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Post by carbonsummit on Nov 3, 2011 11:06:32 GMT -5
Youth, do yourself a favor and choose the no EQ option. Calibrate your distances and channel levels manually. Don't forget to set your volume control first before doing so. Make sure your input setup(s) is also selected with no EQ. I've tried EmoQ a few times, and I've always liked the way it sounds much more setting it up without it. I am speaking of primarily listening to music. Mainly 5.1 concerts, SACD, and DVD-A. Another thing that I've noticed listening to standard CDs, SACDs, and DVDA is that the analog inputs of the UMC sound very good compared to using HDMI. That is of course as long as your source has 5.1 or 2.1 analog outputs. While listening to any mulit-channel SACD, I can toggle back and forth between the input I have setup to use the HDMI connection and the input using the analog inputs. Easy to discern the difference that way. Here in lies the problem with the UMC-1 that I struggled with. If I can't trust EmoQ to even get me close then what good is it? I've read so many people say they just don't use EmoQ at all, run the UMC-1 with only the distances and levels set and no room correction. That just doesn't make sense to me! I know my room isn't a perfect studio sound chamber so there must need to be some correction needed to bring the sound closer to the way the director wanted it to sound in a movie for example. I know there are a few tweekers on here that swear that they can tune the EQs manually and have no need for a room correction system. Well I for one don't think thats possible, at least for me, to do by ear so I'd like a room correction program to get me close to what the setting should be and then I can make small changes if needed to suit my personal tastes. But overall trying to set each speakers EQ is a daunting task that I wasn't up to the challenge to do, and I wasn't happy with EmoQs results so that left me in a no win situation with the UMC-1. I would be thrilled to see the XMC-1 come out with something like Audyssey Multi EQ XT that my Onkyo uses, I'd buy the XMC-1 in a second! The sound of the UMC-1 was great for music, but just didn't give me the HT experence I'm getting with my Onkyo. Since I'm 90% HT/10% music the UMC-1 wasn't working for me. But I will say that when I listen to music now with my Onkyo I sorely miss the UMC-1! So having the XMC-1 come with a decent room correction for HT and still retain the great music sound of the UMC-1 would be my perfect pre/pro. With the flexiblity to be able to assign different EQs to each function I could have my cake and eat it too. But I doubt we'll see Audyssey or some other big name room correction on the XMC-1 so I'm left using a pre/pro of another brand that meets my needs better 90% of the time.
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Post by Woodpecker on Nov 3, 2011 13:46:30 GMT -5
Very true Carbon. I'd actually recommend another pre or a receiver if my main focus was movies. For music though, I don't think you can do much better than the UMC unless you spend quite a bit more. That said, I think you can only do so much room correction electronically via Audyssey or any other program. I've had my main system in 4 completely different rooms over the past few years. Neither was able to be adequately corrected via room correction software.
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Post by Youthman on Nov 3, 2011 15:01:18 GMT -5
Very true Carbon. I'd actually recommend another pre or a receiver if my main focus was movies. I was told the UMC-1 was excellent for both 2ch and for HT. I had a great HT receiver, was looking for something that was equally good for HT but a little better than the Yamaha in 2ch.
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NorthStar
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Post by NorthStar on Nov 3, 2011 15:22:37 GMT -5
The UMC-1 is a Surround Processor, so of course it is for HT.
Not only that, it is excellent with Music.
And right now it only cost $499! ...That is the lowest price EVER!
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Post by Youthman on Nov 3, 2011 15:24:34 GMT -5
That's why I purchased it. LOL. It's definitely more laborious to get it "dialed in" than previous AVR's I have owned. I haven't had much time to devote to the settings in the EmoQ. If not tonight, this weekend will be able to.
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Post by Youthman on Nov 3, 2011 15:25:35 GMT -5
The UMC-1 is a Surround Processor, so of course it is for HT. In all fairness, just because it's a "Surround Processor" doesn't necessarily mean it's a good surround processor.
