ttocs
Global Moderator 
I always have a wonderful time, wherever I am, whomever I'm with. (Elwood P Dowd)
Posts: 8,162
|
Post by ttocs on Nov 16, 2021 9:48:42 GMT -5
I doubt very much that anyone, in hindsight, would have invested in a G3P knowing that you are in an endless wait to be able to utilize it's full potential. I did. and . . . . I made purchases from Panasonic, Philips, Pioneer, Denon, TiVo, and Emotiva, "after" previous purchases were not made whole by promises of features which either never ended up existing or were never properly implemented and operational issues were never resolved, which include a Panasonic tv and disc player which were advertised as being able to use one remote - a seemingly identical remote - but was never able to function as advertised. And yet, I bought more Panasonic TVs because I enjoyed what did work. Panasonic oversold, I beat my head against a wall that didn't move, but in the end - who cares? I loved the picture quality and recommended others buy the same models as I had because of how good they were. All of the brands listed above and others not listed have needed reboots-a-plenty, and a Philips dvd recorder bricked with a firmware update a couple months past the one year warranty and wasn't revertible. I don't regret any of the purchases due to the enjoyment derived being far greater than the difficulties incurred, and that is still the case today. |
|
|
|
Post by JNieves on Nov 16, 2021 11:23:43 GMT -5
It appears my issue is now resolved by simply choosing the USB as the preferred audio input for my HDMI Mac Mini input. Clearly the RMC experiences a major conflict if two different audio inputs are in place for one of the HDMI inputs. Even when putting the Mac Mini to sleep, or a complete reboot, the RMC now recognizes the device with no hiccups or spasms. No need for dongles either. Hope this info will be helpful to others. I also have a Mac Mini connected to the XMC-2 along with a PS4 and an Apple TV; all have been wonky (PS4 would show picture but no audio if input set to HDMI 2.0, Mac Mini never allowed more than 2 channel playback, AppleTV would not allow ATMOS sound). All the problems were fixed with these dongles: hdfury.com/product/dr-hdmi-4k/Expensive, I know but everything displays and sounds correctly with these in the chain. I think the HDMI board in the XMC-2 identifies itself in a way that does not jibe with the aforementioned components. I also ended up using the USB input for music, but I use a different input for HDMI and for USB. Addendum: Add me to the list - I purchased both the XMC-1 and my XMC-2 knowing full well that I would need to wait to use all the features (Dirac) and knowing both that bugs were to be expected and also knowing about how liquid release dates are with Emotiva. I was more than willing to work around bugs and wait for updates for that glorious sound. $15k sound on a $3k budget is just too good to not do. |
|
|
|
Post by 5channels on Nov 16, 2021 11:30:35 GMT -5
I doubt very much that anyone, in hindsight, would have invested in a G3P knowing that you are in an endless wait to be able to utilize it's full potential. I did. and . . . . I made purchases from Panasonic, Philips, Pioneer, Denon, TiVo, and Emotiva, "after" previous purchases were not made whole by promises of features which either never ended up existing or were never properly implemented and operational issues were never resolved, which include a Panasonic tv and disc player which were advertised as being able to use one remote - a seemingly identical remote - but was never able to function as advertised. And yet, I bought more Panasonic TVs because I enjoyed what did work. Panasonic oversold, I beat my head against a wall that didn't move, but in the end - who cares? I loved the picture quality and recommended others buy the same models as I had because of how good they were. All of the brands listed above and others not listed have needed reboots-a-plenty, and a Philips dvd recorder bricked with a firmware update a couple months past the one year warranty and wasn't revertible. I don't regret any of the purchases due to the enjoyment derived being far greater than the difficulties incurred, and that is still the case today. |
|
|
|
Post by 5channels on Nov 16, 2021 11:44:08 GMT -5
Note to self, never consider a product endorsement from protean force. That being said, I have purchased from Emotiva, but only for dumb products, read Power Amp. Sad to say I would not consider or recommend smart Emo products...Sorry to the fine folk at Emotiva, but it is once bitten twice shy that takes over here.
It is a shame that due to the digital age, we willingly accept the role of being beta testers. But what the hey, a shrug is a good as two thumbs up these days, right?
