|
|
Post by pachieh on Feb 5, 2018 11:14:46 GMT -5
I am getting closer to finally getting a processor. But, looking for opinions on an AVM60 vs XMC-1 GEN 2/3 as there's not a lot out there comparing the two. I understand the V3 board will finally be out next month, so trying to figure out which way to go.
Specifically, the AVM60 is balanced for XLR outputs, as is the XMC-1. What I'm not sure of is how good the GEN 3 is with the fully differential setup of L/C/R compared to the AVM60 (or even Gen 2 with the new V3 HDMI board).
What I can't find is any upgrade options (hardware wise) for the AVM60 like they used to do with the AVM50. I'm guessing it's NOT upgradeable like an XMC with a board swap and firmware update.
Anyone have any thoughts? I know DIRAC and ARC are pretty darn close in capability, so it kinda comes down to if the fully differential setup of the GEN 3 is really worth it.
|
|
bootman
Emo VIPs 
Typing useless posts on internet forums....
Posts: 9,358
|
Post by bootman on Feb 5, 2018 11:59:57 GMT -5
I would get what fits your current needs now.
To take advantage of any fully differential setup would require you to keep the audio signal fully differential all the way to the amps feeding the speakers.
So Source, preamp, and mono block block differential amps to the speakers.
If you are not planning of doing that, then take the balanced differential feature out of your equation.
|
|
|
|
Post by davidl81 on Feb 5, 2018 12:44:17 GMT -5
Do/will you need Atmos? The XMC-1 does not yet support it even with the new board, but an upgrade should be coming. Timing on that upgrade is kind of up in the air though. I too am interested in what others have to say about these tow units as I have been looking to upgrade but I do need Atmos.
|
|
|
|
Post by pachieh on Feb 5, 2018 20:28:34 GMT -5
I would get what fits your current needs now. To take advantage of any fully differential setup would require you to keep the audio signal fully differential all the way to the amps feeding the speakers. So Source, preamp, and mono block block differential amps to the speakers. If you are not planning of doing that, then take the balanced differential feature out of your equation. For the XMC, only audio signal it will be processing is for home theater, from my XBOX One X via HDMI. I have a Emo DR-3 being built now for my amps, so I think that chain is good. While it will be hooked up to my "2-channel part," it will only be via HT-Bypass. When I listen to 2-channel music, it's from my Ayre DAC to my ARC REF5SE, then to the DR-3. davidl81 Avatar Feb 5, 2018 12:44:17 GMT -5 davidl81 said: Do/will you need Atmos? The XMC-1 does not yet support it even with the new board, but an upgrade should be coming. Timing on that upgrade is kind of up in the air though. I too am interested in what others have to say about these tow units as I have been looking to upgrade but I do need Atmos. Not huge on Atmos as it'll require more speakers, something that makes it annoying to move often and resets and recalibrate. High quality 5.1 will suit us well for now. |
|
|
|
Post by emofrmcgy on Feb 5, 2018 20:48:41 GMT -5
Having previously owned an Xmc and currently owning an Anthem. I don’t think there is a wrong choice between these two pieces.
In your case, grab an xmc so it matches your new amps.
Jmo anyway.
|
|
|
|
Post by Gary Cook on Feb 5, 2018 23:40:03 GMT -5
Having back to back compared (my room, my speakers, my ears) an AVM60 with my UMC-200 I would probably choose the UMC-200 based on sound quality. But it is pretty close, they sound pretty damn good and I wouldn't be disappointed owning an AV60. Both units were REW'd to a reasonable (not perfection) standard and no built in correction systems were utilised. The AVM60 utilises the AK4458 DAC (same as the Onkyo TX 545/646/747 range) which has been around for almost 3 years, a long time in DAC world. All up I would expect the XMC-1 to be step above, DIRAC not withstanding.