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NorthStar
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Post by NorthStar on Nov 3, 2011 15:28:40 GMT -5
Hey, it's up to you, and you only, to decide of that! After all, it's your total system, and your room, and your values, and your life.
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Post by Youthman on Nov 3, 2011 15:35:45 GMT -5
Don't forget to include "My money and my ears". LOL
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NorthStar
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Post by NorthStar on Nov 3, 2011 15:55:31 GMT -5
I already mentioned the 'Money' equation ($499). And your Life should automatically include your 'Ears'. ;D
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Post by corbaatje on Nov 3, 2011 16:03:02 GMT -5
What I do not understand, just new too the brand Emotiva, is that Emotiva is selling a HT processor. In all the other area's they sell great stuff. IMO if you sell a HT processor it has to have good room EQ and be relatively bug free. If not or when you are not able too, do not sell and stick too the other great things you make. I checked, as I am from Holland, forums in Holland, Germany and the UK( Dutch, English and German I can read :-))the UMC1 is destroying the good name off Emotiva and is scaring people off abroad. All the other stuff is getting raving comments!
I think the XMC1(would like too buy and try one) will be critical for Emotiva. Another mistake(and a mistake it is IMO) on HT would be a disaster for Emotiva. I hope they are wise and get rid off EmoQ. I have had different receivers(Yamaha, Arcam, NAD) and have now a Denon 3311CI with Audyssey XT. Audyssey with my Antimode 8033C for my sub gives me a sound for HT like I never heard before. Just stereo is lacking. Emotiva please make a piece that solves my problem!!
I like Emotiva's vibe and stuff very much, so fingers crossed they come with a bug free and a good working room EQ for the XMC1.
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Post by Youthman on Nov 3, 2011 17:07:42 GMT -5
I would think the biggest reason Emotiva decided to develop their own room correction was a cost factor. My guess is the Audyssey XT license would drive the UMC-1 up substantially. Just a guess though. I'm not of the opinion yet that the UMC-1 is a mistake. I believe it has a lot of potential and for it's cost, it cannot be touched. I guess it was just too easy setting up my previous Yamaha RX-V1800. The room correction did it's thing and sounded great for HT, but only "ok" for 2ch. I'm hoping with time I can tweak the UMC-1 to sound great for both 2ch and HT.
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Post by Youthman on Nov 3, 2011 17:16:48 GMT -5
It has been suggested that it is better to cut than it is to boost the EQ. The bad thing is that it sounds better to me in the + vs the -. Again, the only thing I know to do is what I've done a LONG time ago and that's to create a smiley face type curve on the EQ with all of the sliders in the positive. I know this isn't the proper way which is why I'm seeking advice here in the forums.
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NorthStar
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Post by NorthStar on Nov 3, 2011 17:25:52 GMT -5
A 'smiley face curve' on the EQ. Yep, been there done that, until I crank it up all the way!!! ;D But you know what; if you like the sound that way, that's all what it matters. ...And you just follow your own musical path, journey... * Personally I cannot give you direct advice as I don't use the UMC-1. But from all my other pre/pros and receivers and integrated amplifiers in the past; I prefer no Tone controls, no EQ at all! PURE DIRECT STRAIGT and the shortest path. Music of course. For Movies; with five, seven, nine, or even eleven speakers, plus one or more subwoofers; then a good Auto Room EQ & Calibration system is a great idea.
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Post by Youthman on Nov 3, 2011 18:16:41 GMT -5
A 'smiley face curve' on the EQ. Yep, been there done that, until I crank it up all the way!!! ;D But you know what; if you like the sound that way, that's all what it matters. As I mentioned, I realize this is not the proper method to set an EQ, I just don't know how to determine which frequencies need to be boosted, which need to be cut and by how much. It only makes sense that if you boost a signal, then try and crank it, you will likely introduce distortion. But from all my other pre/pros and receivers and integrated amplifiers in the past; I prefer no Tone controls, no EQ at all! Could not agree with you more. I've always kept my Onkyo, Yamaha and Harman Kardon receivers at a Flat EQ. For some reason, they didn't need adjusting to sound good. The Harman Kardon AVR55 sounded fantastic for 2ch and it didn't even have any room correction software. To me, the Emo NEEDS EQing in order to sound good. I'm just not exactly sure how to get it to sound great.
