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Post by wintermute on Mar 26, 2013 23:26:54 GMT -5
I've been a bit of an Emotiva fanboy. I've owned two XPA-1s, 3 XPA-5s and a XDA-2. One of my XPA-5s hums. So I talked to customer service, described how I had three XPA-5s side by side and one of the three hummed loud enough that I would turn it off when not playing music. I sent them jpgs of RTA charts from REW of all three. Clearly showing that one XPA-5s had a hum at 240hz that the others didn't. They asked me to loosen and retighten the chassis screws and the transformer mounting bolt. No help. So they gave me a RMA to send it back. $90 for me to ship it back from California. Today 3 weeks later it has returned with a note: "transformer hum is within acceptable level".
So now I'm out $90, still have a XPA-5 that hums too loud for my HT room and questioning what to do next. I have an active speaker configuration and need 12 identical channels of amplification for Left/Center/Right. So if one XPA-5 goes, they all have to go. So short term anyway they stay.
I just don't understand why they would ship it back without contacting me first. Why not contact me first and discuss some options? Maybe I would have paid to have had the transformer swapped. Or send me a replacement transformer and I'll swap it myself. Or maybe accept it in trade for a new replacement. But to just ship it back with a simple note basically saying, "it hums, deal with it", isn't what I expected based on my prior contacts with Emotiva sales and customer service. Why wouldn't customer service warn me that this might happen?
I understand that they deal with a lot of customers with a lot of unreasonable complaints. I agree that they have a right to determine what is an acceptable level of hum. But if a customer goes to the trouble and expense to ship a unit back for service I feel that I should get a little more out of it than a note.
And yes, the XPA-5 still hums, significantly louder than the other two.
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Post by ocezam on Mar 26, 2013 23:41:22 GMT -5
Well I agree 100% with your 3rd paragraph. Why don't you call them on the phone and see if you can get any more help?
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Lsc
Emo VIPs 
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Post by Lsc on Mar 27, 2013 0:30:50 GMT -5
I feel for you. I had a XPA-5 that I sent in for repairs because it blew up on me (my buddy gave it an endearing name - smokey) about three weeks ago. I called last Wednesday after giving them a week to look at it, considering shipping time, and they said the repair went fine and it will be shipped out today or tomorrow and you will get a tracking number.
I called back today because I didn't get a tracking number and they gave me a tracking number. But when I went to track it, the number was not found by fed-ex. A return call to Emotiva went when they said it will be shipped out today. When asked why since it should have already been shipped, the girl's answer was "they had to make some more repairs". Since I was at work I had to hang up.
Had to make more repairs to something that was repaired already and should have been shipped out. Nice story..something my 6 year old would tell me.
Wintermute, I'm not surprised by your result based on my experience. I'm still a big Emotiva fan but their repair dept could use some more structure. And it's not difficult...below is a sample.
1. Acknowledge they received the item.
2. Explanation of the problem and work performed. A phone call to customer if required.
3. Return ship and inform customer of tracking number.
Crazy that they would just return it to you. But like I said, I'm not surprised. I agree, you will need to call and talk to someone other than Ashley who gave me my "cute" explanation and expect a better resolution.
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Post by GreenKiwi on Mar 27, 2013 1:16:05 GMT -5
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Post by wintermute on Mar 27, 2013 1:30:05 GMT -5
I don't think the CMX2 would help. The hum is not coming from the speakers, its coming from the transformer. The hum is there without any inputs or speakers attached. All three XPA-5s are plugged into the same outlet box.
I will talk to Emotiva tomorrow. If nothing else to let them know I'm not happy. Short term I'll probably send all three XPA-5s into the garage and run longer cables. Eventually I'll sell all three on craigslist and replace them with something else. I thought about buying another new XPA-5 and selling only the bad one but that would never feel right.
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Post by wintermute on Mar 27, 2013 1:50:17 GMT -5
My other comment about the CMX2 is I thought Emotiva's official stance is that no exterior power conditioning is needed for their amplifiers? Looks like the CMX2 has about $5-$10 of components in it. Why wouldn't they just add them internally to the their amps?
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Post by audiohead on Mar 27, 2013 2:42:55 GMT -5
@op something doesn't seem right?I would gave Emotiva a call ask too speak with someone above a Tech or other than someone who works on units.No "Hum"at anytime is "Acceptable"in any amp it should have been repaired or replaced.I had a Carver amp that did that very same thing and the power trans was replaced in it.Give them a call I would bet my last buck they will fix it.My XPA-5 will be a year old May 5 of this year and if it would start that the Humming that is it would be taking out and repaired.Best of luck Bro.
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Post by GreenKiwi on Mar 27, 2013 5:36:26 GMT -5
I don't think the CMX2 would help. The hum is not coming from the speakers, its coming from the transformer. The hum is there without any inputs or speakers attached. All three XPA-5s are plugged into the same outlet box. I will talk to Emotiva tomorrow. If nothing else to let them know I'm not happy. Short term I'll probably send all three XPA-5s into the garage and run longer cables. Eventually I'll sell all three on craigslist and replace them with something else. I thought about buying another new XPA-5 and selling only the bad one but that would never feel right. The cmx2 is specifically designed to stop transformer hum. At least transformer hum caused by dc offsets. But as others have said, definitely try to speak with someone technical at emotiva. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2013 6:49:23 GMT -5
If you have received the XPA-5 back, you might want to try a little experiment: Swap the transformer with one of the non-humming units. The very act of removing and replacing the transformer *could* result in mitigation of the hum. And it's not a tough job, should take less than 30 minutes total. It's worth a shot, right?