Cheers
|
|
|
|
Post by ElectricKoolAid on Nov 16, 2021 11:56:24 GMT -5
I get that some of you want DLBC yesterday/last month/last year. The fact is, it obviously isn’t . Wait for it, or don’t. It will be ready, when Emotiva deems it ready, and asking for a date that they probably don’t know yet isn’t going to make it come any sooner. We’ve been down the promised dates road before, and Emotiva was crucified for every date they missed, well intentioned or not. Now they don’t give any solid dates, and they get crucified for not saying much, if anything(see statement before this and the vicious cycle goes in a circle). Soooooooooooo, ditd, ditd. If they don’t move fast enough for you, then all G3P owners have options, sell and buy that perfect other processor you’ve been eyeing(no such thing), invest in your own home theater company and develop your own home theater processor since it’s so easy to do, or wait. This response isn’t meant to draw anyones ire, or piss on anyones thoughts, but raising one’s blood pressure over something you can’t possibly control is getting you nowhere. So sell and move on, invest and become an AV CEO, or wait. It really is that simple. I understand the "damned if you do, damned if you don't" thinking when it comes to updating customers on target dates and such. I think really what most of us are looking for is just a little more communication. I'm more than happy with something like "we are shooting to release the next update by the end of November" and then come that time if there are issues and such another update to the effect of "there were issues implementing X or Y and/or new issues were discovered when fixing this" and then give us a new estimate. For me, as a customer, that's all I'm really looking for. I guess that's because I have to do the same thing at my job for our customers/employees so it's just engrained in me to provide regular updates but I understand that it's a little different for public facing support. Either way, I'll continue to wait for another update but just wanted to throw out my 2 cents. |
|
cawgijoe
Emo VIPs 
"When you come to a fork in the road, take it." - Yogi Berra
Posts: 5,033
|
Post by cawgijoe on Nov 16, 2021 13:50:21 GMT -5
I get that some of you want DLBC yesterday/last month/last year. The fact is, it obviously isn’t . Wait for it, or don’t. It will be ready, when Emotiva deems it ready, and asking for a date that they probably don’t know yet isn’t going to make it come any sooner. We’ve been down the promised dates road before, and Emotiva was crucified for every date they missed, well intentioned or not. Now they don’t give any solid dates, and they get crucified for not saying much, if anything(see statement before this and the vicious cycle goes in a circle). Soooooooooooo, ditd, ditd. If they don’t move fast enough for you, then all G3P owners have options, sell and buy that perfect other processor you’ve been eyeing(no such thing), invest in your own home theater company and develop your own home theater processor since it’s so easy to do, or wait. This response isn’t meant to draw anyones ire, or piss on anyones thoughts, but raising one’s blood pressure over something you can’t possibly control is getting you nowhere. So sell and move on, invest and become an AV CEO, or wait. It really is that simple. I understand the "damned if you do, damned if you don't" thinking when it comes to updating customers on target dates and such. I think really what most of us are looking for is just a little more communication. I'm more than happy with something like "we are shooting to release the next update by the end of November" and then come that time if there are issues and such another update to the effect of "there were issues implementing X or Y and/or new issues were discovered when fixing this" and then give us a new estimate. For me, as a customer, that's all I'm really looking for. I guess that's because I have to do the same thing at my job for our customers/employees so it's just engrained in me to provide regular updates but I understand that it's a little different for public facing support. Either way, I'll continue to wait for another update but just wanted to throw out my 2 cents. If you have been here long enough, you know the history that lcseminole is referring to and it is nasty. So I understand Emotiva's current stance. However I also understand from the customer point of view how hard it is to wait on something that has been promised and wanting to know what a ballpark timeframe for delivery might be. The impatient usually move on to another product. The patient just put it out of mind and are rewarded when it comes. Right now I'm happy with my XMC-2 and it's current reliability and performance. It's producing the sound I need and I rarely have to reboot and I'm not looking for DLBC even if my processor could use it. |
|
|
|
Post by ElectricKoolAid on Nov 16, 2021 13:58:26 GMT -5
I understand the "damned if you do, damned if you don't" thinking when it comes to updating customers on target dates and such. I think really what most of us are looking for is just a little more communication. I'm more than happy with something like "we are shooting to release the next update by the end of November" and then come that time if there are issues and such another update to the effect of "there were issues implementing X or Y and/or new issues were discovered when fixing this" and then give us a new estimate. For me, as a customer, that's all I'm really looking for. I guess that's because I have to do the same thing at my job for our customers/employees so it's just engrained in me to provide regular updates but I understand that it's a little different for public facing support. Either way, I'll continue to wait for another update but just wanted to throw out my 2 cents. If you have been here long enough, you know the history that lcseminole is referring to and it is nasty. So I understand Emotiva's current stance. However I also understand from the customer point of view how hard it is to wait on something that has been promised and wanting to know what a ballpark timeframe for delivery might be. The impatient usually move on to another product. The patient just put it out of mind and are rewarded when it comes. Right now I'm happy with my XMC-2 and it's current reliability and performance. It's producing the sound I need and I rarely have to reboot and I'm not looking for DLBC even if my processor could use it. Fair enough, I've only been around these parts for the last 11 months or so. |
|
|
|
Post by 5channels on Nov 16, 2021 14:53:45 GMT -5
How about a courtesy message to all Emoids.
