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Post by novisnick on Apr 21, 2017 19:51:48 GMT -5
Go with 16GB of RAM, or at least don't fill up all of your RAM slots, so if you want to upgrade to 16 later you can easily do so. Amen to that! I would start too with 16GB right out of the bat, however, no matter what amount you want to start with, do NOT max out the physical slots. You would regret it in the future. Keep your options open. |
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bootman
Emo VIPs 
Typing useless posts on internet forums....
Posts: 9,358
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Post by bootman on Apr 21, 2017 20:25:29 GMT -5
I should one day post a video on how fast my rig boots up. No one will believe it if I just told you.  UEFI and an SSD are your friends. Raid 0- M.2 PCIe 3.0 SSDs are my bae. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- CrystalDiskMark 5.2.1 x64 (C) 2007-2017 hiyohiyo Crystal Dew World : crystalmark.info/----------------------------------------------------------------------- * MB/s = 1,000,000 bytes/s [SATA/600 = 600,000,000 bytes/s] * KB = 1000 bytes, KiB = 1024 bytes Sequential Read (Q= 32,T= 1) : 3228.984 MB/s Sequential Write (Q= 32,T= 1) : 3039.495 MB/s Random Read 4KiB (Q= 32,T= 1) : 693.807 MB/s [169386.5 IOPS] Random Write 4KiB (Q= 32,T= 1) : 477.275 MB/s [116522.2 IOPS] Sequential Read (T= 1) : 3190.444 MB/s Sequential Write (T= 1) : 2696.526 MB/s Random Read 4KiB (Q= 1,T= 1) : 49.695 MB/s [ 12132.6 IOPS] Random Write 4KiB (Q= 1,T= 1) : 142.824 MB/s [ 34869.1 IOPS] Test : 1024 MiB [C: 10.2% (96.8/953.3 GiB)] (x1) [Interval=5 sec] Date : 2017/04/21 21:30:10 OS : Windows 10 Professional [10.0 Build 15063] (x64) Or if I was Danish it would be the bae. |
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Post by pknaz on Apr 21, 2017 22:31:06 GMT -5
I had an Samsung 840 Pro SATA for a while, so I thought I'd "Upgrade" to an 850 Pro M.2 that was, at least on paper, MUCH faster.....so I thought. I noticed exactly 0 difference in real world performance.
to the OP: Get the regular Samsung 850, I don't think you'll notice the difference in real world usage between the 850 and 850 pro for your use cases.
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Post by ÈlTwo on Apr 21, 2017 23:02:39 GMT -5
UEFI and an SSD are your friends. Raid 0- M.2 PCIe 3.0 SSDs are my bae. I haven't used Raid 0 since I had two 640 GB WD Black drives. With those specs I don't have to look at test results to know how fast that puppy boots. |
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nrde
Minor Hero
Posts: 62 
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Post by nrde on Apr 22, 2017 1:34:59 GMT -5
I had an Samsung 840 Pro SATA for a while, so I thought I'd "Upgrade" to an 850 Pro M.2 that was, at least on paper, MUCH faster.....so I thought. I noticed exactly 0 difference in real world performance. to the OP: Get the regular Samsung 850, I don't think you'll notice the difference in real world usage between the 850 and 850 pro for your use cases. Weird advice, buy inferior technology as you might not see any difference anyway. It's like saying "listen to mp3's instead of flacs, you will not hear the difference with your speakers anyway." to an HiFi enthuastist. I don't see any reason to choose sata for a new machine/motherboard anymore. There is basically no price difference and M.2 is the faster than sata, takes less space. |
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Post by pknaz on Apr 22, 2017 9:24:06 GMT -5
I had an Samsung 840 Pro SATA for a while, so I thought I'd "Upgrade" to an 850 Pro M.2 that was, at least on paper, MUCH faster.....so I thought. I noticed exactly 0 difference in real world performance. to the OP: Get the regular Samsung 850, I don't think you'll notice the difference in real world usage between the 850 and 850 pro for your use cases. Weird advice, buy inferior technology as you might not see any difference anyway. It's like saying "listen to mp3's instead of flacs, you will not hear the difference with your speakers anyway." to an HiFi enthuastist. I don't see any reason to choose sata for a new machine/motherboard anymore. There is basically no price difference and M.2 is the faster than sata, takes less space. I didn't say chose sata over M.2, did I? |
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Post by garbulky on Apr 22, 2017 10:58:13 GMT -5
pknaz nrdeI see both your points but real world usage, the truth being unless the durability is the same, I'll probably go with the 850 pro sata because of the 10 year warranty. I think my current hard drive averages something like 30-50 MB per second transfers which isn't that hot, so this would be a humungous step up!
