DC-1

[GreenKiwi]

Oh. And the dc-1 + hd650s are really enjoyable.

[gcannon]

May 13, 2014 19:15:36 GMT -5 GreenKiwi said:

What app are you using to play the music?

Before getting a Mac mini, I would wait for reviews of the OliveOne to trickle in. People are starting to get them and the look really cool.

JRiver Media Center v19

I've not heard of OliveOne. I'll google it to learn more.  I'm new to digital music players as I'm updating my 14 y/o system.
 
Thanks!

[garbulky]

May 13, 2014 19:10:59 GMT -5 gcannon said:

Well I received the DC-1 and the HD650s and all I can say is oh my goodness!! IF there is a warm-up I can't wait to hear them then. Right out of the box the DC-1 and the HD650 are awesome. I have a Dragonfly 1.2 and PBS Speakers and B&W P7 HPs I was trying out and they are not in the same league. Amazing sound quality.

I am having a couple of issues running from my laptop. First the highest sample rate I am getting on the DC-1 is 96k even though I am playing several 24/192 songs from HDTracks. I was getting up to 192k from the Dragonfly. There must be a setting somewhere that is limiting the sample rate?? The second issue is I'm getting pops and crackles, which I read means my computer is lagging. I've got a pretty powerful laptop - i7, 4GM memory, Win 7 64-bit SP-1. It's a work laptop, so just temporary. I read that many use a Mac Mini as their dedicated music device. Is that recommended?

Any ideas or suggestions on how to fix/improve? I want to get everything right with HPs before I use as a preamp direclty into my amps.

Thanks for all your help!!

It depends on waht app you are using to play the music. The pops and crackles are not that your computer is lagging. Your computer has TONS of power to play flac files. Just as an example I used a Pentium 3 computer to play 192 khz 24 bit files. Yes the computer that did windows XP when it first came out. It has 0.7 gigabytes of memory. And has a speed which is about ten or more times slower than your current machine. This computer can't even play video files but it had no trouble with high resolution audio. IT HAD TROUBLE EVEN PLAYING YOUTUBE VIDEO. Think about that!

It depends on what you are using to play and how you are going about it. For instance are you using WASAPI? What are you using to play the files - windows media player, foobar, media monkey, j river? Are you using a USB connection? Have you installed the drivers?
I wouldn't bother with a mac mini. Your laptop will work great. However, you are going to have to configure it a bit and experiment.

[GreenKiwi]

You might check out the output settings and dsp. There is a sampling rate section that controls the output rates for various input rates.

Here's the olive one info
myoliveone.com

I've got one on order... I'm hopeful it will be much more consistent than my PC and Mac solutions have been.

[d1sturb3d]

^ the wait for the One is killing me already GK

[gcannon]

May 13, 2014 21:27:55 GMT -5 garbulky said:

May 13, 2014 19:10:59 GMT -5 gcannon said:

Well I received the DC-1 and the HD650s and all I can say is oh my goodness!! IF there is a warm-up I can't wait to hear them then. Right out of the box the DC-1 and the HD650 are awesome. I have a Dragonfly 1.2 and PBS Speakers and B&W P7 HPs I was trying out and they are not in the same league. Amazing sound quality.

I am having a couple of issues running from my laptop. First the highest sample rate I am getting on the DC-1 is 96k even though I am playing several 24/192 songs from HDTracks. I was getting up to 192k from the Dragonfly. There must be a setting somewhere that is limiting the sample rate?? The second issue is I'm getting pops and crackles, which I read means my computer is lagging. I've got a pretty powerful laptop - i7, 4GM memory, Win 7 64-bit SP-1. It's a work laptop, so just temporary. I read that many use a Mac Mini as their dedicated music device. Is that recommended?

Any ideas or suggestions on how to fix/improve? I want to get everything right with HPs before I use as a preamp direclty into my amps.

Thanks for all your help!!

It depends on waht app you are using to play the music. The pops and crackles are not that your computer is lagging. Your computer has TONS of power to play flac files. Just as an example I used a Pentium 3 computer to play 192 khz 24 bit files. Yes the computer that did windows XP when it first came out. It has 0.7 gigabytes of memory. And has a speed which is about ten or more times slower than your current machine. This computer can't even play video files but it had no trouble with high resolution audio. IT HAD TROUBLE EVEN PLAYING YOUTUBE VIDEO. Think about that!