"We are actively working on DLBC for G3P processors. The current yet tentative target for release is first quarter 2022. Please note that due to the complexities of this solution all timelines are tentative, but we assure you that DBLC is in active development at Emotiva"
Empty customer service desks are not an encouraging sign
|
|
|
|
Post by brutiarti on Nov 16, 2021 15:27:55 GMT -5
How about a courtesy message to all Emoids. "We are actively working on DLBC for G3P processors. The current yet tentative target for release is first quarter 2022. Please note that due to the complexities of this solution all timelines are tentative, but we assure you that DBLC is in active development at Emotiva" Empty customer service desks are not an encouraging sign For desperate customers , first quarter means January 1st , lol |
|
|
|
Post by 5channels on Nov 16, 2021 15:34:31 GMT -5
before 8am...LOL
|
|
|
|
Post by JNieves on Nov 16, 2021 16:32:27 GMT -5
Emoids... sounds like something you would treat with numbing cream...
|
|
|
|
Post by 5channels on Nov 16, 2021 16:44:49 GMT -5
I was going to use Emotopians, but seeing as there is an itch...
|
|
|
|
Post by routlaw on Nov 16, 2021 17:53:39 GMT -5
I also have a Mac Mini connected to the XMC-2 along with a PS4 and an Apple TV; all have been wonky (PS4 would show picture but no audio if input set to HDMI 2.0, Mac Mini never allowed more than 2 channel playback, AppleTV would not allow ATMOS sound). All the problems were fixed with these dongles: hdfury.com/product/dr-hdmi-4k/Expensive, I know but everything displays and sounds correctly with these in the chain. I think the HDMI board in the XMC-2 identifies itself in a way that does not jibe with the aforementioned components. I also ended up using the USB input for music, but I use a different input for HDMI and for USB. Addendum: Add me to the list - I purchased both the XMC-1 and my XMC-2 knowing full well that I would need to wait to use all the features (Dirac) and knowing both that bugs were to be expected and also knowing about how liquid release dates are with Emotiva. I was more than willing to work around bugs and wait for updates for that glorious sound. $15k sound on a $3k budget is just too good to not do. Sounds like you've created a good working situation for this. I have also looked into this hdfury devices if for but mostly for my projector rather than sound. The more I think about early on shortly after receiving my RMC-1L I ran into a similar issue with my Opponent 203 player that was of course connected via HDMI but also a coax cable as well as analog FR&FL cables. Long story short the RMC had a nervous breakdown. Anyway now that I know what not to do in configuring gear everything over the last week or so has been smooth sailing with one exception worth mentioning. From what I can determine these devices really don't like to have cable swapping going on while powered up and this is especially true of USB. Much easier to put into standby, swap cables then turn back on. From what I can tell so far analog cables don't create this problem, but if doing this its better to mute the processor or swap to a different input while switching IMHO. |
|
|
|
Post by AudioHTIT on Nov 17, 2021 11:24:24 GMT -5
I also have a Mac Mini connected to the XMC-2 along with a PS4 and an Apple TV; all have been wonky (PS4 would show picture but no audio if input set to HDMI 2.0, Mac Mini never allowed more than 2 channel playback, AppleTV would not allow ATMOS sound). All the problems were fixed with these dongles: hdfury.com/product/dr-hdmi-4k/Expensive, I know but everything displays and sounds correctly with these in the chain. I think the HDMI board in the XMC-2 identifies itself in a way that does not jibe with the aforementioned components. I also ended up using the USB input for music, but I use a different input for HDMI and for USB. Addendum: Add me to the list - I purchased both the XMC-1 and my XMC-2 knowing full well that I would need to wait to use all the features (Dirac) and knowing both that bugs were to be expected and also knowing about how liquid release dates are with Emotiva. I was more than willing to work around bugs and wait for updates for that glorious sound. $15k sound on a $3k budget is just too good to not do. Sounds like you've created a good working situation for this. I have also looked into this hdfury devices if for but mostly for my projector rather than