Cheers
Gary
|
|
|
|
Post by Soup on Feb 6, 2018 7:11:22 GMT -5
Having back to back compared (my room, my speakers, my ears) an AVM60 with my UMC-200 I would probably choose the UMC-200 based on sound quality. But it is pretty close, they sound pretty damn good and I wouldn't be disappointed owning an AV60. Both units were REW'd to a reasonable (not perfection) standard and no built in correction systems were utilised. The AVM60 utilises the AK4458 DAC (same as the Onkyo TX 545/646/747 range) which has been around for almost 3 years, a long time in DAC world. All up I would expect the XMC-1 to be step above, DIRAC not withstanding. Cheers Gary You must be JOKING. Comparing the sound quality of the UMC200 to the AVM60 and saying the UMC200 is better is silly.....................(at least to my ears) I KNOW my Anthem MRX 510 kicked my UMC200's ass when i compared them directly................... Is this an early April Fools joke? |
|
|
|
Post by emofrmcgy on Feb 6, 2018 9:59:26 GMT -5
Having back to back compared (my room, my speakers, my ears) an AVM60 with my UMC-200 I would probably choose the UMC-200 based on sound quality. But it is pretty close, they sound pretty damn good and I wouldn't be disappointed owning an AV60. Both units were REW'd to a reasonable (not perfection) standard and no built in correction systems were utilised. The AVM60 utilises the AK4458 DAC (same as the Onkyo TX 545/646/747 range) which has been around for almost 3 years, a long time in DAC world. All up I would expect the XMC-1 to be step above, DIRAC not withstanding. Cheers Gary You must be JOKING. Comparing the sound quality of the UMC200 to the AVM60 and saying the UMC200 is better is silly.....................(at least to my ears) I KNOW my Anthem MRX 510 kicked my UMC200's ass when i compared them directly................... Is this an early April Fools joke? Opinions are definitely highly biased by personal preference. |
|
|
|
Post by creimes on Feb 6, 2018 10:20:30 GMT -5
Having back to back compared (my room, my speakers, my ears) an AVM60 with my UMC-200 I would probably choose the UMC-200 based on sound quality. But it is pretty close, they sound pretty damn good and I wouldn't be disappointed owning an AV60. Both units were REW'd to a reasonable (not perfection) standard and no built in correction systems were utilised. The AVM60 utilises the AK4458 DAC (same as the Onkyo TX 545/646/747 range) which has been around for almost 3 years, a long time in DAC world. All up I would expect the XMC-1 to be step above, DIRAC not withstanding. Cheers Gary You must be JOKING. Comparing the sound quality of the UMC200 to the AVM60 and saying the UMC200 is better is silly.....................(at least to my ears) I KNOW my Anthem MRX 510 kicked my UMC200's ass when i compared them directly................... Is this an early April Fools joke? I actually just went from a UMC-200 to a MRX310 and prefer the sound of the Anthem, but for some reason I also preferred the sound of the Sherbourn PT-7020C4 to the UMC-200 as well, of course this is personal preference as well, I wasn't all that impressed with the UMC-200, and I've owned the UMC-1, PT-7030, XMC-1, PT-7020C4, but of course we all have different likes in terms of how something sounds. Chad |
|
|
|
Post by Gary Cook on Feb 6, 2018 18:36:28 GMT -5
Having back to back compared (my room, my speakers, my ears) an AVM60 with my UMC-200 I would probably choose the UMC-200 based on sound quality. But it is pretty close, they sound pretty damn good and I wouldn't be disappointed owning an AV60. Both units were REW'd to a reasonable (not perfection) standard and no built in correction systems were utilised. The AVM60 utilises the AK4458 DAC (same as the Onkyo TX 545/646/747 range) which has been around for almost 3 years, a long time in DAC world. All up I would expect the XMC-1 to be step above, DIRAC not withstanding. You must be JOKING. Comparing the sound quality of the UMC200 to the AVM60 and saying the UMC200 is better is silly.....................(at least to my ears) I KNOW my Anthem MRX 510 kicked my UMC200's ass when i compared them directly................... Nothing more than my opinion, so hence not worth much, if anything at all. Noting that I don't use my UMC-200 for stereo 2.1 music, for that I use the XSP-1 (now that's where I can use "night and day"). As a result any comparisons with the UMC-200 are based on HT use in 5.1 Dolby TrueHD and DTS HDMA. I should also mention that when I had the AVM60 (November 2016) it couldn't handle DTS-X which I understand was corrected in a later software release. What it sounds to me is exactly that, what it sounds to me, not someone else. However there is some technical basis to support my opinion, since the original release of the AK4458 in 2013 AKM has promoted a higher level of the DAC series designated AK4458VN which was available in 2016. The VN version features AKM's Velvet Sound architecture, which the basic AK4458 doesn't have. The AK4458VN is used in a number of current generation AVR's from Pioneer, Marantz, Denon, Onkyo and also can be found in the Oppo 203. Having flipped the lid I noted that AVM60 used the basic AK4458. FWIW, the reason I tried the AVM60 (yikes, 15 months ago) was because I was just about over waiting for the XMC-1 updates (4K + Atmos/DTSX) and was looking for an alternative.  Cheers Gary |
|
|
|
Post by Soup on Feb 6, 2018 18:41:26 GMT -5
I think there is MORE to SOUND QUALITY than using the LATEST CHIP....................It is how it is implemented.....................
