UPA-1 reviews to come...

[sketch2099]

several weeks ago i purchased two upa-1 amps and unfortunately have been unimpressed with them ever since i got them. some of my favorite demo material (sacds pf pink floyd, miles davis, and bob dylan) just doesn't sound as good anymore. i'm currently running the analog outs of my oppo bdp-83se to a bel canto pre6 preamp which then feeds the upa-1's. the sound is completely different than what my denon 3808 produced (in pure direct mode with the analog outs of the SE). sure it's louder, more lively, and there's more bass, but it there's also less fine detail, the music is now rougher, harsher, and more metallic. bob dylan's highway 61 revisited sacd is unlistenable to me with the upa-1s. i even ran the amps for several days without listening to them before i began to compare. it's now been three weeks later and i'm really feeling unsatisfied with these amps.

[ossif]

Apr 6, 2010 12:11:07 GMT -5 sketch2099 said:

several weeks ago i purchased two upa-1 amps and unfortunately have been unimpressed with them ever since i got them. some of my favorite demo material (sacds pf pink floyd, miles davis, and bob dylan) just doesn't sound as good anymore. i'm currently running the analog outs of my oppo bdp-83se to a bel canto pre6 preamp which then feeds the upa-1's. the sound is completely different than what my denon 3808 produced (in pure direct mode with the analog outs of the SE). sure it's louder, more lively, and there's more bass, but it there's also less fine detail, the music is now rougher, harsher, and more metallic. bob dylan's highway 61 revisited sacd is unlistenable to me with the upa-1s. i even ran the amps for several days without listening to them before i began to compare. it's now been three weeks later and i'm really feeling unsatisfied with these amps.

It is rather impossible that a denon 3808 amps come even 10 miles close to the UPA-1 so I believe that there is a problem in your setup.

[jackfish]

Let me get this straight... Are you using the STEREO AUDIO OUT or the 5.1CH/7.1CH AUDIO OUT of the Oppo BDP-83SE for both setups?

[sketch2099]

yes, stereo analog outs for both setups, (and for a setup where i had the denon feeding the upa-1 amps)

i do hope there is something wrong with my setup, but i'm pretty confident that everything is hooked up correctly (even contacted to bel canto tech support and got some great info from them)

let me be a little more descriptive, the internal amps of the denon definitely don't have near the power of the upa-1's. you're right they don't come close to the upa-1's. but the upa-1's had way more power than i could possibly need. sure it sounded very loud and clear at high volumes, but i really mostly listen to moderate/quite levels most of the time, and here the upa-1's didn't have the near sound quality of the internal denon amps.

good things about the upa-1 amps: loud, made the sound much more alive, added oomph and bass, sounded great with low quality mp3s

down sides: rough, harsher sound (almost a metallic sound that another reviewer noted), made higher resolution recordings a lot worse sounding (like bob dylan's highway 61 revisited sacd, my girlfriend freaked when she heard how unlistenable this recording became with the upa-1s).

feel free to disregard my opinion though

[jackfish]

Its your ears that have to be satisfied by your equipment, not mine or anyone elses. Hope you can find something that does.

[Pauly]

No big deal, man. I remember people calling me crazy because I liked the sound of my DMR-1 better than the Outlaw separates I had. They said that no receiver would be able to compete against the Outlaw separates. Granted, the DMR is not your normal receiver, but still. Like jackfish said. It's your ears that have to be satisfied. It's impossible for everybody out there to love the UPA-1, or any amp out there. Everybody will have their own taste.

[SteveB]

Nothing metalic about my pair of UPA-1's. I love the sound.

[twilkins]

Apr 9, 2010 7:34:17 GMT -5 SteveB said:

Nothing metalic about my pair of UPA-1's. I love the sound.

+1. I've owned the UPA-1, UPA-2, XPA-3 and XPA-5. They've all had a natural/neutral sound. I would hate to have to do a blindfolded A/B comparison between any of them and try to choose. Having said that I love the seperation and sound of my 2 channel music with the UPA-1's.

