dolby
Minor Hero
Posts: 62 
|
Post by dolby on Aug 3, 2019 1:55:23 GMT -5
Isn't there a market for these ?
I'm not talking Emotiva specifically - but the industry as a whole.
I went from UMC-1 >>> UMC-200 ... and although I'm not quite in the market for something else, I'm looking to upgrade to HDMI 2.0 and all the newer formats. The MC-700 doesn't cut it because of the lack of Dolby Atmos - but the very next processor is multiples higher and is really quite high end. Surely something a bit better than the MC-700 would generate interest?
I checked a competitor out (Emotiva is hugely expensive in my country - from owning 10 x Emotiva products, I've now got only 2 left and I'm probably going to jump ship) and they offer a slimline AVR with all the latest formats / HDMIs etc - but only front / sub preouts. This would have been an idea processor and something I'd happily upgrade every 2 years.
I can't be the only one looking at this and thinking manufacturers have it wrong ?
|
|
Jack
Minor Hero
Posts: 75
|
Post by Jack on Aug 3, 2019 11:52:27 GMT -5
I am also interested in a modest upgrade from my UMC-1. I only have 5.1, so I don't need an XMC-1or RMC-1. What is out there for prepros for a 5.1 system?
|
|
|
|
Post by 405x5 on Aug 3, 2019 12:54:25 GMT -5
I wish you guys the best of luck finding what you want.
With the vast majority of end users relying on 5.1, this Industry has shot itself in the foot.
These days, you better know what you want, because anything you involve yourself in technologically, may be gone when you wake up the next day.
Bill
|
|
LCSeminole
Global Moderator 
Res firma mitescere nescit.
Posts: 20,495
|
Post by LCSeminole on Aug 3, 2019 14:17:15 GMT -5
There are already factory refurbished XMC-1’s available available from Emotiva due to their XMC-1Trade-in program for the RMC-1/RMC-1L/XMC-2. Look for them on eBay under the seller name “jadedesign”, or call them. They’re listed at $1500, but with a “Best Offer” option. Maybe they’ll accept your offer/price, you’ll never know if you don’t make the offer though.
|
|
|
|
Post by vcautokid on Aug 3, 2019 14:31:45 GMT -5
Pre Pros are the biggest and largest cost as far as components go from a manufacturer. The economies of scale compared to everything else is mind boggling. Certifications and compliances. It is a multiple glorified computer. Has to be. All the surround schemes, the bullsheet HDMI compliances and HDCP cops. Oh yeah. Make sound good, have balanced, were you gonna differential that sir? Software that is stable, and an interface that is amazing to use, or amazing you dropped quantum science and shouldn't have because an engineer wanted to show his rocket surgery. The fact that pre pro and cheap are in the same sentence is a miracle in of itself. I love pre pros. Not all the hoops HDMI and others make manufacturers jump through to get it.
|
|
|
|
Post by 405x5 on Aug 3, 2019 15:04:18 GMT -5
Pre Pros are the biggest and largest cost as far as components go from a manufacturer. The economies of scale compared to everything else is mind boggling. Certifications and compliances. It is a multiple glorified computer. Has to be. All the surround schemes, the bullsheet HDMI compliances and HDCP cops. Oh yeah. Make sound good, have balanced, were you gonna differential that sir? Software that is stable, and an interface that is amazing to use, or amazing you dropped quantum science and shouldn't have because an engineer wanted to show his rocket surgery. The fact that pre pro and cheap are in the same sentence is a miracle in of itself. I love pre pros. Not all the hoops HDMI and others make manufacturers jump through to get it. Recently, I got with Sunfire to see if anything was in the offing regarding getting back into it. They would not even talk to me about it. Bill |
|
|
|
Post by knucklehead on Aug 3, 2019 15:29:05 GMT -5
What's wrong with an AVR with preamp outs? I've gone full circle, having used an AVR and external amps to preamp processors. For music I use an integrated amp. With an AVR you get 9 or 11 channels of amps, and depending on the brand, very good room correction, at half or less the price of an equivalent preamp processor.
