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Post by novisnick on Apr 9, 2015 23:38:36 GMT -5
klinemj: If you have not tried it, instead of using the XMC-1 internal DAC, I suggest connecting the external DC-1 DAC to XMC-1 Balanced XLR In, and then put the XMC-1 in (analog) balanced mode, and then select the setting of reference in the surround sound settings... (see what you think) Analog Performance: Digital Input to Balanced Analog Output (HDMI PCM); S/N ratio (all main channels): > 110 dB (A weighted) Balanced Input to Balanced Output (Reference Stereo Mode)S/N ratio: > 123 dB (A weighted) This sounds like some fun!! |
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klinemj
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Post by klinemj on Apr 10, 2015 4:57:25 GMT -5
klinemj: If you have not tried it, instead of using the XMC-1 internal DAC, I suggest connecting the external DC-1 DAC to XMC-1 Balanced XLR In, and then put the XMC-1 in (analog) balanced mode, and then select the setting of reference in the surround sound settings... (see what you think) Analog Performance: Digital Input to Balanced Analog Output (HDMI PCM); S/N ratio (all main channels): > 110 dB (A weighted) Balanced Input to Balanced Output (Reference Stereo Mode)S/N ratio: > 123 dB (A weighted) I do plan to try that, but to get a sub playing the XMC will have to convert to digital and back, if I understand its options for playback. So, I have thought it seems wrong to use a DAC to get to analog only to have it go back to digital and an a long again. Mark |
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Post by Boomzilla on Apr 10, 2015 5:17:47 GMT -5
...but to get a sub playing the XMC will have to convert to digital and back, if I understand its options for playback. So, I have thought it seems wrong to use a DAC to get to analog only to have it go back to digital and an a long again... Exactly correct. And thanks for a very good review, Mark - I enjoyed it. Cordially - Boom |
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Post by Boomzilla on Apr 10, 2015 5:24:54 GMT -5
Hi klinemj - May I ask one question - The trade-in value of my XSP-1, gen. 2 is $500. In your opinion, is the XSP-1 a significant enough improvement to justify the $1,500 difference between the two products? And to clarify the background info, my listening is 75% two-channel audio and 25% (max) movies. For stereo, I also run 2.1 channels, and for movies, 5.1. Thanks in advance for your opinion. Boomzilla |
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Post by geebo on Apr 10, 2015 7:04:16 GMT -5
klinemj: If you have not tried it, instead of using the XMC-1 internal DAC, I suggest connecting the external DC-1 DAC to XMC-1 Balanced XLR In, and then put the XMC-1 in (analog) balanced mode, and then select the setting of reference in the surround sound settings... (see what you think) Analog Performance: Digital Input to Balanced Analog Output (HDMI PCM); S/N ratio (all main channels): > 110 dB (A weighted) Balanced Input to Balanced Output (Reference Stereo Mode)S/N ratio: > 123 dB (A weighted) I do plan to try that, but to get a sub playing the XMC will have to convert to digital and back, if I understand its options for playback. So, I have thought it seems wrong to use a DAC to get to analog only to have it go back to digital and an a long again. Mark That's correct Mark. But Direct mode will get you redirected bass with minimal processing. No PEQ or Dirac. |
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Post by vneal on Apr 10, 2015 7:09:35 GMT -5
Nice review
I am one of those fence setters that may have to jump in
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Post by klinemj on Apr 10, 2015 7:20:40 GMT -5
geebo yes...and if I run my DC-1 analog in the the XMC, I would clearly try direct mode vs. Reference stereo to see how they compare. Reference would be the dc-1 in all its glory but without sub, whereas direct would have the sub but for from analog in back to digital and back to analog. Worth comparing...will work that in after I get DIRAC going. I just ordered full Dirac yesterday but have to wait for the key (and am heading to E-town, KY with my daughter tonight for a weekend of soccer!) Mark
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Post by geebo on Apr 10, 2015 7:23:55 GMT -5