[gzubeck]

Apr 6, 2010 14:51:10 GMT -5 sketch2099 said:

yes, stereo analog outs for both setups, (and for a setup where i had the denon feeding the upa-1 amps)

i do hope there is something wrong with my setup, but I'm pretty confident that everything is hooked up correctly (even contacted to bel canto tech support and got some great info from them)

let me be a little more descriptive, the internal amps of the denon definitely don't have near the power of the upa-1's. you're right they don't come close to the upa-1's. but the upa-1's had way more power than i could possibly need. sure it sounded very loud and clear at high volumes, but i really mostly listen to moderate/quite levels most of the time, and here the upa-1's didn't have the near sound quality of the internal denon amps.

good things about the upa-1 amps: loud, made the sound much more alive, added oomph and bass, sounded great with low quality mp3s

down sides: rough, harsher sound (almost a metallic sound that another reviewer noted), made higher resolution recordings a lot worse sounding (like bob dylan's highway 61 revisited sacd, my girlfriend freaked when she heard how unlistenable this recording became with the upa-1s).

feel free to disregard my opinion though

There's a lot of things that can go wrong.

1) Have you tried just listening to one channel at a time to make sure that one of the two amps is not defective. Because if one is defective the whole sound stage and imaging will disappear.

2) What do you have your amps plugged into? A wall socket or power conditioner. Some things like power conditioning , some things (Like amps) don't. Amps are very hungry for power and the sound quality may be reduced by truncated power supply.

3) How's your speaker placement? Cause with new more powerful amps you may have to adjust where your speakers are located in relation to back and side walls. If you have the room you may want to adjust where your listening distance is.

4) Some components my need a few hours (100) before they open up. Also you may need to find out if your speakers are a good match for these amps. If you have really sensitive speakers (96 db at 1 meter) these amps may not be the best choice for your speakers.

5) We have no idea about your surrounding acoustics in your room. Do you have a lot of windows or tile floors? You might need to dampen your lively environment.

6) If you have a friend who knows audio you should get a second opinion to see if you've done something wrong. You would be surprised how many times I've made mistakes but could tell there was just something wrong with the sound.

7) From what I've heard from others on this forum these amps should be a step up in power and better imaging and general sound quality for the audiophile taste. Your probably right that there is something wrong you just haven't figured it out yet. I hope this posting helps.

[mrsyed]

I don't think he(sketch2099) is alone, I also find that my UPA-1 is metallic, its been more than 50 hours. One of the LED on my UPA-1 has gone out. I also read that the UPA-1 is supposedly less bright than the XPA-2, glad I did not get the XPAs. And I am not new to emotiva, this was an upgrade to the UPA-2. UPA-2 were much more tolerable.
I'll give it another week before this goes back and having demo'ed the Outlaw M2200, which I find is more nuetral and subdued, I might lean in that direction.

[maggieuser]

Apr 6, 2010 14:51:10 GMT -5 sketch2099 said:

yes, stereo analog outs for both setups, (and for a setup where i had the denon feeding the upa-1 amps)

i do hope there is something wrong with my setup, but i'm pretty confident that everything is hooked up correctly (even contacted to bel canto tech support and got some great info from them)

let me be a little more descriptive, the internal amps of the denon definitely don't have near the power of the upa-1's. you're right they don't come close to the upa-1's. but the upa-1's had way more power than i could possibly need. sure it sounded very loud and clear at high volumes, but i really mostly listen to moderate/quite levels most of the time, and here the upa-1's didn't have the near sound quality of the internal denon amps.

good things about the upa-1 amps: loud, made the sound much more alive, added oomph and bass, sounded great with low quality mp3s

down sides: rough, harsher sound (almost a metallic sound that another reviewer noted), made higher resolution recordings a lot worse sounding (like bob dylan's highway 61 revisited sacd, my girlfriend freaked when she heard how unlistenable this recording became with the upa-1s).

feel free to disregard my opinion though

Does anyone remember the thread that had the metallic sound problem and got replys about changing interconnects

[roadrunner]

It sounds like you may have the two speakers hooked up out of phase to one another. Your description of the sound quality is classic for out of phase speakers. Of course, there are any number of other things that could be contributing to this. Good luck finding the problem. It might just be the particular combinations of gear and room acoustics are at odds with each other.

Have you tried using the Denon receiver as the pre amp instead of the Bel Canto to see what the system sounds like? Are you using an esoteric brand of interconnects or speaker wire? I have also seen halogen lighting have this effect on sound quality, as can flourescent lights, dimmer switches, and decorative lighting. These are just a few of the possibilities.

