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Post by davidl81 on Feb 14, 2018 10:39:07 GMT -5
Thanks for the help with the room treatments. I have ordered them today and hopefully get them fairly soon. They recommend 6 2'x4' panels (one between each set of columns and two on the back wall) and four 2'x4' bass traps for the four main corners of the room. I'll take pictures after everything is set up. They did not recommend ceiling treatments at this time, as I can add them later if I felt the need to.
Thanks, David
lenoski,
I have looked to the web site you linked for speaker placement. It recommend me to move my mains 3.5' from the side walls and 4' from the front wall. That puts those towers in front of the screen and pretty close to the front row of couches. I may end not not being able to optimize speaker placement due to seating/viewing limitations of the room.
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Post by creimes on Feb 14, 2018 10:43:36 GMT -5
Thanks for the help with the room treatments. I have ordered them today and hopefully get them fairly soon. They recommend 6 2'x4' panels (one between each set of columns and two on the back wall) and four 2'x4' bass traps for the four main corners of the room. I'll take pictures after everything is set up. They did not recommend ceiling treatments at this time, as I can add them later if I felt the need to. Thanks, David lenoski, I have looked to the web site you linked for speaker placement. It recommend me to move my mains 3.5' from the side walls and 4' from the front wall. That puts those towers in front of the screen and pretty close to the front row of couches. I may end not not being able to optimize speaker placement due to seating/viewing limitations of the room. Looking forward to hearing your thoughts when the panels are up, don't forget to rerun any room correction that you may have ran. Have you considered the Anthem AVM60 for an Atmos processor ? Chad |
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Post by davidl81 on Feb 14, 2018 10:58:08 GMT -5
Thanks for the help with the room treatments. I have ordered them today and hopefully get them fairly soon. They recommend 6 2'x4' panels (one between each set of columns and two on the back wall) and four 2'x4' bass traps for the four main corners of the room. I'll take pictures after everything is set up. They did not recommend ceiling treatments at this time, as I can add them later if I felt the need to. Thanks, David lenoski, I have looked to the web site you linked for speaker placement. It recommend me to move my mains 3.5' from the side walls and 4' from the front wall. That puts those towers in front of the screen and pretty close to the front row of couches. I may end not not being able to optimize speaker placement due to seating/viewing limitations of the room. Looking forward to hearing your thoughts when the panels are up, don't forget to rerun any room correction that you may have ran. Have you considered the Anthem AVM60 for an Atmos processor ? Chad I have looked at it and I may go that route, but I have a 40% upgrade card so I could basically buy the RMC-1 (April ish???) for the same price as the AVM60. The other thing is hopefully the sound works out pretty well and I may be able to hold off of the processor for a bit. I am looking to upgrade to a 4k projector, but I won't do that till next year so I don't really need to upgrade from my Marantz right now. |
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Post by Casey Leedom on Feb 14, 2018 12:34:08 GMT -5
leonski, I have looked to the web site you linked for speaker placement. It recommend me to move my mains 3.5' from the side walls and 4' from the front wall. That puts those towers in front of the screen and pretty close to the front row of couches. I may end not not being able to optimize speaker placement due to seating/viewing limitations of the room. General Speaker Placement recommendations are really just that. It's impossible for anything that doesn't do full Ab Inito simulations to actually tell you where to put your speakers. You should use the "considerations" that such General Speaker Placement recommendations offer and then do a lot of careful listening. Generally, I start off with a compromise of "ideal" placement, obstruction issues, and aesthetics. Then I sit in the "sweet spot" and play a lot of different music and listen critically for issues of sound stage, uneven frequency response, and reflection harshness. Yes, things like DIRAC can try to correct for that, but I think that it's better to start with something that's as good as possible and then let DIRAC take over from there. Uneven frequency response can be node reinforcement from the speaker placement and reflections from the walls, and bass corner/wall reinforcement. This happens predominantly in lower frequencies. You can fudge a bit side -to-side and back-and-forth to try to ameliorate the issues. Reflection harshness is generally a high-frequency phenomena and can be at least partially addressed with room treatments. Hard surfaces like walls, plate glass windows, and especially corners are things to check. You can place temporary, easy-to-move sound absorbers in various locations and carefully listen to the quality of recording which sound harsh. This should help identify where the primary problems are. Then it's back to compromising with aesthetics .... Sound staging issues are mostly controlled by the degree of toe in on the front left/right speakers. Toed in to far and everything seems to be coming from between the two speakers. Toed in too little and everything seems to come from the speakers themselves. And, as I said, play, play, play. It's a hobby: Have fun! Casey |
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Post by Casey Leedom on Feb 14, 2018 12:37:14 GMT -5
... Have you considered the Anthem AVM60 for an Atmos processor ? ... I have looked at it and I may go that route, but I have a 40% upgrade card so I could basically buy the RMC-1 (April ish???) for the same price as the AVM60. The other thing is hopefully the sound works out pretty well and I may be able to hold off of the processor for a bit. I am looking to upgrade to a 4k projector, but I won't do that till next year so I don't really need to upgrade from my Marantz right now. I wouldn't hazard to guess a particular time-line for the RMC-1, but I think that we're very close right now. And the XMC-1, gen3 (AKA "XMC-2") shouldn't be too far behind that since it looks like it's build on the same platform. Casey |
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Post by davidl81 on Feb 25, 2018 16:19:27 GMT -5
I got the room treatments installed this weekend and overall I’m pretty happy. It makes a difference, not OMG this is 1000x’s better than before, but a noticeable difference. I’ll get some pics up once I get the room cleaned up a bit. I did order a DR-2 that hopefully will be in within the next few weeks. I can sell the XPA-2 and my total out of pocket difference won’t be that huge.
