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Post by marcl on Apr 2, 2020 9:57:31 GMT -5
Yes, you’ve got it. PCM is what’s being received, whether that would be the best thing to display, I’m not sure. I’ve read of different AVR’s displaying various formats. DD+ would probably be more accurate than TrueHD as well, Dolby should probably define what it should read. In any case I’d say it’s a low priority to fix as long as everyone understands it’s lossy. Fortunately it sounds really good. This comment is not Apple specific, but from what I think I've learned recently is that most of your streaming services, whether rental or not, use lossy formats. Even the expensive rentals in 4k. You're FvF example.. I assume you mean that is showing DD+ as well. What I'm seeing is iTunes, Amazon, etc.. Reencoding into lossy codecs and lower bitrates. DD for example is almost always 384k bitrate instead of the standard 560??? I can't remember, but I normally do my DD tracks at the highest 640k. For Atmos tracks, they take the TrueHD, make it DD+ and add the objects from Atmos. It still sounds great, but it is nothing like the lossless version. If you rent the physical 4k disc of FvF, it will show as TrueHD. If I remember correctly, that track has a bitrate that exceeds 8Mbps at times. iTunes Atmos.xlsx (63.23 KB) This might be useful. I found a list of ATMOS programming available on iTunes and Netflix and put them in this spreadsheet so you can sort and search. I've tried a couple on iTunes (FvF was good), but with Netflix it's been a little uncertain. Using ATV4K with 4K subscription connected to HDMI2 on XMC-2 V1.9, I always have to start the movie, Audio says Auto or DDSurround, then I pause it, cycle power on the XMC-2 (Video Always On mode), and then I see the ATMOS logo ... sometimes not right away. Worked this way for Roma and The Highwaymen. But on a couple others like The Wolf's Cry and The Red Sea Diving Resort I never saw the ATMOS logo, just DDSurround. And in fact for Wolf's Cry I only actually got stereo and not even regular surround or upmix. I guess some of this could be Netflix wankiness. But the business with having to cycle the XMC-2 is consistent.
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Post by megash0n on Apr 2, 2020 10:18:58 GMT -5
This comment is not Apple specific, but from what I think I've learned recently is that most of your streaming services, whether rental or not, use lossy formats. Even the expensive rentals in 4k. You're FvF example.. I assume you mean that is showing DD+ as well. What I'm seeing is iTunes, Amazon, etc.. Reencoding into lossy codecs and lower bitrates. DD for example is almost always 384k bitrate instead of the standard 560??? I can't remember, but I normally do my DD tracks at the highest 640k. For Atmos tracks, they take the TrueHD, make it DD+ and add the objects from Atmos. It still sounds great, but it is nothing like the lossless version. If you rent the physical 4k disc of FvF, it will show as TrueHD. If I remember correctly, that track has a bitrate that exceeds 8Mbps at times. View AttachmentThis might be useful. I found a list of ATMOS programming available on iTunes and Netflix and put them in this spreadsheet so you can sort and search. I've tried a couple on iTunes (FvF was good), but with Netflix it's been a little uncertain. Using ATV4K with 4K subscription connected to HDMI2 on XMC-2 V1.9, I always have to start the movie, Audio says Auto or DDSurround, then I pause it, cycle power on the XMC-2 (Video Always On mode), and then I see the ATMOS logo ... sometimes not right away. Worked this way for Roma and The Highwaymen. But on a couple others like The Wolf's Cry and The Red Sea Diving Resort I never saw the ATMOS logo, just DDSurround. And in fact for Wolf's Cry I only actually got stereo and not even regular surround or upmix. I guess some of this could be Netflix wankiness. But the business with having to cycle the XMC-2 is consistent. That's pretty odd. I do not use Apple products, so I unfortunately cannot comment. I use a Win10 PC and an Xbox One X. I don't think these issues are with iTunes or Netflix as much as they are hardware to hardware or software to software issues between the RMC and the device itself. It seems like the APTV doesn't care a lot for the RMC.
