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Post by AudioHTIT on Aug 13, 2012 1:16:17 GMT -5
When I got my current Maggie's I listened to them for several months before deciding what component I wanted to change next. When you hear them in your room on familiar ground you'll probably be finding some new favorite albums.
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Post by paintedklown on Aug 13, 2012 5:32:47 GMT -5
Oh believe me, everything in place, it is a perception warping, addictive experience. I dont get my permanent Ncores till Nov. I am crying that I have to go back to my old amp till then. And my old amp rules! my heavily modified, battery powered Virtue is NO SLOUCH. I'm listening to the Ncores right now in my system and it is like listening to an audio hologram of the bands. The Virtue had nice 3D properties, but this is like a high definition hologram. Absolutely effortless and stunning. Most impressive, being with a raw ERC-2 using the ERC-2 dac. It will be interesting to experiment by adding the XDA-2 and an Empirical Audio Synchromesh as are my plans. I was worried the Emotiva gear wouldn't mate well, but it sounds nice. Of course, the Ncores could have more performance extracted with more high end equipment, many of the guys running them have high five figure preamps and the like, but it is good to know the Emotiva source gear makes a good match for these amps on the "fantastic value" end of the spectrum of which I am still a part of. the ERC-2 does sound excellent with these and gives me confidence to move forward with an XDA-2 and XSP-1. I must admit that your enthusiasm seems VERY sincere, and that is hard to dismiss (especially when coupled with the huge buzz surrounding these amps). I re-read my initial post, and perhaps I came off a bit too much like a "doubting Thomas" and that wasn't my intention. These do seem rather exciting, honestly they do. I have considered getting MMGs for a long while now, especially since the .7 series Maggies do not respond the same to the Magnestand modification, and I am always afraid of getting burned on used Maggies again. I could probably sell my B&Ws for the $600 needed to get the MMGs, and worry about the mod later...I just get worried that I will regret making that move as I haven't really had the opportunity to listen to any Magnepans long enough (in store demos only) to know that I could live with them (theoretically) forever. The price for the Ncore DIY kit seems VERY reasonable (I believe someone mentioned that it's about $1500 for the parts) if these amplifiers are everything they are reported to be. It is VERY tempting to want to try them out, but the only way I would be able to afford to do so is by selling my much loved XPA-1 monos. That is another risk I don't want to worry about regretting.  All hype aside, I am asking as a fellow Emotiva lounge member, do you honestly feel that these Ncore amplifiers can outperform the XPA-1 monoblocks in a way that I would have zero regrets?  To be honest, the SQ isn't so much a concern, it's the dynamics and headroom that I feel I would miss without my XPA-1s. I hope that makes sense. I hate to be asking all of these questions...and I am just kind of thinking out loud a bit here too...but I always dream of putting together a REALLY killer 2 channel system for music, and getting MMGs, and these Ncore amplifiers CAN be a very real (ie doable with my budget and some gear selling/swapping) upgrade path for me if it's worth it. It's just that those are two very bold, and dramatic changes to make in a system...IMO anyway. I feel like a kid that's standing outside the cookie store, wanting a bite of an Oreo to see how it compares to my Chips A'hoy, before I switch brands.  ;D |
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klinemj
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Post by klinemj on Aug 13, 2012 6:47:06 GMT -5
Good analogy! I don't know if they would outperform XPA-1's...it would be great if we had a user w/a direct comparison.
For me - I'll be able to compare to XPA-2. If they don't outperform the XPA-2...we have our answer vs. the XPA-1's!
Mark
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Post by GreenKiwi on Aug 13, 2012 12:29:12 GMT -5
rclark any chance you'll have them long enough to find someone with some XPA-1 who lives near you to compare?
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Post by rclark on Aug 13, 2012 14:48:42 GMT -5
Again, it's merely my conjecture, all the amps compared so far are in a class above the xpa-1. I have not heard the xpa-1, but have no doubts these Ncores would kill them. I'd put money on it.
