|
|
Post by denon2311 on Jul 5, 2014 4:50:20 GMT -5
Hi
I would like to know which is the better choice for adding more power to my Avr-2311 receiver for creating a warmer sound and better movies.
Any advise is greatly appreciate !
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2014 6:43:02 GMT -5
Hi and welcome to the Emotiva Lounge. I'm sorry, but you give us almost no information except that you own a Denon 2311. That was a $650 entry level or low mid AVR receiver. You apparently want to maybe add more power while getting a warmer sound? Why warmer, is current setup on the bright edgy side sound wise? Better movies, louder, cleaner sounding? That might very well be due to your speakers (maybe metal tweeter on a fairly low priced speaker or some other reason) or you don't have enough power and are driving your speakers into clipping distortion (although not likely). The Emotiva amps are all excellent buys and superb price/performance values as they are factory direct to the buyer and of very high build quality. I'm guessing you might have a 7 speaker surround system and are considering using the Emo amp for either 2 or 3 channels and the Denon amp for the other channels or all 7 channels from an Emotiva? Please give us as much detail as possible about your system, room and listening likes for music, movies and preferred volume levels. We need to know your speakers, brand and model numbers, and any other applicable gear (CD player, DVD player, or other music sources) in your music/HT system. Room: dimensions (all three) and is it open to other areas? What about sound deadening in your room, carpeting, drapes, upholstered furniture, etc. or does it have hardwood floors, etc? ..... all this and other answers to questions affect how much power you need and also what in particular might be causing the lack of wamness you desire. Only with this detailed info can we give you a reasonably applicable answer to your inquiry.  |
|
|
|
Post by brubacca on Jul 5, 2014 7:25:32 GMT -5
As far as I can tell the Denon AVR-2311CI does not have pre-outs for all of its channels. If this is the case you can not add an external amp.
I believe that was the first generation Denon AVR where you had to go to the 3xxx series to get pre-outs for all channels.
|
|
|
|
Post by Dark Ranger on Jul 5, 2014 10:44:07 GMT -5
Yeah, the first thing I checked was if the Denon AVR-2311CI had preouts beyond the usual subwoofer outputs. Nope. This model has only two subwoofer preouts in the main zone. Therefore OP cannot use any of the three mentioned amplifiers. He'd need another AVR with preouts or move up to a surround processor (e.g. UMC-200). That aside, denon2311, I've owned the XPA-200 and currently own the UPA-700 (pushing the 4 surrounds and Zone 2 speakers). I would not describe either of these amplifiers as "warm" but rather quite neutral. They don't color the input signal which is a good thing if you want to hear the content as it was intended. I think what we need from you is more information on your preferences, your current HT components, and your goals. Budget would also be useful. Since the Denon AVR doesn't provide what you're wanting to do, we're talking about getting a new receiver or processor, plus amps. Might be more cash expenditure than you planned on. |
|
|
|
Post by vcautokid on Jul 5, 2014 10:54:27 GMT -5
That is correct. You have to go to an AVR-3xxx model or higher for multi channel pre outs. Another way is to use a high level to low level converter for the front channels, and hook up an XPA-3 for the front stage. That is you take your speaker outs from the Denon, plug them into this converter which than goes RCA out to the XPA-3. Far less expensive solution than another reciever or pre pro.
|
|
|
|
Post by vcautokid on Jul 5, 2014 11:00:39 GMT -5
The company that makes this conveter is Scoche audio I believe. Under $30.00 each. You need get enough of them to cover the 3 front channels. I think you need 2 of them.
|
|
|
|
Post by garbulky on Jul 5, 2014 11:19:04 GMT -5
Hi dennon! I'm afraid amps won't create better movies. But it can make them more enjoyable!  As others have mentioned you may not be able to use the amps with your current reciever. You would need to spend money to get something like a UMC-200 as well. To reccomend an amp, it's impossible to do so without knowing more information from you. Refer to Chuckienuts post for what information to provide. Anyway, either one of those amps will provide you better power than what you have. |
|
|
|
Post by denon2311 on Jul 5, 2014 11:51:36 GMT -5
Hi
My current 7.1 setup includes
Front L/R mission mx3
Ctr mission mxc-2
FHT mission mx-1
Surround JBL
Sub SVS SB2000
I am trying to reduce the power loading from my 3 years old receiver by adding a amp for music listening n movies but not sure will it mismatch to my setup
I am also concern if UPA700 deliver 75watts to eight ohm speakers is under power or I need a 150watts amp into my eight ohm speakers is a better choice .
