ken51
Minor Hero
Posts: 37
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Post by ken51 on Mar 27, 2021 6:08:19 GMT -5
I recently purchased the PT 100/ S300 from my local hifi shop. I had been powering Polk Lsi 15 speakers with an underpowered amp. The salesman was an ex Polk employee and recommended this combo to get the most out of the speakers. The speakers sound much better, but I believe I have become bored with them. I am looking for a more immersive experience. The center imaging of the speakers is fine, but the soundstage is not as wide and deep as I would like. I want to audition the T1+ and the T2+, but returning one would probably cost me $$, which I would like to avoid. My room is 19x12. The setup is on the 12’ wall, 41” from the wall, 21” from the side walls. The sweet spot is about 10’ away. Which speaker would be better for me and my room? I do have a sub woofer. Thanks in advance.
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Post by pallpoul on Mar 27, 2021 8:01:23 GMT -5
T2+, but get an XPA-2 Gen-3 amp.
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ken51
Minor Hero
Posts: 37
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Post by ken51 on Mar 27, 2021 9:59:58 GMT -5
This is for music. I don’t feel the need to spend an extra $1000.
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Post by vcautokid on Mar 27, 2021 13:38:29 GMT -5
Sounds awesome. How far will sit from the speakers? What make and size of the Subwoofer? The T2+ almost gets along fine without a Subwoofer but since you have one, you will have the extension down low and it will do the heavy lifting down there. So that being said, you could get away with the T1+. Again depending on your seating distance. If you will be fairly close, I think the T1+ will work just fine. Further back, you may enjoy the slightly bigger oomph of the T2+. If it were me I would go with the T2+ as it will stay with me as I grow my system later such as a more powerful power amplifier, or if I prefer to listen maybe without the Subwoofer. The T2+ will give more to you. As always your room Acoustics and speaker placement are key, and treatment of the room to make the room complement your speakers and Subwoofer. Most people think backwards and pay attention to the speakers first. Nope, not the best approach, or even worse use room correction to attempt fix a room's problem. Also a nope. Make sure the room is right first. Use whatever tools are available to you if you haven't already done so. Understanding your room first and getting the most out it will help your speaker and subwoofer get along well in there together. I wanted to share this rather than be just another opinion toggle get this or that. Your room matters more first than any speaker you would select.
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ken51
Minor Hero
Posts: 37
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Post by ken51 on Mar 27, 2021 14:28:26 GMT -5
My room is not great. One side is ceiling to floor windows. The other side is a sofa. The back wall is 6’ with an opening to my kitchen. There is a rug. The ceiling is vaulted and appsx 9’. Treating the room is a challenge due to WAF issues.I’m leaning now towards the T2+. Your input is appreciated. Thank you. I may just bite the bullet and order both and pay for the return. Maybe Emotiva will waive the return cost if I keep one pair.
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Post by davidl81 on Mar 27, 2021 14:41:59 GMT -5
My room is not great. One side is ceiling to floor windows. The other side is a sofa. The back wall is 6’ with an opening to my kitchen. There is a rug. The ceiling is vaulted and appsx 9’. Treating the room is a challenge due to WAF issues.I’m leaning now towards the T2+. Your input is appreciated. Thank you. I may just bite the bullet and order both and pay for the return. Maybe Emotiva will waive the return cost if I keep one pair. The T2 will have better bass response than the T1, and if price is not a big issue (or physical size) I would get the T2 over the T1. The T2 will do everything the T1 does, but just with better low end. I would just get the T2 and call it good.
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Post by vcautokid on Mar 27, 2021 14:57:01 GMT -5
Actually there are many cool tricks to room treatment that don't make your room look like a studio. You can use pictures with transparent cloth that allows dampening material underneath. Carpeting, Putting something over a glass table and so on. Also treatment is as subtle or as obvious as need be. Most rooms are asymmetric and that is not necessarily a liability. I would say sure go for the T2+ but I wanted to let you know you have options. Some may find the T1+ great in a much smaller room or different instance. It is always about options and key optimizations that make a difference.
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Post by pallpoul on Mar 27, 2021 16:33:07 GMT -5
The T2+ will not be optimal with an S300 amp. I tried it, and ended up with the xpa-2 Gen3. It's not to say it will not work, however an s300 will get u by The T 1+ will be great with the s300, and no need to spend on the xpa -2 .. just an advise.
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Post by Ex_Vintage on Mar 27, 2021 22:26:16 GMT -5
If you are not going to change the amp, look for some higher sensitivity speakers like Klipsch or Tekton.
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Post by garbulky on Mar 27, 2021 22:54:07 GMT -5
A used pair of emotiva PA-1 monoblocks at about $500-600 would do very well powering the T2.
