XSP-1

[kkennally]

I just purchased the XSP-1 from emotiva and it will arrive Monday. Does anyone know if the headphone section is powerful enough to run a pair of HiFiman HE-400's?

[garbulky]

Apr 3, 2015 22:41:46 GMT -5 kkennally said:

I just purchased the XSP-1 from emotiva and it will arrive Monday. Does anyone know if the headphone section is powerful enough to run a pair of HiFiman HE-400's?

You'll hear something. But no, it's not. It needs grunt. You should be looking at dedicated headphone amps for those phones. And not just any headphone amp. Research is your friend with getting a good match for it

[kkennally]

I was reading a review for the XDA-2 and during the headphone testing phase of the review they used a set of HiFiman HE-400s. The reviewer stated that they sounded superb with internal headphone amp of the XDA-2. I would think that the headphone out of the XSP-1 would be as good if not better than the XDA-2?

[leonski]

Sine-Wave
If you are still concerned with a proper headphone amp for your HE-400s, go check out HEADFI.

The folks over there have FORGOTTEN more about headphones / amps and such than you'll find over here at the Emo site.

[RCUBE]

Hello,
Can anyone tell me a good subwoofer they are using with the XSP please?
All THREE of my subs are sounding diminished when connected to the XSP. i have already tried stuff like using a Y adapter to bump up the gain. I hardly get any impact from subs i have used before.
Currently i am feeding into a UMC 200 and pushing the volume to 90% to get the desired impact from my subwoofers.

The subwoofers i have are 2xJamo 660 and 1x Mirage. It it difficult to swallow that all three of my subs are gone bad just when i connected the XSP.

any suggestions will be highly highly helpful.


cheers
R

[sahmen]

May 25, 2015 9:10:44 GMT -5 RCUBE said:

Hello,
Can anyone tell me a good subwoofer they are using with the XSP please?
All THREE of my subs are sounding diminished when connected to the XSP. i have already tried stuff like using a Y adapter to bump up the gain. I hardly get any impact from subs i have used before.
Currently i am feeding into a UMC 200 and pushing the volume to 90% to get the desired impact from my subwoofers.

The subwoofers i have are 2xJamo 660 and 1x Mirage. It it difficult to swallow that all three of my subs are gone bad just when i connected the XSP.

any suggestions will be highly highly helpful.


cheers
R

Maybe you should mention how you're configuring the XSP-1 with your subs first.  Where are you setting the crossover on the XSP-1?, and where on the subs, as they're connected to the XSP-1?   There is no normal reason why the XSP-1 should make any sub sound "diminished" in my view...  It seems something is off with the set-up.

[Boomzilla]

The combined input impedance of the three subs may be low enough that the XSP's sub output buffer amp can't keep up. Try disconnecting all but one of the subs to test this theory. If the single sub works properly, then you'll need a buffer amp between the XSP and the three subs.

[RCUBE]

Edited--
@ boomzilla and sahman
the XSP has cross over set at 80hz and the switch on XSP is positioned to do bass management. The left subwoofer out RCA from XSP is terminated with Y adapter and connects to the 1st sub. Output from subwoofer 1 is connected to subwoofer 2 again terminated using Y adapter.

Sub woofer 1 is daisy chained to subwoofer 2.

i have tried various combinations including using a single subwoofer. The ONLY way i seem to get the subs firing [properly] is to run the RCA outs from the XSP into the UMC and connect the UMC to the subs and bump the volume at the UMC to 90%

I like the XSP and dont want to pull it out of the setup and not to mention, am not sure how the XPA 1L will react to that.
if i have to sell of my existing subs and buy one good sub that is guaranteed to work with the XSP, then so be it. but i just so want the problem gone

the other alternative is to get rid of all 3 subs and upgrade from the Axiom M22 to something like the M80 HP [which seems like the expensive option at 3K a pair]


I just checked, the JAMOs are the ones that have the low output when connected directly to the XSP. The mirage does work.
The mirage is a 300W entry level sub and is not good enough by itself.

[Boomzilla]

Hi RCUBE -

May I assume that you're using the balanced outputs from your XSP-1 for your main speakers? You do know that those outputs have a higher signal level than the RCA outputs to the subs that you're using? I suspect that if you switched your main power amps to their RCA connections, that you wouldn't need the 10 db bump for the sub.

