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Post by AudioHTIT on Jul 28, 2018 5:52:12 GMT -5
Agreed on all counts, Boom, with the exception of cost being the only driver. While that may well be the most significant, I think the light weights and especially small footprints, as relates today’s ever-smaller living spaces, are and will continue to be important drivers to bringing listeners newly into the Class D fold. ... and—as you noted in your warm basement—lower power consumption (and its by product heat). That’s what interests me about Class D |
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Post by emoon3 on Aug 5, 2018 19:56:43 GMT -5
I bought three of these for my LCR channels. They’re fantastic. I upgraded from a UPA-700, so they’re definitely more powerful. The autosensing works really well. Clean, quiet. And saving me a ton of space and much more energy efficient.
The only downside is one of the rubber feet came off while I was sliding one of them into place. They’re held in place by a tiny, double-sided adhesive pad. Would have preferred screw on feet.
But other than that, really happy.
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Post by leonski on Aug 5, 2018 21:16:15 GMT -5
Whatever. Mine have never shut down one moment playing music, while my last Emotiva amp shut down four times to the point of needing to travel back to Franklin. No shutdown means, essentially, that' you've never exceeded design limits. 'power' of ICE modules is severely time limited, ususally 60 seconds and in some cases 30 seconds. And always at a much lower than advertised power. icepower.dk/products/amplifier-power-modules/as-series-intelligent-audio-amplifier-power/download YOUR amps datasheet and look. The 1200, single channel amp is <300 watts continuous without thermal shutdown. And the time limit is listed some else in the specs. This situation could probably be remedied thru the use of some very aggressive heat sinking. for the <1% of the time it might be needed. My point is that with the rare exception of a few 'power users' we probably ALL use a LOT LESS amp power than we 'think'. The guy who is using the PA-1 amps on his front / center is doing well and not only using a little less electric power, but has a satisfying system. |
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Post by chicagorspec on Aug 5, 2018 21:20:17 GMT -5
Whatever. Mine have never shut down one moment playing music, while my last Emotiva amp shut down four times to the point of needing to travel back to Franklin. No shutdown means, essentially, that' you've never exceeded design limits. 'power' of ICE modules is severely time limited, ususally 60 seconds and in some cases 30 seconds. And always at a much lower than advertised power. icepower.dk/products/amplifier-power-modules/as-series-intelligent-audio-amplifier-power/download YOUR amps datasheet and look. The 1200, single channel amp is <300 watts continuous without thermal shutdown. And the time limit is listed some else in the specs. This situation could probably be remedied thru the use of some very aggressive heat sinking. for the <1% of the time it might be needed. My point is that with the rare exception of a few 'power users' we probably ALL use a LOT LESS amp power than we 'think'. The guy who is using the PA-1 amps on his front / center is doing well and not only using a little less electric power, but has a satisfying system. ...and yet they've worked fine for music. Much better than my last Emotiva combo amplifier/boat anchor. |
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Post by leonski on Aug 5, 2018 23:46:33 GMT -5
I dont' know why. Speaker sensitivity is fairly high. The only thing I can think of is that speaker reactance was NOT to the EMOs liking.
I see no measured data for that, which I'd expect, given the Mulriple drivers and gigantic amount of DSP applied to the Legacy speakers.
If the EMO amps were distorting, I'm GLAD you didn't damage a tweeter / s-Tweeter in the bargain.
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Post by Boomzilla on Aug 6, 2018 0:41:29 GMT -5
NOBODY's done a review on how these new Emotivas sound? WTF? Someone buy a pair & spill the beans, please! Big Dan - I'll write about them if you'd like...
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Post by emoon3 on Aug 6, 2018 1:50:28 GMT -5
NOBODY's done a review on how these new Emotivas sound? WTF? Someone buy a pair & spill the beans, please! Big Dan - I'll write about them if you'd like... They sound great. I pushed them as far as I dare without disturbing my neighbors (I live in an apartment) no distortion or clipping. They do what all good amps should do, get out of the way and present the music. My UPA-700 is only 80w permchannel, so the pa-1s are definitely more authoritive. A decent amount of good, clean power. I did a fair amount of two channel listening and I hear an improvement - especially in the lower midrange, but again, I attribute that to more power. I feel like the Boxers had been power starved before now. The sound is definitely more dynamic, more punch. I definitely wouldn’t guess they were class D amps if I heard them without knowing. I bought them knowing I could send them back if not satisfied, but they’re not going anywhere. I would say, if you are someone that likes the warm distortion of tube amps, these probably won’t be your cup of tea. These present the music as it is in a very precise waywithout sounding clinical. |
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Post by leonski on Aug 6, 2018 2:33:27 GMT -5
In reading many 'd' amp reviews, and mainly the B&O ICE stuff, they SEEM to have more in common than glaring differences.
Sometimes a buffer section (No Gain) prior to the amp itself can have a small effect.
I'd look up ALL the ASC module reviews and get a feel for how reviewers react to them......That would be about IT for the EMO offering, as well
No big surprises.
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Post by Boomzilla on Aug 6, 2018 7:00:00 GMT -5
...I definitely wouldn’t guess they were class D amps if I heard them... That’s the best endorsement I’ve heard yet! |
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klinemj
Emo VIPs 
Official Emofest Scribe
Posts: 15,090
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Post by klinemj on Aug 6, 2018 8:49:29 GMT -5
...I definitely wouldn’t guess they were class D amps if I heard them... That’s the best endorsement I’ve heard yet! This is the same thing I would say about my Hypex. Class D has indeed changed vs. past executions. Mark |
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Post by tchaik on Aug 6, 2018 9:30:42 GMT -5
That’s the best endorsement I’ve heard yet! This is the same thing I would say about my Hypex. Class D has indeed changed vs. past executions. Mark I'm just superstitious I guess..... still want my honking bigass toroidal transformer and mega rows of caps and transistors.  I am sure if I did a head to head listening between the two technologies both with similar specs and both well executed I might not be able to tell the difference. but who can argue with the sexiness of owning an amp that might give you a hernia when you try to move it...... tchaik............... |
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Post by craigl59 on Aug 6, 2018 11:35:15 GMT -5
tchaik:
Was able to compare a Nord Stereo UP class D last year to an Emotiva XPA-1L and the Emotiva won hands down -- there was no comparison. In particular, the Nord was thin as regards tone weight and acoustical instruments such as cellos seemed more like pictures than actual representations.
