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Post by brax on Apr 7, 2010 21:28:38 GMT -5
How can Audioholics rate it as a "Gotta Have it" whenthey haven't even heard it? Is that an advertisment or a review?
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Post by roadrunner on Apr 8, 2010 15:39:27 GMT -5
How can Audioholics rate it as a "Gotta Have it" whenthey haven't even heard it? Is that an advertisment or a review? My guess would be because of the "quality" of the components used in building the sub are unheard of in this price range. Competing gear having similar component quality costs a great deal more. The pre-production Ultra 10 subs have been at every show that Emotiva has participated in for the past 6+ months, including Emofest and several GTG events. The sound quality of those pre-production Ultra 10 subs has been outstanding. Chance are Audioholics personnel have heard the pre-production unit at one time or another. I am anxious to see some reviews of the production units for both the Ultra 10 and the Ultra 12. I have very high expectations based on how good the pre-production unit sounded. ;D |
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Post by monkumonku on Apr 8, 2010 16:17:12 GMT -5
How can Audioholics rate it as a "Gotta Have it" whenthey haven't even heard it? Is that an advertisment or a review? My guess would be because of the "quality" of the components used in building the sub are unheard of in this price range. Competing gear having similar component quality costs a great deal more. The pre-production Ultra 10 subs have been at every show that Emotiva has participated in for the past 6+ months, including Emofest and several GTG events. The sound quality of those pre-production Ultra 10 subs has been outstanding. Chance are Audioholics personnel have heard the pre-production unit at one time or another. I am anxious to see some reviews of the production units for both the Ultra 10 and the Ultra 12. I have very high expectations based on how good the pre-production unit sounded. ;D I read the "summary" and while I am a big fan of Emo stuff, I do have to say that I thought they seemed to be quite enamored of the sub before they have even listened to it. It is true that the construction quality and materials sound first rate but still, I don't see how they can fawn over something without doing a real review of it. The other problem is that people may begin to question their objectivity if they are so favorable about something they haven't reviewed yet. |
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Post by Porscheguy on Apr 8, 2010 21:31:08 GMT -5
My guess would be because of the "quality" of the components used in building the sub are unheard of in this price range. Competing gear having similar component quality costs a great deal more. The pre-production Ultra 10 subs have been at every show that Emotiva has participated in for the past 6+ months, including Emofest and several GTG events. The sound quality of those pre-production Ultra 10 subs has been outstanding. Chance are Audioholics personnel have heard the pre-production unit at one time or another. I am anxious to see some reviews of the production units for both the Ultra 10 and the Ultra 12. I have very high expectations based on how good the pre-production unit sounded. ;D I read the "summary" and while I am a big fan of Emo stuff, I do have to say that I thought they seemed to be quite enamored of the sub before they have even listened to it. It is true that the construction quality and materials sound first rate but still, I don't see how they can fawn over something without doing a real review of it. The other problem is that people may begin to question their objectivity if they are so favorable about something they haven't reviewed yet. Like I mentioned in another thread, the Emos and the 'holics are pretty good friends I've heard - not a bad thing.... |
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Post by brax on Apr 8, 2010 22:08:06 GMT -5
It's a bad thing if they are giving the review because they are friends...IF that is the case, their review of ANY Emo gear is worthless.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2010 0:01:24 GMT -5
I agree that this First Impressions and First Look that mentioned a "gotta have it" comment was quite complimentary. However, as stated, this was in great part due to Audioholics past experience with the price/performance history of Emotiva's previous products.
To Tom Andry/Audioholics credit it did continue on to mention:
"...............The Ultra Subs look to be a great value - the price alone will tell you that- but we really won't know their performance until they get into one of our rooms................"
I believe we simply have a first look here to drum up interest in upcoming products that Audioholics plans to review that seem to be projected as big bangs for the buck. A little self advertising and drumming up excitement for readers to return. All the reviews I have read at Audioholics on products from all brands seem to be very fair and accurate IMO. I value their reviews as highly as most other online or magazine equipment reports.