Second, you say that you're using a Y-connector to run your subs? I don't think you need it (nor do I think that it boosts the sub volume in any way). Please review your sub's manual. I'd bet that the sub accepts a mono signal on a SINGLE input jack (typically the one labeled "Left"). Splitting the signal to both inputs on the subs may also be a part of the problem. Where did you get the idea that feeding both jacks would increase the overall sensitivity of the sub's plate amp? I'm not saying it's wrong, only that I've never heard this before. Maybe try doing away with the Y connector & feeding only the monophonic input jack of the sub.

Finally, another suggestion that may or may not work for you - If you put your subs in the corners of the room, their sensitivity will be increased by the "room effect" of better sub coupling to the acoustic space. This will also induce some "room boom" at specific frequencies, but this can be tamed with room correction software. In effect, corner placement multiplies the acoustic power of the subwoofer's bass compared to any other room placement.

Hope this helps - Boom

[Deleted]

Just an FYI. Using a y adapter in fact increases the sensitivity of the amp on the sub (increases its gain input) by 6db. This is a common workaround if the output signal from the avr or whatever is too low to wake a sub up from standby or if the signal is getting clipped somehow.

Ime I also had anemic bass output from my xsp1. I was using all unbalanced connectors. I think it is just the analog bass management.

I could be wrong in that point

[Boomzilla]

May 26, 2015 6:10:53 GMT -5 @bmoney said:

Just an FYI. Using a y adapter in fact increases the sensitivity of the amp on the sub (increases its gain input) by 6db. This is a common workaround if the output signal from the avr or whatever is too low to wake a sub up from standby or if the signal is getting clipped somehow.

Ime I also had anemic bass output from my xsp1. I was using all unbalanced connectors. I think it is just the analog bass management.

I could be wrong in that point

Thank you kindly for the information about using dual SW inputs, @bmoney - I didn't know that. In fact, reviewing the owners' manual for my PowerSound Audio XV-15, under "inputs" it says:

"You can use a Y-connector on the subwoofer if it doesn’t power up in AUTO mode at low levels. (Please make sure to recalibrate if you use a Y-connector.)"

This would indicate increased sensitivity when using both inputs via Y-connector, thus confirming your statement.

As to the XSP-1 having attenuated bass, I honestly don't think so. It merely splits the frequencies without making any level changes at all, if I read the manual correctly. In fact, if the analog bass management attenuates the sub signal at all, it must also attenuate the high-pass by an equal amount.

I'll test the theory by using my Oppo for bass management & see what happens.

Boom

[RCUBE]

Ok for the first time I am seeing some positive movement!!

Boomzilla
Your trick of using RCA between XSP and XPAs worked to connect my mirage directly to the XSP. The Jamo sub still asks for the Y adapter to even wake up (the output is almost negligible)

However, that's a compromise to use unbalanced connections when the components are fully balanced.
How can I get the Jamo working ? Am so used to dual subs that I can easily locate the second sub

[novisnick]

ranjit he,
When subs are employed properly you should not be able to audibly locate any of the subs. Just my $ 0.02. 8)

[RCUBE]

I agree. The crossover setting probably is too high. I can fix that quick.
But, what is hard to believe is that I need to use unbalanced connections in an otherwise balanced setup.

Any idea on how to fix that?

[Boomzilla]

If your sub has balanced inputs?... But of course not, or you wouldn't be asking!

Short answer = No way to fix this. If your sub's plate amp isn't designed for balanced XLR inputs (most aren't), then you've GOT to use the unbalanced ones.

HOWEVER - If your source disc player (I use the DACs in my Oppo for both music & movies) has an audio setup menu, there's often an option in the disc player menu to automatically boost the sub signal by 10 dB. OTOH, if you're feeding your preamp a full range signal, and letting the XSP-1 do the bass management, then you may be SOL.

The ONLY other thing I could think of would be to put a line level gain stage between the sub output of the XSP-1 and the input of the subwoofer(s).

