to the way I have things hooked up, I can live without a source switcher and what not. The Denon had been getting a digital signal then gaining it, whereas my audio card did the gaining when I ran analog to the Denon (limited to 2ch with no external 7.1 input), hence the incredible sound when I ran into the Denon via analog. I am however stuck to 2ch on anything that is not my computer now lol, but I pretty much exclusively just use my pc for everything. I am going to 5.1 because when I removed the Denon, I removed the bitstreaming ability for myself on hi resolution audio support on movies, there is no codec for computers to run the high res audio on analog atm due to some PAP aka protected audio path crud. That leaves me with the only 7.1 source on pc games that support it, while there is support on a few games I own, the justification is not enough to keep the extra 2 channels, and to be honest, the sound from where my rear speakers are, sounds almost as good when something is on the side of me in a pc game coming exclusively on the side channels in 7.1 (basically fronts and where i have my rear channels, work at the same time making a fake side channel but psychoacoustically works well!). I am going to sell the two side speakers (Infinity P162) and use the rears as sides but leave them to the rear sides. Due to the room, the rears have always been exactly opposite of my fronts, in placement and direction, so I basically am in a perfect circle of speakers, and the rears are not straight back from me, they are as far to the side behind me, as the fronts are to the side ahead. I am hoping to be able to sell the current sides and rears and get the matching Martin Logans and have a really superb 5.1 layout, and am just waiting on the other eq to arrive to have eq on all channels, just need to eq 2 more channels onto that graph that are not included yet . Honestly, 7.1 is not really necessary to me unless you have the budget to make a strong 5.1 first....learning this as I grow up of course, but seems common sense. I also do not want to eventually waste money on two pairs of Martin Logans if I am only really using one pair most of the time. Going for a matching 5 channels on Martin Logan and hopefully a NHT B-12d subwoofer. Funny as it is, with finding the Kenwood, I have my L and R on that as a power amp; C on the XPA-200 alone; side and rear on the UPA-700, and eventually just 2 channels only on the UPA-700...haha.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2013 16:33:19 GMT -5
dougc, Guitar Center from online. Picked 2 up in person.
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Post by dougc on Aug 25, 2013 16:35:59 GMT -5
Your Yamaha 3020 is also a newer unit. Mine is a 12 yr. old middle of the line unit when 5.1 first came out. I have a 30 yr. old Yamaha Integrated amp that blows it away on MUSIC that was the discussion.
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novisnick
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Post by novisnick on Aug 25, 2013 16:42:49 GMT -5
Your Yamaha 3020 is also a newer unit. Mine is a 12 yr. old middle of the line unit when 5.1 first came out. I have a 30 yr. old Yamaha Integrated amp that blows it away on MUSIC that was the discussion. My bad, I think I missed something. But I did sleep at a Holiday Inn last night! Really I get it, I also have a Yammy 1050 from the early 80s, Great stereo and 5.1 HT sound.My TT and boots are older then those and still work very well. FM receiver took a Lightning strike but the rest of the 1050 works great. My apologies for your toes
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Post by dougc on Aug 26, 2013 21:46:27 GMT -5
Its all good, I walk on my toes all day long. Sorry that may have came with an attidude, 5 min. before I responded I found out my granddaughter pushed in the dust caps on 4 of my midbass drivers. That was all 4 on one main speaker. 7" Vifa PL18wo's that are no longer available. Sorry I was a little irritated. BTW I have nothing against Yamaha I have had 5 of them in the last 30 yrs. All 5 of them still work only 1 sucks unfortunately its the one controlling my system. Don't figure. Doug
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2013 22:25:32 GMT -5
Its all good, I walk on my toes all day long. Sorry that may have came with an attidude, 5 min. before I responded I found out my granddaughter pushed in the dust caps on 4 of my midbass drivers. That was all 4 on one main speaker. 7" Vifa PL18wo's that are no longer available. Sorry I was a little irritated. BTW I have nothing against Yamaha I have had 5 of them in the last 30 yrs. All 5 of them still work only 1 sucks unfortunately its the one controlling my system. Don't figure. Doug That is a sad day Dougc . With the 31 band EQ's here, it is in no way a good place for kids to be around either. One of my biggest peeves...and that I want to backhand people in the past over, is from people doing things to my Infinity speakers. I hardly ever have people over here to visit, but it seems like every single one of them would set stuff on my side channel by the chair on the left of the room, or when I had the front pair, to be on top of the FR by the entrance for keys. I even have had people swing lanywards with keys not on purpose and put a ding in the cone because I had the grilles off. People have put cell phones, keys, and left them up there like its a table. I cannot understand how some people are so shallow with other peoples goods. I have had people put their feet all over the walls, to throwing crumbs on the floor saying OH ITS NO BIG DEAL right after I told them to not do it. If anybody puts stuff on any of the ML's, I guarantee a verbal beatdown about being inconsiderate of other peoples belongings. Do people put stuff on your speakers like that? I really want to have the grilles off of the ML's but I do not trust visitors enough even as rare as it is. I may not even allow kids in here to be honest. I remember this quote whenever people do something bad when people stand by, not that kids know what they are doing besides having fun though....but for adults though. "My hate is general, I detest all men; Some because they are wicked and do evil, Others because they tolerate the wicked, Refusing them the active vigorous scorn Which vice should stimulate in virtuous minds."