More problematic was the volume issue. No matter how much you turned the volume up, it didn't seem loud enough. Suspect this is related to the tone weight problem and other reviewers (including one who reviewed the Lyngdorf 2170) have mentioned this same problem.
STILL, have most of the Emotiva products and am trying to find an excuse to order two of the PA-1s. Will be looking at other reviews as they appear and appreciate Emoon3's comment above.
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klinemj
Emo VIPs
Official Emofest Scribe
Posts: 15,090
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Post by klinemj on Aug 6, 2018 15:09:33 GMT -5
This is the same thing I would say about my Hypex. Class D has indeed changed vs. past executions. Mark I'm just superstitious I guess..... still want my honking bigass toroidal transformer and mega rows of caps and transistors. I am sure if I did a head to head listening between the two technologies both with similar specs and both well executed I might not be able to tell the difference. but who can argue with the sexiness of owning an amp that might give you a hernia when you try to move it...... tchaik............... I don't know - I find it pretty sexy that my Class D are so light I can (and do) hang them on the wall with ordinary picture hanger hooks and wire. LOL! And, I do think that with the right Class D, you would not be able to tell the difference. But, just like not all Class A or Class A/B are created equal, not all Class D are created equal either. So you will find some comments like the above post who tried the Nord's and preferred the Emotiva. I found my Hypex gave up nothing in punch and ability to get loud vs. my old Emotiva XPA-2, but I actually gained more clarity and hear a less grainy high end. Mark |
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Post by emoon3 on Aug 6, 2018 17:24:33 GMT -5
Just a quick update. I started having problems with the auto-turn on. It seems like if there’s not a certain amount of signal going to the amp, it wouldn’t turn on. For example, the center channel would always be on because the dialog was playing there, but the left and right channels wouldn’t switch on if there was something faint playing there. Sometimes just the left or right would be on. When I switched all the amps to be on full time, you could definitely hear sounds coming from the speaker that were not triggering the auto-on feature.
Two channel audio never has this problem.
I’ve switched to having the amps on full time, bit would love to have the auto-on fetaure working correctly to save on power consumption.
Soundwise, still loving them.
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Post by leonski on Aug 6, 2018 17:59:21 GMT -5
My Auto-On Parasounds have the same issue. If the level feeding the amp is very low, they don't 'sense' the signal. But that is a very low level, indeed.
The auto on appears to be related to a capacitor charging. OR discharging. If while watching something LATE at night, I turn the level Way Down, a couple minutes later one or both amps might drop out. When the capacitor discharges, the circuit flips to 'off'.
A quick increase in level and all is well. When I shut down for the evening, the amps stay 'on' for a while and I can hear the relays drop out, a couple minutes later.
What amps are you referring to? Any chance of getting a Kill-A-Watt meter, about 25$ retail, and actually measuring power draw with NO signal?
How warm are the amps under no-signal conditions? If cool, I'd say you have little or nothing to worry about. Power draw at idle / no signal is VERY minimal. Unless that switch marked 'Class A' is to the on position.
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Post by emoon3 on Aug 6, 2018 18:42:38 GMT -5
My Auto-On Parasounds have the same issue. If the level feeding the amp is very low, they don't 'sense' the signal. But that is a very low level, indeed. The auto on appears to be related to a capacitor charging. OR discharging. If while watching something LATE at night, I turn the level Way Down, a couple minutes later one or both amps might drop out. When the capacitor discharges, the circuit flips to 'off'. A quick increase in level and all is well. When I shut down for the evening, the amps stay 'on' for a while and I can hear the relays drop out, a couple minutes later. What amps are you referring to? Any chance of getting a Kill-A-Watt meter, about 25$ retail, and actually measuring power draw with NO signal? How warm are the amps under no-signal conditions? If cool, I'd say you have little or nothing to worry about. Power draw at idle / no signal is VERY minimal. Unless that switch marked 'Class A' is to the on position. Thanks. These are the pa-1 amps. They are completely cool to the touch so I think I’m fine. I’ll just leave them on. Thanks again! |
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Post by leonski on Aug 6, 2018 19:27:50 GMT -5
emoon,
IF you are really curious, B&O publishes Lots of DataSheets. For each amp in a series. Your idle power will be buried in the mass of published information. And it is well organized so you
won't go blind finding it.
Just look up ASC300.
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Post by Bonzo on Aug 6, 2018 19:48:30 GMT -5
Almost odd for an Emotiva amp that they didn't include a trigger input instead. I guess they figured these will be used by people who want the most simple set up?
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Post by emoon3 on Aug 6, 2018 19:52:20 GMT -5
Almost odd for an Emotiva amp that they didn't include a trigger input instead. I guess they figured these will be used by people who want the most simple set up? They have trigger inputs. I’m just trying to avoid wiring up the trigger ins and outs #lazy lol. |
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Post by emoon3 on Aug 6, 2018 19:52:48 GMT -5
Almost odd for an Emotiva amp that they didn't include a trigger input instead. I guess they figured these will be used by people who want the most simple set up? Thanks. Will do. |
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