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Post by roadrunner on Apr 9, 2010 0:42:52 GMT -5
I agree that this First Impressions and First Look that mentioned a "gotta have it" comment was quite complimentary. However, as stated, this was in great part due to Audioholics past experience with the price/performance history of Emotiva's previous products. To Tom Andry/Audioholics credit it did continue on to mention: "...............The Ultra Subs look to be a great value - the price alone will tell you that- but we really won't know their performance until they get into one of our rooms................" I believe we simply have a first look here to drum up interest in upcoming products that Audioholics plans to review that seem to be projected as big bangs for the buck. A little self advertising and drumming up excitement for readers to return. All the reviews I have read at Audioholics on products from all brands seem to be very fair and accurate IMO. I value their reviews as highly as most other online or magazine equipment reports. +1 Chuckienut. You hit a bulls eye with that post. ;D |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2010 0:52:12 GMT -5
Thanks Roadrunner! I know that article was glowing but to me it was sort of a "previews of coming attractions." If Oppo announced that they were coming out with a Blu-Ray only player (no SACD-DVD Audio) to sell for $189, you can bet it would get a lot of advanced press from online magazines like Audioholics. This is exactly how I view this article on the new Emo subs. ;D
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ntrain42
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Post by ntrain42 on Apr 9, 2010 9:35:25 GMT -5
How can Audioholics rate it as a "Gotta Have it" whenthey haven't even heard it? Is that an advertisment or a review? Just one more reason why online review sites and publications tend to be worthless in many aspects(not all, but many). |
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Post by jmilton on Apr 9, 2010 9:43:32 GMT -5
How can Audioholics rate it as a "Gotta Have it" whenthey haven't even heard it? Is that an advertisment or a review? Just one more reason why online review sites and publications tend to be worthless in many aspects(not all, but many). " We're dubious, we're doubtful, we're perplexed and most of all, we don't believe. For that price, in that box, that performance can't be true. But over and over Emotiva has proved us wrong. We're willing to bet that the Ultra Subs will once again make a believer out of us."... based on past experience with products from Emotiva, they are saying that though the claims seem spurious, Emotiva has consistently proven to be an over achiever and a real A/V bargain. Thus, one can conclude: "Gotta Have It!" (No one squawked when they said the same thing about the almost released Oppo 83. If a company has a track record to back up their claims... I'm interested!)  |
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ntrain42
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Post by ntrain42 on Apr 9, 2010 9:54:43 GMT -5
Just one more reason why online review sites and publications tend to be worthless in many aspects(not all, but many). " We're dubious, we're doubtful, we're perplexed and most of all, we don't believe. For that price, in that box, that performance can't be true. But over and over Emotiva has proved us wrong. We're willing to bet that the Ultra Subs will once again make a believer out of us."... based on past experience with products from Emotiva, they are saying that though the claims seem spurious, Emotiva has consistently proven to be an over achiever and a real A/V bargain. Thus, one can conclude: "Gotta Have It!" (No one squawked when they said the same thing about the almost released Oppo 83. If a company has a track record to back up their claims... I'm interested!) See thats my point exactly. Is the Emotiva product really an "over achiever"? No way. It makes a GOOD product at a more reasonable price. In reality, the AV industry is just loaded with the majority heavily OVER charging for a similiar performance product at best. And all these publications go along with it since they are funded by these companies with ad dollars. As they say, don't bite the hand that feeds you. Thats why I like companies like Emotiva, Rythmik, monoprice, Oppo, many of the pro audio and DIY companies. |
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Post by jv51 on Apr 9, 2010 10:49:25 GMT -5
How would the U-12 be compared to the JL audio 12?
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Post by Animo on Apr 9, 2010 11:54:42 GMT -5
How would the U-12 be compared to the JL audio 12? Side by side...... Sorry I couldn't resist. Seeing this is your first post, let's just say that the JL Audio, comes in at least 2 to 3 times the cost of the U-12. Has more than twice the power, and is in a bigger enclosure. However, that doesn't always amount to a sack of beans. Truthfully, you would have to judge them both for yourself. Until someone actually gets one for review, everything is just speculation. |
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Post by jmilton on Apr 9, 2010 11:56:07 GMT -5
How would the U-12 be compared to the JL audio 12? I don't think anyone here would seriously compare the two. If you have the coin and can get help lifting it...go JL. |
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Post by brax on Apr 9, 2010 23:31:51 GMT -5
Well, let’s just look at the spec’s…….
Sealed 12” driver in a 1.8 cubic foot cabinet powered by 500 watts, with a response down to 22hz and in-room spl of 110-113db.
