My speakers ARE NOT out of phase....

[barrynj]

Feb 17, 2010 15:05:32 GMT -5 moodyman said:

...If your main speakers were out phase and you listened to say some music..you would immediately notice things were awry. I listen to music all the time through my 8.3's and can tell you with absolute certainty they are not out of phase as my UMC suggests.

Moodyman, you're saying that the phase of your speakers is matched. What the processor may be telling you is that your speakers are out of phase with your system not each other. Try reversing polarity on both the left and right speakers, so that they still match each other, but are opposite of what they are currently.

[mathguy]

Moodyman,

Thank you for the well-mannered response to my comment. I can see that Emo-Q's characteristics don't settle well for you at all and with that I can sympathize ( I would want everything to work out-of-the-box to my expectations as well ).

What I meant to say with my comment in a lighthearted way ( and failed, obviously ) is that I hope your focusing ( on Emo-Q shortcomings ) is not killing your enjoyment of the unit. I had an older Onkyo receiver that does an auto set up with a mike....It did not get the right channel distance correct ( off by 2 feet at least ) and it NEVER detected the subwoofer. While I used it, I just set the distances and subwoofer parameter manually. In every other way it worked very well.

As regards the UMC-1 it seems to me that the firmware has fixed most items and hopefully the next firmware release will address the Emo-Q quirks . Everything new these days has glitches....unfortunately.

[moodyman]

Feb 17, 2010 17:54:27 GMT -5 barrynj said:

What the processor may be telling you is that your speakers are out of phase with your system not each other. Try reversing polarity on both the left and right speakers, so that they still match each other, but are opposite of what they are currently.

Thats a good point...but I ran EMO-Q a few times already and half the time it says they are fine the other times it says they are out. I'm just ignoring what it says about phase at this point.

[moodyman]

Feb 17, 2010 19:05:48 GMT -5 mathguy said:

Moodyman,

Thank you for the well-mannered response to my comment. I can see that Emo-Q's characteristics don't settle well for you at all and with that I can sympathize ( I would want everything to work out-of-the-box to my expectations as well ).

What I meant to say with my comment in a lighthearted way ( and failed, obviously ) is that I hope your focusing ( on Emo-Q shortcomings ) is not killing your enjoyment of the unit. I had an older Onkyo receiver that does an auto set up with a mike....It did not get the right channel distance correct ( off by 2 feet at least ) and it NEVER detected the subwoofer. While I used it, I just set the distances and subwoofer parameter manually. In every other way it worked very well.

As regards the UMC-1 it seems to me that the firmware has fixed most items and hopefully the next firmware release will address the Emo-Q quirks . Everything new these days has glitches....unfortunately.

Actually I am enjoying the UMC despite its shortcomings. I'm very impressed with the flexibility it gives you.

I just downloaded REW..I'm gonna try to use that and the UMC's extensive equalizer adjustments to come up with my own EQ for each speaker. I will certainly post in the Emo forum with my results.

[mathguy]

Ah,

Glad to hear you are enjoying the UMC-1 ( even with glitches ). I am hoping to get one myself as soon as the preorder list(s) clears and use the 40% discount before the price goes up on the unit.

[Dan Laufman]

Hi All,
OK, I'm not stirring the pot here... just my two cents worth...

I've used EmoQ quite a bit. I have had very good and reliable results in the rooms that I have used it in. I've also seen photos of some of the rooms you are trying to tame and I can understand the challenges the system is facing! It is sensitive to placement, and if you have a highly reflective room or an asymmetrical layout it seems to be sensitive to this too. However, it is not a POS as some of you want to believe, nor are we saying it's perfect.

It's a tool and I believe that for most of you it can be very helpful. Having said this, I HEAR all of your comments.

Lonnie and I are working with our team to see if we can fine tune the systems gating and capture windows to make it more "robust" for ALL types of rooms. I believe that we can.

Please don't throw the baby out with the bath water. EmoQ is completely SW driven, and we can and will, make improvements to it over these next few months, I'm sure of this.

The ironic thing is, as strongly negative as some of you are feeling about EmoQ, I have the same very strong negative feelings about another very popular room correction system out there that the same people that hate EmoQ swear by. I can't stand it and have never heard it improve a system, but that does not mean I'm right, as many of you love it. It doesn't let you do anything if you disagree with it, which infuriates me!

The wonderful thing about EmoQ is that it allows you to make judgments and fine tune its results to your likings and personal taste. It also has a very powerful and flexible multi-band EQ system that is a great tool even if you never run the automatic set up. Please try to put some perspective on this when you make your comments.

We're doing our utmost to give you the best possible product we know how to build. Even without the automatic room set up, the UMC-1 is a fantastic and very powerful processor. I hope you can see this and weigh this in your comments about our system.

We hear you and are paying attention, but please understand that these are complex issues. Constant improvement and refinement is part of what we do.

Thanks for your input and support; we DO appreciate it!
Best regards,
Big Dan

[houston1]

Very cool Dan. I love the flexibility that the software upgrade path allows you to "fine tune" your product.