I just shipped them off to the next member, sadly, very sadly, but look forward to having mine in Nov.
At that point it should be easy enough to find xpa-1 owners in the area. I believe Chuckinut is local. But again, no doubt these would slaughter xpa-1's, compare the measurements alone.
Also, don't forget that total wattage isn't the only indicator. If watts ruled all, people would have stopped spending thousands on 12 watt SET amps a loooong time ago. Again, these are bridgeable for 1200 watts at 4ohms. Last time I checked, that's a lot of power.
The Ncores are rarefied air, the company of amp they match and beat. I've never seen someone immediately sell their $12,000 Clayton monoblocks for XPA-1's. Just sayin.
keep you posted when the time comes, which will he soon enough. Any of you who go ahead and buy the Ncores, have fun! And remember you could easily sell them on Audiogon, you'd have offers so fast your head would spin. These are the real deal.
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Post by monkumonku on Aug 13, 2012 15:18:03 GMT -5
Again, it's merely my conjecture, all the amps compared so far are in a class above the xpa-1. I have not heard the xpa-1, but have no doubts these Ncores would kill them. I'd put money on it. I just shipped them off to the next member, sadly, very sadly, but look forward to having mine in Nov. At that point it should be easy enough to find xpa-1 owners in the area. I believe Chuckinut is local. But again, no doubt these would slaughter xpa-1's, compare the measurements alone. Also, don't forget that total wattage isn't the only indicator. If watts ruled all, people would have stopped spending thousands on 12 watt SET amps a loooong time ago. Again, these are bridgeable for 1200 watts at 4ohms. Last time I checked, that's a lot of power. The Ncores are rarefied air, the company of amp they match and beat. I've never seen someone immediately sell their $12,000 Clayton monoblocks for XPA-1's. Just sayin. keep you posted when the time comes, which will he soon enough. Any of you who go ahead and buy the Ncores, have fun! And remember you could easily sell them on Audiogon, you'd have offers so fast your head would spin. These are the real deal. Well based on what you wrote above, I seriously doubt that you could provide an unbiased opinion or comparison of the Ncore amps versus the XPA-1's or anything else that wasn't Screaming Eagle expensive.  |
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Post by rclark on Aug 13, 2012 15:36:33 GMT -5
I realize feathers will be ruffled. Believe whatever makes you feel better •shrug•.
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Post by garbulky on Aug 13, 2012 15:49:08 GMT -5
Well the xpa-1's has 87 or 89 db SNR @ 1 watt and I think the ncores have a better SNR if that's anything to go by...
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klinemj
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Post by klinemj on Aug 13, 2012 16:00:28 GMT -5
I placed my order today...will be building 2 monoblocks, each with their own NC400 and related power supply.
I'll order the related parts once I get a better idea of the arrival of the NC400's. They are sold out until September 2nd right now, so I asked Niels to give me an ETA. After shipping + other parts I need, the total will end up at just under $1500.
Mark
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Post by savjac on Aug 13, 2012 16:01:08 GMT -5
Congrats on the Maggies, I owned them for many years. You will love them for music at the very least and will most probably not be able to pull yourself away when watching movies, so transforming are they. With the right power and you seem to have that, they can provide attack on the leading edge of sound better than most any moving coil speaker.
As far as the new Ncores, dunno, never heard them, but then again I am old and not trusting of newer technology. I am not sure you can get all them watts through those little wires without melting something. Maybe someday I will hear them, but for now, I love my XPA.
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Post by rclark on Aug 13, 2012 16:07:54 GMT -5
The good thing Jack is you dont have to take my word for it. Plenty of other people with much better credentials than me have reviewed. but yes that amps are that efficient. I ran them at full power several times and no problems. The Maggie's just drank it up, of course.
Congrats Mark! I have no doubt that with your 1.7's powered by Ncores you are stepping into a new realm.
