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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 20, 2014 16:43:48 GMT -5
In regards to dynamics. There's also the efficiency difference. The XPR-2's s providing a tiny tiny fraction of its power to the Klipsch vs the deftech. It simply may not be at its best when powering something at such low power. SNR (overall quality) goes up as power levels go up. As for the deftechs, the speakers may simply not be able to power the space that large rooms brings. So the assumtpions made using speakers with these kind of different attributes may not be solely due to an issue of the amp. (It may well be, but not definitive imo). In general, I'd agree with you, but the sonic signature of the XPR-2 is consistent between the DefTechs and the Heresys. BOTH are running in the (generous) class-A envelope of the XPR-2. If I heard significant changes in sound with the XPR-2 + DefTech/Heresy combo that I didn't hear with the Crown PS-400 + DefTech/Heresy combo, then I'd say that the amp was the cause. But the XPR-2 sounds like itself regardless of speakers (so far) as does the Crown. In other words, the amps aren't changing their sonic stripes just because they're driving different speakers. That being the case, I'm prone to attribute changes in the sound to the changes in the speakers - not the changes in the power amplifiers. |
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 20, 2014 16:45:12 GMT -5
There are several such doodads. There's the Antimode 8033...etc. Thank you again - THAT'S the one I was thinking of. |
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 20, 2014 16:46:28 GMT -5
LOL - And the WAF on THAT might be? |
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Post by monkumonku on Feb 20, 2014 16:48:54 GMT -5
Those eyeballs do not have very good reviews. If I may, I would suggest something a bit more textured and acoustical, such as this to use as phase plugs: |
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Post by garbulky on Feb 20, 2014 16:53:00 GMT -5
Does the sledgehammer come with the price?
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Post by monkumonku on Feb 20, 2014 16:57:11 GMT -5
Does the sledgehammer come with the price? No, but I'm sure if you don't want to spend money for it, Mrs. Boom can lend you the one she uses on her husband's head when he keeps buying and trying all this new stuff.  |
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 20, 2014 17:07:19 GMT -5
Mrs. Boom is the world's most generous wife. I'm lucky to have her!
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Post by Chuck Elliot on Feb 20, 2014 17:54:30 GMT -5
Let's talk about a couple of things regarding the Heresy II...attenuation via autoformer to level match drivers = wild impedance swings as each 3dB of attenuation causes a 2x impedance increase. In the old days, large value capacitors were extremely expensive and could add a lot to cost. To me this explains some PWK decisions. With the midrange running only on a high-pass the crossover to the tweeter is kind of rough and I would guess is your issue...My guess would be that the ping-pong balls are somehow masking this bad blend. The real solution is to get the midrange on a bandpass. Anyone make such a crossover, or do I need to calculate it myself? AlkEng - use to make universals and extreme slopes Aletheia Audio - Now makes Al's universals and his designs. Bob Crites - basically dups of originals, but he's the man for driver issues. I'd call and talk to him! Very nice guy! All except Bob's are very expensive. My crossovers from Al for my DIY cost me almost $900 for the pair. |
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Post by Chuck Elliot on Feb 20, 2014 17:55:25 GMT -5
Mrs. Boom is the world's most generous wife. I'm lucky to have her! How's your female UPS driver? |
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 20, 2014 18:01:40 GMT -5
How's your female UPS driver? THAT I wouldn't know... |
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 20, 2014 18:07:55 GMT -5
AlkEng - use to make universals and extreme slopes - Aletheia Audio - Now makes Al's universals and his designs. - Bob Crites - basically dups of originals, but he's the man for driver issues. I'd call and talk to him! Very nice guy! All except Bob's are very expensive. My crossovers from Al for my DIY cost me almost $900 for the pair. That being the case, I'll be rolling my own IF I opt to change. No sense buying Bob Crites' when I can make my own using the original parts with fresh caps. For the price of your ALKs , I can buy a set of Heresy IIIs (NEW, even) from a local shop. Using online calculators (and maybe some Zoebel networks to ensure consistent resistance), I can do the deed if I must at 6, 12, or even 18 dB per octave. I've done them before & they've turned out very well. On the other hand, the phase plug alone has improved the sound sufficiently that I may just replace the caps & leave well enough alone. Should I opt to keep the 2s, the only other changes I anticipate are doubling the thickness of the back and switching from wood screws to t-nuts & machine screws on the drivers & back. |