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Post by dougc on Aug 26, 2013 22:28:14 GMT -5
Tyler you may want to contact Emotiva about only using 2 speakers on the 700. I remember reading something before I bought mine on using less than 4 will potentially burn it up. I forgot you still have the Infinity's on the rear, that makes perfect sense. After all most DVD's are still only 5.1. Maybe I'm missing something. Doug
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2013 22:36:39 GMT -5
Good point, and that could be true Doug. I will be sure to put that on my list to look up and contact on as well. Though I think it could only be burning wires inside if there was too much pull from lesser amounts of speakers. I will definitely look it up. Thanks! I am going to try and match the ML's into a 5ch and get the nht sub. I would run ML 15's if possible in the future, in the side-ish rear location for 5.1, so the front and ML15's would merge together to make a virtual side channel as is the case atm when forcing 5.1 layout. ATM to make the set complete, just need a single ML15 pair and a sub, the nht b-12d sub. The last EQ should be up and running soon, meaning 5.1ch of 31-band EQ. Everything is almost in place minus those speakers I want to get, hopefully lol. Will look up the UPA situation you mention. Thanks. Any way to suction those cones back out on your speakers? Vacuum cleaner if you cant hold a seal?
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Post by dougc on Aug 26, 2013 23:06:24 GMT -5
Tyler tried the vacuum, not happening. I might be able to pull 2 of the 4 drivers and push through the pole vent opening. The other 2 are f..ked (sorry Dan). My son said," whats the big deal, it's only cosmetic". I told him," hand me a $20,000 bill and let me drill holes in it". After all it's only cosmetic !!. Dumb ass.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2013 23:12:06 GMT -5
Yeah, its like putting a dip in the middle of a gaming system joystick, and saying its only cosmetic ...the stick still works. Doh .
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Post by dougc on Aug 27, 2013 20:19:27 GMT -5
yes a couple of people have tried setting crap on my speakers. Unfortunately it's usually my oldest son who has taken over my living room and wont watch his daughter. Unfortunately again it has costed me quite a few glasses and mugs. Anyway on another subject, out of curiosity. Why are you determined on the NHT B-12B sub.? Just curious. Doug
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2013 17:32:57 GMT -5
Sealed. Bash amp. The boundary knob on the sub. Otherwise onboard eq and DSP which is utilised on more of other subs. Dad has 2 of them. Bash amps for 500 watts RMS are not cheap and are highly regarded on their own. . Not determined...but open to ideas. So far that boundary eq knob is nice if needed ever..not seeing that svs has that on their subs. I know that the old mirage sub I use...ran more flat on the upper knob position for room eq wizard response results. Not sure what the setting is...probably +3dB. The mirage has no phase adjustment though...90s sub Lol. Way better than the infinity though...while being only 150 watts not sure if that's RMS. Infinity showed up like an avalanche on results...thunder bass and nothing outside of that small range even within the LFE frequency range. Infinity PS312 SW is the yellowish brown color, while the rest are the three boundary knob positions on the Mirage SW. Ignore the purple result which is the lowest one on the graph (it is a eq job on the infinity, rest of results are no eq). Each vertical box is 5dB.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2013 23:09:02 GMT -5
24dB variance before EQ, 9dB variance after (with most hz ranges well under that). I am now hearing things from the 5.1 layout with my fake side speaker layout, that I have never heard before in movies. very happy to be calling this the mancave right now!
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