Btw, fot xpa-1 owners, apparently there is a thread on diyaudio where the geeks there have been able to apply mods and take the performance up quite a bit. Food for thought, something to consider as well.
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klinemj
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Post by klinemj on Aug 13, 2012 16:42:43 GMT -5
I am genuinely excited to hear them...thanks for all your info on them. It made making my decision easy. Well, that - and I ran into a lot of spare cash lately. Lucky me!
Mark
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Post by rclark on Aug 13, 2012 17:12:17 GMT -5
Hahahahaha, that always helps |
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Post by AudioHTIT on Aug 13, 2012 17:15:02 GMT -5
I am genuinely excited to hear them...thanks for all your info on them. It made making my decision easy. Well, that - and I ran into a lot of spare cash lately. Lucky me! Mark I'm just surprised you are buying new amps for speakers you haven't even heard in your house yet? |
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Post by rclark on Aug 13, 2012 17:21:15 GMT -5
When the foundation is strong, you can build your system around that. You are never done tweaking.
I would consider the Ncores as something to build a system around. It's pretty neat that he offered them as diy, certainly didn't have to. The retail units will be hugely expensive, but in that world of multi multi thousand dollar amps, the big companies that have stratospherically priced amps are sweating now. That's the industry buzz.
You have heavy hitters like Theta for the first time ever making a class D amp, using Ncores. They will be expensive but still be considered a bargain in that range.
Anyway, maggies with their dipole radiation are much less room interactive. And several people have verified these amps are wonderful with Maggies, including me.
BTW, I think Emotiva would make an excellent licensee of the NC1200. If they could somehow make an amp that was less expensive than the coming Mola Mola, Theta, PS Audio, Accoustic Imagery models (the Atsahs' are beautiful, btw), then they would have a big hit on their hands.
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Post by AudioHTIT on Aug 13, 2012 17:28:27 GMT -5
I've owned 3 different pairs of Maggies over many years (current pair about 6), I'd still always start with speakers and match amps to them - but I'm glad you like your amps so much.
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Post by rclark on Aug 13, 2012 17:34:00 GMT -5
They are startlingly good with maggies, and so far, with anything else thrown at them. Vandersteens, Gedlee wave guides, electrostats, line arrays, the list is huge. Some people have had to make some minor adjustments, but it appears to have paid dividends.
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klinemj
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Post by klinemj on Aug 13, 2012 18:16:41 GMT -5
Understandable to question. I know the Maggies will not suffer with my XPA-2 because I took the XPA-2 + my USP-1 + my ERC-2 into the dealer to make my "buy" decision on the Maggies. So, I know I will have a step up with the Maggies vs. my existing source/pre-amp/amp.
Buying the nCores based solely on reviews and giving them a try is just a continuation of my grand experiment. And as I noted, if they don't beat the XPA-2...I can sell them or use them elsewhere in my home.
So, I'm not really out much, if anything, no matter what.
Mark
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Post by rclark on Aug 13, 2012 18:30:08 GMT -5
now remember, the build has some complications to it, make sure to read the threads there at audiocircle, and to post your vs xpa-2 review after you've had some time to adjust and compare. There are specific things you must get right, the twists in the wires, the orientation of the parts, it's not simply snap together and roll. Join the community over there and you'll get all the help you need.  |
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Post by klinemj on Aug 13, 2012 18:52:11 GMT -5
Just signed up! You'll see me over there as mkcarnut. I should have registered here as that, but I didn't and once I got far enough in - didn't want to change PW's. I did note some of the intricacies, but it's great to have the DIY user group over there to run questions past. As soon as I get my plan together, I'll post it w/questions to make sure I am thinking right. I was thinking of buying one of those "RE2207-JRNC James Romeyn nCore chassis" as a starting point as it has the holes pre-drilled and would have the boards in the right spot to start with. Then, it's a matter of twisting wires, making connections, and adding a power switch if I want (and a (power on" light).
And yes - count on a review here!
Mark
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;D