It depends on what you are using to play and how you are going about it. For instance are you using WASAPI? What are you using to play the files - windows media player, foobar, media monkey, j river? Are you using a USB connection? Have you installed the drivers?
I wouldn't bother with a mac mini. Your laptop will work great. However, you are going to have to configure it a bit and experiment.

Thanks garbulky. I'm using JRiver v19. I downloaded the drivers from the DC-1 product page and configured JRiver per Keith's post in the Thread on DC-1 and Players thread (set to WASAPI and check no events box). I went into the laptop Sounds, Select DC-1, Advanced and set sample rate to 24/192. I'm still only getting 96k to the DC-1. 

That's the extent of my knowledge how to set it up.  And did I mention how awesome the sound is now .

[garbulky]

May 14, 2014 13:03:47 GMT -5 gcannon said:

May 13, 2014 21:27:55 GMT -5 garbulky said:

It depends on waht app you are using to play the music. The pops and crackles are not that your computer is lagging. Your computer has TONS of power to play flac files. Just as an example I used a Pentium 3 computer to play 192 khz 24 bit files. Yes the computer that did windows XP when it first came out. It has 0.7 gigabytes of memory. And has a speed which is about ten or more times slower than your current machine. This computer can't even play video files but it had no trouble with high resolution audio. IT HAD TROUBLE EVEN PLAYING YOUTUBE VIDEO. Think about that!

It depends on what you are using to play and how you are going about it. For instance are you using WASAPI? What are you using to play the files - windows media player, foobar, media monkey, j river? Are you using a USB connection? Have you installed the drivers?
I wouldn't bother with a mac mini. Your laptop will work great. However, you are going to have to configure it a bit and experiment.

Thanks garbulky. I'm using JRiver v19. I downloaded the drivers from the DC-1 product page and configured JRiver per Keith's post in the Thread on DC-1 and Players thread (set to WASAPI and check no events box). I went into the laptop Sounds, Select DC-1, Advanced and set sample rate to 24/192. I'm still only getting 96k to the DC-1. 

That's the extent of my knowledge how to set it up.  And did I mention how awesome the sound is now .

Okay well you did everything right. Try a few other things
1. First in J-river make sure there isn't some setting that is limiting you to 96 khz.
2. Play a regular mp3 or lossless file at 44.1khz. If it doesn't display 44.1 khz when you do so then that means EVERYTHING is being converted to 96khz for some reason. And we have to try some other things.
3. You set the no event mode on WASAPI. Try it without it (makes it a different mode)
4. Try a different USB port. preferrably not one right next to it. For instance, one on the other sde of the laptop.
5. Try a different preferrably shorter USB cable.
6. .go to "sounds" in the WINDOWS control panel.
- Check the DC-1 USB as "use as default" and allow exclusive access
- somewhere under sounds in the playback probably in options or advanced or configure there is a sampling rate option. Click 192 khz. Also if the option presents itself under sample rate - say "allow exclusive access"

[krusty]

I would try foobar2k, since it's not as heavy as jriver, and make sure the drivers are ok.

[gcannon]

May 14, 2014 13:49:41 GMT -5 garbulky said:

May 14, 2014 13:03:47 GMT -5 gcannon said:

Thanks garbulky. I'm using JRiver v19. I downloaded the drivers from the DC-1 product page and configured JRiver per Keith's post in the Thread on DC-1 and Players thread (set to WASAPI and check no events box). I went into the laptop Sounds, Select DC-1, Advanced and set sample rate to 24/192. I'm still only getting 96k to the DC-1. 

That's the extent of my knowledge how to set it up.  And did I mention how awesome the sound is now .

