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Post by mfeust on Mar 10, 2021 9:04:56 GMT -5
That is exactly what my system does, The first time I heard it I almost jumped out of my seat. I would love to know what the engineer does to accomplish this.
I think it has to do with phase.
Mark
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Post by LuisV on Mar 11, 2021 12:56:15 GMT -5
Schiit Bifrost 2 back in da house...  Mogami digital coax cable connects the Node 2i to the Bifrost, while Canare XLRs connect it to the Freya...  Ah... the shelf looks much better now! Time to let her warm up a bit before listening critically. And yes... cable management is on the todo list...   |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 11, 2021 15:04:05 GMT -5
Schiit Bifrost 2 back in da house... Mogami digital coax cable connects the Node 2i to the Bifrost, while Canare XLRs connect it to the Freya... Ah... the shelf looks much better now! Time to let her warm up a bit before listening critically. And yes... cable management is on the todo list... What's the little device ontop of the Bitfrost? |
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Post by LuisV on Mar 11, 2021 15:25:22 GMT -5
@deleted it's the Schiit Mani; phono-preamp.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 11, 2021 17:33:01 GMT -5
Schiit Bifrost 2 back in da house... Mogami digital coax cable connects the Node 2i to the Bifrost, while Canare XLRs connect it to the Freya... Ah... the shelf looks much better now! Time to let her warm up a bit before listening critically. And yes... cable management is on the todo list... Question, why are you using the Coaxial from the Node 2i rather than optical? I may be confused because one of the optical inputs is actually an adapter from RCA. I'm just curious because most of the hype w/ Schiit seems to over the USB. Is it possible to utilize output from Node 2i if there's a USB out to the Bitfrost 2? |
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Post by LuisV on Mar 11, 2021 17:52:04 GMT -5
I'm using COAX out, see attached image... call me old school, but COAX is typically better than toslink (optical) output; both are digital out, just different tech.  |
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Post by LuisV on Mar 11, 2021 17:59:51 GMT -5
Forgot to answer the USB question... USB is typically used from a computer in a desk setup and Schiit put a ton of work into developing their own USB format as desktop headphone systems was how they initially broke into the audio scene when Schiit was born. I have a Pi connected via USB to my Lyr 3 multibit DAC. Rumor has it that Schiit is putting work into using Unison USB in their new transport as the preferred method to connect to their DACs. There's a bunch of tech around how they isolated USB from input and output noise within their circuits. Way above what I can understand, but whatever it is, this Schiit sounds fantastic. lol
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Post by Zombie on Mar 11, 2021 19:59:11 GMT -5
I'm using COAX out, see attached image... call me old school, but COAX is typically better than toslink (optical) output; both are digital out, just different tech. View AttachmentI’ve tried both the optical and coaxial on my Node2i and can’t really tell any difference. The node with my Schiit Gumby sounds fantastic. The node also plays well with my Project S2 but lacks some of the warmth of the Gumby. |
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Post by LuisV on Mar 11, 2021 20:02:52 GMT -5
The Gumby is on my list of potential upgrades; waiting it out as I'm thinking it's due for a platform update. For now, I'll enjoy the Bifrost...
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Post by chops on Mar 11, 2021 21:02:41 GMT -5
Forgot to answer the USB question... USB is typically used from a computer in a desk setup and Schiit put a ton of work into developing their own USB format as desktop headphone systems was how they initially broke into the audio scene when Schiit was born. I have a Pi connected via USB to my Lyr 3 multibit DAC. Rumor has it that Schiit is putting work into using Unison USB in their new transport as the preferred method to connect to their DACs. There's a bunch of tech around how they isolated USB from input and output noise within their circuits. Way above what I can understand, but whatever it is, this Schiit sounds fantastic. lol I must say, moving from the Node 2i via coax to Bifrost 2 to the Raspberry Pi 4 via USB to the Bifrost 2 was a major upgrade in sound. |
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Post by LuisV on Mar 11, 2021 21:17:21 GMT -5
Ha... that's my next bake off, the Pi4 running RoPieee XL from my headphone setup against the Node 2i. Plan is to let the Bifrost break in for a bit, before I perform the bake off.