-RW-
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Post by davidas6350 on Mar 27, 2013 8:31:29 GMT -5
^ It may not be a tough job but that's not right. Your suggestion should have been done in Emotiva's shop when they had the amp. The same "very act of removing and replacing" could also result in having both amps humming, so to me, it's not worth the shot.
I hope this is an isolated incident; I noticed last week that one of my XPA-1 is humming louder than the other--they are less than 2 months old. Granted I only hear it in the middle of the night in complete silence so I'm not worried, yet.
What exactly is an acceptable hum level?
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Post by jmilton on Mar 27, 2013 9:35:38 GMT -5
Q:"What exactly is an acceptable hum level?" A: The one you can not hear from your seated position.  |
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KeithL
Administrator 
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Post by KeithL on Mar 27, 2013 10:25:45 GMT -5
DC offset on the power line will often cause a power transformer to hum excessively - because it saturates the transformer core. IF that were the problem, then the CMX-2 would fix it.... but, honestly, that isn't that common a problem and, IF that were the problem, then it would affect all of your amps plugged into that circuit. I don't think the CMX2 would help. The hum is not coming from the speakers, its coming from the transformer. The hum is there without any inputs or speakers attached. All three XPA-5s are plugged into the same outlet box. I will talk to Emotiva tomorrow. If nothing else to let them know I'm not happy. Short term I'll probably send all three XPA-5s into the garage and run longer cables. Eventually I'll sell all three on craigslist and replace them with something else. I thought about buying another new XPA-5 and selling only the bad one but that would never feel right. The cmx2 is specifically designed to stop transformer hum. At least transformer hum caused by dc offsets. But as others have said, definitely try to speak with someone technical at emotiva. |
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Post by davidas6350 on Mar 27, 2013 10:30:20 GMT -5
jmilton --> That's an "acceptable" answer.  However, I'm more interested in what criteria does Emotiva use to say "hum is within acceptable level." Not everyone is seated the same distance to their amps, not to mention the difference in hearing sensitivity for each invidual. |
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Post by gearhead2003 on Mar 27, 2013 11:00:39 GMT -5
I would say for sure give them a call and talk to them. CSR are human and can have long days that do effect their level of assistance they provide. On a day where the tech might have normally picked up the phone to call you might have been the day he or she got into a fight with their significant other or busted their knuckle on your chassis..you never know.
Trust me I majored in the hospitality industry in one of the top schools in the country, even I had my better days.
What would be improper is if you gave them a second chance to make things right and they dropped the ball.
In all fairness they do need to make things right, its just a certain level of patience on your part that is needed in this circumstance.
Judging from the support that is delivered by the EMO clan I am guessing they will.
Best of luck and let us know how it goes!
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Post by gearhead2003 on Mar 27, 2013 11:27:07 GMT -5
ps "acceptable level" of humming is not to an audiophile's standards. Since Emo does make products to such a level the noise from my perspective is not. Even if the slightest thing is off in our setups we notice a huge difference. I've pulled all nighters in the middle of a work week to troubleshoot a off sounding tone or problem in my system.
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Post by Porscheguy on Mar 27, 2013 12:56:47 GMT -5
Call and ask for Joe Laliberte. He's in charge of service. Tell him this isn't fair or to your liking....
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Post by roadrunner on Mar 27, 2013 14:11:28 GMT -5
Your repair sheet, filled out by the tech who repaired your amp, should have the tech's name or initials on it. Call and talk directly with the tech who performed the RMA check. If he gives you no satisfaction then call and talk to Joe or Big Dan and let them know what has transpired. Stay calm and be factual. In my five years of working with Emotiva when I needed any repair work, they were always willing to bend over backward to satisfy me with whatever issue I had.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2013 14:24:27 GMT -5
>> It may not be a tough job but that's not right. Your suggestion should have been done in Emotiva's shop when they had the amp. The same "very act of removing and replacing" could also result in having both amps humming, so to me, it's not worth the shot.<<
Whatever, dude. But nothing ventured, nothing gained. If you end up with 2 humming xformers, this gives you extra ammunition with which to fire back at Emo....
-RW-
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Post by wintermute on Mar 27, 2013 14:27:43 GMT -5
Your repair sheet, filled out by the tech who repaired your amp, should have the tech's name or initials on it. Call and talk directly with the tech who performed the RMA check. If he gives you no satisfaction then call and talk to Joe or Big Dan and let them know what has transpired. Stay calm and be factual. In my five years of working with Emotiva when I needed any repair work, they were always willing to bend over backward to satisfy me with whatever issue I had. Yes the tech's name is on the repair sheet. But I don't see the point in talking to him. Obviously we have a disagreement on what an acceptable level of hum is. It is clearly audible from my listening chair approx 8ft away. Its audible anywhere in the 15ftx18ft room. Its not loud, but audible. It was audible when I first got it over a year ago and seems to have gotten louder since then. Certainly loud enough that I was willing to pay $90 to ship it to Emotiva and to tear apart my system for 3 weeks. My preference right now would be for Emotiva to ship me a replacement transformer and allow me to swap it myself. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2013 14:34:19 GMT -5
Wow, that's some new information. If you heard it from day 1, you should have returned that amp under the 30 day trial period. There is NO way I would have waited a year to confront Emo with the problem...
-RW-
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