Okay well you did everything right. Try a few other things
1. First in J-river make sure there isn't some setting that is limiting you to 96 khz.
2. Play a regular mp3 or lossless file at 44.1khz. If it doesn't display 44.1 khz when you do so then that means EVERYTHING is being converted to 96khz for some reason. And we have to try some other things.
3. You set the no event mode on WASAPI. Try it without it (makes it a different mode)
4. Try a different USB port. preferrably not one right next to it. For instance, one on the other sde of the laptop.
5. Try a different preferrably shorter USB cable.
6. .go to "sounds" in the WINDOWS control panel.
- Check the DC-1 USB as "use as default" and allow exclusive access
- somewhere under sounds in the playback probably in options or advanced or configure there is a sampling rate option. Click 192 khz. Also if the option presents itself under sample rate - say "allow exclusive access"

Spent a couple of hours on this tonight with no luck. See below:
 1.  Could not find a setting in JRiver limiting output. Read wiki, setting output options, searched support boards
2. This works for settings below 96k
3. WASPI does not work in no event mode.  JRiver says to check it also
4. Only 2 USB ports right next to each other
5. This could  be the problem.  The only USB cord with the square plug I had was from an old hard drive enclosure.  It's probably 5' long.  Since I don't have another one, I saved this for last.
6.  Did this last night and again today.

Really frustrating.  I really appreciate your help! 

[gcannon]

OK, I feel like a fool .  I just discovered I have no files over 96k...  I went to HDTracks and looked at my downloads and they were all 96k and below.  I just downloaded a 192k file and it plays in 192k.

Also, the popping and cracking have stopped completely. 

I think I'm all good! 

Thanks again for all your help!! 

[garbulky]

May 14, 2014 21:55:56 GMT -5 gcannon said:

OK, I feel like a fool .  I just discovered I have no files over 96k...  I went to HDTracks and looked at my downloads and they were all 96k and below.  I just downloaded a 192k file and it plays in 192k.

Also, the popping and cracking have stopped completely. 

I think I'm all good! 

Thanks again for all your help!! 

Glad to hear it was all sorted. If there is popping and cracking again you can also increase the buffer size to 2000ms. and switch USB ports. It may help. Hopefully it doesn't happen again.
If it does, you can try disabling system sounds in windows. (under sound in windows control panel go to sound schemes or something similar and select no sound.) You can also try switching the USB port. And sometimes other programs may be taking up the process like a game that is minimized or an internet browser window playing an ad etc.

[klinemj]

Great news...now go enjoy that awesome sound!

Mark

[pressureworld]

I plan to pick up the DC-1 sometime soon. Does anyone know if this DAC can handle Beyerdynamic DT880 600 OHM headphones. I have no idea how powerful the HP amp is in this unit.

[garbulky]

Jun 2, 2014 1:13:10 GMT -5 pressureworld said:

I plan to pick up the DC-1 sometime soon. Does anyone know if this DAC can handle Beyerdynamic DT880 600 OHM headphones. I have no idea how powerful the HP amp is in this unit.

This is from keith an Emotiva engineer

Nov 11, 2013 9:41:09 GMT -5 KeithL said:

DC-1 HEADPHONE AMP OUTPUT SPECS

Since everybody has been asking for these......

DC-1
Headphone amp:

NOTE: The two headphone outputs are entirely independent - each has its own amplifier/driver (you can't set them to different levels, but these specs are for EACH one).
These are with the frequency response jumper set to FLAT.

Frequency Response: 20 Hz - 20 kHz +/- 0.14 dB (at 1 V output)

THD: < 0.025% (at 1 V output; at 1 kHz)

S/N: > 101 dB (ref 1 V output; A weighted)

Power output:
750 mW into 8 ohms
1200 mW into 32 ohms
180 mW into 300 ohms
90 mW into 620 ohms

At the price for a DAC + headphone amp combo unit I really doubt you will get a more powerful unit. If you wanted to get a more powerful unit, you will have to invest in a standalone headphone amp. ....to go the next step up you would be looking at something like a $250 schiit asgard unit or slightly lower price with a $100 schiit modi.

[GreenKiwi]

The LHLabs Geek Pulse is probably in the same power range...

That being said, this should drive those headphones w/o any trouble. It happily drives the Beyer T70 250ohm and Senn HD650 300ohm. The cans that really want power are the low impedance orthodynamic cans, like the HE-500 or the HE-6 (that people connect to speaker amps.)

