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Post by pedrocols on Oct 30, 2018 19:04:07 GMT -5
I want to take a shot at answering the OP's question. The answer is no. How good you guys think I did?
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Post by qdtjni on Oct 30, 2018 19:05:19 GMT -5
I already had until reading your idiotic first post Does the truth hurt so much so you have to resort to being rude and offensive? |
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Post by novisnick on Oct 30, 2018 19:39:00 GMT -5
I haven't listened to any of the Rendu or Sotm network players (at least not that I recall). (But I have listened to far too much tube gear.  )
Have you personally listened to any of the products we're talking about? Mark Please listen to one, you’ll have a better understanding of what we’re hearing and firmer ground to base your reasoning upon . Thank you. |
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Post by novisnick on Oct 30, 2018 19:42:47 GMT -5
Let us know when you hear one of these units in person, until then,,,,,enjoy the popcorn 🍿. I had the sMS-200 long before you even know these kind of devices and Roon existed, my friend.  The sMS-100 even longer. Thanks, thats great to know. What you’ve failed to state clearly is what? You heard no different? You heard a difference and then decided to upgrade to the sms-200 from the sms-100? Curious that you only post a link and not personal experience. Do tell. Inquiring minds. |
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Post by novisnick on Oct 30, 2018 19:50:29 GMT -5
Have you heard the latest? An ultrarendu? an SMS-200 ultra? Others? Mark I've had an microRendu and have had an SMS-200 Ultra too. What does that have to do with the review link I shared? What does a review from outside sources have to do with our forum discussion here? Its a statement of opinion, period. Did you write the review? Then what do we care what somemstranger says. Please add your experience to our forum. You’ve stated that you’ve had all of these devices. Wheres YOUR review or statements about them? Why do you keep buying/borrowing? However you get them? Obviously theres something ablout these devices you like. Please share. |
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klinemj
Emo VIPs 
Official Emofest Scribe
Posts: 15,095
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Post by klinemj on Oct 30, 2018 20:12:51 GMT -5
See my prior comment in response to yours and my comment to boom... FYI, in my listening, I found the MR to be a step up from the PC I was using, the ultrarendu to be an even bigger/more clear step up, and based on what I heard in chicagorspec's system - I suspect the signature rendu would be an even great step up (but have not heard it in my system). Mark It's probably very system and room dependant but in my system with Mytek Manhattan (first I then upgraded to II) and B&W 804D3, I could hear no difference between the MR, SMS-200 and SMS-200 Ultra. Based on memory, I did find them all sounding better than SBT, all of them fed with the same LPSU. However, while they don't sound bad at all, using Roon Bridge and Dirac in a NUC (with an SoTM USB-card) fed with the same LPSU, sounds way better than any miniscule difference there might be between those devices. I've also tried with different configurations of RPIs including one with a HifiBerry board, same conclusion - The NUC with Dirac sounds way better then any of them. While I do have the SoTM USB board, I had a Mac Mini with Dirac and no such fancy UBS board, it sounded pretty darn similar. In my headphone rig, I could hear no difference at all between SOTM SMS-200 & SMS-200 Ultra when feeding my HD-800 through a Schiit Jotunheim. They sounded better then an RPI3 but to be honest I might as well have been fooled by expectation bias. In conclusion, I take full Dirac over the MR and SOTM devices any day when listening to speakers I didn't find Dirac helped in my 2 channel listening above what I can get without it. But, what works for one does not work for all. Mark |
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Post by chicagorspec on Oct 30, 2018 21:11:21 GMT -5
I already had until reading your idiotic first post Does the truth hurt so much so you have to resort to being rude and offensive? You lead with a post that says nothing more than "Here's a link that says the stuff you guys own and have been talking about is junk, now I'll just sit back and watch." Next, you inform us that you're an experienced user of these devices, which apparently we were supposed to have been mind readers to understand after your first post. Then you tell us you'll "get the thread back on track", implying that the discussion to that point was the work of idiots, but thankfully you've arrived to set us straight. So you imply that the thread participants were idiots not once but twice, then on getting called out you point the finger at someone else. Save your holier than thou act for someone else. |
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Post by pedrocols on Oct 30, 2018 21:15:08 GMT -5
So was the OP's question answered? I see no future in this discussion. Put your egos away  |
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Post by novisnick on Oct 30, 2018 21:28:43 GMT -5
Sounds as if the search for what we’re finding is in the Mytek Manhattan II. At $6K it most likely incorporates the improvements that the sms-200Ultra brings to the table. Therefore no improvements are observed.