sound. The more I think about early on shortly after receiving my RMC-1L I ran into a similar issue with my Opponent 203 player that was of course connected via HDMI but also a coax cable as well as analog FR&FL cables. Long story short the RMC had a nervous breakdown. Anyway now that I know what not to do in configuring gear everything over the last week or so has been smooth sailing with one exception worth mentioning. From what I can determine these devices really don't like to have cable swapping going on while powered up and this is especially true of USB. Much easier to put into standby, swap cables then turn back on. From what I can tell so far analog cables don't create this problem, but if doing this its better to mute the processor or swap to a different input while switching IMHO. I truly believe most of the issues I’ve had are directly tied to the HDMI output on the Mac mini (and possibly other models). My problems began when I installed the V3 board in the XMC-1, video handshakes became problematic and it was almost impossible to let the mini go to sleep and wake back up gracefully (I believe ttocs and I commiserated during this time). The problems continued with the RMC-1, but were not quite as severe — which is to say that the V3 HDMI board in both models, and the Firmware controlling it, contribute to the problem. To be clear, the primary problem I am experiencing is loss of display (black screen), typically after the mini goes to sleep, but sometimes after a reboot (complete power down of the mini usually is successful). I can also normally use VNC to get into the mini and see the display is no longer defined. I continue to put the weight of the blame on the mini because I use a second mini for my desktop, and have had similar problems since switching to a 4K TV as my monitor in 2018 (both a Toshiba, and TCL). So while in my experience the problem seemed to begin with the V3 board, I would contend that it allowed the mini to ‘see’ the 4K resolution of my then (also new) Sony 85x900F. Both of my minis are 2018’s so I have not tested with an M1 based model, though it sounds like the issues continue (I might test with my new M1 Max based MacBook Pro 14 when I return home after ski season ⛷) Having also looked to the Apple forums for help, another contributor may be some core change to macOS that began with Catalina. The are long threads of users having issues connecting minis with Catalina (and now later releases) with 4K TVs. In my case USB devices, either problematic individual devices or certain combinations, also contribute. On occasion I’ve had to disconnect certain USB devices to get the mini’s HDMI output to rediscover the display — the Emotiva DC-1 has often been the culprit of choice, but not exclusively. Of course no discussion can go on without mentioning cables, but using a known good 4K certified cable as inexpensive as the Monoprice 4K Slim HDMIs should eliminate them from consideration. While I agree that it’s good practice to shut your system down before swapping cables (especially HDMI ), I think it’s not directly related to this issue. I also have had multiple TVs connected to my XMC-1v3 and RMC-1 (HD/G4, 4K/G5, 4K/G6), as well as the Oppo 203 and have had virtually no issues with them. I would be surprised if switching the minis HDMI audio input to USB solves this problem long term, as I ran my system that way for some time and still had problems, but as all I’ve outlined above shows there are many variables, so it’s possible. As I wrote in a previous post, both my desktop mini and my HT mini have become stable after using a USB-C to HDMI adapter for the monitor connection (rendering DisplayPort), and though it’s inconvenient to lose a USB-C connection, and it annoys me to not be able to use the HDMI output designed for this purpose, it’s nice to have it just work. The HDFury appears to be another solution. All this is to say that while I think the mini is the primary culprit (hardware and OS), there is some blame to be placed with the G3P/V3/FW, somewhat of an oil and water situation. It will be interesting to see if the G3P’s HDMI 2.1 board has any affect on this situation. |
|
scotts
Seeker Of Truth
Posts: 8
|
Post by scotts on Nov 17, 2021 11:42:57 GMT -5
Does anybody know if an eACR upgrade to the XMC-2 will require a future HDMI board, or can it be done just with a software upgrade? Also when can we expect an eARC upgrade to come?