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cawgijoe
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Post by cawgijoe on Apr 2, 2020 10:40:02 GMT -5
View AttachmentThis might be useful. I found a list of ATMOS programming available on iTunes and Netflix and put them in this spreadsheet so you can sort and search. I've tried a couple on iTunes (FvF was good), but with Netflix it's been a little uncertain. Using ATV4K with 4K subscription connected to HDMI2 on XMC-2 V1.9, I always have to start the movie, Audio says Auto or DDSurround, then I pause it, cycle power on the XMC-2 (Video Always On mode), and then I see the ATMOS logo ... sometimes not right away. Worked this way for Roma and The Highwaymen. But on a couple others like The Wolf's Cry and The Red Sea Diving Resort I never saw the ATMOS logo, just DDSurround. And in fact for Wolf's Cry I only actually got stereo and not even regular surround or upmix. I guess some of this could be Netflix wankiness. But the business with having to cycle the XMC-2 is consistent. That's pretty odd. I do not use Apple products, so I unfortunately cannot comment. I use a Win10 PC and an Xbox One X. I don't think these issues are with iTunes or Netflix as much as they are hardware to hardware or software to software issues between the RMC and the device itself. It seems like the APTV doesn't care a lot for the RMC. I don't have Atmos set up, but I don't have any issues with my XMC-2 and my Apple TV 4K playing "standard" Dolby and recognizing it. Strange.
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Post by AudioHTIT on Apr 2, 2020 11:47:03 GMT -5
That's pretty odd. I do not use Apple products, so I unfortunately cannot comment. I use a Win10 PC and an Xbox One X. I don't think these issues are with iTunes or Netflix as much as they are hardware to hardware or software to software issues between the RMC and the device itself. It seems like the APTV doesn't care a lot for the RMC. I would disagree with that assessment, while the best picture and sound (by a noticeable amount) is achieved by playing a UHD disc on my Oppo, the Apple TV4K produces excellent 4K DV picture and Atmos sound, and I have virtually no problems using it with the RMC-1. Disclaimer: I don’t have 4K Netflix, but do watch 4K Amazon Prime & 4K Disney+ regularly without difficulty, both with Atmos.
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Post by davidl81 on Apr 2, 2020 14:22:15 GMT -5
That's pretty odd. I do not use Apple products, so I unfortunately cannot comment. I use a Win10 PC and an Xbox One X. I don't think these issues are with iTunes or Netflix as much as they are hardware to hardware or software to software issues between the RMC and the device itself. It seems like the APTV doesn't care a lot for the RMC. I would disagree with that assessment, while the best picture and sound (by a noticeable amount) is achieved by playing a UHD disc on my Oppo, the Apple TV4K produces excellent 4K DV picture and Atmos sound, and I have virtually no problems using it with the RMC-1. Disclaimer: I don’t have 4K Netflix, but do watch 4K Amazon Prime & 4K Disney+ regularly without difficulty, both with Atmos. I think Netflix on ATV is more of the issue. My Apple TV 4K does great with the RMC-1 (w1/.9) with 4K HDR, Atmos content. Both through Itunes movies and Disney+. The Netflix sound sometimes gets a little wonky for some reason, like the dialog bounces around from the center to either left or right. But this seems to be specific to Netflix on the RMC-1
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Post by megash0n on Apr 2, 2020 14:24:39 GMT -5
That's pretty odd. I do not use Apple products, so I unfortunately cannot comment. I use a Win10 PC and an Xbox One X. I don't think these issues are with iTunes or Netflix as much as they are hardware to hardware or software to software issues between the RMC and the device itself. It seems like the APTV doesn't care a lot for the RMC. I would disagree with that assessment, while the best picture and sound (by a noticeable amount) is achieved by playing a UHD disc on my Oppo, the Apple TV4K produces excellent 4K DV picture and Atmos sound, and I have virtually no problems using it with the RMC-1. Disclaimer: I don’t have 4K Netflix, but do watch 4K Amazon Prime & 4K Disney+ regularly without difficulty, both with Atmos. My bad. I must be misunderstanding the numerous people complaining about issues with APTV and the RMC. Secondly, I'm not suggesting that it sounds bad, just stating that the bitrate is often considerably lower. ( with streaming services)
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Post by Gary Cook on Apr 2, 2020 14:27:55 GMT -5
I don’t know if it’s the case in the US but in Australia Netflix, Prime, Disney etc are reducing the video and audio quality of their programming to use less bandwidth. This is due to the large number of people working from home resulting from the social distancing requirements forced on us by the Corona virus. So just because a program is promoted as 4K Atmos doesn’t mean that it’s broadcast in 4K Atmos.
