richb
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Oppo Beta Group - Audioholics Reviewer
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Post by richb on Feb 18, 2019 16:13:12 GMT -5
This last test lead me to the conclusion that the XMC-1 is reporting and playing correctly PCM 7.1 from ATV 4K. The one to blame here is ATV 4K/iTunes. "The Expanse" played on the ATV4K Amazon Prime is 5.1 according to the Oppo UDP-205 and 7.1 according to the XMC-1. The same source and same title, they both cannot be correct. I suspect 5.1 is the correct answer. - Rich |
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Post by enricoclaudio on Feb 18, 2019 16:37:50 GMT -5
I did check The Expanse and you are right, Rich. It's PCM 5.1 on my Marantz and PCM 7.1 on the XMC-1 with no sound on rear speakers.
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cawgijoe
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Post by cawgijoe on Feb 18, 2019 19:48:27 GMT -5
The No Center Channel for me happens with Directv.
Just happened now. Had to toggle from Dirac to Preset 1 and back to get sound.
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LCSeminole
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Post by LCSeminole on Feb 18, 2019 19:51:18 GMT -5
This last test lead me to the conclusion that the XMC-1 is reporting and playing correctly PCM 7.1 from ATV 4K. The one to blame here is ATV 4K/iTunes. "The Expanse" played on the ATV4K Amazon Prime is 5.1 according to the Oppo UDP-205 and 7.1 according to the XMC-1. The same source and same title, they both cannot be correct. I suspect 5.1 is the correct answer. - Rich My conclusion as well. Any 5.1 pcm track streamed through the ATV4K from the NetFlix or Prime Video apps produces sound for the side surrounds but none in the back surrounds. |
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LCSeminole
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Post by LCSeminole on Feb 18, 2019 19:57:32 GMT -5
This last test lead me to the conclusion that the XMC-1 is reporting and playing correctly PCM 7.1 from ATV 4K. The one to blame here is ATV 4K/iTunes. Verified this as well with PCM 7.1 content, but this still doesn't explain the PCM 5.1 content being identified as 7.1 on the XMC-1 and since PCM 5.1 content from Oppo UDP-203 produces the same result, I believe there is only a "Display" reporting error. |
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LCSeminole
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Post by LCSeminole on Feb 18, 2019 20:04:47 GMT -5
OK guys, I found something very interesting. I was testing PCM 7.1 with Hacksaw Ridge from ATV 4K and like I said, I'm only getting PCM 5.1 sound so no sound on my rear speakers. Now, I went to my bedroom where I have a Marantz SR6013 in a 5.1 speaker setup but I turned ON Rears and put some temporary speakers and playing the same movie, I get my Marantz SR6013 reporting PCM 7.1 and only PCM 5.1 sound, no sound coming from rear speakers. Now, I put Mission Impossible Fallout from ATV 4K and voila, Marantz SR6013 reports PCM 7.1 and got sound on rear speakers. Went back to living room setup, put the same movie up with the XMC-1, and voila, XMC-1 reports PCM 7.1 and THERE IS SOUND coming from the rear speakers. Looks like some movies on iTunes their core audio is 5.1 while others are 7.1 but ATV 4K either way reports PCM 7.1. I also get PCM 7.1 and sound from rear speakers with Solo, Guardians of the Galaxy 2 and Black Panther. Nice find. |
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LCSeminole
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Post by LCSeminole on Feb 18, 2019 20:08:45 GMT -5
When sending DD5.1 from any source to the XMC-1 and select Surround format, only 5.1 speakers will have sound even if you have a 7.1 speaker setup. This is the way DD codec works. However, if you send DTS5.1 from any source to the XMC-1 and you have a 7.1 speaker setup, you will get on your rear speakers the same sound as in your surround speakers as this is per DTS codec. If you want your rear speakers to play content when sending DD5.1, then you have to select DD PLIIx Music or Movie up mixer. If I set my ATV 4K on Best Sound (PCM), the XMC-1 shows PCM 7.1 as incoming signal but I get only PCM 5.1 and no sound on my rear speakers. Up mixers are not available with PCM 5.1. So I think this is a bug that I didn't catch before because I have my ATV 4K set on DD 5.1 so I can use DD PLIIx Movie Up Mixer and have sound coming out of my rear speakers. View Attachment From my experience, DD 5.1/DD+ 5.1/DolbyTrueHD 5.1 have always worked with DPLIIx to give 7.1 sound(back surrounds matrixed). |