[moodyman]

Feb 17, 2010 20:09:30 GMT -5 Dan Laufman said:

Hi All,


Having said this, I HEAR all of your comments.

Lonnie and I are working with our team to see if we can fine tune the systems gating and capture windows to make it more "robust" for ALL types of rooms. I believe that we can.

Please don't throw the baby out with the bath water. EmoQ is completely SW driven, and we can and will, make improvements to it over these next few months, I'm sure of this.

Big Dan

Excellent!!..I appreciate you responding in this thread. I think many people just wanted to hear that your gonna at least look into tweaking EMO-Q to make it more usable. Overall I'm very impressed with the UMC-1.

[klinemj]

Thanks Dan! Great comments...

In that other auto-EQ system you mention, I doubt it would be the one I use. Mine is called "Odd-I-See", and while I was not involved in the naming, I think it's called that because every time I see what it recos and listen to it's results, I say..."Odd, I see...I guess I will not use it's reco's" and I leave it turned off. So, I love it in that it is consistent...I consistently don't like it's reco's and I consistently can't tweek the parts I don't like it and I consistency don't use it's reco's. Yeah, consistency is good...

Seriously...I do like what I see of Emo-Q from what has been shown, and I do think it's very good as is from what I have seen. I love the initial settings w/a huge variety of adjustments easily possible. Very good can always be better so I like your attitude on this, but it does not appear to me that there should be a big rush to fix anything now that the data is starting to settle out.

I'd rather you get the details to us on the XMC-1 so those of us on the UMC/XMC bubble can make our final call (with the big XMC detail I need to hear being price and 'rough' timing...but esp. price).

Many thanks,

Mark

[Mike Ronesia]

My room will most likely send Emo-Q into a tizzy fit, but i expect that and can't wait to try. With my current system I had to go in and do all manual EQ after running the setup. Thanks for the update Dan.

[DYohn]

Feb 17, 2010 20:09:30 GMT -5 Dan Laufman said:

The wonderful thing about EmoQ is that it allows you to make judgments and fine tune its results to your likings and personal taste. It also has a very powerful and flexible multi-band EQ system that is a great tool even if you never run the automatic set up.

This is exactly why I am happy with it. I LOVE the flexibility and the fact that it is completely user customizable. This is a feature that I have dreamt about for some time and I thought I'd have to spend 3 or 4 grand to get. Thank you for this!

[venaka]

hey guys what does reverse phase in subwoofer mean

[bootman]

Feb 17, 2010 22:16:01 GMT -5 venaka said:

hey guys what does reverse phase in subwoofer mean

Check your sub amp settings.
If it's at 0 degrees then set to 180.
If it's at 180 set to 0. ;D

[ksuvet]

Nice comments by Dan. It's nice to have some some official word that acknowledges the reported issues and commits to further investigation and, hopefully, correction/adjustment of the software. That's all I'm asking right now. Of course, we'll all become a little more demanding as the trial period nears an end . I also agree with the comment about the power of the manual EQ without the auto setup. I'm looking forward to learning REW in the next few weeks and checking results. Hopefully we can get some comparison graphs from people on the forum soon!

[mathguy]

Thanks to Dan for the excellent comments!

I just wanted to say that I am NOT throwing the baby out with the bathwater. After seeing your video with Emo-Q I was very pleased at the sheer capabilities of the system. Like I said earlier I am waiting for the preorders to clear....of course, that could be a while!

[RayoVac]

Dan's comments would be great to refer to in ALL these posts where folks are fighting Emo-Q results. Run it... if it looks good and sounds good, keep the settings. Otherwise... tweak things so that they not only make sense based on your environment and equipment... but most importantly that you like the sound.

[brand450]

Feb 17, 2010 17:35:23 GMT -5 flamingeye said:

My yamaha 1600s auto EQ does exactly what you all say the Emo-Q does and every re-try is different from the last with different things wrong each time so I skip the levels , distends and x-overs an just run the EQ part then go in and tweak the EQ further till it`s just right and when I had a denon AVR it did the same thing so you have to take auto EQ with a grain of salt it`s just a tool a starting point some will get you there better then others but nun will be perfect/accurate and just because you got good/adequate results with one doesn`t mean you will with the next one or the next or the next one should never trust auto EQ IMHO you should always do manual adjustments afterwards

My yamaha rxv3800 does the exact same thing, but its only on the left speaker. Used to drive me up the wall...now I have learned to live with it. System sounds amazing!

[wizardofoz]

If you are getting speakers out of phase them maybe move your mic 1/2 a wave and retry the results.

[PapaJac]

www.rythmikaudio.com/phase1.html

Maybe this info can help too.

[venaka]

Feb 17, 2010 22:31:27 GMT -5 bootman said:

Feb 17, 2010 22:16:01 GMT -5 venaka said:

hey guys what does reverse phase in subwoofer mean

Check your sub amp settings.
If it's at 0 degrees then set to 180.
If it's at 180 set to 0. ;D

thanks boot, this doesnt mean that I have to rerun emo-q again either right?