Here's one for $80 after shipping: www.ebay.com/itm/PRO1327-Stereo-Audio-Line-Preamp-pre-amp-Pre-amplifier-Gain-Control-0-15dB-/140976052673?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item20d2d3d9c1

Or another for $19 with free shipping: www.ebay.com/itm/PAC-LD-10-10X-Preamp-Ground-Loop-Isolator-Adjustable-Line-Driver-Signal-Booster-/360395799066?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item53e9437a1a

Or if you want to shoot the moon, here's a German one: www.ebay.com/itm/Lehle-SUNDAY-DRIVER-Buffered-15db-Line-Signal-Booster-Preamp-Gold-Plated-GERMANY-/171726350908?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27fbb02a3c

[knucklehead]

May 25, 2015 20:46:29 GMT -5 RCUBE said:

Edited--
@ boomzilla and sahman
the XSP has cross over set at 80hz and the switch on XSP is positioned to do bass management. The left subwoofer out RCA from XSP is terminated with Y adapter and connects to the 1st sub. Output from subwoofer 1 is connected to subwoofer 2 again terminated using Y adapter.

Sub woofer 1 is daisy chained to subwoofer 2.

i have tried various combinations including using a single subwoofer. The ONLY way i seem to get the subs firing [properly] is to run the RCA outs from the XSP into the UMC and connect the UMC to the subs and bump the volume at the UMC to 90%

I like the XSP and dont want to pull it out of the setup and not to mention, am not sure how the XPA 1L will react to that.
if i have to sell of my existing subs and buy one good sub that is guaranteed to work with the XSP, then so be it. but i just so want the problem gone

the other alternative is to get rid of all 3 subs and upgrade from the Axiom M22 to something like the M80 HP [which seems like the expensive option at 3K a pair]


I just checked, the JAMOs are the ones that have the low output when connected directly to the XSP. The mirage does work.
The mirage is a 300W entry level sub and is not good enough by itself.

There are 2 switches that control bass management on the XSP-1. For full bass management they need to be switched so they are positioned towards each other - away from the adjusting screws. One is for low pass and the other is for high pass. If you have one or the other switched away from the other I don't think it will manage bass in the manner you are looking for.

From page 12 of the XSP-1 manual:

Note: To set the XSP-1 for “full bass management”, set both switches towards the center
(towards each other).
Note: The High Pass and Low Pass crossover points are typically set to the same frequency
for smoothest blending of high and low frequency bands, but this may not be optimum in all
systems.

[leonski]

Knuck is on to something.
IF you are using bass management features in BOTH the sub(s) and the XSP, than you may be double-cutting the bass. Basically running a crossover INTO another crossover.

On my system (non-EMO) I run the signal to the sub as full-range and use the crossover IN the sub. The main speakers get a low-cut signal so I don't get much bass from the main speakers.

IF you are running crossovers on the subs, turn the signal from the XSP to full-range. If you can turn the crossover of the subs OFF, try that as an experiment with the system otherwise untouched.

Than you can experiment with limiting LF to the main speakers. In my setup, I find this eliminates boominess and muddiness.

[Boomzilla]

leonski and @knucklehead are right, IMHO.

If you're using low pass filters at the XSP-1 AND at the subs, you're changing the low-pass slope, which will cause potential cancellation at the crossover point.

Therefore either:

1. Set the crossover frequency at the XSP-1 and put the subs' filters to as high a frequency as they'll go OR

2. Use the full-range output from the XSP-1 and adjust the low-pass at the subs.

Even if you're adjusting at both places, though, there SHOULD be enough bass output to wake up the subwoofers. You DO have the "volume" on the subs cranked up, yes?

The XSP-1 DOES have balanced XLR outputs for the subwoofer(s), so you're OK to there. If you want balanced all the way, then you'll need to buy some better subwoofers that offer XLR inputs.

Boom

[Deleted]

I wouldn't equate better subs as those with xlr inputs. The two don't go hand in hand

[RCUBE]

Thanks guys.
1- Yes I have the switches facing each other on the XSP
2- yes I feed the XSP a full signal (source is synology NAS feeding to a TEAC UD-501 which feeds the XSP via XLR)
3- yes I have the crossover on the sub turned as high as possible)

The only thing I can think of is, the Jamo subs expect a higher current input. Which is exactly what boomzilla is pointing to by saying use a gain booster.
I guess the UMC is currently doing this job (a very very expensive booster)


Which is why I am asking if any of you are using the XLR connectors from the XSP and in that case, which subwoofer you are using?

My reasoning is, I will duplicate this and the problem should be solved.