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Post by doc1963 on Feb 19, 2019 11:09:54 GMT -5
I believe this is expected behavior from the ATV, but not the Oppo. AFAIK, when selecting "Best Quality" in the ATV4K's audio settings, it will send 7.1 uncompressed PCM regardless of the actual channel count of the original content. That is to say as long as that content is encoded as true multi-channel "surround" based format. I do see my XMC-1 switch between PCM 2.0 and PCM 7.1 when going in-between the menus and actual content. I also see PCM 2.0 from content (or apps) that don't have, or support, multi-channel "surround" content. My XMC-1 also reports "DD5.1" if I set my ATV4K to output "Dolby Digital 5.1" as opposed to "Best Quality". Until now, I thought this was correct. Tonight, I will plug my ATV4K into the HDMI Input of my Oppo to see what it "sees" coming from the ATV. Afterwards, I will also set my 203 to output PCM instead of bitstream to see if I get the same "PCM 7.1" results as you. I'm trying your idea sending the ATV4K through the HDMI input on the 203, and yes both the 203 and XMC-1 report DD5.1 from DD5.1 stream content. However when sent 5.1 pcm content from the ATV4K the 203 reports 5.1, but the XMC-1 reports 7.1, and 2.0 & 7.1 pcm content report correctly on both the 203 and XMC-1. So this definitely supports my conclusion that this is a bug that the XMC-1 reports 5.1 pcm incorrectly. Definitely want to hear whether your findings verify mine or if they're different. I ran the test last night and my findings match yours to the letter. The ATV4K does indeed output uncompressed 5.1 LPCM for 5.1 content and 7.1 for 7.1 content as does the Oppo UDP-203 when set to output LPCM. The XMC-1 does indicate 7.1 in both cases, so this is clearly a bug that affects both reporting and up-mixing of 5.1 content on a 7.1 system (as my "rears" also remain silent with 5.1 content). |
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Post by enricoclaudio on Feb 19, 2019 13:50:46 GMT -5
I few mins ago got a new code (V5.4.2) from Lonnie. I will install it later today and report my findings.
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Post by rogersch on Feb 19, 2019 14:50:08 GMT -5
I received it also an hour ago and installed it right away. It seems that my audio problem has been solved and that locking to a changed audio format seems also be quicker. Great.  |
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Post by doc1963 on Feb 19, 2019 15:06:03 GMT -5
I few mins ago got a new code (V5.4.2) from Lonnie. I will install it later today and report my findings. Since the code has been released to members outside of the test group, I can tell you that it does not fix the "PCM 7.1" bug we have been discussing over the last several posts. |
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Post by sgracing on Feb 19, 2019 15:19:39 GMT -5
I received it also an hour ago and installed it right away. It seems that my audio problem has been solved and that locking to a changed audio format seems also be quicker. Great. Hope this is the fix for locking on audio via through ARC. It's the only issue I need resolved. Fingers crossed ! |
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Post by thrillcat on Feb 19, 2019 15:41:28 GMT -5
I'm trying your idea sending the ATV4K through the HDMI input on the 203, and yes both the 203 and XMC-1 report DD5.1 from DD5.1 stream content. However when sent 5.1 pcm content from the ATV4K the 203 reports 5.1, but the XMC-1 reports 7.1, and 2.0 & 7.1 pcm content report correctly on both the 203 and XMC-1. So this definitely supports my conclusion that this is a bug that the XMC-1 reports 5.1 pcm incorrectly. Definitely want to hear whether your findings verify mine or if they're different. I ran the test last night and my findings match yours to the letter. The ATV4K does indeed output uncompressed 5.1 LPCM for 5.1 content and 7.1 for 7.1 content as does the Oppo UDP-203 when set to output LPCM. The XMC-1 does indicate 7.1 in both cases, so this is clearly a bug that affects both reporting and up-mixing of 5.1 content on a 7.1 system (as my "rears" also remain silent with 5.1 content). It actually sounds more like the ATV is sending everything in a 7.1 format, and if the content is actually 5.1, it’s still sending 7.1 but with silent rear surrounds? Or am I missing something? |
