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Post by Bonzo on May 10, 2017 9:57:52 GMT -5
So the 205 is a downgrade in this regard. That's unfortunate.  I have a bunch of HDCD discs. The Grateful Dead are/were big proponents of HDCD. It may not have HDCD, but it's definitely not a downgrade! Sure it would have been nice to have it, but it may be due to the chipset used? Speculation. It is most certainly a "downgrade in this regard" as I said. Sure it has lots of upgrades, but leaving off HDCD when the previous model had it is a downgrade. What if they had decided to leave off DVD-Audio playback, or SACD playback? Those would absolutely be considered downgrades. And I'd venture that there are many more HDCD encoded CD's out there in the world than either of the other two. Whether their sound quality advantages matters or not is up to the beholder. But I for one find it a disappointment that they dropped it. Hopefully enough people complain and maybe they'll add it back via a firmware update. Many people are upset about the apps thing. Doesn't bother me in the slightest. I've always thought a Blu-ray player was not the best place to have that capability, but that's just me. A relatively inexpensive Roku stick makes much more sense to me. But, in the eyes of the people who liked those things on the previous models, not having them is certainly a downgrade. I think the 205 is already turning out to be a slight disappointment, and I don't even have one yet. It's certainly not as perfect as the 95 was for it's time. |
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cawgijoe
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Post by cawgijoe on May 10, 2017 10:22:37 GMT -5
It may not have HDCD, but it's definitely not a downgrade! Sure it would have been nice to have it, but it may be due to the chipset used? Speculation. It is most certainly a "downgrade in this regard" as I said. Sure it has lots of upgrades, but leaving off HDCD when the previous model had it is a downgrade. What if they had decided to leave off DVD-Audio playback, or SACD playback? Those would absolutely be considered downgrades. And I'd venture that there are many more HDCD encoded CD's out there in the world than either of the other two. Whether their sound quality advantages matters or not is up to the beholder. But I for one find it a disappointment that they dropped it. Hopefully enough people complain and maybe they'll add it back via a firmware update. Many people are upset about the apps thing. Doesn't bother me in the slightest. I've always thought a Blu-ray player was not the best place to have that capability, but that's just me. A relatively inexpensive Roku stick makes much more sense to me. But, in the eyes of the people who liked those things on the previous models, not having them is certainly a downgrade. I think the 205 is already turning out to be a slight disappointment, and I don't even have one yet. It's certainly not as perfect as the 95 was for it's time. To each his own. Not having HDCD or Apps would not prevent me from buying one. Can HDCD be added via firmware update? I don't know the answer to that. Might want to reach out to Oppo. |
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Post by Boomzilla on May 10, 2017 10:58:46 GMT -5
Well, per the owners' manual, the UDP-205 DOES support DLNA, so I can continue to stream audio from my server to the Oppo. I've yet to hear how it sounds...
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Post by Bonzo on May 10, 2017 11:04:57 GMT -5
Very true. I can tell you there are plenty of people here not happy about the app thing. I'm sure HDCD is less. I'm like you with the app thing, especially if losing those makes everything work so much faster, as has been reported. But losing HDCD makes my shoulders dip slightly with disappointment. Makes me wonder if I should just find a used 95 player and be done with it until I have the need for 4K. Sound wise there was no change between a 95 and a 105. I just may do that. I would think the answer is yes, but maybe not. Not using proper computer lingo I know, but I believe HDCD is more a "program" sort of thing, not a hardware thing. I think it's similar to being able to decode a file format. But if the difference is like going from PC to Apple, that could be a problem. |
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Post by novisnick on May 10, 2017 11:16:08 GMT -5
Without any more additional information it seams that ill pass on the newer Oppo. Ill combine the use of my 103 and Samsung 4K player. Own them both now and see no improvement buying a single box that won't satisfy my needs.
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Post by Boomzilla on May 10, 2017 11:52:38 GMT -5
I'll give you my (useless) opinion when mine arrives.
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Post by Bonzo on May 10, 2017 12:48:10 GMT -5
I'll give you my (useless) opinion when mine arrives. You have any HDCD discs you haven't sold already? I'd like to see if it's in there and they just forgot to mention it.  |
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Post by Bonzo on May 10, 2017 12:58:18 GMT -5
I'll give you my (useless) opinion when mine arrives. Your 105 is silver is it not? Please PM first if you decide to get rid of it. Thanks. |
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LCSeminole
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Res firma mitescere nescit.