Cheers Gary
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Lsc
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Post by Lsc on Apr 2, 2020 14:39:25 GMT -5
I don’t know if it’s the case in the US but in Australia Netflix, Prime, Disney etc are reducing the video and audio quality of their programming to use less bandwidth. This is due to the large number of people working from home resulting from the social distancing requirements forced on us by the Corona virus. So just because a program is promoted as 4K Atmos doesn’t mean that it’s broadcast in 4K Atmos. Cheers Gary Still getting 4K Atmos for now.
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Post by steelman1991 on Apr 2, 2020 14:58:42 GMT -5
I would disagree with that assessment, while the best picture and sound (by a noticeable amount) is achieved by playing a UHD disc on my Oppo, the Apple TV4K produces excellent 4K DV picture and Atmos sound, and I have virtually no problems using it with the RMC-1. Disclaimer: I don’t have 4K Netflix, but do watch 4K Amazon Prime & 4K Disney+ regularly without difficulty, both with Atmos. I think Netflix on ATV is more of the issue. My Apple TV 4K does great with the RMC-1 (w1/.9) with 4K HDR, Atmos content. Both through Itunes movies and Disney+. The Netflix sound sometimes gets a little wonky for some reason, like the dialog bounces around from the center to either left or right. But this seems to be specific to Netflix on the RMC-1 You are correct about the "bouncing sound", but it's an issue not specific to the RMC-1. It is however to the Apple TV4K and Netflix (funnily though not on all Atmos titles). EDIT - just re-read your post and I'm not sure, but I think you meant to say Apple TV, in the last sentence, rather than RMC-1.
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Post by steelman1991 on Apr 2, 2020 15:01:01 GMT -5
I don’t know if it’s the case in the US but in Australia Netflix, Prime, Disney etc are reducing the video and audio quality of their programming to use less bandwidth. This is due to the large number of people working from home resulting from the social distancing requirements forced on us by the Corona virus. So just because a program is promoted as 4K Atmos doesn’t mean that it’s broadcast in 4K Atmos. Cheers Gary Yes we're having the same restrictions in the UK, though the ISP's have been adamant that there is adequate bandwidth resource available to cope without this restriction.
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Post by AudioHTIT on Apr 2, 2020 15:03:45 GMT -5
I would disagree with that assessment, while the best picture and sound (by a noticeable amount) is achieved by playing a UHD disc on my Oppo, the Apple TV4K produces excellent 4K DV picture and Atmos sound, and I have virtually no problems using it with the RMC-1. Disclaimer: I don’t have 4K Netflix, but do watch 4K Amazon Prime & 4K Disney+ regularly without difficulty, both with Atmos. I think Netflix on ATV is more of the issue. My Apple TV 4K does great with the RMC-1 (w1/.9) with 4K HDR, Atmos content. Both through Itunes movies and Disney+. The Netflix sound sometimes gets a little wonky for some reason, like the dialog bounces around from the center to either left or right. But this seems to be specific to Netflix on the RMC-1 Right, we have to distinguish between the platform, ATV4K in this case works very well; and the App on that platform, Netflix w/4K subscription seems to have some issues (that bouncing dialog is most identified). It even seems possible (in reading on other sites), that the dialog issue may be more pronounced with x.x.4, as you hear about it less with .2 systems. In any case it doesn’t seem limited to the RMC/XMC as other AVRs report it too.