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Post by novisnick on Feb 25, 2018 16:38:38 GMT -5
I got the room treatments installed this weekend and overall I’m pretty happy. It makes a difference, not OMG this is 1000x’s better than before, but a noticeable difference. I’ll get some pics up once I get the room cleaned up a bit. I did order a DR-2 that hopefully will be in within the next few weeks. I can sell the XPA-2 and my total out of pocket difference won’t be that huge. If not night and day then your room wasn’t too bad, BUT! Over time you will notice many differences in the sound of much of your music. The rhythm, tone and detail will creep up on you, you will become more spoiled! LOL Enjoy. 😁🎶🎶🎶 |
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Post by garbulky on Feb 25, 2018 20:16:52 GMT -5
I got the room treatments installed this weekend and overall I’m pretty happy. It makes a difference, not OMG this is 1000x’s better than before, but a noticeable difference. I’ll get some pics up once I get the room cleaned up a bit. I did order a DR-2 that hopefully will be in within the next few weeks. I can sell the XPA-2 and my total out of pocket difference won’t be that huge. If not night and day then your room wasn’t too bad, BUT! Over time you will notice many differences in the sound of much of your music. The rhythm, tone and detail will creep up on you, you will become more spoiled! LOL Enjoy. 😁🎶🎶🎶 What he said...over time the differences will come out. |
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Post by davidl81 on Feb 26, 2018 0:47:17 GMT -5
Here are the pics. I was able to get 6 total panels of the 2x4 up and 2 bass traps. I have two more bass traps for the rear of the room, but they won’t fit with the columns. The rear panel looks crooked in the picture, but my level says it’s dead on. Also I have this little 2’ indention in the room and I was able to put a panel there. Attachments:
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Post by kybourbon on Feb 26, 2018 7:41:40 GMT -5
Here are the pics. I was able to get 6 total panels of the 2x4 up and 2 bass traps. I have two more bass traps for the rear of the room, but they won’t fit with the columns. The rear panel looks crooked in the picture, but my level says it’s dead on. Also I have this little 2’ indention in the room and I was able to put a panel there. Did you put a trap at the first reflection point though? That's the most important one. |
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Post by davidl81 on Feb 26, 2018 9:13:47 GMT -5
Here are the pics. I was able to get 6 total panels of the 2x4 up and 2 bass traps. I have two more bass traps for the rear of the room, but they won’t fit with the columns. The rear panel looks crooked in the picture, but my level says it’s dead on. Also I have this little 2’ indention in the room and I was able to put a panel there. Did you put a trap at the first reflection point though? That's the most important one. Using the mirror test the best I can tell the first reflection point is the wall right next to the speaker where the panels are installed. I made a crude drawing and I have panels installed pretty much on every wall location open in the room. I have a large double door that is the main entrance to the room. I have nothing covering those doors, but I am not sure if there is any way (or need) to install panels on the doors. There is also a door to the attic space that is opposite the entrance doors that I am not able to install panels on. Attachments:
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Post by fbczar on Feb 26, 2018 9:22:24 GMT -5
Here are the pics. I was able to get 6 total panels of the 2x4 up and 2 bass traps. I have two more bass traps for the rear of the room, but they won’t fit with the columns. The rear panel looks crooked in the picture, but my level says it’s dead on. Also I have this little 2’ indention in the room and I was able to put a panel there. Did you put a trap at the first reflection point though? That's the most important one. Looks like the best thing to do with the other bass traps is to put them on the columns under each sconce. That should take care of the first reflection point. Of course, putting traps on the ceiling also deals with a first reflection point. By the way, if you decide to buy a processor with Dirac you can check the effect of the bass traps Dirac. I have a setup much like yours and I eventually added bass traps on the ceiling. The ceiling traps were especially helpful for music and movie dialog. |
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Post by fbczar on Feb 26, 2018 9:34:55 GMT -5