|
|
|
|
Post by vcautokid on Aug 3, 2019 16:12:34 GMT -5
Well some AVR pre outs are pretty lame. Distortion at relatively low output. Also the newer AVRs don't necessarily switch off the amps inside when the pre outs are used. Fun huh?
|
|
|
|
Post by Soup on Aug 3, 2019 17:22:40 GMT -5
I am also interested in a modest upgrade from my UMC-1. I only have 5.1, so I don't need an XMC-1or RMC-1. What is out there for prepros for a 5.1 system? What about a used Anthem MRX 510 or 520 depending on budget? |
|
cgolf
Emo VIPs 
Posts: 4,613
|
Post by cgolf on Aug 3, 2019 19:21:35 GMT -5
Outlaw Audio has a couple for under $1000. One is around $600 and the other around $900. Might even find them cheaper in the used market. No idea how they perform.
|
|
dolby
Minor Hero
Posts: 62
|
Post by dolby on Aug 4, 2019 2:34:22 GMT -5
If I look at this : www.us.marantz.com/us/Products/Pages/ProductDetails.aspx?CatId=avreceivers&ProductId=NR1609$749.00 ... HDMI 2.0 / HDCP2.2 / Dolby Atmos / WiFi / Blueooth ... and an amplifier section. Surely, this thing would well as a processor (if they had pre-outs)? Remove the amps - add the pre-outs - cut the price by $100? It seems a conscious decision to leave them out? I find it silly that I have to go out, buy a mid level AVR at twice the price and instantly bypass the amp section. And then in 3 years when they have HDMI2.2 / HDCP 2.5 - spend another $1,500 on a new amp just to get those features Rather a $600.00 every 2 years |
|
|
|
Post by 405x5 on Aug 4, 2019 8:40:50 GMT -5
If I look at this : www.us.marantz.com/us/Products/Pages/ProductDetails.aspx?CatId=avreceivers&ProductId=NR1609$749.00 ... HDMI 2.0 / HDCP2.2 / Dolby Atmos / WiFi / Blueooth ... and an amplifier section. Surely, this thing would well as a processor (if they had pre-outs)? Remove the amps - add the pre-outs - cut the price by $100? It seems a conscious decision to leave them out? I find it silly that I have to go out, buy a mid level AVR at twice the price and instantly bypass the amp section. And then in 3 years when they have HDMI2.2 / HDCP 2.5 - spend another $1,500 on a new amp just to get those features Rather a $600.00 every 2 years I once paid Marantz nearly 800.00 for one of their products and ended up tossing it in the trash within 18 months. Unhappy would be an understatement, but honestly, not entirely their fault, it was a victim of this never ending parade of obsolescence. Bill |
|
|
|
Post by Perpendicular on Aug 4, 2019 10:31:22 GMT -5
If I look at this : www.us.marantz.com/us/Products/Pages/ProductDetails.aspx?CatId=avreceivers&ProductId=NR1609$749.00 ... HDMI 2.0 / HDCP2.2 / Dolby Atmos / WiFi / Blueooth ... and an amplifier section. Surely, this thing would well as a processor (if they had pre-outs)? Remove the amps - add the pre-outs - cut the price by $100? It seems a conscious decision to leave them out? I find it silly that I have to go out, buy a mid level AVR at twice the price and instantly bypass the amp section. And then in 3 years when they have HDMI2.2 / HDCP 2.5 - spend another $1,500 on a new amp just to get those features Rather a $600.00 every 2 years What I think would be a good alternative is to have available a unit similar to this slim designed Marantz that includes pre-outs for 9.1 or 9.2 channels minimum, remove all but 4 of the amps and have those remaining 4 amps be low powered Class A/B or D with speaker outputs to power the Atmos and DTS: X Height Channels only. You can then use your separate amps of choice or active speakers. Make sure to include High End Room Correction too. Also, keep the price below $1,000. I bet a manufacture of said product would sell a ton of them. |
|
|
|
Post by SteveH on Aug 4, 2019 10:41:57 GMT -5