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richb
Sensei
Oppo Beta Group - Audioholics Reviewer
Posts: 890
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Post by richb on Feb 19, 2019 15:50:29 GMT -5
I ran the test last night and my findings match yours to the letter. The ATV4K does indeed output uncompressed 5.1 LPCM for 5.1 content and 7.1 for 7.1 content as does the Oppo UDP-203 when set to output LPCM. The XMC-1 does indicate 7.1 in both cases, so this is clearly a bug that affects both reporting and up-mixing of 5.1 content on a 7.1 system (as my "rears" also remain silent with 5.1 content). It actually sounds more like the ATV is sending everything in a 7.1 format, and if the content is actually 5.1, it’s still sending 7.1 but with silent rear surrounds? Or am I missing something? The testing posted indicates the ATV4K is outputting 5.1 LPCM and the XMC-1 is reporting and treating it as 7.1. - Rich |
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Post by rogersch on Feb 19, 2019 15:50:45 GMT -5
I received it also an hour ago and installed it right away. It seems that my audio problem has been solved and that locking to a changed audio format seems also be quicker. Great. Hope this is the fix for locking on audio via through ARC. It's the only issue I need resolved. Fingers crossed ! Sorry I can't tell as I switched back to using Toslink for audio from my TV. From a point of view of supported audio formats ARC has not much of an advantage. |
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Post by doc1963 on Feb 19, 2019 15:52:13 GMT -5
I ran the test last night and my findings match yours to the letter. The ATV4K does indeed output uncompressed 5.1 LPCM for 5.1 content and 7.1 for 7.1 content as does the Oppo UDP-203 when set to output LPCM. The XMC-1 does indicate 7.1 in both cases, so this is clearly a bug that affects both reporting and up-mixing of 5.1 content on a 7.1 system (as my "rears" also remain silent with 5.1 content). It actually sounds more like the ATV is sending everything in a 7.1 format, and if the content is actually 5.1, it’s still sending 7.1 but with silent rear surrounds? Or am I missing something? No, the ATV is sending either 5.1 or 7.1 PCM based on which is used in the actual content. Running the ATV through the HDMI input of the Oppo UDP-203 and reading the extended information confirms this. The XMC-1 is not recognizing the content as 5.1, reports it as 7.1, and doesn't provide an up-mixing path to fill out the rear channels. The same thing happens, using physical media, if you set the Oppo to output LPCM rather than bitstream. |
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Post by doc1963 on Feb 19, 2019 15:54:31 GMT -5
It actually sounds more like the ATV is sending everything in a 7.1 format, and if the content is actually 5.1, it’s still sending 7.1 but with silent rear surrounds? Or am I missing something? This is what I think is going on as well. I'm going to (once again) switch out my XMC-1 with my AV7703 and see how the 7703 reads the incoming stream...  |
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Post by sgracing on Feb 19, 2019 16:01:01 GMT -5
Hope this is the fix for locking on audio via through ARC. It's the only issue I need resolved. Fingers crossed ! Sorry I can't tell as I switched back to using Toslink for audio from my TV. From a point of view of supported audio formats ARC has not much of an advantage. The reason for my interest is toslink doesn't support the Dolby master audio and HDMI supports all formats from the Sony . Once ARC is locked on after input an toggle I stream all formats with the Sony Z9D to the XMC-1 . The XMC-1 stays in while booted . Its just the initial power up that requires toggling inputs . I'M hoping that someone at Emotiva understands this issue . |
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ttocs
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Post by ttocs on Feb 19, 2019 16:36:47 GMT -5
It actually sounds more like the ATV is sending everything in a 7.1 format, and if the content is actually 5.1, it’s still sending 7.1 but with silent rear surrounds? Or am I missing something? This is what I think is going on as well. . . . except for PCM 2.0  (ATV4K on HDMI-5) |
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ttocs
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Post by ttocs on Feb 19, 2019 17:00:17 GMT -5
Ran the ATV4K into OPPO 105 back HDMI input.  |
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