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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 20, 2014 2:14:57 GMT -5
Instead of writing about it, I should have just invited Garbulky over & watched his jaw drop at the difference! LOL
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2014 2:36:40 GMT -5
Where did he find the $6 ping pong balls, Jean Pierre's Sports Emporium?
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 20, 2014 2:50:47 GMT -5
Where did he find the $6 ping pong balls, Jean Pierre's Sports Emporium? Wally-World - $5.something plus tax for a half-dozen. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2014 3:18:14 GMT -5
Where did he find the $6 ping pong balls, Jean Pierre's Sports Emporium? Wally-World - $5.something plus tax for a half-dozen. Tacks, I thought you held them in place with velcro? |
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Post by bub on Feb 20, 2014 3:33:31 GMT -5
Great tip... Hope to implement this week..Endless possibilities .. Thanks |
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 20, 2014 4:43:50 GMT -5
Wally-World - $5.something plus tax for a half-dozen. Tacks, I thought you held them in place with velcro? Tax is no joke, my friend - It's INCOME TAX TIME! If only I could Velcro my wallet to my hip! LOL |
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 20, 2014 8:18:42 GMT -5
And I cringe to say this, but with the Heresys, as with most other speakers I have on hand, I think that the Crown PS-400 amp is a better (and more dynamic) match than the XPR-2. The XPR works its magic with some speakers, but the Heresys, for whatever reason, aren't one of the "some." There's absolutely no question that the XPR-2 is far, far better at bass control than the Crown, but since every speaker I have will henceforth be operated from 80 Hz. on up (with the lower frequencies going to the subwoofer), that bass control (or its lack) is no longer a major factor to consider. The XPR-2 is also a far more refined sounding amplifier but with that refined sound comes a big plus and a big minus. The plus is depth of imaging. The XPR-2 provides an almost holographic center image that no other amp I've tried can produce. The minus is that with that refined sound comes a somewhat reduced dynamic presentation that robs music of its "live" sound. If the two amps were British, the XPR-2 would be a dapper gentleman in tweeds, the PS-400 a working rowdy. So will I end up keeping the Heresys? Too soon to say. I have two other items arriving soon that may inform the choice: 1. On March 5th, Emotiva is supposed to ship me the XSP-1, Generation two. When Garbulky and I auditioned my USP-1, we found that it improved dynamics. If the XSP-1 has the same effect, then the XPR-2's slight dynamic reticence will be compensated for by the preamp and the system will be balanced with both of those two items in the mix. On the other hand, if the XSP-1 fails to do anything for the system dynamically, then either very, very careful speaker matching will be required OR the XPR-2 may have to be temporarily shelved. 2. Today, UPS is due to deliver me a pair of KEF Q300 speakers with the centered tweeter. I've read that these speakers are particularly dynamic and image very, very well. If they live up to their reviews in my room, then the XPR-2 may be a good match. The only consistent criticism I've read of the speakers is that their treble sounds slightly emphasized and "wispy." If there's a treble rise, it may be tamable with the XSP-1's tone controls. We'll see... KEF update (From Secrets of Home Theater & High Fidelity review): ON-AXIS RESPONSE:  The on-axis response of the KEF Q300 shows a remarkably flat response over the broad spectrum of 35 Hz to 20 kHz. The response is a little choppy in the isolated band between 350 Hz and 1.5 kHz. This was not generally audible with regular program material. 30-DEGREE OFF-AXIS RESPONSE:  At 30 degrees off-axis, the Q300 speakers had a response curve that was actually smoother between 10 kHz and 20 kHz than the on-axis plot, demonstrating that the KEF Uni-Q design promotes fine dispersion. Elsewhere, the response is much flatter than expected for an off-axis measurement. This is a very good test result. Therefore, no tone controls are likely to be needed. |
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Post by garbulky on Feb 20, 2014 11:40:27 GMT -5
Where did he find the $6 ping pong balls, Jean Pierre's Sports Emporium? Wally-World - $5.something plus tax for a half-dozen. You're biggest mistake was right here! You should have used premium pingpong balls with proper acoustic properties. Not this wally world rubbish. What's the absorption specs on them?!   All kidding aside. That is an interesting modification. I wonder what the idea behind that is? To diffuse the sound or improve the radiation characteristics? |
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Post by monkumonku on Feb 20, 2014 11:45:54 GMT -5
Wally-World - $5.something plus tax for a half-dozen. You're biggest mistake was right here! You should have used premium pingpong balls with proper acoustic properties. Not this wally world rubbish. What's the absorption specs on them?! All kidding aside. That is an interesting modification. I wonder what the idea behind that is? To diffuse the sound or improve the radiation characteristics? Why stop at ping pong balls? I would also try golf balls, nerf balls, whiffle balls, lemons or limes or mandarin oranges, etc. because each has its own acoustic properties. You might also experiment with things that are not round. Hmm.. I just got an idea for the next big audio tweak that will cost about $500 and be marvelously reviewed by 6 Moons and other foolish publications... |
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 20, 2014 11:54:42 GMT -5
As I said, I was HIGHLY skeptical. Not any more!