geebo yes...and if I run my DC-1 analog in the the XMC, I would clearly try direct mode vs. Reference stereo to see how they compare. Reference would be the dc-1 in all its glory but without sub, whereas direct would have the sub but for from analog in back to digital and back to analog. Worth comparing...will work that in after I get DIRAC going. I just ordered full Dirac yesterday but have to wait for the key (and am heading to E-town, KY with my daughter tonight for a weekend of soccer!) Mark I'll be looking forward to the DC-1 comparison. Have a safe and enjoyable trip. |
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Post by klinemj on Apr 10, 2015 7:32:57 GMT -5
In your opinion, is the XSP-1 a significant enough improvement to justify the $1,500 difference between the two products? I also am a "more 2-channel music than multichannel" guy when it comes to critical listening. (I use the multichannel more hours as the system is our main house TV, but I am not really listening critically on TV...) It's hard for me to say universally that it's enough to justify the cost...the value equation is a very personal one, so I hesitate to say the value is there for me and project that to others. What I can without a doubt say - for me, the value is there for what I did. And, what I did was pay $1999 less 40% (so, $1219 shipped). And, if I sell the XSP-1, the DC-1, and the UMC-1 for what they are running these days, I come out paying very little. So, my incremental is shaping up to be quite small and the XMC-1 is an incredible value. And, even if I just sell the XSP-1 - the sound increase + system simplification are worth the ~$700 delta I paid vs. could sell the XSP-1 for. For someone who has to pay the full price of $1999 or the upcoming new price of $2499...hard to say. That said, what I would tell someone who was just getting into a system and wanted great 2 channel and great multichannel in a single system and was hemming and hawing about the price of the XMC-1, I would tell them to pick the pre/pro they would otherwise buy, add in the cost of a 2 channel preamp with HT Bypass, and add in the cost of a great CD player or DAC...compare that to the XMC-1 price. I think most would find that to get anywhere near the same quality, they would be paying as much or more than the XMC-1. And, with the XMC-1, the simplicity of having all in 1 box with fewer cables is a bonus. And, the bass improvement for me is huge...I think someone would have a hard time integrating bass this well with any pre/pro combined with a 2 channel preamp. So, that's my 2 cents...thanks for asking! Mark |
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Post by bootman on Apr 10, 2015 7:43:45 GMT -5
Your PC HDMI issue is because the XMC has no video processing and the UMC did. The VP acts as the middleman during HDMI switching so your display really only "sees" the output of the VP while it takes care of the switching. (assuming you have it set for a specific output and not pass through) Now every HDMI switch requires a reinitialization between source and display. So guess what happens now if your source is asleep at the wheel?  To help minimize HDMI switching problem setup your video sources outputs to match those of the display so that minimal setup is needed between switching. For PC sources not letting it go to sleep may help but if your PC shuts off the video out when it no longer senses a display (unlike a VP that is always "there") you may be out of luck. |
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Post by klinemj on Apr 10, 2015 8:57:11 GMT -5
Interesting bootman...FYI, this happens even if I have the PC display working and toggle over to another source (like my STB or my Oppo) and toggle right back in seconds. So, my PC is not going to sleep that quickly - but maybe it is shutting off the video. Are there any settings on the PC to avoid having it shut off the video when it no longer senses a display? I didn't see anything obvious on the panel controlling my video, but I may not know what to look for.
Thanks!
Mark
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Post by routlaw on Apr 10, 2015 9:50:57 GMT -5
Can someone explain what is meant by programmable inputs? This is something new to me… or I think it is.