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Post by chops on Mar 11, 2021 21:31:05 GMT -5
Ha... that's my next bake off, the Pi4 running RoPieee XL from my headphone setup against the Node 2i. Plan is to let the Bifrost break in for a bit, before I perform the bake off. Prepare for some good times ahead. It'll be hard to pull the cans off when you start listening to the Pi 4/XL/Bifrost 2 combo. And speaking of cans, I'm in search for a decent pair of light, comfy, well fitted earbuds with blue teeth. LOL There's a lot to choose from I tell ya. And I've never researched them before today. |
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Post by LuisV on Mar 11, 2021 21:36:38 GMT -5
Sorry... gonna use the Pi in the 2 channel system against the Node 2i and Bifrost; already using the Pi with good success with the Lyr 3 and my HD6XX.
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Post by LuisV on Mar 11, 2021 21:56:15 GMT -5
That is exactly what my system does, The first time I heard it I almost jumped out of my seat. I would love to know what the engineer does to accomplish this. I think it has to do with phase. Mark When he says "Good Night", he's right beside me to my left, about 5 feet away from my head. Almost like I could swing my left arm out to my side and smack him in his face. LOL It's an extremely convincing experience with these speakers. Almost to the point of being creepy when I play those last couple of seconds of the track over and over several times in a row. Just tried this and it's really freaky and freakin awesome at the same time! Thanks for sharing! |
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Post by foggy1956 on Mar 11, 2021 22:45:34 GMT -5
That is exactly what my system does, The first time I heard it I almost jumped out of my seat. I would love to know what the engineer does to accomplish this. I think it has to do with phase. Mark When he says "Good Night", he's right beside me to my left, about 5 feet away from my head. Almost like I could swing my left arm out to my side and smack him in his face. LOL It's an extremely convincing experience with these speakers. Almost to the point of being creepy when I play those last couple of seconds of the track over and over several times in a row. Just tried this and it's really freaky and freakin awesome at the same time! Thanks for sharing! Try DSOTM brain damage, listen for the voice talking😎 |
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on Mar 12, 2021 10:06:41 GMT -5
Guys... just to be clear here...
Schiit has upgraded their USB input circuitry several times over the years... and this is the latest version...
And, from their description, it does indeed sound well thought out.
But it is still the standard USB Audio Class 2 format. (If it was a new format then it would require special drivers...)
Quoting the Schiit Audio website:
"our Unison USB input is 100% UAC2 compliant (that is, USB Audio Class 2, the accepted standard for USB audio transmission.)"
I should also point out that their change of opinion about the sound quality of USB is interesting but not Earth-shattering. USB has always worked just fine as an audio interface - and been comparable to Coax - with each having pros and cons. The current USB asynchronous data transmission protocol is superior to the original isochronous type... (Which is why most modern DACs support it.)
However both USB and Coax inputs vary between individual products so not all versions of either work equally well... HOWEVER, contrary to what some audiophiles have continued to believe over the years, there is nothing inherently inferior about USB.
(Although, from an engineering perspective, Coax tends to depend more heavily on the quality of the source signal than asynch USB.)
Proper implementations of either have always been able to deliver excellent sound quality.
(So all that has happened is that the guys at Schiit Audio have now decided that they like USB inputs after all.)
Also, more interestingly, and again to quote the Schiit website: "What formats does Unison USB support? PCM, up to 24/192. That's it."
"No DSD? No."
"No MQA? Hell no."
Forgot to answer the USB question... USB is typically used from a computer in a desk setup and Schiit put a ton of work into developing their own USB format as desktop headphone systems was how they initially broke into the audio scene when Schiit was born. I have a Pi connected via USB to my Lyr 3 multibit DAC. Rumor has it that Schiit is putting work into using Unison USB in their new transport as the preferred method to connect to their DACs. There's a bunch of tech around how they isolated USB from input and output noise within their circuits. Way above what I can understand, but whatever it is, this Schiit sounds fantastic. lol I must say, moving from the Node 2i via coax to Bifrost 2 to the Raspberry Pi 4 via USB to the Bifrost 2 was a major upgrade in sound. |
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Post by LuisV on Mar 12, 2021 10:47:56 GMT -5
Guys... just to be clear here... Schiit has upgraded their USB input circuitry several times over the years... and this is the latest version...