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Post by LCSeminole on May 10, 2017 14:02:14 GMT -5
I'll give you my (useless) opinion when mine arrives. You have any HDCD discs you haven't sold already? I'd like to see if it's in there and they just forgot to mention it. I just tried: The Cars - The Cars, The Dave Brubeck Quartet - Time Out & Dishwalla - Opaline(all HDCD encoded) and my UDP-203 sees them as regular CD's. My old BDP-83 & BDP-93 both played HDCD's, but you actually have to turn that feature on in the SetUp Menu. Personally I don't miss the HDCD encoding in the UDP-203 and I certainly am quite pleased they left the app's out on the UDP-20x models. The apps on the older Oppo models rarely got updates as opposed to FireTV's/AppleTV's/Roku's frequent updates, not to mention the robustness of these apps are far superior, IMO. |
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on May 10, 2017 16:00:26 GMT -5
HDCD is a software decode, so it should be possible to add it using firmware (note that Microsoft owns the technology now, so there might be license issues). It is most certainly a "downgrade in this regard" as I said. Sure it has lots of upgrades, but leaving off HDCD when the previous model had it is a downgrade. What if they had decided to leave off DVD-Audio playback, or SACD playback? Those would absolutely be considered downgrades. And I'd venture that there are many more HDCD encoded CD's out there in the world than either of the other two. Whether their sound quality advantages matters or not is up to the beholder. But I for one find it a disappointment that they dropped it. Hopefully enough people complain and maybe they'll add it back via a firmware update. Many people are upset about the apps thing. Doesn't bother me in the slightest. I've always thought a Blu-ray player was not the best place to have that capability, but that's just me. A relatively inexpensive Roku stick makes much more sense to me. But, in the eyes of the people who liked those things on the previous models, not having them is certainly a downgrade. I think the 205 is already turning out to be a slight disappointment, and I don't even have one yet. It's certainly not as perfect as the 95 was for it's time. To each his own. Not having HDCD or Apps would not prevent me from buying one. Can HDCD be added via firmware update? I don't know the answer to that. Might want to reach out to Oppo. |
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Post by Bonzo on May 10, 2017 17:00:50 GMT -5
HDCD is a software decode, so it should be possible to add it using firmware (note that Microsoft owns the technology now, so there might be license issues). To each his own. Not having HDCD or Apps would not prevent me from buying one. Can HDCD be added via firmware update? I don't know the answer to that. Might want to reach out to Oppo. That's what I was thinking. Thanks for confirming Keith. I'll bet that license thing is something Oppo didn't want to pay for thinking the cost outweighed the benefit. Of course I disagree. |
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Post by routlaw on May 10, 2017 17:04:31 GMT -5
HDCD is a software decode, so it should be possible to add it using firmware (note that Microsoft owns the technology now, so there might be license issues). Hmm, seems like I remember when HDCD first came out and its been sometime now, that it was a Pacific Microsonic's technology and thus a chip was installed on board the player. Back in those days Wadia among others took some criticism for not having implemented those chips since all of their hardware at that time was software driven rather than relying on off the shelf DAC chips, such as Burr Brown and others. However I also remember some reviewers claiming that if a CD was recorded with this technology and a CDP such as the Wadia's did not have the technology installed at least to some degree some of the purported benefits were realized. But I'm also relying on my memory from well over a decade ago by now, so don't go to the bank on that statement. I'm not sure I have more than half a dozen or so CD's that were even recorded in HDCD in the first place. Seems like HDCD was one of those technologies that never really took off and became mainstream. In other words having HDCD onboard might not be a deal breaker at least for me. |
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Post by routlaw on May 11, 2017 19:14:40 GMT -5
I became more curious about this issue with HDCD on the Oppo 205 and decided to investigate a bit more. For those interested perhaps the following will be helpful. First I contacted Oppo, and asked them directly why HDCD was not supported in their new players. The direct quote to the answer is below. "The decoder manufacturer no longer wanted to support HDCD decoding, so the player doesn't support it as well." Taking things a step further a brief search came up with the following on Wikipedia. Suffice it to say, we can't fault Oppo for leaving this decoder out the new player as it seems to be DOA whether warranted or not. Regarding my previous statement it would appear from the article below that an onboard chip does not exist for HDCD, instead the technology was software driven. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Definition_Compatible_DigitalHope this helps. |
