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Post by garbulky on Jan 22, 2022 2:02:40 GMT -5
The COVID tests detect COVID not the flu. They are simply different viruses. The flu is an influenza virus, COVID is a coronavirus. The vax does help prevent death and hospitalizations AND reduces transmission. That's not a big deal just for people in poor health. It's a big deal for everyone. You don't have to be in poor health to have complications or die. Equally as important you also don't have to be in poor health to transmit it to others. The Omicron is close in transmission rates to measles which makes it the second most most infectious disease present. The flu though very infectious isn't even close to being so transmissible as these or have as many deaths. COVID deaths so far 861,000 in the last two years. Flu deaths are likely even lower due to current public health measures like masking and social distancing. Sorry, but the CDC director says the vaccines do not stop virus transmission: Fully vaccinated people who get a COVID-19 "breakthrough" infection can spread the virus to others even if they are not symptomatic, Centers for Disease Control Director Rochelle Walensky told CNN on Thursday. Yes indeed. The current vaccines are not guaranteed to stop Omicron transmission. However, as I mentioned, they do reduce its ability to transmit and that's important because this is the second most contagious disease. Against the original alpha strain , the vaccine WAS able to stop transmission. But the alpha strain is no longer out there in significant amounts. Well - the term filtering can be used in different ways. So it depends on what you mean by it. Masks are effective against protecting against COVID and there are certainly studies about it. Note effectiveness - is in levels. Wearing a mask will not guarantee you against COVID infection. See some of the studies www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-briefs/masking-science-sars-cov2.html#anchor_1634654801820You are right that the type of mask you wear offers different degrees of protection. Surgical masks offer good droplet protection. Cloth masks can offer a mixed bag. Neither cloth or standard paper masks offers aerosol filtration of the virus. COVID is spread through both droplet (large cough droplets) and aerosol (airborne tiny viral particles suspended in a fine mist from breath. So depending on the mask you wear, different protection is afforded. For cloth or surgical masks, the importance comes when both people are wearing masks. Your mask slows down your breath or cough and their masks slows down their breath or cough. So the spread is lower which is protective. Yes N-95 masks are made and certified to standards. They are able to filter particles as small as the aerosol mist that COVID can travel on. They are also required to be able to create a tight seal on average around a minimum limit of people that wear it. Even better seals can be made by adjusting the size to the appropriate face. This provides improved filtration. I've worn n-95 masks daily 9 hours a day for years so I would disagree with you there. I find them quite comfortable compared to regular surgical masks. The slight increase in warmth and humidity is also easier for me to breath on cold days. Having said that...yes they are tight. The quality of the mask and tightness can create bands on your face and create visible indentations and even skin damage. I haven't had that issue at all. It may be due to the quality of the n95 mask I have chosen. I've used one with a leather pad that I found is more comfortable on my face. But that's not to downplay that they can indeed cause facial irritation from the tightness - for some people. But clearly not me. Here are some examples of more comfortable n95s Leather pad  Silicone seal  There are other masks that are effective. KF94 masks are also certified and regulated (but I could be wrong about the regulation). KN95 masks have a standard but there is no body that requires regulation of the product. There have also been a large amount of fakes found of KN95 masks. |
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Post by fbczar on Jan 22, 2022 10:53:38 GMT -5