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nrde
Minor Hero
Posts: 62
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Post by nrde on Apr 22, 2017 15:32:36 GMT -5
I didn't say chose sata over M.2, did I? Oops, sorry. I blame me not being english native speaker  Here the price difference is something like 25$, maybe it's worth the peace of mind with the reliability anyway. |
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Post by MusicHead on Apr 22, 2017 16:19:57 GMT -5
garbulky, Hey, FYI, got this afternoon my EVGA GeForce GTX 1050. I just finished to physically install it, now installing the Nvidia drivers and the related software. An information bit that may be useful to you: if the video card you'll get is the Dual Slot width design, it will cover one of the other PCI connectors, even if the card itself needs to plugged only in one. Specifically, the added width is on the left side (looking from the top, once you plug it in). My old card was almost twice as long, but it was only Single Slot wide. The cooling fan was mounted flush with the heatsink and would pull the air sideways. The new card has the fan on top of the heatsink, making it wider but much shorter. I was not using the other connector anyway, depending on the layout of the motherboard you will get and what other cards you need, it is something you may want to keep in mind. The design depends on who actually make the card, so another brand may do it differently and use a Signed Slot width design. In the meantime Windows finished its stuff and I got my system back to its 1920x1080 full resolution. Time now to do some benchmarking to feel good about the money I spent :-)
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Post by garbulky on Apr 22, 2017 23:31:44 GMT -5
garbulky, Hey, FYI, got this afternoon my EVGA GeForce GTX 1050. I just finished to physically install it, now installing the Nvidia drivers and the related software. An information bit that may be useful to you: if the video card you'll get is the Dual Slot width design, it will cover one of the other PCI connectors, even if the card itself needs to plugged only in one. Specifically, the added width is on the left side (looking from the top, once you plug it in). My old card was almost twice as long, but it was only Single Slot wide. The cooling fan was mounted flush with the heatsink and would pull the air sideways. The new card has the fan on top of the heatsink, making it wider but much shorter. I was not using the other connector anyway, depending on the layout of the motherboard you will get and what other cards you need, it is something you may want to keep in mind. The design depends on who actually make the card, so another brand may do it differently and use a Signed Slot width design. In the meantime Windows finished its stuff and I got my system back to its 1920x1080 full resolution. Time now to do some benchmarking to feel good about the money I spent :-) Very helpful. Okay by the width sticks out. You mean it sticks out towards the bottom of the motherboard right? Like if the intel/amd CPU processor is on the top side of the motherboard, then the graphics card width sticks out towards the bottom? |
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Post by garbulky on Apr 22, 2017 23:39:55 GMT -5
There's a guy selling a AMD R9 390X 8GB GPU for $200 on craigslist. Now that's a nice price and will be much faster but the same price as the Geforce 1060 card I'm going to buy new.
Sounds like a no brainer but I do have some niggles in the way.
It looks like that card consumes quite a bit of power. My wall power outlets are powering a large amoutn of devices. I know that they are already close to the maximum draw.
The solution is to put in an extra 20 amp outlet in there.
Also I have a 650 watt power supply while a 750 watt power supply is recommended. Adding a powerful card is going to not only require me to get a more powerful power supply, but puts me at risk for too much power draw from the outlets.
Seems like when I add all those things up, I'm not really saving anything. So I think I'll stick to a Nvidia Geforce 1060. It's not quite as powerful. But it appears to be able to do all the games I want at playable frame rates and high settings at 1080p. Though I'm not against whatever equivalent ATI card is as an option. I currently run a Radeon and it's been very reliable.
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nrde
Minor Hero
Posts: 62
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Post by nrde on Apr 23, 2017 7:04:03 GMT -5
There's a guy selling a AMD R9 390X 8GB GPU for $200 on craigslist. Now that's a nice price and will be much faster but the same price as the Geforce 1060 card I'm going to buy new. Consider 3xx series is basically 3-4 years old (390 was a re-brand of their 290, the same way 5xx is now re-brand with small tweaks of 4xx). Even if the card can run the games as fast as for example 1060, it does so a lot less efficiently. Also it runs hot meaning it needs more efficient cooling system, which means more noise (depending of the cooler). I would always choose more recent mid range card over older high end card. (unless I need for example linux drivers that are sometimes not available right away). At the moment I would buy amd 570/580 or nvidia 1060 (or 1070). But that said, 390X is a good card and if the above isn't critical it's not a bad deal, on the other hand same generation nvidia cards are even better. Even my nvidia 970 is better in almost every way but also more expensive. |
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Post by MusicHead on Apr 23, 2017 9:57:08 GMT -5