I’m willing to bet that my Brooklyn and sms-200 Ultra sound similar to the Manhattan but at a lessor expense,
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Post by chicagorspec on Oct 30, 2018 21:39:46 GMT -5
Novisnick, I know you have love for the SoTM stuff and I'd really like to hear it as I respect your opinion and the passion you exude for this gear. I've not looked into it deeply, but honestly found the proliferation of different elements and models SoTM offers to be quite confusing, especially as someone who was moving for the first time into streaming. Please remind me what pieces you have, including I believe the word clock, since I don't see that in your signature. Are there other elements you wish you had but are saving up for? Anything you tried and didn't find of benefit? Feel free to PM me if you'd rather. Thanks.
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Post by Boomzilla on Oct 30, 2018 21:53:05 GMT -5
To get this thread back on track - Boom, consider using an Raspberry Pi as Roon endpoint to start with, possibly with an add-on board such as HifiBerry or similar. OK - Let me get this straight - Loungers consistently castigate me for buying too much gear, yet YOUR recommendation (and klinemj's and novisnick's, etc.) is "buy more?" Really? I have valid reasons to be highly skeptical of claims without scientific evidence (and all of you do too). Yet you're preaching what seems like a never ending litany of "just try it (aka "just buy it") - it sounds better - trust me - really!" Roon sounds better than jRiver - a Micro-Rendu or a SOtM between the server computer and the DAC improves the sound - a Raspberry Pi is a better endpoint than my existing DAC - Your DAC sounds better than mine (that you've never heard) - And on and on and on... LISTEN to yourselves! There's NO scientific evidence for ANY of these claims - NONE. Next you'll be telling me that your $1,000,000 speaker wires are something I just HAVE to try. I'm on the borderline of thinking that you've squandered any and all credibility that you might have ever had. Really. If any of these claims have merit, find me a single credible scientific explanation (with unbiased measurements from a credible laboratory) for why. ONE! I bet you can't do it. Now I will admit that it's possible (HIGHLY unlikely, but at least remotely possible) that you're right despite the dearth of credible explanations. Stranger things have happened (Berma Sanchez once actually kissed me,..). But before I spend one single penny (much less the absurd asking prices) on ANY of these magic tomfooleries, I want to hear the differences for myself. Nothing short of a VERY credible scientific explanation (not some advertising fluff) or a startling personal audition (and it will have to be a TRULY startling one) will persuade me. I've proposed a review (with extensive measurements on lab-grade equipment done by the Secrets laboratory), but haven't received an answer yet. Suffice it to say that the Secrets lab-manager is highly skeptical. So I may (or may not) get to try one out. I still like you guys (despite the fact that I think you've been drinking far too much or something), but I'm not parting with thousands of my dollars without more evidence. Boomzilla PS: Don't tell me to buy it, try it, and then return it if I don't like it - I've never been comfortable doing that. Just me... |
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Post by novisnick on Oct 30, 2018 22:00:53 GMT -5
Novisnick, I know you have love for the SoTM stuff and I'd really like to hear it as I respect your opinion and the passion you exude for this gear. I've not looked into it deeply, but honestly found the proliferation of different elements and models SoTM offers to be quite confusing, especially as someone who was moving for the first time into streaming. Please remind me what pieces you have, including I believe the word clock, since I don't see that in your signature. Are there other elements you wish you had but are saving up for? Anything you tried and didn't find of benefit? Feel free to PM me if you'd rather. Thanks. I should move back over to this thread for further discussion specifically about my setup and sotm. Unless there’s objections that I don’t for-see. Please give me some time to compose this information. emotivalounge.proboards.com/thread/53226/sotm-sms-ultra-special-edition?page=6 |
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Post by chicagorspec on Oct 30, 2018 22:03:53 GMT -5
Novisnick, I know you have love for the SoTM stuff and I'd really like to hear it as I respect your opinion and the passion you exude for this gear. I've not looked into it deeply, but honestly found the proliferation of different elements and models SoTM offers to be quite confusing, especially as someone who was moving for the first time into streaming. Please remind me what pieces you have, including I believe the word clock, since I don't see that in your signature. Are there other elements you wish you had but are saving up for? Anything you tried and didn't find of benefit? Feel free to PM me if you'd rather. Thanks. I should move back over to this thread for further discussion specifically about my setup and sotm. Unless there’s objections that I don’t for-see. Please give me some time to compose this information. emotivalounge.proboards.com/thread/53226/sotm-sms-ultra-special-edition?page=6Great, thanks. I (and Boomzilla? Maybe not!) look forward to it. |
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Post by novisnick on Oct 30, 2018 22:09:44 GMT -5
Seems that the OP has officially closed this thread!