Sorry, but the CDC director says the vaccines do not stop virus transmission: Fully vaccinated people who get a COVID-19 "breakthrough" infection can spread the virus to others even if they are not symptomatic, Centers for Disease Control Director Rochelle Walensky told CNN on Thursday. Yes indeed. The current vaccines are not guaranteed to stop Omicron transmission. However, as I mentioned, they do reduce its ability to transmit and that's important because this is the second most contagious disease. Against the original alpha strain , the vaccine WAS able to stop transmission. But the alpha strain is no longer out there in significant amounts. Well - the term filtering can be used in different ways. So it depends on what you mean by it. Masks are effective against protecting against COVID and there are certainly studies about it. Note effectiveness - is in levels. Wearing a mask will not guarantee you against COVID infection. See some of the studies www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-briefs/masking-science-sars-cov2.html#anchor_1634654801820You are right that the type of mask you wear offers different degrees of protection. Surgical masks offer good droplet protection. Cloth masks can offer a mixed bag. Neither cloth or standard paper masks offers aerosol filtration of the virus. COVID is spread through both droplet (large cough droplets) and aerosol (airborne tiny viral particles suspended in a fine mist from breath. So depending on the mask you wear, different protection is afforded. For cloth or surgical masks, the importance comes when both people are wearing masks. Your mask slows down your breath or cough and their masks slows down their breath or cough. So the spread is lower which is protective. Yes N-95 masks are made and certified to standards. They are able to filter particles as small as the aerosol mist that COVID can travel on. They are also required to be able to create a tight seal on average around a minimum limit of people that wear it. Even better seals can be made by adjusting the size to the appropriate face. This provides improved filtration. I've worn n-95 masks daily 9 hours a day for years so I would disagree with you there. I find them quite comfortable compared to regular surgical masks. The slight increase in warmth and humidity is also easier for me to breath on cold days. Having said that...yes they are tight. The quality of the mask and tightness can create bands on your face and create visible indentations and even skin damage. I haven't had that issue at all. It may be due to the quality of the n95 mask I have chosen. I've used one with a leather pad that I found is more comfortable on my face. But that's not to downplay that they can indeed cause facial irritation from the tightness - for some people. But clearly not me. Here are some examples of more comfortable n95s Leather pad Silicone seal There are other masks that are effective. KF94 masks are also certified and regulated (but I could be wrong about the regulation). KN95 masks have a standard but there is no body that requires regulation of the product. There have also been a large amount of fakes found of KN95 masks. With respect, there is no reading of the CDC’s revision of their mask policy, released on January 14, 2022, that could lead one to believe that wearing a surgical mask or a cloth mask was of any significant value in preventing any variety of Covid-19. Prior to the pandemic literally every teaching hospital, including the Mayo Clinic, directly stated on their websites that such masks did not work against influenza. The influenza virus is three times larger than the Covid-19 virus and those sites flatly stated that masks were ineffective against influenza which transmits in exactly the same fashion as Covid-19. After the pandemic began those same hospitals, under significant political pressure, revised their stance to say exactly the following: Wearing a mask, in combination with, Hand Washing, and Social Distancing helps to prevent the spread of Covid 19. You will note they never said wearing a mask, other than an N95, had any effect by itself. They always included hand washing and social distancing. As time has moved on we have determined cloth and surgical masks are not effective, social distancing of 6 feet (the distance should be MUCH more) was totally arbitrary and had little effect, and the droplet argument obfuscated the fact that the preponderance of cases were transmitted in the form of an aerosolized virus. I have taken 3 shots because of my age, but given the incidence of Myocarditis in young males and the infinitesimally small chance of fatalities among the young and very young who do not have serious co-morbidities I do not believe either group should be vaccinated, especially if they already have natural immunity from a prior infection, which is another maddening subject. I hope you and yours and all the members of this board stay safe and are free to make medical decisions for themselves. |
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Post by novisnick on Jan 22, 2022 15:39:58 GMT -5
All this information is everywhere! You can’t turn on anything without being bombarded with it. I’m not here for more indoctrination!
Thank you!
Now, back to you normal broadcasting!
