DC-1

[Deleted]

Day 3 comments on the DC-1... see Day 2. Love this thing!

On a side note, I am sort of lamenting the fact that I did not buy a DSD DAC as I do have a fair amount of DSD content, but even via PCM it is pretty revelatory. I have listened to more music in the last three days than I have in the last couple of weeks combined. I love visiting old albums for the first time.

Next plan is to move it into my home theater room and try it out on all of my big boy equipment. That will be a true test for me.

[hemster]

Sept 7, 2013 17:45:52 GMT -5 bootman said:

So who is the DC-1's main competition here?
The Cambridge Audio DacMagic Plus?

I've listened to the DacMagic Plus and it is a very decent unit. However on balance I found that the noise floor on the DC-1 is almost non-existent. It's really that good.

Of course I haven't done a double-blind Coke/Pepsi test but I know what my ears heard. 

[paintedklown]

Sept 7, 2013 17:45:52 GMT -5 bootman said:

So who is the DC-1's main competition here?
The Cambridge Audio DacMagic Plus?

Yes, I would say that + Schiit Gungir, Asus Xonar Essence One, Benchmark DAC1 (refurb is $700 on their web site), Musical Fidelity M1-A, Music Hall 25.3, NAD D-1050, etc.

I am sure there are many others if you look around. Once you get to the $700 +/- price range, there is a LOT of stuff out there to compete with. Some well known/reviewed stuff at that.

Not knocking the DC-1...just saying, since it was asked.

[bootman]

No knocking at all.
Someone needs to do a shootout.

[GreenKiwi]

I've got one in sf, if someone has others they want to compare it with.

[Deleted]

I have owned or own a Rega DAC, NAD M51, Peachtree Decco65, Musical Fidelity V-DAC II, Asus Xonar Essence One, AudioQuest DragonFly, HRT MicroStreamer, Emotiva XDA-1, and Oppo BDP-105 (USB mode). Of all these DACs, the DC-1 is my favorite. It provides a consistently enjoyable experience no matter what kind of music I am playing. The DC-1 sounds like a cross between the Rega and NAD for me which is an outstandingly positive statement as both are significantly more money. The DC-1 provides the smooth, analog like sound of the Rega with the detailed, refined sound of the NAD. The DC-1 is a killer value. I had been on the fence for a while about whether to buy one, but now I kick myself for not buying it sooner.

[novisnick]

Y'all are nudging, no pushing me into a purchase of the DC-1, It would have only took a sneeze to get me there!

[paintedklown]

Sept 8, 2013 8:57:46 GMT -5 bootman said:

No knocking at all.
Someone needs to do a shootout.

A BIG +1

I would love to see someone like Tyll Hertsens (from Inner Fidelity) or NwAvGuy (he does measurements with his reviews) gather up around 10 or so fully balanced DACS at sub $1K price points, and give us a "shootout to end all doubt" (I just came up with the title of the article there).

IMO, both of these guys arguably know DACS just about as well as anyone else in the business, and their lives are essentially dedicated to this type of stuff. It would be a great/educational read and I am sure would also probably generate quite a bit of revenue for all involved through, ads/banners/click through purchasing links/exposure/etc.

[brubacca]

Sept 8, 2013 12:48:29 GMT -5 @balthazar2k4 said:

I have owned or own a Rega DAC, NAD M51, Peachtree Decco65, Musical Fidelity V-DAC II, Asus Xonar Essence One, AudioQuest DragonFly, HRT MicroStreamer, Emotiva XDA-1, and Oppo BDP-105 (USB mode). Of all these DACs, the DC-1 is my favorite. It provides a consistently enjoyable experience no matter what kind of music I am playing. The DC-1 sounds like a cross between the Rega and NAD for me which is an outstandingly positive statement as both are significantly more money. The DC-1 provides the smooth, analog like sound of the Rega with the detailed, refined sound of the NAD. The DC-1 is a killer value. I had been on the fence for a while about whether to buy one, but now I kick myself for not buying it sooner.

Killing me with this comparison. Must resist until I have the money.

[GreenKiwi]

novisnick - It would sound amazing with those XPA-1Ls... those things are just begging for a DC-1 to be connected to them =P

brubacca - What more do we need to tell you =D (Though I will say, the XDA-1 is a great great DAC. I have had very complaints with it, and I'm guessing that popping it through a tube processor would have probably alleviated those.... or getting a preamp for analog volume control. I ended up using the computer for volume control at 24bit depth, so it was still quite good. I still have two, I really need to sell one, but it seems very hard to part with. Its value on the used market seems way lower than how I value its sound.)

[theoctavist]

Sept 6, 2013 1:08:16 GMT -5 GreenKiwi said:

Some devices have sockets with op amps in them. The op amps are often pin compatible with other op amps and people will swap them out, like tube rolling.

yes, and the DC-1 has them.  i thought the emo tech guys would at least give some specs on the op amps...but no worries, ill research the part numbers myself and experiment. 

[theoctavist]

Sept 5, 2013 11:44:09 GMT -5 Dan Laufman said:

There are no swappable op amps on the DC-1...

, sir.  unless i am blind, i am seeing LM 4562s of the socketed variety, which indeed *are* swappable(and some would say improved on) with burson op amps, sun audio op amps, etc. 

www.audio-gd.com/Pro/diy/OPA/OPAEN.htm

[Deleted]

Sort of off-topic, but I mentioned earlier that I was lamenting the fact that I originally was looking for a DAC with DSD capability. Ask and ye shall receive. Schiit Audio just announced a DSD 'add-on' DAC. It does DSD only and can be used with your existing PCM DAC. Now I know what my next purchase will be.