Have a nice day my friend! I’ve not been drinking the EmoBlue or any other “aid” LOL
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klinemj
Emo VIPs
Official Emofest Scribe
Posts: 15,095
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Post by klinemj on Oct 30, 2018 22:39:27 GMT -5
To get this thread back on track - Boom, consider using an Raspberry Pi as Roon endpoint to start with, possibly with an add-on board such as HifiBerry or similar. OK - Let me get this straight - Loungers consistently castigate me for buying too much gear, yet YOUR recommendation (and klinemj's and novisnick's, etc.) is "buy more?" Really? I have valid reasons to be highly skeptical of claims without scientific evidence (and all of you do too). Yet you're preaching what seems like a never ending litany of "just try it (aka "just buy it") - it sounds better - trust me - really!" Roon sounds better than jRiver - a Micro-Rendu or a SOtM between the server computer and the DAC improves the sound - a Raspberry Pi is a better endpoint than my existing DAC - Your DAC sounds better than mine (that you've never heard) - And on and on and on... LISTEN to yourselves! There's NO scientific evidence for ANY of these claims - NONE. Next you'll be telling me that your $1,000,000 speaker wires are something I just HAVE to try. I'm on the borderline of thinking that you've squandered any and all credibility that you might have ever had. Really. If any of these claims have merit, find me a single credible scientific explanation (with unbiased measurements from a credible laboratory) for why. ONE! I bet you can't do it. Now I will admit that it's possible (HIGHLY unlikely, but at least remotely possible) that you're right despite the dearth of credible explanations. Stranger things have happened (Berma Sanchez once actually kissed me,..). But before I spend one single penny (much less the absurd asking prices) on ANY of these magic tomfooleries, I want to hear the differences for myself. Nothing short of a VERY credible scientific explanation (not some advertising fluff) or a startling personal audition (and it will have to be a TRULY startling one) will persuade me. I've proposed a review (with extensive measurements on lab-grade equipment done by the Secrets laboratory), but haven't received an answer yet. Suffice it to say that the Secrets lab-manager is highly skeptical. So I may (or may not) get to try one out. I still like you guys (despite the fact that I think you've been drinking far too much or something), but I'm not parting with thousands of my dollars without more evidence. Boomzilla PS: Don't tell me to buy it, try it, and then return it if I don't like it - I've never been comfortable doing that. Just me... You've tried SO much gear...what's trying a bit more? LOL! Seriously, there's not very much gear I would say "just try it", but this is one. And, for the record...I personally didn't find Roon sounds better than jRiver. It is easier to set up and use and has some other benefits, but sound is not one of them. And, a Pi isn't better in sound than my DAC's....but it is a fun, Roon ready toy! But, make your own call...meanwhile, I'll just keep on enjoying my ultraRendu. Mark |
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Post by qdtjni on Oct 31, 2018 3:26:10 GMT -5
To get this thread back on track - Boom, consider using an Raspberry Pi as Roon endpoint to start with, possibly with an add-on board such as HifiBerry or similar. OK - Let me get this straight - Loungers consistently castigate me for buying too much gear, yet YOUR recommendation (and klinemj 's and novisnick 's, etc.) is "buy more?" Really? I have valid reasons to be highly skeptical of claims without scientific evidence (and all of you do too). Yet you're preaching what seems like a never ending litany of "just try it (aka "just buy it") - it sounds better - trust me - really!" Roon sounds better than jRiver - a Micro-Rendu or a SOtM between the server computer and the DAC improves the sound - a Raspberry Pi is a better endpoint than my existing DAC - Your DAC sounds better than mine (that you've never heard) - And on and on and on... LISTEN to yourselves! There's NO scientific evidence for ANY of these claims - NONE. Next you'll be telling me that your $1,000,000 speaker wires are something I just HAVE to try. I'm on the borderline of thinking that you've squandered any and all credibility that you might have ever had. Really. If any of these claims have merit, find me a single credible scientific explanation (with unbiased measurements from a credible