First a sealed sub rolls off pretty high, for this sub I would guess somewhere around 30-35hz. Second, a sealed sub needs more power by the nature of the design compared to a ported sub, and 500 watts in the sub world is low power. Third, a sub by definition should reproduce the ultra low frequencies and if 22hz is it’s low end, it will not be ideal for movies, but should do fine with music. And finally I would guess that that in room response of 110db is somewhere in the 35-40hz if it can even get there under “normal” conditions. I’m sure Emo tested the sub to get these spec’s so it would be interesting to see the test method and a graph of it’s output.
So if you want to judge this sub on it’s specs, I’d say it would be okay for music, but will lack enough low output for a good HT sub.
I have had 3 subs in my system so far, I started with a 12” SVS, built a 15” sono tube sub and now have dual 18” sealed subs. I’ve done a lot of graphing of drivers, sub styles and cabinet volumes and from my limited experience, the numbers on this sub don’t add up. Small driver+small cabinet+low power does not equal a gotta have sub.
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Post by rygher3 on Apr 10, 2010 1:07:16 GMT -5
Well, let’s just look at the spec’s……. Sealed 12” driver in a 1.8 cubic foot cabinet powered by 500 watts, with a response down to 22hz and in-room spl of 110-113db. First a sealed sub rolls off pretty high, for this sub I would guess somewhere around 30-35hz. Second, a sealed sub needs more power by the nature of the design compared to a ported sub, and 500 watts in the sub world is low power. Third, a sub by definition should reproduce the ultra low frequencies and if 22hz is it’s low end, it will not be ideal for movies, but should do fine with music. And finally I would guess that that in room response of 110db is somewhere in the 35-40hz if it can even get there under “normal” conditions. I’m sure Emo tested the sub to get these spec’s so it would be interesting to see the test method and a graph of it’s output. So if you want to judge this sub on it’s specs, I’d say it would be okay for music, but will lack enough low output for a good HT sub. I have had 3 subs in my system so far, I started with a 12” SVS, built a 15” sono tube sub and now have dual 18” sealed subs. I’ve done a lot of graphing of drivers, sub styles and cabinet volumes and from my limited experience, the numbers on this sub don’t add up. Small driver+small cabinet+low power does not equal a gotta have sub. So you are saying that a sub that is designed to perform very well with music makes it not be a gotta have sub? Everybody has different listening preferences and it might not be for them. However, that does not mean that it is a poor sub. I'm not saying that the Ultra is the end all be all, because no subwoofer is. It does seem to be a very interesting sub in the market for its price and it will be interesting to see what people think of how they sound. The only way to really know if a sub is good is to hear it yourself. |
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Post by brax on Apr 10, 2010 8:49:28 GMT -5
Yes, a sub that is only good with music may be a good sub but not a gotta have sub. Maybe if they renamed it a bass module (something to supplement bass shy speakers like bookshelfs speakers) it would make more sense. IMHO, a sub should be capable of 20hz minimum and 16hz for a gotta have sub.
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Post by placebo473 on Apr 11, 2010 17:45:58 GMT -5
Uh. I gotta have it.
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Post by bigred7078 on Apr 11, 2010 19:58:12 GMT -5
Yes, a sub that is only good with music may be a good sub but not a gotta have sub. Maybe if they renamed it a bass module (something to supplement bass shy speakers like bookshelfs speakers) it would make more sense. IMHO, a sub should be capable of 20hz minimum and 16hz for a gotta have sub. its not like its cant reach 20hz... its just down a few db's... |
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Post by brax on Apr 11, 2010 21:15:35 GMT -5
Bigred, I do know there is output below 20hz............
I would assume the F3 of the sub is 22hz or more than likely higher. If that is true, they are more than a few db's below at 20hz. The only way to know for sure is to see an output graph on this sub. Early drop off is the big drawback of a sealed design. To over come this you need increased cabinet volume and or amplifier power.
To make the sub smaller so that is more acceptable, and to keep costs down to make it more affordable they didn't build the driver capable of handling higher power and did not use a high power amp. These are all choices made for the design and marketing of this sub. Can this sub compete with others in it's class, more than likely yes and will do well. But this sub probably will not be a must have, just a good value in it's class. Don't try and sell it as anything more........
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