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Post by monkumonku on Jan 22, 2022 15:52:55 GMT -5
All this information is everywhere! You can’t turn on anything without being bombarded with it. I’m not here for more indoctrination! Thank you!Now, back to you normal broadcasting! "Normal broadcasting?" This IS the NEW normal now. Get used to it!  |
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Post by 405x5 on Jan 22, 2022 16:15:43 GMT -5
 I got this |
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Post by rbk123 on Jan 22, 2022 17:11:03 GMT -5
Why you have this notion that doctors and scientists are some sort of "elites wielding power" is beyond me. Well if that's what you took from that, not sure what to tell you. I simply responded to one of your points about clinical situations. The elites item is part of a response to a separate point in your novella trying to rationalize the suppression of information. I like the tin hat bit; that hasn't been used in a while so good to see you bringing up the oldies. What was it you said "follow the money" right... Nope, try again. |
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Post by rbk123 on Jan 22, 2022 17:22:07 GMT -5
Yes indeed. The current vaccines are not guaranteed to stop Omicron transmission.... Well - the term filtering can be used in different ways. So it depends on what you mean by it. Masks are effective against protecting against COVID and there are certainly studies about it. Note effectiveness - is in levels. Wearing a mask will not guarantee you against COVID infection....etc... Have to agree with most of the facts, not opinions, that Gar has in this post. |
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Post by garbulky on Jan 22, 2022 18:57:50 GMT -5
I'm assuming you are talking about this? www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/types-of-masks.htmlI think they are clearly recommending masks be worn. In their key messages: "Masks and respirators are effective at reducing transmission of SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19, when worn consistently and correctly." Their update clarifies that there are different levels of protections afforded by different types of masks. Prior to this, N-95's were being saved for healthcare workers. They have removed this requirement and expanded their use for the general public, if they are able to use them. Hmmm.... do you have a link? At my hospital, prior to the pandemic, we had droplet precautions for the flu and our protocols required masks for influenza (among other PPE). The same went for our ambulance service. And we did wear them. Well... Not exactly. Some of what you're saying is not wrong, but there is a bit of a nuance which matters. Influenza is mainly transmitted via droplets. There is some evidence that it can be slighty infectious through airborne means (aerosols). But our main concern is droplets. COVID also transmits mainly via droplets. But the airborne component is considered much more significant than with the flu. The infectiousness matters too. COVID also differs depending on the strain. All main strains of COVID transmit at much greater efficacy than the FLU does (much more infectious). But Omicron is especially substantially more infectious. Second only to measles, leaving the flu far behind. This infectiousness can lead to change in reccomendations. Here's my thing. Human behavior and misinformation have seriously outpaced our institutions ability to deal out effective reccomendations. In my opinion, public health agencies need to do a better job at figuring out how to make their messaging ACTUALLY affect real world behavior and make more meaningful change. As can be viewed by the thread people view changing guidance as the pandemic and information grows as being "they don't know what they're doing" or "they're being manipulated and we can't trust them" or "follow the money". This means people are less likely to follow credible information. And that's not a good thing. [/quote] "Serious comorbidities" Well that requires quite a bit of digging. The more infection spreads, the more likely people like my friends who do have these comorbidities are likely to catch COVID from unvaccinated people and get seriously ill or die. Vaccination prevents the spread and protects everyone. For instance, my friends have cancer, are immune compromised with heart issues. The vaccination effectiveness is low on the immune compromised. They have been posting begging people to be vaccinated to protect the vulnerable. My heart goes out to them. But blaming comorbidities can be a misleading way to handwave the unpredictability of COVID . Healthy people with no health complications can and do die of this thing. And we KNOW that they do transmit it. Hence the importance of vaccination - reduce the likelihood of transmission. Here's what I found, but haven't had a lot of time to verify their sources of information. www.statista.com/statistics/1191568/reported-deaths-from-covid-by-age-us/A little under a 1000 children have died under 18. Over 5,000 people have died under 18-29. Over 15,000 30-39. Nearly 40,000 40-49. So that is not an infinitessimally small number. And don't forget hospitalizations. Or the strain on healthcare during the pandemic. So for instance if the health system is strained to the brink by overwhelming numbers of COVID patients, the person having a stroke, or who had a bad car wreck, or chest pain, would experience massive delays. You've seen the news surgeries of elective surgeries (no not just plastic surgeries) being cancelled, postphoned. Massive waiting lines for urgent healthcare issues due to overwhelmed hospitals ERs and surgical centers. So overwhelming hospitalizations due to unvaccinated people can cause an increase in bad outcomes for people with other issues. Since unvaccinated people transmit the virus more than the vaccinated, the spread is faster. This creates work shortages in other industries. Like the thousands of airplane flights that have been cancelled. The trucking industry with a lack of drivers. The healthcare industry that has a lack of workers because they are out. The CDC reccomends among other things for the public to: -Get Vaccinated -Mask - Observe social distance - Avoid poorly ventillated or crowded spaces www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/prevention.html Indeed, I have four family members that have caught COVID twice and gotten quite sick. I think the words "almost died" were used even on the reinfection. So I wouldn't count on it. There is a substantial rate of reinfection with Omicron for those that have had Delta or the alpha strain. However, some preliminary data indicates that previous infection + vaccination can provide a substantial boost in protection though healthcare experts caution not to "try to get it" to get the immunity. Thank you!! I hope you stay safe too. We all need some good news during this time.