garbulky, Hey, FYI, got this afternoon my EVGA GeForce GTX 1050. I just finished to physically install it, now installing the Nvidia drivers and the related software. An information bit that may be useful to you: if the video card you'll get is the Dual Slot width design, it will cover one of the other PCI connectors, even if the card itself needs to plugged only in one. Specifically, the added width is on the left side (looking from the top, once you plug it in). My old card was almost twice as long, but it was only Single Slot wide. The cooling fan was mounted flush with the heatsink and would pull the air sideways. The new card has the fan on top of the heatsink, making it wider but much shorter. I was not using the other connector anyway, depending on the layout of the motherboard you will get and what other cards you need, it is something you may want to keep in mind. The design depends on who actually make the card, so another brand may do it differently and use a Signed Slot width design. In the meantime Windows finished its stuff and I got my system back to its 1920x1080 full resolution. Time now to do some benchmarking to feel good about the money I spent :-) Very helpful. Okay by the width sticks out. You mean it sticks out towards the bottom of the motherboard right? Like if the intel/amd CPU processor is on the top side of the motherboard, then the graphics card width sticks out towards the bottom? In hindsight, I should have taken a picture... What I mean is that the new card is thicker sideway compared to the old one. On the back of the computer case it will take two slots, as if you had installed two regular size cards. One of the slots will have the connectors, the other the intake for the cooling fan. But again, it depends on the actual design of the video card brand. Nvidia only provides the chip and the reference design, the manufacturer decides how to actually make the video card. Asssuming for example you would pick the GeForce GTX 1060 6GB made by EVGA, they have two models, both Dual Slots wide, but one is longer than the other. You can see the form factor here, look at the pictures: www.evga.com/products/product.aspx?pn=06G-P4-5161-KRwww.evga.com/products/product.aspx?pn=06G-P4-6161-KRJust out of curiosity, I did a quick search and it looks like all of the 1060 Google could find (EVGA, MSI, Asus, PNY, Zotac, etc) are Double Slot width. Do not get too worried about this. It could be an issue only if you had to stuff all of the PCI buses on your mother board with cards. I have an Hauppage TV Tuner card in addition to the Nvidia video card, so having to take the space of two cars for just one was not an issue. |
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Post by MusicHead on Apr 23, 2017 10:08:44 GMT -5
There's a guy selling a AMD R9 390X 8GB GPU for $200 on craigslist. Now that's a nice price and will be much faster but the same price as the Geforce 1060 card I'm going to buy new. Consider 3xx series is basically 3-4 years old (390 was a re-brand of their 290, the same way 5xx is now re-brand with small tweaks of 4xx). Even if the card can run the games as fast as for example 1060, it does so a lot less efficiently. Also it runs hot meaning it needs more efficient cooling system, which means more noise (depending of the cooler). I would always choose more recent mid range card over older high end card. (unless I need for example linux drivers that are sometimes not available right away). At the moment I would buy amd 570/580 or nvidia 1060 (or 1070). But that said, 390X is a good card and if the above isn't critical it's not a bad deal, on the other hand same generation nvidia cards are even better. Even my nvidia 970 is better in almost every way but also more expensive. GTX 1060 6GB compared to R9 390X: gpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Nvidia-GTX-1060-6GB-vs-AMD-R9-390X/3639vs3497As nrde said, the 390 is basically an overclocked 290 and a quite good performing card. However, the crazy thing is the max power, 350W! That is almost 3X the power needed by the GTX 1060 (120W). You can tell is old tech and they have to push it hard to make it perform. For that alone I would not buy it, especially used. But that is me, YMMV. |
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Post by garbulky on Jun 5, 2017 12:05:49 GMT -5
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Post by monkumonku on Jun 5, 2017 12:37:20 GMT -5
You didn't mention anything about a power supply or fans. You have those already? That would increase your price. I think deciding on what components depends on what you plan on using the PC for. [edit] - oops, never mind, I didn't see your original post when I wrote the above! |
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Post by garbulky on Jun 5, 2017 12:44:18 GMT -5
You didn't mention anything about a power supply or fans. You have those already? That would increase your price. I think deciding on what components depends on what you plan on using the PC for. [edit] - oops, never mind, I didn't see your original post when I wrote the above! I have a power supply and case. One side of the case is going to be completely open. |
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Post by Boomzilla on Jun 5, 2017 14:43:15 GMT -5
Two words - "dust" and "catcher..."
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Post by knucklehead on Jun 5, 2017 21:51:14 GMT -5
I should one day post a video on how fast my rig boots up. No one will believe it if I just told you. UEFI and an SSD are your friends. I'm using a 480gb SSD. It is partitioned with Win 7 on 140gb and the rest for Linux. If it weren't for the dialog screen with a built in 20 second pause at the end of the POST cycle so I can pick which op sys I want to boot to, boot time would be about 15 seconds into Linux. Win 7 boot is a bit slower - maybe 30 seconds since it has to load anti-virus and a software firewall. Not bad on either account IMO. Moboard is a ASUS ROG CROSSBLADE RANGER FM2+ AMD with onboard graphics. CPU/GPU combo is an AMD A8-7600 quad core, 12gb of G.Skill DDR3 1600. Linux has only used 20gb of the 340gb available to it in the 1.5 years I've built this HTPC.. I use Linux daily and have for 1.5 years. Win 7 has used almost half of it's allotted 140gb and I probably log into it once a month or so - usually to update the software and for programming my Harmony remote when needed. Windows is a giant resource hog in comparison. |
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Post by garbulky on Jun 6, 2017 10:36:44 GMT -5
Still looking for some input. My main question - the processor.
I5 6700 K kabylake, I7 6700 K skylake, or I7-7700 Kabylake
The I7-7700 is the fastest and costs the same as the skylake. But skylake runs much cooler strangely. Is it worth it for a minor speed increase over the i7 6700k skylake to deal with additional heat?
I'm leaning towards the newer kabylake despite the heat but almost all the failures I've had was with hot running hardware.
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Here the price difference is something like 25$, maybe it's worth the peace of mind with the reliability anyway.