Thanks & have a great day!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
|
|
|
|
Post by garbulky on Jul 5, 2014 12:18:30 GMT -5
Depends on what yo want to spend really for the amps. They will all do a good job. As others have mentioned you would need to get a different reciever or AVR to reduce the load as your current unit does not have the required connectors at the back to make it work with the amps you plan to buy
|
|
fxe02
Minor Hero
Posts: 32 
|
Post by fxe02 on Jul 5, 2014 12:35:41 GMT -5
i attended the atlanta show.After speaking with Lonnie and Nick , i purchased 2xpa-1L's TO Power my Martin Logan's.My outlaw power amp had shut down with my wife palying christian music.It couldn't handle them.I can't tell you how sweet they sound.They opened up the entire sound stage.
Andrew Robinson reccomended an isf calibration for my vizio lcd.The gentleman(chris eberle-orlando florida)tweated the set .It was way out , and is now incredible.He does not like martin logan - but, loved the sound powered by EMOTIVA.
My point is that this company not onLy MAKES GREAT STUFF, but is there to advise,help and guide you into audio nurvana.Nick has actually advised me to not buy one of there products!
I love the credibility !
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2014 12:49:02 GMT -5
As far as I can tell the Denon AVR-2311CI does not have pre-outs for all of its channels. If this is the case you can not add an external amp. I believe that was the first generation Denon AVR where you had to go to the 3xxx series to get pre-outs for all channels. Whoops! My goof, thanks for clarifying that!  |
|
|
|
Post by Dark Ranger on Jul 5, 2014 13:21:34 GMT -5
I am also concern if UPA700 deliver 75watts to eight ohm speakers is under power or I need a 150watts amp into my eight ohm speakers is a better choice. It really comes down to your preferred average volume level along as well as desired headroom. First, let me clarify that the UPA-700 is rated at 80 watts per channel into 8 ohms at 0.01% distortion, and 100 watts per channel into 4 ohms at 0.01% distortion. In both cases, the power output is specified with all channels driven. That is the key right there. That means all seven channels can each handle at least 80 watts into 8 ohms / 100 watts into 4 ohms at 0.01% distortion. The amplifier can actually produce more power than that although distortion rises as power output increases. In contrast, the Denon AVR's power supply cannot handle the advertised "105 watts per channel into 8 ohms at 0.08% distortion" if all channels are driven concurrently. Sound & Vision reviewed the Denon AVR-2311CI and supplied measurements for the power output (HT Labs Measures) among other things. When all seven channels are driven concurrently into 8 ohm loads, power output was found to be 66.3 watts per channel at 0.1% distortion. What this means is the Denon AVR, despite being advertised at a higher wattage (105 wpc), actually produces less power per channel than the UPA-700 when the AVR is tested this way. The simple conclusion is that the UPA-700 is a more powerful amplifier than the AVR. My point is that if you're happy with the listening levels provided by the AVR (assuming you're not driving it into clipping), then the UPA-700 will be more than adequate for your needs. However, if you are overdriving the AVR or want to have very loud average levels (say 90+ dB at the listening position), then there are several things we'll need to check *such as room size and seated distance from speakers) before settling on an upgrade path. |
|
|
|
Post by novisnick on Jul 5, 2014 13:26:48 GMT -5
I am also concern if UPA700 deliver 75watts to eight ohm speakers is under power or I need a 150watts amp into my eight ohm speakers is a better choice. It really comes down to your preferred average volume level along as well as desired headroom. First, let me clarify that the UPA-700 is rated at 80 watts per channel into 8 ohms at 0.01% distortion, and 100 watts per channel into 4 ohms at 0.01% distortion. In both cases, the power output is specified with all channels driven. That is the key right there. That means all seven channels can each handle at least 80 watts into 8 ohms / 100 watts into 4 ohms at 0.01% distortion. The amplifier can actually