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ken51
Minor Hero
Posts: 37
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Post by ken51 on Mar 28, 2021 6:23:23 GMT -5
It’s funny how opinions differ on whether or not the T2+ will work with the A300. Steve Guttenberg reviewed it with Maggie’s and power hungry Elacs and said it was fine. My current speakers have an efficiency’ of 88db and the T2’s are 91db. So according to the numbers, the T2s should be ok. I have a serious case of FOMO, so I will order both. And thanks for all for your replies. I will call Emotiva, and listen to what they have to say. In the hifi store where I bought my amps,I listened to Goldenear Triton 3 speakers. They also have a ribbon tweeter but were $2800. They had the sound I was looking for. This is why the Emotiva speakers intrigue me.
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Post by brutiarti on Mar 28, 2021 9:45:36 GMT -5
I have the T2 (not the +) powered by a Primare amp with 160W at 4ohms and the T2s sound wonderful. I don’t play them loud tough
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Post by Ex_Vintage on Mar 28, 2021 12:49:18 GMT -5
It’s funny how opinions differ on whether or not the T2+ will work with the A300. Steve Guttenberg reviewed it with Maggie’s and power hungry Elacs and said it was fine. My current speakers have an efficiency’ of 88db and the T2’s are 91db. So according to the numbers, the T2s should be ok. I have a serious case of FOMO, so I will order both. And thanks for all for your replies. I will call Emotiva, and listen to what they have to say. In the hifi store where I bought my amps,I listened to Goldenear Triton 3 speakers. They also have a ribbon tweeter but were $2800. They had the sound I was looking for. This is why the Emotiva speakers intrigue me. I have some B1+ speakers in my workout room. The ribbon tweeter in the Emo speakers is excellent. Very good clarity, without the strain of a horn. I previously had an A-500 (110W) driving some Elac UF5's (85db). I changed to a XPA amp and it helped with mid to low definition. The Emo speakers should work well with the A-300.
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Post by doc1963 on Mar 29, 2021 10:36:06 GMT -5
ken51… as someone who owns the T2, but has also owned the LSi 15, I would suggest that you take a look at the review of the T2+ recently posted by Thomas & Stereo found HERE. His impressions are probably the most “fair” and the closest to my own that I’ve ever encountered. While his review is highly favorable, he does point out what you might be giving up with the T2. Especially when used primarily for a two-channel setup. IMO, the LSi series marked Polk’s reentry back into serious hi-fidelity and, aside from my original Monitor 10B’s, still remains as one of my favorite “stand alone” stereo speakers. At the time, Vifa’s Ring Radiator was one of the best tweeters I’d heard. I was such a huge fan of the LSi’s, I decided to give them to my son rather than sell them when making my transition over to more of a “ hybrid” type of system. While the LSi’s were outstanding for music, their voicing fell just a bit short for home theater use, so I had to look beyond. The T2 is an excellent speaker that is well balanced and serves well for both music and home theater. But in order to do this, there are some tradeoffs which I’m going to try my best to outline here before you decide. Having had a long relationship with the LSi 15, I can tell you that you will lose that slightly “bumped up” bottom end, but will gain a more “accurate” bass response with the T2. Your first impression will be “where’s the bass…?” It is there, but is isn’t accentuated or exaggerated in any way. Those two 8” woofers will produce plenty of accurate bass, but not in the volumes you might think you’re going to get. You “might” need your subwoofer to accompany them… With the T2, you will also trade off the warmer midrange of the LSi. The T2 is neutral and uncolored. I can understand why Thomas referred to it as “dry”. It might be somewhat dry, but it is accurate. But what you will gain, in spades, is an extended and very detailed high end that is about the best I’ve heard from a loudspeaker anywhere close to this price. While I wouldn’t necessarily use the same terminology, some would say it’s “bright” without being fatiguing. I fully agree with the latter, but would stop short of calling it bright. However, that might be as a result of my “older” ears. All of this, combined, leads to a speaker that is very well rounded for both stereo and home theater “if” you are willing to accept that it is voiced to be both accurate and neutral and focuses on the quality of the recording rather than trying to veil it. If your specific tastes call for “warmth”, “buttery smoothness”, a “voluptuous bottom end” or a speaker that’s forgiving of less than stellar source material, you won’t find this here. If “accuracy” and “micro-dynamics” are most desirable, then these are your discounted ticket. Placement will also be an important factor with the T2. Prepare to spend some quality “Goldilocks” time here. They don’t have to be as forward in the room as you think, but having just the right amount of toe in/out will work wonders. Regardless of which you chose (T1+ or T2+), just be cautiously aware that the Airmotiv loudspeakers are not "voiced" the same as the Polk LSi15’s that you currently own, nor are they voiced the same as the GoldenEar Tritons that you’ve mentioned. Getting that fact out of the way, up front, might help you decide if you really do want to pursue an audition. You're already aware that returning the T2 would be costly if, in fact, you may be already suspecting that this isn’t the "sound" you're looking for. If you like the overall LSi's sound, but would prefer a slightly more extended and detailed top end, the Tritons might be a better fit, but come at a higher cost. Or, if you wait just a few more weeks, Polk is releasing their new “Reserve” series which looks to be quite compelling and may be exactly what you’re looking for. Again, at a higher price. But if either of those two options more precisely fit your parameters, does their price versus the Airmotiv really matter...? My biggest concerns for you are what you might be expecting from the T2, how well they would match your parameters and, ultimately, how well they would integrate with the rest of your system. While others have already pointed out your amp (which I consider to be modestly adequate), I’m more concerned about your having a preamp with absolutely no bass management. If you find that you need to integrate your subwoofer, that concern “could” become a real problem depending upon how diverse and useful the onboard controls of your subwoofer really are (you didn’t mention your specific subwoofer). At the end of the day, please take these words for what they are… strictly an opinion.