[stoneoftone]

Source equipment matters. I am also very pleased with my Kimber Palladian PK10. I purchased from Audiogon/Weinhart Design for 647.00 (David Weinhart = class = cares about all customers). I wanted to hate it and sell if for what I paid for it. However, no hype, it works = deep solid black background = no noise = pure music. Talk about pulling the best out of my preamp to feed the UPA-1's.... .

Lets say it:
Emotiva, value value value! I am a proud owner of a pair of UPA-1's now. I now understand how they kicked a 3k Plinius to the curb (RPA-1).

I enjoy the best of both worlds: Tubes DRIVEN DIRECTLY VIA 3.0 and my Solid State butt muscle system with the UPA'1s. They are detailed, laid back with great highs-clean treble extension, great midrange and articulate bass that does not impede the upper bass or midrange! They are warm sounding amps in the positive way. I know I made the right choice being a Tube Listener that wanted quality Solid State again for a 3rd to half of his music collection! I am pleased to say the least..... . Furthermore, the UPA-1's are great listening at low volume too.

Cheers, listen often - listen deep - Stone of Tone

[ee]

So i love these amps. Exactly as described in the posts that i read here while learing about Emotiva over the last 4 months. They are laid back, neutral, dynamic, great depth, cool running, voices are very natural, and don't seem to take away or add anything to the music. I played music non-stop through the 2x upa-1 for about 40 hours. They never sounded bright or anything from the start just clear and full bodied and smooth. A big compliment would be that my wife's first comment was 'those sound so much better, like all the music is there'. My avr just could not deliver in the lower end. Sound is equal full bandwidth which it was not with just the avr trying to supply the power that my speakers just needed more of. The sub is now just an extension of the fronts and matches perfectly. Probably the best compliment I can give is that I hooked these up last Saturday and Monday I ordered another upa-1 for the center and a upa-2 for the surrounds. So now I get to update my profile.

[xki]

roadrunner points it out: Out of phase will sound very tinny. I can say from experience that this is true!

I'm assuming that the phase has been checked and rechecked but, for the heck of it, reverse the leads and just see.

[Lsc]

No worries... I believe you when you say they sound bad. I know you are not crazy. I own an emotiva amp too and it sounds great but so what? You could have gotten some lemons.

[skeetlong]

Just a note on my two coins worth..My vote is for the UPA-1s..anything i throw at them amps..from Trisha Yearwood..to Karen Carpenter..to Pink Floyd..and still going threw what i have..warm?..yes..clean output you bet!..can they make you low end hit as low and tight as your speakers can go?..yep!..mids and high are as clean and detailed as i have ever heard!..i will never use anything but mono,s.Emotiva you guys hit Gold with your Amp,s..

[briank]

Regarding the tinny, metallic or thin sound, what ic's and speaker cables are you using? Are you using spades on your amp side speaker connections?

[skeetlong]

Last nite i had my system up to -20dbs on a few songs..i put Journey on then Stix and then cool down with some Clint Black..my wife was sitting next too in the sweet spot..i then put her Thisha YearWood in..the song she likes most is the (song remembers when)..she started singing alone with it..a first that i know of from her..Like i said before Emotiva Gold man!..I really Luv my two UPA-1s...I clean them off everyday...now i know why you guys put 80,000ufs in each of them...thats a 160,000ufs into stereo!..One word?..WOW!

[Nemesis.ie]

Jul 8, 2010 13:41:59 GMT -5 mrsyed said:

I don't think he(sketch2099) is alone, I also find that my UPA-1 is metallic, its been more than 50 hours. One of the LED on my UPA-1 has gone out. I also read that the UPA-1 is supposedly less bright than the XPA-2, glad I did not get the XPAs. And I am not new to emotiva, this was an upgrade to the UPA-2. UPA-2 were much more tolerable.
I'll give it another week before this goes back and having demo'ed the Outlaw M2200, which I find is more nuetral and subdued, I might lean in that direction.

It would be useful to find out what speakers folks are running that are reporting metallic sound. I can't say mine sound at all metallic with the ERM speakers, I wouldn't like a harsh/tiny "metallic" sound either - I have some sample Gimell high-res files and the sound is rich and natural.