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Post by audiobill on Feb 3, 2023 15:19:48 GMT -5
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 3, 2023 17:39:34 GMT -5
What could Emo possibly offer that's not readily available from many others? A lower price than Topping? A lower price? Probably not. But the sound of the DAC is only partially from the converter chip. The low-pass filters affect the sound The output buffer amps affect the sound The power supply affects the sound The features (balanced, unbalanced, analog bypass, etc.) affect the sound Topping DOES offer great value for the money spent, but so do other companies... I had to decide between a Topping and my Emotiva DAC recently. The Topping got sold... |
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Post by audiobill on Feb 3, 2023 17:41:52 GMT -5
I’m so excited to see what Keith conjures up in Emo’s “all out assault on the high end”
I’ll never understand the business miscall in deleting the DC1. Just hope they use quality parts.
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Lsc
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Post by Lsc on Feb 3, 2023 18:18:58 GMT -5
There is a rather important distinction which I don't see here... An actual analog ladder network is made out of resistors and so is actually passive. However, that does not mean that devices that have an analog ladder network volume control IN THEM are passive. The DC1 did have an analog ladder network type Volume Control. This means that, with a digital input, the output of the DAC circuitry itself was fixed, and the output volume was controlled by an analog ladder network... And it also means that, with an analog input, the entire signal path was analog... However the signal path was NOT passive... There were still always active ANALOG buffers and an active ANALOG gain stage in the signal path (an ACTIVE ANALOG preamp section). … Yes this is the limitation of my SMSL D400ES and most other DACs at this price point. The volume is useless because it reduces the resolution. I’m hoping the XMC2’s analog preamp is good enough. It sounds pretty good right now since the new DAC improved my system’s sound quality. |
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Post by novisnick on Feb 3, 2023 18:28:41 GMT -5
I’m so excited to see what Keith conjures up in Emo’s “all out assault on the high end” I’ll never understand the business miscall in deleting the DC1. Just hope they use quality parts. |
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Post by audiobill on Feb 3, 2023 18:43:20 GMT -5
Sometime in late 2024 if history be the guide.
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 3, 2023 23:51:31 GMT -5
Yes, this is the limitation of my SMSL D400ES and most other DACs at this price point. The volume is useless because it reduces the resolution… Really? Although true in the very early days of digital, every digital volume control that I know of these days oversamples the bejesus out of the audio signal before doing volume attenuation. This minimizes bit depth loss to the point of inaudibility (although you’re right, some bit depth reduction is still afoot). Unless you’re driving Klipschorns with a thousand-watt amp, I doubt you’d be able to reduce the volume sufficiently to hear any resolution loss. |
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Post by vcautokid on Feb 4, 2023 11:39:59 GMT -5
The DAC world has changed immensely since the DC-1 days. I was hoping for a successor to DC-1 too. But needs change,and I had moved on to other makes, and models. You can only wait so long. Plus the bargains today are really good. The Topping E70, and L70 together making $700.00, says I can get them any time if I don't want to wait. High End DACs, really not my bag as the lower costs ones are doing so well. Heck even the Schiit Bifrost2 is really strong if you don't want to wait. I hope Emotiva wows me at least as much as they did with MR-1. To me the most exciting product brought out in recent history of Emotiva. This DAC would have to be really something to compete. Going to be a most curious couple of years. 2024 sounds about right.
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Lsc
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Post by Lsc on Feb 4, 2023 12:56:04 GMT -5
Yes, this is the limitation of my SMSL D400ES and most other DACs at this price point. The volume is useless because it reduces the resolution… Really? Although true in the very early days of digital, every digital volume control that I know of these days oversamples the bejesus out of the audio signal before doing volume attenuation. This minimizes bit depth loss to the point of inaudibility (although you’re right, some bit depth reduction is still afoot). Unless you’re driving Klipschorns with a thousand-watt amp, I doubt you’d be able to reduce the volume sufficiently to hear any resolution loss. What I said is what technically happens per Keith. Now whether that can be heard or not, I’m not sure. I have my new SMSL DAC fixed out going into the XMC2’s balanced in….never used this input before but I’m very glad Emotiva provided it. My salon2 has never sounded so good. I don’t think I’ll be able to tell if I went directly into the amp from the SMSL D400ES and it would just be a massive inconvenience and not really sustainable as I don’t want to be rewiring when listening to 2 channel. |
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Post by brubacca on Feb 5, 2023 9:55:03 GMT -5
I just this week got a Schiit Modi MultiBit 2 DAC. Its darn good and only $300.
I wish Emotiva well, but a few years ago it became apparent to me that Emotiva was focusing more on Home Theater with all the processors.
I think you'd be hard pressed to compare sonically with Schiit's MultiBit Lineup. ifi audio also has very interesting products at some lower price points.
Now an Emotiva Dac with Ethernet/Roon input, more of a streamer becomes much more interesting to me.
Streamers while coming down in price just this week , are a place where overpriced products seem to reign. Something comparable to the ifi NEO Stream at $1,300 would be a good target for a higher end Emotiva Product. Do a similar thing for say $700/$800 and you really would have something there. Lose the silly stuff like the optical Ethernet connection.