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Post by housetech on Mar 29, 2021 15:13:46 GMT -5
Dock1963- Vifa’s Ring Radiator- agreed, very nice tweeter price to performance. Reserve R700 could be a big player in the $2k/pair arena. If they had come out last year, I would have auditioned them prior to buying T2+. I found the T2 as you described them.
I like the 2-way half of the T2. The woofer output is accurate but are less than expected in loudness for two 8" woofers. Turning up the bass 2-6db doesn't make much difference through the receiver we're using... +2db is about the most I go. I like the folded ribbon, they are NOT too bright. (I'm a M.A. owner) The T2 is an odd fit for me; I like & enjoy them, but not a "go to" speaker for 'sit down' stereo music for me. I use the T2 for general music listening when we're cooking or working around the house. I have connected them to XMC & XPA5, but my opinion didn't change. I have 2.5 way that can match or exceed the T2 bass using smaller drivers. If you plan to use a sub, the T1+ could work for you. If there is a day trip's drive dealer near, I'ld go compare them. A must for the T2- REMOVE the grills for imagining improvement. (Mine are in their boxes)
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Post by creimes on Mar 29, 2021 17:00:52 GMT -5
Dock1963- Vifa’s Ring Radiator- agreed, very nice tweeter price to performance. Reserve R700 could be a big player in the $2k/pair arena. If they had come out last year, I would have auditioned them prior to buying T2+. I found the T2 as you described them. I like the 2-way half of the T2. The woofer output is accurate but are less than expected in loudness for two 8" woofers. Turning up the bass 2-6db doesn't make much difference through the receiver we're using... +2db is about the most I go. I like the folded ribbon, they are NOT too bright. (I'm a M.A. owner) The T2 is an odd fit for me; I like & enjoy them, but not a "go to" speaker for 'sit down' stereo music for me. I use the T2 for general music listening when we're cooking or working around the house. I have connected them to XMC & XPA5, but my opinion didn't change. I have 2.5 way that can match or exceed the T2 bass using smaller drivers. If you plan to use a sub, the T1+ could work for you. If there is a day trip's drive dealer near, I'ld go compare them. A must for the T2- REMOVE the grills for imagining improvement. (Mine are in their boxes) Coming from Monitor Audio RX6 to Chane A5rx-c and then Emotiva T1 and now Chane 753 I found the T1 to have the most exaggerated bass of them all, I found the low end and high end of the T1 more pronounced than the mids whereas the 753 are even across the board, the bass is powerful and tighter and the mids and highs match the bass better on the 753 compared to the T1, out of all those towers the T1 to my ears in my room were more v shaped than all the other speakers I have had or have. Chad
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Post by housetech on Mar 29, 2021 19:44:43 GMT -5
Chad, I agree with the mids of the "T"s could be more pronounced. The M.A.s have mids and now they're positioned further away from the wall, bass is there too. I would like to hear the 753 that you settled on. I remember your first Chanes didn't quite do it for you. 3x 210mm poly bass drivers, Sealed bass system- interesting.