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Post by garbulky on Jan 22, 2022 19:01:04 GMT -5
Yes indeed. The current vaccines are not guaranteed to stop Omicron transmission.... Well - the term filtering can be used in different ways. So it depends on what you mean by it. Masks are effective against protecting against COVID and there are certainly studies about it. Note effectiveness - is in levels. Wearing a mask will not guarantee you against COVID infection....etc... Have to agree with most of the facts, not opinions, that Gar has in this post. Thank you. I try to differentiate my personal opinions from the facts. My apologies if I have failed. |
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Post by garbulky on Jan 22, 2022 19:11:44 GMT -5
All this information is everywhere! You can’t turn on anything without being bombarded with it. I’m not here for more indoctrination! Thank you!Now, back to you normal broadcasting! It's that pandemic burnout! We are all tired of being tired.  |
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Post by Boomzilla on Jan 22, 2022 20:44:03 GMT -5
All this COVID stuff may not go away for a while, yet. Even if America reaches some combination of "mostly vaccinated," and/or "mostly survived a variant and have some natural immunity," the rest of the world isn't in the same condition. That means that new variants are likely to keep popping up. Some will be more transmissible, some less. Some will be more lethal, some less. Some will be clobbered by our vaccines, some won't.
I suspect that eventually, like the flu virus, most of us will opt to have periodic vaccinations. There are risks, so some (particularly those with already compromised immune systems) will opt to skip the vaccinations. One way or another, most of us will persist.
The only sure things in life are death and taxes.
My theory is that we'll probably see COVID in waves. In between waves, I hope to visit my friends and eat at restaurants. But when the average infection rate is 20% (one in every five tests show positive for Omicron - as it is in my area, just now), I opt shelter in place as much as possible and mask up when I go out.
I do give regular thanks for the CDC and NIH for their aggressive detection protocols and their support of genetic-engineering vaccine development.
Boom
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Post by novisnick on Jan 22, 2022 21:00:19 GMT -5
All this information is everywhere! You can’t turn on anything without being bombarded with it. I’m not here for more indoctrination! Thank you!Now, back to you normal broadcasting! It's that pandemic burnout! We are all tired of being tired.  And I had this crazy idea that I wouldn’t have to tolerate or see any of it here in the lounge. Let’s give it a rest and seek Covid elsewhere. Thanks. |
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Post by novisnick on Jan 22, 2022 21:01:33 GMT -5
All this information is everywhere! You can’t turn on anything without being bombarded with it. I’m not here for more indoctrination! Thank you!Now, back to you normal broadcasting! "Normal broadcasting?" This IS the NEW normal now. Get used to it!  I’ll pass, thank you. |
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Post by garbulky on Jan 22, 2022 21:32:18 GMT -5
It's that pandemic burnout! We are all tired of being tired. And I had this crazy idea that I wouldn’t have to tolerate or see any of it here in the lounge. Let’s give it a rest and seek Covid elsewhere. Thanks. This is the only thread with covid information on it. Plenty of other audio goodness to check out on other threads. I will post about some new earbuds I’m trying out soon. |
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Post by knucklehead on Jan 22, 2022 22:15:38 GMT -5
This is much ado over something that has quite likely been around as long as man, perhaps longer. And both have adapted to each other over the years. A simple cold, or flu virus. Whatever. The question is why all the 'ado'? The answer shall set you free, if you are willing.