produce more power than that although distortion rises as power output increases. In contrast, the Denon AVR's power supply cannot handle the advertised "105 watts per channel into 8 ohms at 0.08% distortion" if all channels are driven concurrently. Sound & Vision reviewed the Denon AVR-2311CI and supplied measurements for the power output (HT Labs Measures) among other things. When all seven channels are driven concurrently into 8 ohm loads, power output was found to be 66.3 watts per channel at 0.1% distortion. What this means is the Denon AVR, despite being advertised at a higher wattage (105 wpc), actually produces less power per channel than the UPA-700 when the AVR is tested this way. The simple conclusion is that the UPA-700 is a more powerful amplifier than the AVR. My point is that if you're happy with the listening levels provided by the AVR (assuming you're not driving it into clipping), then the UPA-700 will be more than adequate for your needs. However, if you are overdriving the AVR or want to have very loud average levels (say 90+ dB at the listening position), then there are several things we'll need to check *such as room size and seated distance from speakers) before settling on an upgrade path. Very well written and insightful. And that's all that needs to be said about that. IMHO |
|
|
|
Post by knucklehead on Jul 5, 2014 14:17:30 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by sahmen on Jul 5, 2014 17:31:27 GMT -5
That is correct. You have to go to an AVR-3xxx model or higher for multi channel pre outs. Another way is to use a high level to low level converter for the front channels, and hook up an XPA-3 for the front stage. That is you take your speaker outs from the Denon, plug them into this converter which than goes RCA out to the XPA-3. Far less expensive solution than another reciever or pre pro. I am also interested in this solution, as I have a Denon AVR-991 which has no pre-outs, although I might want to attach my XPA-2 to it in order to Drive the front L & R channels in one of my HT systems. I just wanted to know whether there are any caveats worth noting when it comes to using such converters, as opposed to getting a different receiver equipped with pre-outs or getting a pre pro... For example, does the converter compromise the sound in any way? Also, the converter says it accepts 80 watts per channel. How are we to understand these "80 watts" in this context... The Denon AVR is *nominally* rated at 125 watts per channel (I do not know exactly what that converts to when all channels are driven in a 5.1 system, but I know that 5.1 would imply a significantly lower rate of watts per channel)... So do you think the converter would be compatible with the 991? Let me know, and thanks in advance. |
|
|
|
Post by denon2311 on Jul 5, 2014 21:53:08 GMT -5
Hi Folks
How good fusion 8100 receiver ? Is the amp component same as upa700?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
|
|
|
|
Post by garbulky on Jul 5, 2014 22:06:46 GMT -5
Hi Folks How good fusion 8100 receiver ? Is the amp component same as upa700? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk It's similar though not necessarily the same. Though I don't know for sure, the power output may be slightly lower . It's still more powerful than your current setup. |
|
|
|
Post by lhracing on Jul 5, 2014 22:46:24 GMT -5
Depending on the speaker efficiencies don't underestimate the UPA-700. My son has one with some 91db speakers and it performs very well....very well.
|
|
|
|
Post by knucklehead on Jul 5, 2014 23:26:44 GMT -5
Hi Folks How good fusion 8100 receiver ? Is the amp component same as upa700? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk If you are going to buy the UPA-500 or -700 why not get the UMC-200 instead of the Fusion? Those amps are tailored for the UMC-200. And at the current 20% off if you are a member of the 'E' Club that makes the price for the amp and UMC-200 even better. The amps in the Fusion is probably not the same as found in the UPA-700 - the Fusion weighs 25# - the UPA-700 weighs 29#. |
|
|
|
Post by denon2311 on Jul 6, 2014 8:44:01 GMT -5
Correct ! I am also considering umc 200+upa700 but not sure the performance is ok.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
|
|