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Post by creimes on Mar 29, 2021 20:52:41 GMT -5
Chad, I agree with the mids of the "T"s could be more pronounced. The M.A.s have mids and now they're positioned further away from the wall, bass is there too. I would like to hear the 753 that you settled on. I remember your first Chanes didn't quite do it for you. 3x 210mm poly bass drivers, Sealed bass system- interesting. I really enjoyed the A5rx-c I had and then Emotiva had the T1 on sale and another 20% off(Axpona 20 Sale) so I had to buy the T1 lol, the 753 are the largest most expensive speaker I have owned to date but I am really really liking them, the drivers blend very well, the T1 were a great sounding speaker as well but when I ran them in Reference Stereo as I like to do for 2ch on my XMC-1 they were lacking a mid presentation and I'm not sure why but that was what I found, they seemed very bass heavy considering the size and only having two 6.5 bass drivers. I can't find any faults yet on these 753, for me they are fantastic as I currently don't have subs so they are running full range Chad
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ken51
Minor Hero
Posts: 37
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Post by ken51 on Mar 30, 2021 5:53:15 GMT -5
Doc1963 Not being able to get a baseline listen at a dealer really is a conundrum. The pandemic set me off on this quest, as I have listened to music in copious amounts and have been living vicariously through YouTube reviews and gear articles. That, and as I have been recovering from shoulder surgery, I have way too much time on my hands. I am veering now in the direction of auditioning speakers in the 3 hifi shops in my area. I,too, have older ears and nuances in speakers probably bypass my ears. I like the Polk’s, but would like a more immersive experience. I really veered off and listened to Elacs Unifi UB 52, Kef Q350, and Klipsch RP 600. This shop has no dedicated listening rooms and was difficult to listen closely, but the KEFs came close to what I’m looking for. I will probably try those and if I like them, just alternate them with my existing speakers. I also like to get the biggest bang for the buck. Not that I’m cheap, but frugal. As a photo hobbyist, I never bought the latest and greatest, because a better camera never made me a better photographer. I bought functional gear,ba lot of it used from reputable dealers like BH Photo. So with 2 hobbies going on I cannot justify spending $2800 on the Goldenears. The T2s are the top of my budget and based on your insight, I will pass on that option. Thank you very much.
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Post by doc1963 on Mar 30, 2021 10:33:16 GMT -5
Doc1963 Not being able to get a baseline listen at a dealer really is a conundrum. The pandemic set me off on this quest, as I have listened to music in copious amounts and have been living vicariously through YouTube reviews and gear articles. That, and as I have been recovering from shoulder surgery, I have way too much time on my hands. I am veering now in the direction of auditioning speakers in the 3 hifi shops in my area. I,too, have older ears and nuances in speakers probably bypass my ears. I like the Polk’s, but would like a more immersive experience. I really veered off and listened to Elacs Unifi UB 52, Kef Q350, and Klipsch RP 600. This shop has no dedicated listening rooms and was difficult to listen closely, but the KEFs came close to what I’m looking for. I will probably try those and if I like them, just alternate them with my existing speakers. I also like to get the biggest bang for the buck. Not that I’m cheap, but frugal. As a photo hobbyist, I never bought the latest and greatest, because a better camera never made me a better photographer. I bought functional gear,ba lot of it used from reputable dealers like BH Photo. So with 2 hobbies going on I cannot justify spending $2800 on the Goldenears. The T2s are the top of my budget and based on your insight, I will pass on that option. Thank you very much. I had the feeling that the T2+ wouldn’t fully meet your expectations. Not that the T2’s aren’t exceptional speakers (they are), but they are voiced to be more accurate (less colored) in certain frequencies than what you are accustomed to with the LSi’s. It’s a balancing act to voice a speaker to perform equally well with both music and home theater. The Airmotiv’s do this quite well by not leaning too far one way or the other. But for someone, like yourself, whose interests may stop at just music, they may not be “ everything” you’re hoping for in one package. I totally get where you’re coming from regarding being “frugal”. I’m also very akin to your analogies. I, too, could have been entirely comfortable spending (at least) twice as much money on the gear that makes up my system, but if that gear didn’t bring an appreciable uptick in performance, I wouldn’t waste the money. I strongly believe that there is a point of diminishing return on any investment. And since retirement is just around the corner for me, I’d rather invest the savings where I know I’ll eventually need it. So yes, I totally get it. It’s interesting that you have auditioned, and liked, the KEF Q350. If you are not bound to having a large floor standing speaker (like the T2) and would consider a speaker of smaller stature, why not consider auditioning the T-Zero or even the B1+…? Either of these two options could easily provide you with both the top end and the imaging you're looking for and would be much less expensive to return if they don’t meet your expectations. Since the B1+ pair comes in a single box, those certainly should be less expensive to return versus a larger tower. But more importantly, either of those two options would provide you with an opportunity to audition the exceptional Airmotiv tweeter and, since they don’t attempt to dig quite as deep, should integrate well with your subwoofer. While I have not heard them myself, the T-Zero is said to be the “ sleeper” of the Airmotiv lineup. You might want to consider them. For what it’s worth, take a look at these online reviews and comparisons as well as an opinion of the T-Zero from a fellow forum member who has also auditioned the Q350… Reviews of the B1+ HERE and HERE. Reviews of the T-Zero HERE, HERE and from a forum member HERE. And for a comparison between the B1+ and three other competing bookshelf speakers (including a similar KEF), look HEREHope this helps...
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