I once paid Marantz nearly 800.00 for one of their products and ended up tossing it in the trash within 18 months. Unhappy would be an understatement, but honestly, not entirely their fault, it was a victim of this never ending parade of obsolescence. Bill Obsolescence is what made me purchase a new prepro and amplifiers in 2018. My previous prepro had no subwoofer channel, only had RCA audio and composite video jacks. I had more splitters, switches and extractors hanging off the back of the prepro that I just could not take it anymore, it was time to change and become current. In my opinion, a separate prepro instead of an AVR will save you money in the long run. An amplifier is an amplifier, it basically does not change so it won't need an upgrade due to technology progression like a processor does. |
|
|
|
Post by 405x5 on Aug 4, 2019 13:41:28 GMT -5
I once paid Marantz nearly 800.00 for one of their products and ended up tossing it in the trash within 18 months. Unhappy would be an understatement, but honestly, not entirely their fault, it was a victim of this never ending parade of obsolescence. Bill Obsolescence is what made me purchase a new prepro and amplifiers in 2018. My previous prepro had no subwoofer channel, only had RCA audio and composite video jacks. I had more splitters, switches and extractors hanging off the back of the prepro that I just could not take it anymore, it was time to change and become current. In my opinion, a separate prepro instead of an AVR will save you money in the long run. An amplifier is an amplifier, it basically does not change so it won't need an upgrade due to technology progression like a processor does. Steve, I see from looking at your equipment list you did a slingshot into the 21st century! (RMC and the rest....) You're right about the amplifiers, as long as the power meets the requirements of your room, speakers and the db. levels you wish to attain. My processor...….2014 almost 15. My multichannel amplifier....Jan. 2001 and still breathing. Bill |
|
|
|
Post by MusicHead on Aug 4, 2019 15:26:01 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by strindl on Aug 4, 2019 15:41:59 GMT -5
That looks like a great pre pro..it even has balanced outs for each channel and balanced ins. I've been using an Integra DHC-9.9 for about ten years in my main system. It has worked flawlessly since it was new. No glitches, no need for firmware updates, everything just works like it's supposed to out of the box. Mine was about two grand new, but the one you linked is even less expensive with all of the latest technology updates. |
|
|
|
Post by MusicHead on Aug 4, 2019 16:05:15 GMT -5
That looks like a great pre pro..it even has balanced outs for each channel and balanced ins. I've been using an Integra DHC-9.9 for about ten years in my main system. It has worked flawlessly since it was new. No glitches, no need for firmware updates, everything just works like it's supposed to out of the box. Mine was about two grand new, but the one you linked is even less expensive with all of the latest technology updates. Yeah, sure looks interesting on paper, wonder how it sounds. I also just realized you can still find the Marantz AV7704 at the same price, but not all Marantz authorized dealers have it. Amazon does: www.amazon.com/Marantz-Pre-Amplifier-Component-Amplifier-AV7704/dp/B072ZBX5NZ/ref=mp_s_a_1_2_sspa?keywords=Marantz&qid=1564952408&s=gateway&sr=8-2-spons&psc=1Integra DHC-60.7 vs Marantz AV7704 feeding the same Emotiva amps and a decent set of speakers would be a very cool face-off! |
|
|
|
Post by AudioHTIT on Aug 4, 2019 16:19:47 GMT -5
What's wrong with an AVR with preamp outs? I've gone full circle, having used an AVR and external amps to preamp processors. For music I use an integrated amp. With an AVR you get 9 or 11 channels of amps, and depending on the brand, very good room correction, at half or less the price of an equivalent preamp processor. I think this is a good point and alternative. The market for low cost processors is competing with AVR’s, most in this price range aren’t even considering pre/pros. Emo’s built a couple, so they know how well they sell, I guess they’ve decided to focus higher. I’d say it might be attractive to target the ‘teens’ (in price), for a low cost processor, essentially stripping down the xmc-2 as low as it can go (which it might be at), but sub $1000 seems like a tough place to be. |
|
|
|
Post by teaman on Aug 4, 2019 17:15:16 GMT -5
|
|