[KeithL]

You're actually looking at two different limitations there.

Normal headphone amps have trouble with planars because they need a lot of POWER. When you have a low impedance load, it doesn't take much voltage to run it, but you need to be able to supply the current to go with that voltage. (If you drive 8 volts across an 8 ohm load, then, to avoid clipping, you must be able to deliver the 1 amp of current that goes with it.) Most headphone amps are only designed to deliver a limited amount of current (and so power). So, for inefficient low-impedance cans, it's going to be the current that limits most headphone amps.

High impedance headphones are the exact opposite; they are actually very easy to drive, and don't require much current at all; IF you can output enough voltage to drive them. Most audio equipment (including our DC-1) runs on +/-12V or +/-15V. This is not enough to drive a 600 ohm headphone to loud levels because the voltage isn't high enough. (Our headphone amp chip could handle that just fine, but we would have had to include a separate, and higher voltage, power supply just to run the headphone amp at a high enough voltage. Running the amps at a higher voltage would have also required major heat sinks to avoid their overheating when driving lower impedance loads.) Now, if your high-impedance phones are also a very high efficiency model, you don't need to deliver that much power to get them to go plenty loud - so you don't need so much voltage - and, as long as +/-12V is enough voltage, they are very easy to drive (in terms of power and current.)

It's not that either is a difficult load to drive in the general sense; it's just that you end up having to optimize the headphone amp for either - and designing one that can run both well is somewhat more complicated. (This is why you most often hear about amps that do very well at running one OR the other.) Most headphone amps are optimized to work best with most headphones - which are usually in the 35-60 ohm range, and relatively efficient. Because they also (electrically) look pretty much like a regular speaker, planars do well with speaker amps.

If you're going to compare headphone amp power, then you need to do so at the impedance of the headphones you plan to use - and take into account the efficiency of the headphones.

Incidentally, while some of the planars are very low in efficiency, not all of them are.... The HiFiMan He-500's are actually not as bad as many others, and can be driven very well by heftier headphone amps - like the ones in the DC-1. The new Oppo planars are claimed to be quite efficient, and so should work fine with "normal" headphone amps.

Jun 3, 2014 12:11:07 GMT -5 GreenKiwi said:

The LHLabs Geek Pulse is probably in the same power range...

That being said, this should drive those headphones w/o any trouble. It happily drives the Beyer T70 250ohm and Senn HD650 300ohm. The cans that really want power are the low impedance orthodynamic cans, like the HE-500 or the HE-6 (that people connect to speaker amps.)

[garbulky]

Jun 3, 2014 12:11:07 GMT -5 GreenKiwi said:

The LHLabs Geek Pulse is probably in the same power range...

That being said, this should drive those headphones w/o any trouble. It happily drives the Beyer T70 250ohm and Senn HD650 300ohm. The cans that really want power are the low impedance orthodynamic cans, like the HE-500 or the HE-6 (that people connect to speaker amps.)

I'm not so sure about the geek pulse. The DAC will likely be quite nice but I'm not sure what their power specs are. The most I get is that they have a 7.4V max. I'm not sure how to convert that into power delivered at different resistances. Also from what I'm gathering it is USB powered so there may be a limitation there too.

[GreenKiwi]

It's supposed to have 3000mW output.

My guess is that for voltage swing, it's in pretty much the same boat as the DC-1, working on +-12V rails. And I'm guessing that the power curve ends up being pretty similar. Only time will tell.

[garbulky]

Jun 3, 2014 15:05:33 GMT -5 GreenKiwi said:

It's supposed to have 3000mW output.

My guess is that for voltage swing, it's in pretty much the same boat as the DC-1, working on +-12V rails. And I'm guessing that the power curve ends up being pretty similar. Only time will tell.

3000 mw output?! Wow! How are they pulling that off a USB input? Is this by any chance one of the higher end flavors with their power supply attached?

[GreenKiwi]

Yeah the pulse has a separate power supply and comes in a desktop form factor. Their GeekOut has a 1000mW version that does pull from the USB (little USB stick style device). I assume that they use a cap bank to handle that.