Thanks for your clarification...........
|
|
|
|
Post by pachieh on Feb 6, 2018 20:12:18 GMT -5
Thanks for the input from all. Can anyone clarify Anthem's upgradeability?
|
|
|
|
Post by creimes on Feb 6, 2018 20:22:38 GMT -5
Thanks for the input from all. Can anyone clarify Anthem's upgradeability? Just buying the next processor that is released afaik, if your staying 5.1 I say go for the XMC-1 that's currently for sale or even get a used one as there seems to be more and more of them for sale lately given the RMC-1 is upon us. Chad |
|
|
|
Post by sockemdog on Feb 6, 2018 21:20:21 GMT -5
Thanks for the input from all. Can anyone clarify Anthem's upgradeability? Just buying the next processor that is released afaik, if your staying 5.1 I say go for the XMC-1 that's currently for sale or even get a used one as there seems to be more and more of them for sale lately given the RMC-1 is upon us. Chad In 2001, I spent $2400 at a high-end dealer in SC on an Anthem AVM-2 processor which had a *huge* selling point of being upgradeable. I liked the processor fine for DD/DTS/S-Video and am actually still using it for DAC/preamp duties on my computer setup. However, there never was ANY communication to me about upgrades and when I called Anthem to ask, all I got was "Not at this time". It has cutouts in the back for the upgrades that never came. There were a couple of firmware updates, but that's all... and... "Oh, we have the AVM-20 to sell you which is better/faster/etc". I thought I was "investing" and not just purchasing a piece of equipment. That is a lot of dough in today's dollars as well as back then when I wasn't as financially established as now. I purchased an XMC-1 from Emo about 3 years ago and look at what they're doing... UPGRADING for newer capabilities! That, my friends, is an investment I can feel good about. Brad |
|
|
|
Post by rbk123 on Feb 6, 2018 22:07:59 GMT -5
It'll probably be closer to a wash of the Emo existing investment + upgrade $$, vs. selling prior gen + buying current gen in another processor. I wouldn't get too worked up about it either way; it's a hobby so enjoy your hobby.
|
|
|
|
Post by Gary Cook on Feb 7, 2018 0:12:06 GMT -5
I think there is MORE to SOUND QUALITY than using the LATEST CHIP....................It is how it is implemented..................... Thanks for your clarification........... Not a clarification, it was an example of something technical that may contribute to my opinion. It was not the reason for my opinion. Cheers Gary |
|
|
|
Post by cwt on Feb 7, 2018 7:17:56 GMT -5
Theres your answer an XMC1 ; soon will include hdmi2.0b inputs if UHD is of interest . If you do eventually go atmos/dts-x just send it back to upgrade .. On the modular aspect whats more likely to get continued upgrades over and above what we know atm ?; an older architecture that's had a clever repurposing of its circuitry or a new gen design that's purpose built with atmos etc in mind.. And one thing is for sure the anthem has no chance of getting dirac unison or indeed the new improved dirac algorithms.. Of course timing is important and some options may easily take longer .. Is a RMC1 out of the equation ? Or can you save for 1 ;leaving aside the XMC1 V2; it will be 1st cab of the rank before the gen 3 XMC1 . Good luck with whatever direction you go  |
|
|
|
Post by ausman on Feb 7, 2018 8:32:10 GMT -5
uhd is a dead standard, HDR is the going standards in terms of tv displays and passthroughs..
I think it is great to support dirac, though how far is it going to go once you start using dolby and will it compete or enhance the diracs use???
|
|
|
|
Post by goodfellas27 on Feb 7, 2018 13:33:13 GMT -5
At ISE 2018 in Amsterdam, Canadian AV electronics manufacturer NAD has unveiled a “new and improved” AV pre/pro, the Masters M17 V2 ($5999 U.S.). This update of the Masters M17 supports NAD’s MDC (modular design construction) architecture that allows owners to customize their unit and keep it up-to-date with the latest technology. The company also announced imminent availability of two new MDC modules, the MDC AM 17 ($699 U.S.) that adds support for Dolby Atmos and the MDC AM 230 ($549 U.S.). The Masters M17 V2 is now NAD’s flagship surround-sound AV pre/pro. It is an 11-channel processor and features balanced outputs for all channels. Furthermore, the balanced line stage incorporates the DACs. This model ships with Dirac Live (full version) room correction built-in. This is a networked pre/pro that includes BluOS built-in. This allows it to be a part of a hi-res capable multi-room audio system. It also allows you to play back music—including hi-res and MQA tracks—using the dedicated BluOS app on mobile devices or a PC/Mac. On the video side, the Masters M17 V2 has five HDMI inputs and two HDMI outputs. It includes HDCP 2.2 support and can handle HDR content. It’s also a custom install friendly device; it has CEC/ARCsupport, four IR repeaters, three 12-volt trigger-outs, and an RS-232 data port that supports discrete on/off codes and access to inputs so you can program it to work seamlessly with Crestron and Control4 systems    more here: www.avsforum.com/nad-unveils-masters-m17-v2-av-prepro-atmos-dirac-mdc-modules-ise-2018/ |
|
|
|
Post by Soup on Feb 7, 2018 17:43:16 GMT -5
Beautiful, but how does it SOUND?
|
|
