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Post by megash0n on Feb 18, 2021 6:51:58 GMT -5
Well the Loudness seems to do more than loudness. It has changed the way the dialog sounds and adds to surround levels also more than the fronts. I here more of a center spread across the front stage. I did some methodical testing of the Loudness and I'd say that for stereo content it behaves as we would expect a Loudness option to behave, when used as it should be for very low level listening. When used with multichannel content including upmixed from stereo, I believe it goes way overboard especially in the bass. I measured huge bass boost even at -30 and -40db volume levels. And it has an overall effect on volume and high frequencies. I suggest either not using it for anything but stereo, or be very careful with volume over -30. One of the problems with trying to implement Loudness (maybe endemic to these processors) is that I have heard many people refer to their normal listening levels as anywhere from -30 to -8 ... so how do you program the Fletcher-Munsen curves to kick in gradually when so many listen at such varied reference positions on the volume control. how do they know how loud their test tones are? ☺ Edit: also, could this be derived from voltage instead? |
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Post by megash0n on Feb 18, 2021 7:00:29 GMT -5
2.2 update complete. 1. Unexpected, but as others have noted... 2.2 seems to sound better?! It seems like the default gain is higher, mid-bass is more punchy, and the stage is more velvet-y overall. The sound is making my ears tingle and my skin crawl like I don't remember at all. Emo what did you dooooo? 2. UUUUUGGGGGH, alas there is a tradeoff. CEC has gotten even worse. With "CEC Input" enabled the "Menu" button on my AppleTV causes the processor to change inputs... back to the same input. Result is audio stopping and video blinking out for several seconds. CEC Volume is still broken. I feel a bit like I bought a Ferrari 360 Modena. It looks and sounds incredible, but the glove box falls open every time you take a hard left. Emo, do you need a CEC tester? I volunteer. PS, I'm also a software developer. Let's get this fixed! I agree there seems to be a gain change. I had snaps and pops moving between audio modes and such. The pitch and tone are definitely different in my system. Could very well be a result of Dirac being configured on a broken system that was fix. May just need to run Dirac again. It does seems quicker, and... Thank the Lord that we are now "refreshing the handshake". This is the #emotivaway. It is tiresome. While you appreciate the effort to fix bugs and deliver new features, you never know if they are correct. I'm sure once the unit is 7 years old, people will either just be used to it or it will finally be right. Are there really only a few of us that want and expect excellence and consistency? |
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Post by doc1963 on Feb 18, 2021 7:17:19 GMT -5
2.2 update complete. 1. Unexpected, but as others have noted... 2.2 seems to sound better?! It seems like the default gain is higher, mid-bass is more punchy, and the stage is more velvet-y overall. The sound is making my ears tingle and my skin crawl like I don't remember at all. Emo what did you dooooo? 2. UUUUUGGGGGH, alas there is a tradeoff. CEC has gotten even worse. With "CEC Input" enabled the "Menu" button on my AppleTV causes the processor to change inputs... back to the same input. Result is audio stopping and video blinking out for several seconds. CEC Volume is still broken. I feel a bit like I bought a Ferrari 360 Modena. It looks and sounds incredible, but the glove box falls open every time you take a hard left. Emo, do you need a CEC tester? I volunteer. PS, I'm also a software developer. Let's get this fixed! The overzealous and unwelcome CEC activity originating from the AppleTV is a well documented issue and isn’t specific to Emotiva’s processors. In fact, I’m surprised you didn’t experience similar behavior with your AV8805... my old 7703 surely did. The problem with CEC on the AppleTV is that you cannot turn it off and what control they give you isn’t granular enough. However, there is a solution. Kill CEC communication coming from your AppleTV by either removing pin 13 on your HDMI cable or use a Lindy CEC-less adapter (which has no connection on pin 13) plugged into the HDMI output of your AppleTV. When I first experienced this issue on my 7703, I purchased the CEC-less adapter and it stopped the problem in its tracks. In fact, I now have an adapter plugged into the output of all of my sources that would enumerate the CEC bus. |
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ttocs
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Post by ttocs on Feb 18, 2021 8:52:46 GMT -5