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Post by Woodpecker on Nov 3, 2011 18:36:59 GMT -5
[quote author=thelordoftherings board=preamps thread=20540 post=334229 time=1320359152But from all my other pre/pros and receivers and integrated amplifiers in the past; I prefer no Tone controls, no EQ at all! PURE DIRECT STRAIGT and the shortest path. Music of course.
[/quote]
Exactly why I suggested not using EMO Q. Too much cutting or boosting introduces strange and sometimes distorted sounds. The UMC has tone controls for every channel. But, like Bob said, you'll have to please your ears!
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NorthStar
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Post by NorthStar on Nov 3, 2011 18:37:37 GMT -5
Youthman, REW would be a good tool for you, with a digital EQ from Behringer or a Mini DSP or a separate Sub EQ from Audyssey or a Rane digital EQ or an Anti-mode or others of that sort.
It is in the Bass (below 250Hz or so) that a good EQ is truly beneficial.
* Your room is a dedicated Home Theater room, and if you're serious about quality surround sound and room acoustics, you'll invest in not only room treatments first, but also in a good Room EQ as well. You can hire a pro if money is not much of a concern, or you can learn it yourself with time, dedication, and some investment as well.
Looking at your room, me, I would use acoustic panels to absorb the first modal reflections from the side walls, ceiling and front floor (a carpet there would do).
And then, I would like to simplify my life with a pre/pro from Anthem with ARC room correction kit, or from Denon, Marantz, Onkyo/Integra, NAD with Audyssey MultEQ XT or XT32 AND also with Audyssey MultEQ Pro Ready with the software and hardware kit.
That's me, but I know other people here (Nemesis for example) who had (still always perfectioning) great success with his own separate digital Sub EQs in conjunction with the free REW program software.
Other members here used digital Mini-DSPs or Behringer EQs. And others have digital DSP EQS internally or separately integrated into/with their subwoofer(s) themselves.
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NorthStar
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Post by NorthStar on Nov 3, 2011 18:42:39 GMT -5
Exactly why I suggested not using EMO Q. Too much cutting or boosting introduces strange and sometimes distorted sounds. The UMC has tone controls for every channel. But, like Bob said, you'll have to please your ears! True; any EQ processing, tone controls, indirect audio signal paths, introduce all type of anomalies, like phase shifts, reverbs, delays, and all those nasty and undesirable noises, distractions and sound distortions.
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xki
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Post by xki on Nov 3, 2011 19:09:41 GMT -5
It has been suggested that it is better to cut than it is to boost the EQ. The bad thing is that it sounds better to me in the + vs the -. Again, the only thing I know to do is what I've done a LONG time ago and that's to create a smiley face type curve on the EQ with all of the sliders in the positive. I know this isn't the proper way which is why I'm seeking advice here in the forums. Makes me wish I could take a week off and pay you a visit! ;D
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Post by Porscheguy on Nov 3, 2011 19:22:15 GMT -5
This is obviously a very painful experience for you. I suggest you return the UMC-1 and go back to whatever you were using before. Emotiva has sold more than 5000 UMC-1's and the vast majority are very happy including me. Right out of the box it sounded fabulous. I don't use Emo-Q, Audessy or any of those room correction things. I use my ears and what I think sounds good. If your that disappointed then something is really with your UMC-1 or your ears or your room.
Too bad, its a fabulous product. I've had people at my house that have the Marantz pre/pro and the Denon 5308 and they think the the UMC-1 is amazing.
Life's too short to be unhappy :-)
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Post by carbonsummit on Nov 3, 2011 19:36:17 GMT -5
Emotiva has sold more than 5000 UMC-1's I'd be curious to know where you got that statistic from
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