Did you put a trap at the first reflection point though? That's the most important one. Using the mirror test the best I can tell the first reflection point is the wall right next to the speaker where the panels are installed. I made a crude drawing and I have panels installed pretty much on every wall location open in the room. I have a large double door that is the main entrance to the room. I have nothing covering those doors, but I am not sure if there is any way (or need) to install panels on the doors. There is also a door to the attic space that is opposite the entrance doors that I am not able to install panels on. There are actually two first reflection points to be concerned with. You have taken care of the one for the reflection adjacent to each speaker, but there is also a reflection from each speaker on the the opposite side of the room. I think that reflection will prove to be on the columns where you have sconces mounted, but it could be on the doors. You can find the opposite reflection point I am talking about using a mirror like you did for the other. Just slide the mirror down the wall until you see the speaker from the opposite side of the room. |
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Post by creimes on Feb 26, 2018 10:03:36 GMT -5
I got the room treatments installed this weekend and overall I’m pretty happy. It makes a difference, not OMG this is 1000x’s better than before, but a noticeable difference. I’ll get some pics up once I get the room cleaned up a bit. I did order a DR-2 that hopefully will be in within the next few weeks. I can sell the XPA-2 and my total out of pocket difference won’t be that huge. Did you rerun any room correction you may have ran before installing the panels. Chad |
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Post by kybourbon on Feb 26, 2018 10:14:49 GMT -5
Looking at your drawing (huge help BTW) I don't think you have covered your first reflection point very well. Now, this might very well not be possible in that room. You could try to "hang up" a bunch of heavy blankets temporarily as a test in those areas to see if it makes a difference --- I think it would.
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Post by davidl81 on Feb 26, 2018 10:28:12 GMT -5
Looking at your drawing (huge help BTW) I don't think you have covered your first reflection point very well. Now, this might very well not be possible in that room. You could try to "hang up" a bunch of heavy blankets temporarily as a test in those areas to see if it makes a difference --- I think it would. I agree and I think the doors and the columns are reflection points (the doors being the main one). The issue is just how would I go about even treating the doors. I guess i could install panels on them, but maybe do 1" panels so they have less weight? |
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Post by davidl81 on Feb 26, 2018 10:28:53 GMT -5
I got the room treatments installed this weekend and overall I’m pretty happy. It makes a difference, not OMG this is 1000x’s better than before, but a noticeable difference. I’ll get some pics up once I get the room cleaned up a bit. I did order a DR-2 that hopefully will be in within the next few weeks. I can sell the XPA-2 and my total out of pocket difference won’t be that huge. Did you rerun any room correction you may have ran before installing the panels. Chad Yes I did re-run it on Friday night. |
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Post by fbczar on Feb 26, 2018 10:37:21 GMT -5
Looking at your drawing (huge help BTW) I don't think you have covered your first reflection point very well. Now, this might very well not be possible in that room. You could try to "hang up" a bunch of heavy blankets temporarily as a test in those areas to see if it makes a difference --- I think it would. I agree and I think the doors and the columns are reflection points (the doors being the main one). The issue is just how would I go about even treating the doors. I guess i could install panels on them, but maybe do 1" panels so they have less weight? A single GIK 242 or similar panel only weighs about 8lbs. You should not have a problem with mounting a 242 panel or a monster trap on a door.. |
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Post by kybourbon on Feb 26, 2018 11:13:50 GMT -5
Looking at your drawing (huge help BTW) I don't think you have covered your first reflection point very well. Now, this might very well not be possible in that room. You could try to "hang up" a bunch of heavy blankets temporarily as a test in those areas to see if it makes a difference --- I think it would. I agree and I think the doors and the columns are reflection points (the doors being the main one). The issue is just how would I go about even treating the doors. I guess i could install panels on them, but maybe do 1" panels so they have less weight? I would try some panels and a few of those Command Strips to attach it to the door. Should work. |
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Post by leonski on Feb 26, 2018 13:34:53 GMT -5
My dad built a recording studio many years ago. From control room to studio was maybe a 6" thick wall. Glass on ONE side was not parallel to the other and both were set in rubber foam.
As for doors? Door to control room from studio was an EXTERIOR door, not interior and had a sheet of LEAD attached.
Not only will a door act as a reflector, but a drumhead as well. It'll resonate.
I'd change to an Exterior Door (solid core) and go from there with some diffusion.
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