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Post by garbulky on Jan 22, 2022 22:50:31 GMT -5
This is much ado over something that has quite likely been around as long as man, perhaps longer. And both have adapted to each other over the years. A simple cold, or flu virus. Whatever. The question is why all the 'ado'? The answer shall set you free, if you are willing. Well it's not a simple cold or the flu. But interestingly COVID comes from the same family of viruses as colds which are also a form of coronavirus. Colds come from Coronaviruses, rhinoviruses + some others. What makes COVID different in a practical sense or the "much ado" part is that it can - kill large amounts of people - is far more transmissible by orders of magnitude. - infectious to others while asymptomatic for upto a few days - Can affect multiple organs like the blood vessels, kidneys, brain, the heart, and even mess with pregnancies. it also has a much higher rate of long term effects. - Possibly able create devastating variants in short order. This was not known at the beginning. They thought COVID would not mutate much past the alpha strain. We still don't know what it's going to do in the future. Also unique to COVID is the massive amount of misinformation and mistrust in public health agencies and mitigation measures it has created. Other illnesses have done so but not nearly to the same extent. Unlike the cold though, we have a vaccine for COVID, something we were not sure we could do. |
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Post by knucklehead on Jan 22, 2022 23:19:18 GMT -5
I'll say this much, and no more on this subject because it's plain to see that you've been brainwashed, or cannot think logically for yourself, and it really makes no difference which is the case.
You will know the what and why's of these so-called vaxxes, and possibly very soon, and you ain't going to like it. So have at it, take a few more jabs, the sooner we're rid of the brainwashed the sooner we can get to repairing what is wrong with this country, and the rest of the world.
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Post by garbulky on Jan 22, 2022 23:29:23 GMT -5
I'll say this much, and no more on this subject because it's plain to see that you've been brainwashed, or cannot think logically for yourself, and it really makes no difference which is the case. You will know the what and why's of these so-called vaxxes, and possibly very soon, and you ain't going to like it. So have at it, take a few more jabs, the sooner we're rid of the brainwashed the sooner we can get to repairing what is wrong with this country, and the rest of the world. Are you suggesting that if I take a "few more jabs' I will be gotten rid of because I will die from vaccine complications? |
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Post by novisnick on Jan 23, 2022 1:25:50 GMT -5
And I had this crazy idea that I wouldn’t have to tolerate or see any of it here in the lounge. Let’s give it a rest and seek Covid elsewhere. Thanks. This is the only thread with covid information on it. Plenty of other audio goodness to check out on other threads. I will post about some new earbuds I’m trying out soon. My friend, all I’m saying is that if I wanted to even see the word “Covid” I’d find it in a thousand other places. I have skipped 99% of this thread and will continue to avoid it as much as I can. I’m not a big earbud guy but I do look forward to reading your thoughts. I do have a few sets I use but nothing fancy. Well, maybe my Sony noise canceling set is a bit fancy. Stay well. 🙏🎶🤞 |
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Post by Boomzilla on Jan 23, 2022 5:31:53 GMT -5
I'll say this much, and no more on this subject because it's plain to see that you've been brainwashed, or cannot think logically for yourself, and it really makes no difference which is the case. You will know the what and why's of these so-called vaxxes, and possibly very soon, and you ain't going to like it. So have at it, take a few more jabs, the sooner we're rid of the brainwashed the sooner we can get to repairing what is wrong with this country, and the rest of the world. There's science, and there's brainwashing. Never the two shall meet (except in politics). The vaccines are NOT perfect. They don't protect as widely as we'd wish, and some people have reactions to the vaccines themselves. But the vaccines haven't killed 865,000 people in the U.S.A. That would be the Coronavirus itself. That count isn't opinion or politics - it's a fact. And the death toll continues to rise (primarily in the unvaccinated). That is also a fact. Yes, some people who have been vaccinated and boosted still get the Omicron variant, but your chances of dying (or even being hospitalized) from Omicron go DOWN 90-something percent if you HAVE been vaccinated and boosted. Vaccines are NOT a cure for Coronavirus. But don't confuse the vaccine with the virus itself. It's the virus killing so many of us - not the vaccine. Will there be widespread side-effects from the vaccines? There might be, the jury's still out on that question and the vaccines are still pretty new. But if I can avoid death now, I'll risk some potential side effects down the road. I can't make your decision for you, but I've made mine and said why. I'm NOT brainwashed, and I DO think logically. Cordially - Boom |
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