And, from their description, it does indeed sound well thought out.
But it is still the standard USB Audio Class 2 format. (If it was a new format then it would require special drivers...)
Quoting the Schiit Audio website:
"our Unison USB input is 100% UAC2 compliant (that is, USB Audio Class 2, the accepted standard for USB audio transmission.)"
I should also point out that their change of opinion about the sound quality of USB is interesting but not Earth-shattering. USB has always worked just fine as an audio interface - and been comparable to Coax - with each having pros and cons. The current USB asynchronous data transmission protocol is superior to the original isochronous type... (Which is why most modern DACs support it.)
However both USB and Coax inputs vary between individual products so not all versions of either work equally well... HOWEVER, contrary to what some audiophiles have continued to believe over the years, there is nothing inherently inferior about USB.
(Although, from an engineering perspective, Coax tends to depend more heavily on the quality of the source signal than asynch USB.)
Proper implementations of either have always been able to deliver excellent sound quality.
(So all that has happened is that the guys at Schiit Audio have now decided that they like USB inputs after all.)
Also, more interestingly, and again to quote the Schiit website: "What formats does Unison USB support? PCM, up to 24/192. That's it."
"No DSD? No."
"No MQA? Hell no."
And? Sorry, I'm a little confused... Whatcha trying to say? Schiit has their act together about USB and they're heading down the path of using USB for connectivity between THEIR devices is a good thing? |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 12, 2021 10:57:18 GMT -5
Guys... just to be clear here... Schiit has upgraded their USB input circuitry several times over the years... and this is the latest version...
And, from their description, it does indeed sound well thought out.
But it is still the standard USB Audio Class 2 format. (If it was a new format then it would require special drivers...)
Quoting the Schiit Audio website:
"our Unison USB input is 100% UAC2 compliant (that is, USB Audio Class 2, the accepted standard for USB audio transmission.)"
I should also point out that their change of opinion about the sound quality of USB is interesting but not Earth-shattering. USB has always worked just fine as an audio interface - and been comparable to Coax - with each having pros and cons. The current USB asynchronous data transmission protocol is superior to the original isochronous type... (Which is why most modern DACs support it.)
However both USB and Coax inputs vary between individual products so not all versions of either work equally well... HOWEVER, contrary to what some audiophiles have continued to believe over the years, there is nothing inherently inferior about USB.
(Although, from an engineering perspective, Coax tends to depend more heavily on the quality of the source signal than asynch USB.)
Proper implementations of either have always been able to deliver excellent sound quality.
(So all that has happened is that the guys at Schiit Audio have now decided that they like USB inputs after all.)
Also, more interestingly, and again to quote the Schiit website: "What formats does Unison USB support? PCM, up to 24/192. That's it."
"No DSD? No."
"No MQA? Hell no."
And? Sorry, I'm a little confused... Whatcha trying to say? Schiit has their act together about USB and they're heading down the path of using USB for connectivity between THEIR devices is a good thing? I notice Schiit owners have their own jargon speaking out one end as well as the other. Get your Schiit together KeithL and learn to speak fluent Schiit-head. I love the Schiit talk on Schiit's website. Just the right amount of sarcasm on product description pages! |
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KeithL
Administrator
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Post by KeithL on Mar 12, 2021 11:25:21 GMT -5
I have always felt that Schiit Audio makes nice gear.. I've owned several pieces of Schiit Audio gear in the past... (and I still own one or two).
All were nicely made, performed well, and sounded quite nice...
I would also go as far as to say that their products generally deliver on what they claim. They tend not to make outrageous claims about how their gear sounds...
And, for example, while I personally am not a fan of "tube sound", if that's what you want, Schiit's tube gear is a great way to get that too.