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Post by jmilton on Feb 20, 2014 12:16:27 GMT -5
You're biggest mistake was right here! You should have used premium pingpong balls with proper acoustic properties. Not this wally world rubbish. What's the absorption specs on them?! All kidding aside. That is an interesting modification. I wonder what the idea behind that is? To diffuse the sound or improve the radiation characteristics? Why stop at ping pong balls? I would also try golf balls, nerf balls, whiffle balls, lemons or limes or mandarin oranges, etc. because each has its own acoustic properties. You might also experiment with things that are not round. Hmm.. I just got an idea for the next big audio tweak that will cost about $500 and be marvelously reviewed by 6 Moons and other foolish publications... Hey, check out the "ball lifters" I found in Snob Stereo Magazine:  |
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Post by Chuck Elliot on Feb 20, 2014 12:23:15 GMT -5
Let's talk about a couple of things regarding the Heresy II
The Heresy II crossover(and to some degree all Klipsch Heritage)
woofer - 2nd order
midrange - high pass 1st order
tweeter - 3rd order
attenuation via autoformer to level match drivers
wild impedance swings as each 3dB of attenuation causes a 2x impedance increase.
In the old days, large value capacitors were extremely expensive and could add a lot to cost. To me this explains some PWK decisions.
With the midrange running only on a high-pass the crossover to the tweeter is kind of rough and I would guess is your issue. My old Cornwalls were all 1st order, but blended pretty well.
My guess would be that the ping-pong balls are somehow masking this bad blend.
The real solution is to get the midrange on a bandpass.
The Klipsch forum is filled with its share of odd-ball tweaks such as wrapping the horns in caulk rope to damp vibrations.
If you believe you are headed to the Heresy as your mains, either get the III upgrade kit or sell and get some IIIs.
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Post by garbulky on Feb 20, 2014 12:33:22 GMT -5
In regards to dynamics. There's also the efficiency difference. The XPR-2's s providing a tiny tiny fraction of its power to the Klipsch vs the deftech. It simply may not be at its best when powering something at such low power. SNR (overall quality) goes up as power levels go up. As for the deftechs, the speakers may simply not be able to power the space that large rooms brings. So the assumtpions made using speakers with these kind of different attributes may not be solely due to an issue of the amp. (It may well be, but not definitive imo).
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Post by Chuck Elliot on Feb 20, 2014 12:53:16 GMT -5
In regards to dynamics. There's also the efficiency difference. The XPR-2's s providing a tiny tiny fraction of its power to the Klipsch vs the deftech. It simply may not be at its best when powering something at such low power. SNR (overall quality) goes up as power levels go up. As for the deftechs, it may simply not be able to power the space that large rooms brings. So the assumtpions made using speakers with these kind of different attributes may not be solely due to an issue of the amp. (It may well be, but not definitive imo). Exactly why I am of the opinion that there is such a thing as too much power! 800W on a 95+ dB speaker is too much. We were blowing down doors in the 70s with 100W on Klipsch. Klipsch had to put zener diodes on the tweeter horns as they were popping like corn. Later they increased the order of the tweeter crossover. Hell I drive mine with a UPA-2 and UPA-5! |
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Post by Chuck Elliot on Feb 20, 2014 13:15:06 GMT -5
I add the following from the XPR-1 Audioholics review and leave it you to interpret.  |
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DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Feb 20, 2014 13:15:57 GMT -5
Before:  The implements of destruction:  Installed:  Not much to look at, but you should HEAR the diff! What you've created there is a phase plug. A very common method for improving on-axis FR of a loudspeaker and for reducing distortion (what you are calling "glare") due to sound wave reflections off the horn surfaces. |
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 20, 2014 16:25:58 GMT -5
Thank you, YES! That IS the name for it (that I couldn't remember)...
Now what's the name of that electronic doodad that will analyze the room's bass and save the profile to a equalizer box? It's a stand alone that can work with two or even more channels.
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DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Feb 20, 2014 16:28:52 GMT -5
Thank you, YES! That IS the name for it (that I couldn't remember)... Now what's the name of that electronic doodad that will analyze the room's bass and save the profile to a equalizer box? It's a stand alone that can work with two or even more channels. There are several such doodads. There's the Antimode 8033, the Velodyne SMS-1, stand-alone Audyssey devices, etc. |
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 20, 2014 16:38:44 GMT -5
Let's talk about a couple of things regarding the Heresy II...attenuation via autoformer to level match drivers = wild impedance swings as each 3dB of attenuation causes a 2x impedance increase. In the old days, large value capacitors were extremely expensive and could add a lot to cost. To me this explains some PWK decisions. With the midrange running only on a high-pass the crossover to the tweeter is kind of rough and I would guess is your issue...My guess would be that the ping-pong balls are somehow masking this bad blend. The real solution is to get the midrange on a bandpass. Anyone make such a crossover, or do I need to calculate it myself? ...The Klipsch forum is filled with its share of odd-ball tweaks such as wrapping the horns in caulk rope to damp vibrations. Most of which I'm not interested in. If you believe you are headed to the Heresy as your mains, either get the III upgrade kit or sell and get some IIIs. Decisions, decisions... |
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Post by Bonzo on Feb 20, 2014 16:40:10 GMT -5
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