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Post by steelman1991 on Apr 2, 2020 15:21:57 GMT -5
I think Netflix on ATV is more of the issue. My Apple TV 4K does great with the RMC-1 (w1/.9) with 4K HDR, Atmos content. Both through Itunes movies and Disney+. The Netflix sound sometimes gets a little wonky for some reason, like the dialog bounces around from the center to either left or right. But this seems to be specific to Netflix on the RMC-1 Right, we have to distinguish between the platform, ATV4K in this case works very well; and the App On that platform, Netflix w/4K subscription seems to have some issues (that bouncing dialog is most identified). It even seems possible (in reading on other sites), that the dialog issue may be more pronounced with x.x.4, as you hear about it less with .2 systems. In any case it doesn’t seem limited to the RMC/XMC as other AVRs report it too. Definitely an App/Platform issue.
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Post by kahodges1721 on Apr 2, 2020 22:31:39 GMT -5
Has anyone change the boot behavior on a specific HDMI input outside of lasted used? I’m attempting to configure the setting to default to HDMI1 on boot and if I startup the Xmc2 by remote it seems to work but if I let it boot through my LGC9 (meaning I turn power on the tv and CEC boots the XMC2) it works perfectly except always sets hdmi3 instead of 1. I’m half tempted to just switch the input to hdmi3 but I have a feeling this bug might be missed as it’s not as common.
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Post by markc on Apr 3, 2020 0:14:12 GMT -5
Has anyone change the boot behavior on a specific HDMI input outside of lasted used? I’m attempting to configure the setting to default to HDMI1 on boot and if I startup the Xmc2 by remote it seems to work but if I let it boot through my LGC9 (meaning I turn power on the tv and CEC boots the XMC2) it works perfectly except always sets hdmi3 instead of 1. I’m half tempted to just switch the input to hdmi3 but I have a feeling this bug might be missed as it’s not as common. I use it all the time as my only music source is to stream music from a HTPC using JRiver, connected to HDMI 1 which is set as default start up on the XMC If I just want to listen to music I simply tap the front power button on the XMC and I can then use my iPad to play some music without needing to go near a remote control or without needing the TV on.
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Post by ttocs on Apr 3, 2020 0:46:06 GMT -5
Has anyone change the boot behavior on a specific HDMI input outside of lasted used? I’m attempting to configure the setting to default to HDMI1 on boot and if I startup the Xmc2 by remote it seems to work but if I let it boot through my LGC9 (meaning I turn power on the tv and CEC boots the XMC2) it works perfectly except always sets hdmi3 instead of 1. I’m half tempted to just switch the input to hdmi3 but I have a feeling this bug might be missed as it’s not as common. Mine is setup for Video Remains On and running newest firmware. I can set the Turn-On Input to any choice and it will be on that input next time I power on. I just changed it and it works as intended. Keep in mind, safest practice when changing settings is to "back out" of the menu by pressing the Left Arrow button on the remote. This "sets" the settings. This really isn't required for all settings, but there are some that won't set unless this method is used so I do this for all settings changes. edit: I just realized something about what you wrote. I understand that if you let your tv turn on the XMC-2 that it then chooses HDMI-3 as the Turn-On Input. So if this happens, and next time you turn on the XMC-2 before the tv which input does the XMC-2 choose as the Turn-On Input ? If it uses the input you chose in Preferences then the tv is changing that setting on the fly, so it must be something that is setup on the tv.