For those interested, here is the announcement: www.digitalaudioreview.net/2013/09/schiit-loki-adds-dsd-to-your-existing-dac-for-us149/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=schiit-loki-adds-dsd-to-your-existing-dac-for-us149

Edit: So I bought one as soon as it showed up on Schiit's webpage. Give me a reason now to use the analog pass-through on the DC-1 now.

[Nick]

Posted by theoctavist5 hours ago

Sep 5, 2013 at 11:44am Dan Laufman said:
There are no swappable op amps on the DC-1...
, sir. unless i am blind, i am seeing LM 4562s of the socketed variety, which indeed *are* swappable(and some would say improved on) with burson op amps, sun audio op amps, etc.

www.audio-gd.com/Pro/diy/OPA/OPAEN.htm

I suppose any component is swappable if you want to get down to it but the LM4562 op-amps in the DC-1 are not socketed, they are soldered directly to the PCB. This is why Dan said there are no swappable op-amps in the DC-1. Hopefully this clears things up for you.

[monkumonku]

Sept 9, 2013 3:45:23 GMT -5 theoctavist said:

Sept 5, 2013 11:44:09 GMT -5 Dan Laufman said:

There are no swappable op amps on the DC-1...

, sir.  unless i am blind, i am seeing LM 4562s of the socketed variety, which indeed *are* swappable(and some would say improved on) with burson op amps, sun audio op amps, etc. 

www.audio-gd.com/Pro/diy/OPA/OPAEN.htm

Maybe what Dan meant was that the DC-1 was built with no intention of people swapping out op-amps in the manner in which some people do tube rolling. I am sure that changing the op amps or any other part inside of the box will result in a voiding of the warranty and considering this is a $699 component, that's a risk a lot of people would not want to take.

Technically, unless it is a proprietary part, everything inside of an audio component is swappable. The question is, why would you want to do it. If it is to second-guess the engineers who designed the product then neither they or anyone else can prevent you from replacing what they chose with something you chose yourself but then if you screw up don't go expecting them to honor any warranty.

[bootman]

Sept 9, 2013 3:45:23 GMT -5 theoctavist said:

Sept 5, 2013 11:44:09 GMT -5 Dan Laufman said:

There are no swappable op amps on the DC-1...

, sir.  unless i am blind, i am seeing LM 4562s of the socketed variety, which indeed *are* swappable(and some would say improved on) with burson op amps, sun audio op amps, etc. 

www.audio-gd.com/Pro/diy/OPA/OPAEN.htm

What is your point?

It is apparent that Emotiva does NOT want customers to swap out op-amps.

However you are free to buy one yourself and do with it what you want.
(less warranty if you do swap out stuff.)

Are you going to post pics and thoughts after you do?

[garbulky]

The point is to swap out the op-amp! It's a big hobby with people that like that stuff. It's not fringe but actively pursued in many forums. It's not second guessing the engineer, engineers work within constraints and some - not all - even pursue a certain sound. According to people that like to do it, it can change the sound signature for instance dark to bright, more bass, less bass. Aka to tube rolling.

[monkumonku]

Sept 9, 2013 11:10:11 GMT -5 garbulky said:

The point is to swap out the op-amp! It's a big hobby with people that like that stuff. It's not fringe but actively pursued in many forums. It's not second guessing the engineer, engineers work within constraints and some - not all - even pursue a certain sound. According to people that like to do it, it can change the sound signature for instance dark to bright, more bass, less bass. Aka to tube rolling.

We know the point is to swap out opamps but unlike tube rolling, messing with opamps is probably going to void the warranty. I know if I were the manufacturer I'd not honor any warranty if someone changed the opamps and then reported problems. Tubes are different. People are free to do whatever they want to a component since they own it, including changing the caps, resistors, wiring, etc., but my point is that is not condoned by the manufacturer and will void the warranty. I'd say the majority of equipment owners don't want to mess with that.

[Jim]

Sept 9, 2013 11:10:11 GMT -5 garbulky said:

The point is to swap out the op-amp! It's a big hobby with people that like that stuff. It's not fringe but actively pursued in many forums. It's not second guessing the engineer, engineers work within constraints and some - not all - even pursue a certain sound. According to people that like to do it, it can change the sound signature for instance dark to bright, more bass, less bass. Aka to tube rolling.

I understand people who play with tubes, but when you're replacing an op-amp with another op-amp, I don't understand how the signature would really be different.

To me, it seems much like replacing a processor, with a processor, or a resistor with a resistor.

I'm not saying that people don't get different results, it just seems like any changes would be REALLY subtle?

[jlafrenz]

Sept 7, 2013 23:19:49 GMT -5 hemster said:

Sept 7, 2013 17:45:52 GMT -5 bootman said:

So who is the DC-1's main competition here?
The Cambridge Audio DacMagic Plus?

I've listened to the DacMagic Plus and it is a very decent unit. However on balance I found that the noise floor on the DC-1 is almost non-existent. It's really that good.

Of course I haven't done a double-blind Coke/Pepsi test but I know what my ears heard. 

I noticed the same thing when comparing the DC-1 to the Dac Magic specifically. I haven't compared it to all my other DAC's yet... More on this in the near future