laboratory) for why. ONE! I bet you can't do it. Now I will admit that it's possible (HIGHLY unlikely, but at least remotely possible) that you're right despite the dearth of credible explanations. Stranger things have happened (Berma Sanchez once actually kissed me,..). But before I spend one single penny (much less the absurd asking prices) on ANY of these magic tomfooleries, I want to hear the differences for myself. Nothing short of a VERY credible scientific explanation (not some advertising fluff) or a startling personal audition (and it will have to be a TRULY startling one) will persuade me. I've proposed a review (with extensive measurements on lab-grade equipment done by the Secrets laboratory), but haven't received an answer yet. Suffice it to say that the Secrets lab-manager is highly skeptical. So I may (or may not) get to try one out. I still like you guys (despite the fact that I think you've been drinking far too much or something), but I'm not parting with thousands of my dollars without more evidence. Boomzilla PS: Don't tell me to buy it, try it, and then return it if I don't like it - I've never been comfortable doing that. Just me... Dude, my first post in this thread was to a reference to review with measurements already, something I got quite a bit of flak for. In the one you just quoted I suggested you should consider an RPI that costs some $50 or at the very most $150 with an expansion board and works as a Roon endpoint (or SMB, DLNA, etc) so you can play Tidal and control it from a smart device, pc, mac or whatever..... Where did I ever write that it sounds better that what you have and why on earth are you quoting me?  Maybe you should practice reading more and writing long rude posts more.... |
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Post by qdtjni on Oct 31, 2018 3:32:30 GMT -5
And your evidence for that being? |
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Post by qdtjni on Oct 31, 2018 3:38:34 GMT -5
Does the truth hurt so much so you have to resort to being rude and offensive? You lead with a post that says nothing more than "Here's a link that says the stuff you guys own and have been talking about is junk, now I'll just sit back and watch." Next, you inform us that you're an experienced user of these devices, which apparently we were supposed to have been mind readers to understand after your first post. Then you tell us you'll "get the thread back on track", implying that the discussion to that point was the work of idiots, but thankfully you've arrived to set us straight. So you imply that the thread participants were idiots not once but twice, then on getting called out you point the finger at someone else. Save your holier than thou act for someone else. Boom assked for a review with measurements, I posted one. As for being and idiot, I said anything remotely like that. However, lately you and only you are doing that all on your own! |
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Post by novisnick on Oct 31, 2018 4:07:43 GMT -5
To get this thread back on track - Boom, consider using an Raspberry Pi as Roon endpoint to start with, possibly with an add-on board such as HifiBerry or similar. OK - Let me get this straight - Loungers consistently castigate me for buying too much gear, yet YOUR recommendation (and klinemj 's and novisnick 's, etc.) is "buy more?" Really? I have valid reasons to be highly skeptical of claims without scientific evidence (and all of you do too). Yet you're preaching what seems like a never ending litany of "just try it (aka "just buy it") - it sounds better - trust me - really!" Roon sounds better than jRiver - a Micro-Rendu or a SOtM between the server computer and the DAC improves the sound - a Raspberry Pi is a better endpoint than my existing DAC - Your DAC sounds better than mine (that you've never heard) - And on and on and on... LISTEN to yourselves! There's NO scientific evidence for ANY of these claims - NONE. Next you'll be telling me that your $1,000,000 speaker wires are something I just HAVE to try. I'm on the borderline of thinking that you've squandered any and all credibility that you might have ever had. Really. If any of these claims have merit, find me a single credible scientific explanation (with unbiased measurements from a credible laboratory) for why. ONE! I bet you can't do it. Now I will admit that it's possible (HIGHLY unlikely, but at least remotely possible) that you're right despite the dearth of credible explanations. Stranger things have happened (Berma Sanchez once actually kissed me,..). But