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Post by kahodges1721 on Apr 3, 2020 8:19:11 GMT -5
Has anyone change the boot behavior on a specific HDMI input outside of lasted used? I’m attempting to configure the setting to default to HDMI1 on boot and if I startup the Xmc2 by remote it seems to work but if I let it boot through my LGC9 (meaning I turn power on the tv and CEC boots the XMC2) it works perfectly except always sets hdmi3 instead of 1. I’m half tempted to just switch the input to hdmi3 but I have a feeling this bug might be missed as it’s not as common. Mine is setup for Video Remains On and running newest firmware. I can set the Turn-On Input to any choice and it will be on that input next time I power on. I just changed it and it works as intended. Keep in mind, safest practice when changing settings is to "back out" of the menu by pressing the Left Arrow button on the remote. This "sets" the settings. This really isn't required for all settings, but there are some that won't set unless this method is used so I do this for all settings changes. edit: I just realized something about what you wrote. I understand that if you let your tv turn on the XMC-2 that it then chooses HDMI-3 as the Turn-On Input. So if this happens, and next time you turn on the XMC-2 before the tv which input does the XMC-2 choose as the Turn-On Input ? If it uses the input you chose in Preferences then the tv is changing that setting on the fly, so it must be something that is setup on the tv. Has anyone change the boot behavior on a specific HDMI input outside of lasted used? I’m attempting to configure the setting to default to HDMI1 on boot and if I startup the Xmc2 by remote it seems to work but if I let it boot through my LGC9 (meaning I turn power on the tv and CEC boots the XMC2) it works perfectly except always sets hdmi3 instead of 1. I’m half tempted to just switch the input to hdmi3 but I have a feeling this bug might be missed as it’s not as common. I use it all the time as my only music source is to stream music from a HTPC using JRiver, connected to HDMI 1 which is set as default start up on the XMC If I just want to listen to music I simply tap the front power button on the XMC and I can then use my iPad to play some music without needing to go near a remote control or without needing the TV on. Yeah I completely agree with you guys. When I turn in one via the button on the front it works just fine. Connected to the LG and power on through that it 50/50 on how it Sets it. Sometimes it will be hdmi3 for both audio and video and sometimes it will be arc for audio and hdmi3 for video. Setting to arc makes sense since arc and cec typically go hand in hand. I run my pc directly to the tv and bypass the XMC2 in order to take advantage of gsync capabilities. This means I have a second DisplayPort to hdmi going into the receiver for uncompressed audio since earc is not incorporated yet. I wonder if I take the earc port from the tv and instead of putting it into the output put it into an input. I would lose cec etc but I have a harmony remote for that (that i still need to program) anyone ever try such a workaround? If it works it would be nice bc then I do not have to have a phantom second screen just to get full audio
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Post by ttocs on Apr 3, 2020 12:21:06 GMT -5
Mine is setup for Video Remains On and running newest firmware. I can set the Turn-On Input to any choice and it will be on that input next time I power on. I just changed it and it works as intended. Keep in mind, safest practice when changing settings is to "back out" of the menu by pressing the Left Arrow button on the remote. This "sets" the settings. This really isn't required for all settings, but there are some that won't set unless this method is used so I do this for all settings changes. edit: I just realized something about what you wrote. I understand that if you let your tv turn on the XMC-2 that it then chooses HDMI-3 as the Turn-On Input. So if this happens, and next time you turn on the XMC-2 before the tv which input does the XMC-2 choose as the Turn-On Input ? If it uses the input you chose in Preferences then the tv is changing that setting on the fly, so it must be something that is setup on the tv. I use it all the time as my only music source is to stream music from a HTPC using JRiver, connected to HDMI 1 which is set as default start up on the XMC If I just want to listen to music I simply tap the front power button on the XMC and I can then use my iPad to play some music without needing to go near a remote control or without needing the TV on. Yeah I completely agree with you guys. When I turn in one via the button on the front it works just fine. Connected to the LG and power on through that it 50/50 on how it Sets it. Sometimes it will be hdmi3 for both audio and video and sometimes it will be arc for audio and hdmi3 for video. Setting to arc makes sense since arc and cec typically go hand in hand. I run my pc directly to the tv and bypass the XMC2 in order to take advantage of gsync capabilities. This means I have a second DisplayPort to hdmi going into the receiver for uncompressed audio since earc is not incorporated yet. I wonder if I take the earc port from the tv and instead of putting it into the output put it into an input. I would lose cec etc but I have a harmony remote for that (that i still need to program) anyone ever try such a workaround? If it works it would be nice bc then I do not have to have a phantom second screen just to get full audio Keep in mind that CEC is a crap shoot with mixed brands. Which HDMI CEC settings did you choose in the XMC-2 setup menu? For diagnosing purposes maybe if you only had the Power On setting checked to see if the problem goes away. If you have Input Change selected, this might be the issue?