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 5, 2023 11:21:32 GMT -5
I just this week got a Schiit Modi MultiBit 2 DAC. Its darn good and only $300. I wish Emotiva well, but a few years ago it became apparent to me that Emotiva was focusing more on Home Theater with all the processors. I think you'd be hard pressed to compare sonically with Schiit's MultiBit Lineup. ifi audio also has very interesting products at some lower price points. Now an Emotiva Dac with Ethernet/Roon input, more of a streamer becomes much more interesting to me. Streamers while coming down in price just this week , are a place where overpriced products seem to reign. Something comparable to the ifi NEO Stream at $1,300 would be a good target for a higher end Emotiva Product. Do a similar thing for say $700/$800 and you really would have something there. Lose the silly stuff like the optical Ethernet connection. You bring up a whole variety of interesting topics with this one post! 1. Emotiva's focus on Home Theater - I agree with you totally. Emotiva has, if not abandoned, at least put their "high-end-audio" customers on the back burner for a long, long time. I initially predicted (and I was wrong) that Home Theater would bankrupt Emotiva because they wouldn't be able to compete with the Japanese. Although Home Theater hasn't actually bankrupted Emotiva, it HAS consumed almost all their development and engineering resources so far as I can tell. There HAVE been product introductions that are of significance to stereo listening (amplifiers, for instance), but almost all have also had one foot in the home theater market. 2. Schiit vs. Emotiva - Yes, Schiit is now a direct competitor to Emotiva in the stereo market. You pays your money, you takes your choice... 3. Streamer / DAC - For whatever reason, I understand that Emotiva's next offering will be a DAC only - not a streamer / DAC. I consider this shortsighted in the extreme, but Emotiva apparently thinks it will sell. We'll see... Boomzilla |
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Post by brubacca on Feb 5, 2023 11:31:37 GMT -5
Yes. I was in relatively early on Emotiva 2 channel. I had a XDA-1, USP-1 and UPA-200.
Thought that USP-1 had sone great features with the analog crossover. Back when I was trying to make them work for me I had the wrong speakers for me and judged them poorly. I was able to sell almost all of them and make back just about 100% of what I spent.
Personally wish I had hoarded them away like everything else because I'd love to hear that system again with my current source and speakers. Probably would have saved me thousands of dollars although I love my Rogue Audio Tube Amp.
Like the look of the new stereo gear although the price has crept up where it is not the bargain it used to be although still affordable.
I'm excited to see what they are doing for a new DAC. Hope it does well for them.
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Post by audiobill on Feb 9, 2023 16:07:27 GMT -5
One more day until @keithl big reveal!!!
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Post by KeithL on Feb 9, 2023 16:44:59 GMT -5
OK.... I'm gonna cop out now.... it's gonna be a few more days... but really not much longer now...  One more day until @keithl big reveal!!! |
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 9, 2023 16:58:32 GMT -5
OK.... I'm gonna cop out now.... it's gonna be a few more days... but really not much longer now... Is what it is... Enjoy the Super Bowl & drink some beer for me (I'm diabetic and can't enjoy it anymore). And while I'm at it, I still owe Big Dan an apology. I savaged him in the Lounge some years ago for being late on some promised announcement. It offended him so badly that he chose not to predict any more release dates to avoid any more criticism. Probably a good choice - even if I didn't jump him, someone else probably would. The lesson I've learned from it is that products will get here when they get here. No sense foaming at the mouth about it and getting all hot and bothered. So no criticism from me about predicting a news flash before it's ready. We trust you, KeithL, to let us know first when you can. By the way, has Emotiva ever considered announcing new products on the Lounge 24 hours BEFORE announcing them to the general public? That would give us all the opportunity to place our orders first and reward us for being Emotiva enthusiasts and Loungers... Cheers - Boom |
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Post by brubacca on Feb 12, 2023 18:10:09 GMT -5
OK.... I'm gonna cop out now.... it's gonna be a few more days... but really not much longer now... Is what it is... Enjoy the Super Bowl & drink some beer for me (I'm diabetic and can't enjoy it anymore). And while I'm at it, I still owe Big Dan an apology. I savaged him in the Lounge some years ago for being late on some promised announcement. It offended him so badly that he chose not to predict any more release dates to avoid any more criticism. Probably a good choice - even if I didn't jump him, someone else probably would. The lesson I've learned from it is that products will get here when they get here. No sense foaming at the mouth about it and getting all hot and bothered. So no criticism from me about predicting a news flash before it's ready. We trust you, KeithL, to let us know first when you can. By the way, has Emotiva ever considered announcing new products on the Lounge 24 hours BEFORE announcing them to the general public? That would give us all the opportunity to place our orders first and reward us for being Emotiva enthusiasts and Loungers... Cheers - Boom It used to be tough sledding here. I remember numerous products that were announced here never saw the light of day. I got real frustrated waiting for things that not only slipped, but never happened. I felt that if they should have told us also when they were indefinitely shelved or dead. I'm glad to not have my hopes brought up and then just left to hang. |
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Post by selind40 on Feb 12, 2023 21:59:36 GMT -5
I’m still holding out for the Emo toaster 2.0…….with bagel or waffle options, and keep warm setting.
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Lsc
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Post by Lsc on Feb 15, 2023 12:00:59 GMT -5
I came back looking for an announcement but I guess not yet. I returned my SMSL DAC so I’m back in the market.
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Post by Boomzilla on Feb 15, 2023 13:45:54 GMT -5
I came back looking for an announcement but I guess not yet. I returned my SMSL DAC so I’m back in the market. Hi Lsc - Curiosity prompts me to ask - Why did you return your SMSL DAC? Thanks - Boomzilla |
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Post by routlaw on Feb 15, 2023 18:42:28 GMT -5
I came back looking for an announcement but I guess not yet. I returned my SMSL DAC so I’m back in the market. If you have the budget I can't recommend the Gustard A26 enough. This is a very nice DAC! |
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