before I spend one single penny (much less the absurd asking prices) on ANY of these magic tomfooleries, I want to hear the differences for myself. Nothing short of a VERY credible scientific explanation (not some advertising fluff) or a startling personal audition (and it will have to be a TRULY startling one) will persuade me. I've proposed a review (with extensive measurements on lab-grade equipment done by the Secrets laboratory), but haven't received an answer yet. Suffice it to say that the Secrets lab-manager is highly skeptical. So I may (or may not) get to try one out. I still like you guys (despite the fact that I think you've been drinking far too much or something), but I'm not parting with thousands of my dollars without more evidence. Boomzilla PS: Don't tell me to buy it, try it, and then return it if I don't like it - I've never been comfortable doing that. Just me... Ok Boomzilla , I for one have never given you a hard time about the gear going through your review. I think its fun, just as you must! Ive stated, just review it, buying is an option before and after. I lean to believe you’ll buy but thats not important! Roon doesnt sound better then JRiver, I own both and have found Roon to just be more to my liking. A personal thing. IMHO a Rasperri Phi isn’t going to get you improved SQ. Many dacs sound similar and different, most of the time identical DACs will sound better or worst depending on implementation, just like USB is very dependent in a similar way. But there is more to that as well. Humor aside, no! Don’t try that wire! Yes, listen to the NAA You want science, go to NASA, im not that guy! But I do know what I hear and Ive owned this gear long enough to know its not anticipation bias or any such hooky notion! 😋 Fact, youve bought or reviewed with your own money before and not using any scientific reasoning. You dont like returning things just to try them, then you don’t want the answers bad enough! Its one of the reasons companies offer that service, its built into their business model. Get out of your comfort zone just this once. |
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Post by bluemeanies on Oct 31, 2018 4:23:07 GMT -5
So, let me throw this thought, view, idea, and OBSERVATION about my system and my HO about what I have read on this thread.
My System.
It's PREFECT...YEA you read it correctly it's PERFECT!
How many times have you read that opinion on the EMOTIVA or any FORUM?
Highs, mids (my favorite) which are pristine, and enough bass to move me listening in 2channel without a subwoofer. I have a pretty good soundstage considering I have a small front stage where my left and right channels are positioned at a VERY modest toe in giving me a 3dimensionsal sound.
TIDAL streaming with Audioserver via mini toslink to my Audionote 4.1 external tube dac only to duke it out with my custom SP14 tube amp as both are contenders for transcending my listening experience into a sublime place of listening decadence.
No noise and no artifacts while listening to any genre of music. A hi-hat whipped with a brush listening to Jazz sounds like a brush sliding across a hi-hat. Not distortion. The nuance of a piano pedal being depressed by the lovely legs of Diana Krall are real and distinct.
NO BLACK BOXES. NO MAGIC ELIXER.
I do not what to downplay any of what I have read here b/c the fact remains that all of us have different systems, rooms, and experiences but in my humble setup I sat and listened after reading this thread and questioned myself "how much better can this get"..."where is my next investment"?
The answer for me is none. No more investment....IT JUST CANNOT GET ANY BETTER!!
Of course this is my experience but I have to ask do audiophiles listen to their music or listen to their systems...if it is the latter I beg to say the investments will be infinite and I will go on to say that the experience will not be as rewarding as sitting in your listening absorbing what you have created.
This is not to say there is any wrong with upgrading. However there should be a point of eventually achieving SATISFACTION.
If not, the problem may not be with your system, room, ascoutics or cables...it may be the problem is you can never be satisfied.
I believe there is a point of contentment in listening to music. There is a point where no investment, amount of money or equipment will satisfy a particular group of people.
I guess what I am trying to say is STOP AND SMELL THE ROSES 🌹.
Your system does not sound as bad as what you think.
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