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Post by kahodges1721 on Apr 3, 2020 12:47:25 GMT -5
Yeah I completely agree with you guys. When I turn in one via the button on the front it works just fine. Connected to the LG and power on through that it 50/50 on how it Sets it. Sometimes it will be hdmi3 for both audio and video and sometimes it will be arc for audio and hdmi3 for video. Setting to arc makes sense since arc and cec typically go hand in hand. I run my pc directly to the tv and bypass the XMC2 in order to take advantage of gsync capabilities. This means I have a second DisplayPort to hdmi going into the receiver for uncompressed audio since earc is not incorporated yet. I wonder if I take the earc port from the tv and instead of putting it into the output put it into an input. I would lose cec etc but I have a harmony remote for that (that i still need to program) anyone ever try such a workaround? If it works it would be nice bc then I do not have to have a phantom second screen just to get full audio Keep in mind that CEC is a crap shoot with mixed brands. Which HDMI CEC settings did you choose in the XMC-2 setup menu? For diagnosing purposes maybe if you only had the Power On setting checked to see if the problem goes away. If you have Input Change selected, this might be the issue? 😱 i can’t believe I forgot that was a setting. That’s exactly it! The input on the tv I’m using is hdmi 3 and it’s switching to match that. I turned it off and boom it works as I would expect. Man I feel like an idiot. Thanks a ton for pointing that out.
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Post by apoartar on Apr 3, 2020 18:48:47 GMT -5
Finally got Netflix Atmos streaming to work on my new XMC-2. This was more complicated than I thought, and in case anyone else is having trouble getting Netflix Atmos streaming to work, here’s my story. So… I upgraded my UMC-200 to the XMC-2. I wanted to get full 4K 60fps and Atmos working on my 7.1 system w/LG 2018 OLED TV too. I tested it with a Blu-ray (the Joker) and all 7 channels worked fine. However I couldn’t get Netflix to go from 5.1 to Atmos (or in my case Dolby TrueHD). I had been using a firestick 4K for the Netflix streaming. After much troubleshooting and even replacing HDMI cables with the latest High Speed cables that support HDMI 2.0b it still didn’t work. Double checked all settings, rebooted, nothing worked. It turns out that although the 4K firestick supports Atmos, the Netflix app for the firestick doesn’t (Amazon prime streaming on the firestick supports Atmos, but you have to manually select it after you start the movie or show). I could be wrong, but it seems the only devices that currently support Netflix Atmos is the ATV, the firestick Cube, and the Xbox. Luckily I had an Xbox One X. Hooked that up and it still didn’t work, until I downloaded the Dolby app for it – then I was able to change the audio setting to output Dolby Atmos. But even after that it still didn’t work – until I rebooted the TV, the Xbox and the XMC-2. Now the Netflix Atmos streaming works and titles on Netflix that have Atmos are labeled as such. I also confirmed that all 7 speaker channels are working. I suspect that the issue with Netflix is that generally, you need a device to be connected via a gigabit ethernet cable and connection, so it affords a higher throughput. This is an interesting Netflix tech article about their sound engineering and adaptive audio streaming. netflixtechblog.com/engineering-a-studio-quality-experience-with-high-quality-audio-at-netflix-eaa0b6145f32Overall I’m very happy with the XMC-2 - it has it’s quirks but it sounds great and I’m sure will sound even better after Dirac is released for it.
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Post by rochesterboy on Apr 4, 2020 8:06:17 GMT -5
With Netflix via ATV4k connected to HDMI-4 on the XMC-2 I get Dolby TRUEHD from Netflix, and Dolby ATMOS output from XMC-2. View AttachmentOK, I connected my Apple TV 4K to my XMC-2 HDMI 1 and XMC-2 projects the video out on my Epson 5040UB. Now the ATMOS from NetFlix works. But I cannot enable HDR from Apple TV 4K Settings. It tries first and reverts the setting back to 4K NON HDR. Is it a XMC-2 setting problem or Epson 5040 setting problem? Epson 5040UB has auto setup for HDR.
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