2. UUUUUGGGGGH, alas there is a tradeoff. CEC has gotten even worse. With "CEC Input" enabled the "Menu" button on my AppleTV causes the processor to change inputs... back to the same input. Result is audio stopping and video blinking out for several seconds. CEC Volume is still broken. I feel a bit like I bought a Ferrari 360 Modena. It looks and sounds incredible, but the glove box falls open every time you take a hard left. Emo, do you need a CEC tester? I volunteer. PS, I'm also a software developer. Let's get this fixed! I like the Ferrari comparo! That's from a Rockford Files episode where the Magnum character was introduced and when Jim Rockford was in the passenger seat in Magnum's car the glove box would flip open and hit Jim's knees, and it had weight added to it because a gun was attached to the inside of the door. Try taking the ATV out of the equation. It can wreak havoc with CEC even when every device has CEC disabled. Mine actually re-enabled my projector a bunch of times until I killed every automatic setting in the ATV4K I could find. It did this with each firmware update, until I disabled auto firmware update which I kept finding was re-enabled. |
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Post by hanse1 on Feb 18, 2021 8:52:49 GMT -5
After installing 2.2, I lost the sound to the TV when the XMC-2 is in standby. The previous version 2.1 sometimes lost its sound, but after restarting the XMC-2 it came back. Now I have tried with and without CEC but it makes no difference. I have a box of the type OnePlace (Canal Digital) and a Philips TV. I thought 2.2 would fix this particular problem but it only got worse.
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Post by badfusion on Feb 18, 2021 9:10:34 GMT -5
snaps and pop too when loudness mode is activated ....
maybe dirac need to be reuploaded ...
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Post by inchrist on Feb 18, 2021 9:44:56 GMT -5
2.2 update complete. 1. Unexpected, but as others have noted... 2.2 seems to sound better?! It seems like the default gain is higher, mid-bass is more punchy, and the stage is more velvet-y overall. The sound is making my ears tingle and my skin crawl like I don't remember at all. Emo what did you dooooo? 2. UUUUUGGGGGH, alas there is a tradeoff. CEC has gotten even worse. With "CEC Input" enabled the "Menu" button on my AppleTV causes the processor to change inputs... back to the same input. Result is audio stopping and video blinking out for several seconds. CEC Volume is still broken. I feel a bit like I bought a Ferrari 360 Modena. It looks and sounds incredible, but the glove box falls open every time you take a hard left. Emo, do you need a CEC tester? I volunteer. PS, I'm also a software developer. Let's get this fixed! first, beautiful M5 or M3! sorry I don't know that well. makes since the analogy of the Modena. and pretty good analogy I might add. so glad to hear that you and others are experiencing better sound quality. YAY!! secondly I must admit... way back, along code 1.5, I broke off pin 13 on the HDMI cable from the Apple TV in our test rack at the Emo. headquarters. Then when I got one for Christmas, for my personal system, I prepared anther HDMI cable. So unfortunately, I do not test CEC from Apple TV any longer. Apple TV sends out a "who is awake" every min or so, and if there is any other device powered on in the system that has CEC enabled, then it request input change... (because obviously the consumer wants that input... haha.) It even continues this request if you turn OFF "TV and Receiver control". You can easily turn off CEC input change in the processor and it will ignore this input change request. Though this defeats the "auto change" to ARC when switching the TV input to an app. or off air ant. So I would recommend breaking off pin 13 or buying an HDMI adapter that removes pin 13 "CEC control". I have a feeling that our latest code that helps get "video" coming out of VRO and "re-select of input" to gain video, basically "hot plug" in ether instance... has raised awareness to this Apple TV request of "who's awake". Because we really didn't play with any CEC stuff at all. BUT I am hoping this "hot plug" helps a lot of people experiencing "no video" issue with 2.1 firmware. I do test volume control on 6 different TVs at the office every time we have a new code. And I have found a favorable lock with all of them with this code. unfortunately CEC is written in many "languages" and communication is difficult with all brands and models. Yes, I do admit we need to work on CEC (HDMI in general), and we will keep striving forward. |
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Post by ElectricKoolAid on Feb 18, 2021 9:47:32 GMT -5