|
|
|
|
Post by AudioHTIT on Nov 17, 2021 11:52:18 GMT -5
Does anybody know if an eACR upgrade to the XMC-2 will require a future HDMI board, or can it be done just with a software upgrade? Also when can we expect an eARC upgrade to come? From comments that were made some time ago many of us feel a new board will be required. But lately is seems the definition of eARC has become rather slippery, it appears if you implement only parts of the standard, you can still call it eARC (TV 4KG2). So I’d say it might be possible that some part of eARC could be exposed with the current board, but couldn’t venture if it would meet your needs. It’s not a good idea to speculate about hardware or software releases, though someone ventured next spring for the full HDMI 2.1 board with eARC. |
|
LCSeminole
Global Moderator
Res firma mitescere nescit.
Posts: 20,856
|
Post by LCSeminole on Nov 17, 2021 12:11:45 GMT -5
Does anybody know if an eACR upgrade to the XMC-2 will require a future HDMI board, or can it be done just with a software upgrade? Also when can we expect an eARC upgrade to come? I'm pretty sure that the current HDMI 2.0b board can not be upgraded with eARC with a software/firmware update(only one of the employees Dan/Lonnie/HairNick/KeithL/Ray could answer). A new HDMI 2.1 board has been acknowledged by Emotiva, but no firm dates have been given. Emotiva did answer a few questions put forth to them in a video on their YouTube channel, just look for video subject line, "Emotiva Audio HDMI Installation Guide". They did say this on one of the questions, "It will be an eARC board with the new Dolby update, DTSX Pro, and IMAX Enhanced." |
|
fribur
Seeker Of Truth
Posts: 9
|
Post by fribur on Nov 17, 2021 20:38:11 GMT -5
Those HDMI handshake issues are driving me nuts. ATV4K—> VIZIO OLED65-H1 works like a charm. No issues whatsoever with 4K 12bit (Dolby Vision) 60Hz.
ATV4K—> XMC-2 —> VIZIO OLED65-H1: works up to 30Hz (4K 12bit), with 60 Hz it works in 1 case out of a hundred. And only when I turn on the XMC-2 first, turn around 3-times, at full moon, and then turn on the rest via the Apple Remote (not the TV remote). Tried all kinds of top notch 48 Gbit HDMI cable. 3ft long Monoprice. Tried all possible combinations of CEC setting on all devices. I am so tiered of this. Should I return the TV? Or the XMC-2? Or wait for the next firmware fix for either to magically fix it (got the newest one for each of devices)?
Unbelievable. It’s 2021 and ATV4K and those Vizios are not exactly rare devices….
|
|
Lsc
Emo VIPs
Posts: 3,435
|
Post by Lsc on Nov 17, 2021 21:12:35 GMT -5
Those HDMI handshake issues are driving me nuts. ATV4K—> VIZIO OLED65-H1 works like a charm. No issues whatsoever with 4K 12bit (Dolby Vision) 60Hz. ATV4K—> XMC-2 —> VIZIO OLED65-H1: works up to 30Hz (4K 12bit), with 60 Hz it works in 1 case out of a hundred. And only when I turn on the XMC-2 first, turn around 3-times, at full moon, and then turn on the rest via the Apple Remote (not the TV remote). Tried all kinds of top notch 48 Gbit HDMI cable. 3ft long Monoprice. Tried all possible combinations of CEC setting on all devices. I am so tiered of this. Should I return the TV? Or the XMC-2? Or wait for the next firmware fix for either to magically fix it (got the newest one for each of devices)? Unbelievable. It’s 2021 and ATV4K and those Vizios are not exactly rare devices…. I have a Vizio - cheaper 65” and it does not work well with the XMC2. My other 2 LG 65” OLED work much better. Still perfect but the Vizio is the worst. |
|
Lsc
Emo VIPs
Posts: 3,435
|
Post by Lsc on Nov 18, 2021 0:48:16 GMT -5
Does anybody know if an eACR upgrade to the XMC-2 will require a future HDMI board, or can it be done just with a software upgrade? Also when can we expect an eARC upgrade to come? The new HDMI 2.1 board with eARC will be nice for my Vizio that has eARC. |
|