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Post by Bonzo on May 12, 2017 8:58:25 GMT -5
I became more curious about this issue with HDCD on the Oppo 205 and decided to investigate a bit more. For those interested perhaps the following will be helpful. First I contacted Oppo, and asked them directly why HDCD was not supported in their new players. The direct quote to the answer is below. "The decoder manufacturer no longer wanted to support HDCD decoding, so the player doesn't support it as well." Taking things a step further a brief search came up with the following on Wikipedia. Suffice it to say, we can't fault Oppo for leaving this decoder out the new player as it seems to be DOA whether warranted or not. Regarding my previous statement it would appear from the article below that an onboard chip does not exist for HDCD, instead the technology was software driven. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Definition_Compatible_DigitalHope this helps. Thank you for doing all this legwork, I appreciate it. Definitely helps. Bummer that something like this has bit the dust. Just goes to show that as tech moves on, some good things are left behind. I always say every tech upgrade is like taking 3 steps forward and 2 steps back (or some variation of that, like 5 steps forward and 3 steps back etc). It's almost always the case in one form or another with tech. As we are discussing in the other thread, it's hard to know if it's the HDCD tech, the mastering, or the ADC equipment used that makes these CD's sound the way they do. I guess now we'll have to find out won't we, at least a little. We won't be able to A/B test it to each other, but we'll still be able to A/B them to regular CD's. When I make the move to the Oppo, I'll probably leave my old Denon hooked up for a bit to do some comparisons. Only then will I know if I'm really missing anything. Although with any luck, the Oppo will sound better than my 10 year old Denon anyway. |
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on May 12, 2017 14:50:45 GMT -5
Oddly enough, the last I heard, the HDCD format was owned by MicroSoft - and Windows Media Player supported it. (That was a few years ago, and I have no idea if Windows 10 Groove does or not.) Also remember that you can always RIP the Cds with something like dBPowerAmp, and have it decode the HDCD along the way. You'll end up with a 24/44k file that should be exactly what you'd be hearing if you'd played the HDCD on a player that supported it. I became more curious about this issue with HDCD on the Oppo 205 and decided to investigate a bit more. For those interested perhaps the following will be helpful. First I contacted Oppo, and asked them directly why HDCD was not supported in their new players. The direct quote to the answer is below. "The decoder manufacturer no longer wanted to support HDCD decoding, so the player doesn't support it as well." Taking things a step further a brief search came up with the following on Wikipedia. Suffice it to say, we can't fault Oppo for leaving this decoder out the new player as it seems to be DOA whether warranted or not. Regarding my previous statement it would appear from the article below that an onboard chip does not exist for HDCD, instead the technology was software driven. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Definition_Compatible_DigitalHope this helps. |
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Post by routlaw on May 12, 2017 16:10:10 GMT -5
Keith if you read the short article I linked from Wiki it will detail the history of HDCD, MS ownership of, and the eventual demise of the format. But the long and short of it is, HDCD is dead on the vine from many years ago and thus Oppo chose not to support it any longer too. But as you mention there are more ways to skin a cat in your description above. From my experience, limited as it may be I'm just not sure its worth loosing sleep over.
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Post by mick on May 14, 2017 10:50:29 GMT -5
Can someone confirm if I’m reading the statement correctly below, (oppo 205) that if I buy a 4k uhd dvd from the usa or from anywhere else it will play here in Australia even if I do not have a region free player? But a dvd or blu ray dvd will NOT work here unless I have a region free player? Region Free on DVD, Blu-ray & 4K Discs This version of the Oppo UDP-203 comes pre-installed with the hardware modification to make it Region Free on DVD & Blu-ray Discs. 4K Ultra-HD Discs are already Region Free. www.audiotrends.com.au/Oppo_UDP_205_Multi_Region.html?action=viewProduct&itemId=4356 |
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Post by melm on May 14, 2017 10:53:17 GMT -5
UHD discs have no region coding. You're good to go on 4K discs.
Mel
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Post by mick on May 14, 2017 11:03:02 GMT -5
UHD discs have no region coding. You're good to go on 4K discs. Mel Thanks melm, I didn't know that.
cheers
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Post by sahmen on Jun 6, 2017 9:34:29 GMT -5
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