2.2 update complete. 1. Unexpected, but as others have noted... 2.2 seems to sound better?! It seems like the default gain is higher, mid-bass is more punchy, and the stage is more velvet-y overall. The sound is making my ears tingle and my skin crawl like I don't remember at all. Emo what did you dooooo? 2. UUUUUGGGGGH, alas there is a tradeoff. CEC has gotten even worse. With "CEC Input" enabled the "Menu" button on my AppleTV causes the processor to change inputs... back to the same input. Result is audio stopping and video blinking out for several seconds. CEC Volume is still broken. I feel a bit like I bought a Ferrari 360 Modena. It looks and sounds incredible, but the glove box falls open every time you take a hard left. Emo, do you need a CEC tester? I volunteer. PS, I'm also a software developer. Let's get this fixed! I was curious to hear if anyone had any luck with CEC after the update. I was going to reenable it last night after I got updated to 2.2 but I just didn't feel like messing with it. I did enjoy listening to some of my favorite content and I am fairly certain there is a difference in SQ. A couple songs the bass seemed much louder. One song sounded a tad bit off in the bass but it could be a fluke or maybe I'm misremembering how it sounded before. Either way, I would have to agree, there is a difference. I'll probably mess with CEC this weekend and see if I have any better luck. SIde note, does anyone use Plex on an Nvidia Shield to watch HDR content? I've been having an issue where I'll start a movie with HDR and it will flash the HDR badge up in the corner of my TV screen but I guess the color space or something doesn't shift to the right mode? I'm not sure if it's needing to go to 4:4:4 and not or what is exactly causing this. So the movie will look really washed out and the colors will not be correct. Last night I found that I can manually modify the Shield's video settings to manually switch it over to the correct mode and the color returns to normal. Just wondering if anyone else has had this issue? |
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cawgijoe
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Post by cawgijoe on Feb 18, 2021 9:59:17 GMT -5
After installing 2.2, I lost the sound to the TV when the XMC-2 is in standby. The previous version 2.1 sometimes lost its sound, but after restarting the XMC-2 it came back. Now I have tried with and without CEC but it makes no difference. I have a box of the type OnePlace (Canal Digital) and a Philips TV. I thought 2.2 would fix this particular problem but it only got worse. Have you done a cold reboot....back power switch off.....wait a full 60 seconds or longer and power back up. Are you using VRO? |
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Post by dkaudio on Feb 18, 2021 10:28:41 GMT -5
Started the update process, it got to front panel, the XMC-2 turned itself off, rebooted, and now it has just been on a blank screen for 20 minutes. The USB stick power LED is still lite. Any ideas?
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cawgijoe
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Post by cawgijoe on Feb 18, 2021 10:34:38 GMT -5
Started the update process, it got to front panel, the XMC-2 turned itself off, rebooted, and now it has just been on a blank screen for 20 minutes. The USB stick power LED is still lite. Any ideas? Shut it down with the back power switch....wait 60 seconds or more and turn back on. Check the menu to see if the update came through. I’ve had this happen once or twice and after waiting for twenty minutes or more said “what the hell, it’s under warranty”....... |
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Post by doc1963 on Feb 18, 2021 10:36:38 GMT -5
Started the update process, it got to front panel, the XMC-2 turned itself off, rebooted, and now it has just been on a blank screen for 20 minutes. The USB stick power LED is still lite. Any ideas? “Front Panel” is the last step in the process before it triggers a system reboot. It sounds like you’re using “Lowest Power” as your power mode which would explain the blank display. Have you pressed the Standby button to fully power it back up...? |
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Post by dkaudio on Feb 18, 2021 10:47:18 GMT -5
Started the update process, it got to front panel, the XMC-2 turned itself off, rebooted, and now it has just been on a blank screen for 20 minutes. The USB stick power LED is still lite. Any ideas? “Front Panel” is the last step in the process before it triggers a system reboot. It sounds like you’re using “Lowest Power” as your power mode which would explain the blank display. Have you pressed the Standby button to fully power it back up...? Thank you, I pressed the standby button and it booted. In firmware it reads 2.2 so looks like it went through. What is odd is the front panel update status bar was only 2/3 complete when it shut itself off...seemed like an error. |
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Post by rogerlons on Feb 18, 2021 10:53:40 GMT -5
2.2 update completed without issues. I haven't had any chance for a real listen yet, but I did observe a few things right away:
- Had to do the old "unplug and reset" trick to get ARC to connect properly.