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Post by Bonzo on Feb 20, 2014 18:28:44 GMT -5
Those eyeballs do not have very good reviews. If I may, I would suggest something a bit more textured and acoustical, such as this to use as phase plugs:  If "veiny" texture helps with sound, he might want to swing over to his local, um, "adult store" and see what they have available.   |
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Post by Bonzo on Feb 20, 2014 18:33:04 GMT -5
Mrs. Boom is the world's most generous wife. I'm lucky to have her! What will you pay us to keep from telling her there is no such thing as the perfect loudspeaker that "does it all?" I mean if she finds that out you're done with the fun.  |
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 20, 2014 18:41:37 GMT -5
...If "veiny" texture helps with sound... Axiom audio obviously thinks so - have a look at their ports:  |
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Post by garbulky on Feb 20, 2014 19:25:18 GMT -5
<sigh> Tell me about it. My living room currently has six of those buttholes uh flared ports.
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DYohn
Emo VIPs 
Posts: 18,491
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Post by DYohn on Feb 20, 2014 19:57:20 GMT -5
Boom, if you decide to roll your own crossovers, let me know and I can help you. Crossover design is what I used to do for a living...
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 21, 2014 6:19:53 GMT -5
<sigh> Tell me about it. My living room currently has six of those buttholes uh flared ports. Quit inviting us friends over! LOL The flared ports are JUST ports. |
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 21, 2014 6:20:19 GMT -5
Boom, if you decide to roll your own crossovers, let me know and I can help you. Crossover design is what I used to do for a living... Thank you kindly - I'll keep the offer in mind. |
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 21, 2014 18:22:32 GMT -5
Today, I set up the KEF Q300s on their stands and with the subwoofer crossed over at 80 Hz. gave them a listen.
What do they do well? Image! The coaxial tweeters provide a sharp and deep center image that doesn't shift much even if you're slightly off-axis. The speakers seem to image well whether toed in toward the listener or perpendicular to their rear wall. A foot or more from the back wall and they sing. Any closer to the back wall, and they sound chesty and congested.
What else can they do? Dynamics! They're within spitting distance of the Klipsch Heresys and far better than the Definitive Technology SM65s. This dynamic performance is evident when listening with the XPR-2 amplifier. I've not yet listened to the KEFs with the Crown PS-400, but I'll bet they're even more dynamic there.
What don't the KEFs do? Midbass. The 12" woofer of the Klipsch Heresys deliver a far more realistic picture of orchestra fundamentals than do the 5" woofers of the KEFs. Surprisingly, the KEFs go loudly without sounding strained, but their bass just isn't what it should be. I will try to compensate tomorrow by bringing the subwoofer crossover point up by 10 or 20 Hz.
What else don't the KEFs do? Upper treble. The Heresy's horns sound far more open, airy, and real than do the KEF's concentric tweeters. Don't get me wrong, the KEF's treble is clean, but it just doesn't sound as extended.
So what next? I plan to do the following to try & get the best that the KEFs can give:
1. Remove the grilles & listen without them
2. Raise the subwoofer crossover from 80 to 90 or 100 Hz. to try and fill in the bass
3. Try bi-wiring the speakers to see if it makes a difference in the treble
4. Try the Crown PS-400 amp with the speakers to see it there's a better match (Not that the XPR-2 is a bad match...)
So far, the Klipsch Heresys sound more musical than the KEF Q-300s, but with tweaking, that might change. The KEFs have a LOT of potential.
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Post by deltadube on Feb 21, 2014 18:28:34 GMT -5
Boomer where are the kef muon speakers cheap...
cheers
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