My point was more aimed at the overall long-standing audiophile conceit about Coax vs digital inputs. In some audiophile domains, where the air is thinner than the snake oil, it is widely believed that "coax sounds good and USB sounds bad". And, as a result, some audiophiles continue to consider USB audio to be " the last and worst option"...
Then, every so often, someone comes along, and proudly declares that "they've finally managed to create a USB interface that actually sounds good". (This is usually accompanied by a lot of fanfare - and endless explanations about how they've overcome the dreadful limitations of USB audio.)
My point was that this is mostly not true today... Different inputs on different devices do often sound slightly different - for various reasons...
And there were some serious limitations to early USB audio interfaces (but some early Coax interfaces weren't very good either)...
However, USB has been a perfectly viable alternative, and one that often sounds as good or better than Coax, for years... And, since most modern computers support USB, and not Coax, USB has been the preferred choice for computer audio for years. So, while I'm sure Schiit Audio's latest USB implementation works well, and sounds great, it really isn't news.
I was also poking a bit of fun at the fact that some of the engineers at Schiit Audio were among those with a reputation for not liking USB audio. From their website: "Even Mike Moffat, the famous “friends don’t let friends use USB” guy, prefers Unison to SPDIF." (Coax is S/PDIF.)
If you didn't know... Mike Moffat is one of the principal players at Schiit Audio.
Guys... just to be clear here... Schiit has upgraded their USB input circuitry several times over the years... and this is the latest version...
And, from their description, it does indeed sound well thought out.
But it is still the standard USB Audio Class 2 format. (If it was a new format then it would require special drivers...)
Quoting the Schiit Audio website:
"our Unison USB input is 100% UAC2 compliant (that is, USB Audio Class 2, the accepted standard for USB audio transmission.)"
I should also point out that their change of opinion about the sound quality of USB is interesting but not Earth-shattering. USB has always worked just fine as an audio interface - and been comparable to Coax - with each having pros and cons. The current USB asynchronous data transmission protocol is superior to the original isochronous type... (Which is why most modern DACs support it.)
However both USB and Coax inputs vary between individual products so not all versions of either work equally well... HOWEVER, contrary to what some audiophiles have continued to believe over the years, there is nothing inherently inferior about USB.
(Although, from an engineering perspective, Coax tends to depend more heavily on the quality of the source signal than asynch USB.)
Proper implementations of either have always been able to deliver excellent sound quality.
(So all that has happened is that the guys at Schiit Audio have now decided that they like USB inputs after all.)
Also, more interestingly, and again to quote the Schiit website: "What formats does Unison USB support? PCM, up to 24/192. That's it."
"No DSD? No."
"No MQA? Hell no."
And? Sorry, I'm a little confused... Whatcha trying to say? Schiit has their act together about USB and they're heading down the path of using USB for connectivity between THEIR devices is a good thing? |
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Post by LuisV on Mar 12, 2021 12:48:24 GMT -5
Ah... now I understand, sorry was confused. Yes, Mike was anti-USB, but I'm sure he got his fair share of Schiit for changing his position on the topic. Although USB audio isn't new news, I think Schiit is simply pushing the fact that if implemented properly, it's a viable connection; therefore, since they feel they are implementing it properly, that consumers should reconsider their opinions about USB... as Mike did... USB may surprise them... just as it surprised Mike. Sounds like the making of a commercial...
That's one of the things that I like about Mike and Jason... they are down to earth, make mistakes and are willing to own up to those mistakes. They are not hifi snobs and more often than not, poke fun at themselves. As you stated, they make a good product... I feel that what they do, they do rather well and do it in a fashion that does not over hype the product nor do they lather it in snake oil. They are having fun... and hope that consumers go along for the ride and have fun themselves... I think it worked out rather well for them and us Schiit-heads...
I recall the days of Theta digital, the Angstrom 100 was on my radar, but I purchased a Fosgate Pro-Logic processor instead... I even had various Audio Alchemy products... DTIs, DDEs, forgot the name of their preferred bus... etc, etc.
I think I've managed to stay afloat of the snake oil, learned along the way and have had a ton of fun within this hobby of ours... Schiit Audio is another step in my journey that puts a smile on my face when the music starts playing...
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