- ARC power-on sync issues still exist. After reading Keith's update, I tried to power on the unit with the input set to "last used" - in this case ARC. The unit wouldn't sync properly. Back to the old way - power on to Balanced In, then input change to ARC... Sync'ed up no problem. I hope I didn't just jinx myself.
- I still have an issue where the processor sends a lovely cracking noise to the amps when it switches to an Atmos-enabled stream. This is coming from the aforementioned ARC device (TCL 5-series, which is the easiest for me to test) any time the stream sets audio to Atmos. Best do this with the volume turned way down - it's extremely unpleasant (and possibly harmful) if I forget this step. I will have to double-check whether this is still happening from the Oppo.
I will probably re-run Dirac this weekend, as my wife is not a fan of listening to the measurement tones. I need to do it anyway, since my old XPA-5 Gen1 bit the dust and was replaced with a shiny new Gen3... Now it's just a matter of getting to it.
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on Feb 18, 2021 10:59:12 GMT -5
Just a quick update here... With firmware v2.2 ... If you use the Video Remains On standby feature ("high power standby") ... When the processor is in Standby ONLY THE TV CONNECTED TO HDMI OUTPUT #2 WILL RECEIVE AUDIO.
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Post by hanse1 on Feb 18, 2021 11:04:00 GMT -5
After installing 2.2, I lost the sound to the TV when the XMC-2 is in standby. The previous version 2.1 sometimes lost its sound, but after restarting the XMC-2 it came back. Now I have tried with and without CEC but it makes no difference. I have a box of the type OnePlace (Canal Digital) and a Philips TV. I thought 2.2 would fix this particular problem but it only got worse. Have you done a cold reboot....back power switch off.....wait a full 60 seconds or longer and power back up. Are you using VRO? Excuse my ignorance but what is VRO? |
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on Feb 18, 2021 11:04:37 GMT -5
Another quick note... The thermometer bar that travels across the bottom of the screen when the processor boots up runs on a timer. It simply travels across the screen to show you that something is happening and the process hasn't hung up. (So how far it actually goes, or whether it reaches the far end or not, doesn't matter.)
This is also true for several of the other thermometer bars... They are simply there to show you that there is activity occurring...
“Front Panel” is the last step in the process before it triggers a system reboot. It sounds like you’re using “Lowest Power” as your power mode which would explain the blank display. Have you pressed the Standby button to fully power it back up...? Thank you, I pressed the standby button and it booted. In firmware it reads 2.2 so looks like it went through. What is odd is the front panel update status bar was only 2/3 complete when it shut itself off...seemed like an error. |
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KeithL
Administrator
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Post by KeithL on Feb 18, 2021 11:05:34 GMT -5
That would be "Video Remains On Standby"... otherwise known as "high-power standby"... Have you done a cold reboot....back power switch off.....wait a full 60 seconds or longer and power back up. Are you using VRO? Excuse my ignorance but what is VRO? |
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Post by doc1963 on Feb 18, 2021 11:06:46 GMT -5
“Front Panel” is the last step in the process before it triggers a system reboot. It sounds like you’re using “Lowest Power” as your power mode which would explain the blank display. Have you pressed the Standby button to fully power it back up...? Thank you, I pressed the standby button and it booted. In firmware it reads 2.2 so looks like it went through. What is odd is the front panel update status bar was only 2/3 complete when it shut itself off...seemed like an error. Just so you know moving forward, the progress bar for the final update module (Front Panel) never makes it fully to the end. My assumption is that “shutdown” is the final command and the display goes blank before it has a chance to complete. But yes... you’re all good.  |
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Post by hanse1 on Feb 18, 2021 11:07:19 GMT -5
Just a quick update here... With firmware v2.2 ... If you use the Video Remains On standby feature ("high power standby") ... When the processor is in Standby ONLY THE TV CONNECTED TO HDMI OUTPUT #2 WILL RECEIVE AUDIO.
And I've used HDMI1 so that might explain the problem |
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