Thanks
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Post by dkami712 on Apr 10, 2015 10:09:26 GMT -5
Can someone explain what is meant by programmable inputs? This is something new to me… or I think it is. Thanks stated in this thread "I like the term 'virtual input' (VI) for this feature. With the UMC-1 you have 16 virtual inputs, for each VI you choose which physical input will be used for video (eg. HDMI 3), and which input you want for audio (say Optical 1). Now most of the time you'd probably want the same HDMI input for both audio and video, so you might have VI's 1 through 4 setup just that way. But ... when you have a mix of sports fans and music lovers in the house, you might want VI 5 set to HDMI 1 for video (your cable box), and audio set to Optical 2 (your music server). Due to HDMI restrictions you can never mix two different HDMI inputs so this doesn't apply there. The key however is that you can use the same physical input on multiple virtual inputs. Hope that made sense. " |
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Post by dkami712 on Apr 10, 2015 10:19:59 GMT -5
Interesting bootman...FYI, this happens even if I have the PC display working and toggle over to another source (like my STB or my Oppo) and toggle right back in seconds. So, my PC is not going to sleep that quickly - but maybe it is shutting off the video. Are there any settings on the PC to avoid having it shut off the video when it no longer senses a display? I didn't see anything obvious on the panel controlling my video, but I may not know what to look for. Thanks! Mark I believe the only way to prevent the video from shutting off is to use VGA as the analog signal is continuous. However, that is not an option with the XMC so I think you're SOL. A VGA to HDMI converter wouldn't work either. In the digital world as soon as one side of the "handshake" is removed the signal is terminated with it. |
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Post by klinemj on Apr 10, 2015 12:02:45 GMT -5
routlawHere's a link to the thread that polled about the fully programmable/virtual inputs. The first post (by me) includes a link to the feature request made for the XMC (which describes why I want it back), and the rest includes debates by folks on why they do/do not need it. I loved it on my UMC-1, and it will be the one thing I miss. They walked away from this feature with the UMC-200, and many of use want it back. emotivalounge.proboards.com/thread/38663/poll-configurable-inputs-based-processors?page=1Mark
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Post by klinemj on Apr 10, 2015 12:03:46 GMT -5
dkami712 Thanks for the info! It would be nice if there were a setting I could use, but at least I have a workaround with my PC keyboard toggle. Mark
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Post by novisnick on Apr 10, 2015 12:12:17 GMT -5
routlawHere's a link to the thread that polled about the fully programmable/virtual inputs. The first post (by me) includes a link to the feature request made for the XMC (which describes why I want it back), and the rest includes debates by folks on why they do/do not need it. I loved it on my UMC-1, and it will be the one thing I miss. They walked away from this feature with the UMC-200, and many of use want it back. emotivalounge.proboards.com/thread/38663/poll-configurable-inputs-based-processors?page=1Mark Mark, the only problem I've found with your survey is that I can only vote ONCE!!!!!!!!!!!  |
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Post by dkami712 on Apr 10, 2015 12:16:11 GMT -5
dkami712 Thanks for the info! It would be nice if there were a setting I could use, but at least I have a workaround with my PC keyboard toggle. Mark I'm an IT guy by trade so you've got me thinking  Does your graphics card/drivers have configurable hotkeys? If so, there should be an option to enable/disable your monitor which would do the same as your keyboard sleep function without actually putting the PC to sleep. Let me know! |
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Post by bootman on Apr 10, 2015 12:49:19 GMT -5
Interesting bootman...FYI, this happens even if I have the PC display working and toggle over to another source (like my STB or my Oppo) and toggle right back in seconds. So, my PC is not going to sleep that quickly - but maybe it is shutting off the video. Are there any settings on the PC to avoid having it shut off the video when it no longer senses a display? I didn't see anything obvious on the panel controlling my video, but I may not know what to look for. Thanks! Mark What is your video card in the HTPC? Maybe I can research a solution. |
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Post by klinemj on Apr 10, 2015 13:43:06 GMT -5
You guys are awesome...any help you can offer would be great. My PC is very basic...just a Dell 660 with the graphic card integrated into the motherboard. Looking at its control panel, it is showing "Processor Graphics Information" as "Intel(R) HD Graphics 2000" In the advanced part of the control panel, there is a "hot key manager" section, and it has 6 hotkeys set up: "Enable Digital Display" is CTRL-ALT-F4, and then 4 others are to rotate the display and the last is to open the Graphics and Media control panel. I tried the CTRL-ALT-F4 when I was on black screen from toggling away from and back to the PC on the XMC-1...and that didn't do anything. I also tried the function button + each of the function keys at the top of my keyboard. None of these did anything, either. There's a button labelled "PC" and has the symbol for the power button on it on by keyboard (Logitech K400r), and that's the one I press once and my PC goes on standby and press again and it comes back to life. That's the one that takes me from black screen back to seeing the PC's graphics in my workaround. I can't seem to find a way to program any other hot keys other than the ones shown.
Mark
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Does your graphics card/drivers have configurable hotkeys? If so, there should be an option to enable/disable your monitor which would do the same as your keyboard sleep function without actually putting the PC to sleep. Let me know!