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Post by fbczar on Jul 17, 2016 0:59:03 GMT -5
Wow, I'm not trying to be rude or mean at all but I'm extremely upset about this. What I'm left with is a very limited multi thousand dollar processor because the room correction is trying to correct where it's not needed? The only way to fix this is to spend more money?! My UMC had WAY more output and was WAY more impressive when trying to demo an action packed scene to friends/family. My subs aren't doing a whole lot unless I max my gain or put the XMC at +12 which lowers the output of all the other preouts. I wanted to buy the XMC since it was released but didn't have the funds, I waited years and am left feeling very let down. What's my option? Turn Dirac off or pay more money? There is no doubt that the XMC-1 is a superior processor and there is definitely no doubt that Dirac Full is vastly superior to Dirac LE. However, until you decide to buy Dirac Full I think you can work around the limitations of Dirac LE. I apologize if these suggestions have been made before, but here goes. I like around an 8db bass boost. That much boost is about 6db greater than the boost the standard Dirac LE curve applies. Before you do any measurement with Dirac LE set the levels manually to achieve what ever bass level you hope to ultimately achieve from each sub. Then, before you start measuring, turn down the level of your subs by 6db. Hopefully, this will give you a level close to the middle of the spectrum that Dirac can measure for your subs as well as your other speakers. After successfully completing your measurements turn the level on both subs up by 6db. Since the Dirac LE curve employs a 2db bass boost the effect of increasing your sub level by 6db will be an overall bass boost of 8db. You could also leave the levels alone and use the subwoofer level adjustment on the XMC-1's remote to achieve the 8db boost or any other level for that matter. When you get your hands on Dirac Full you can design a custom room curve that provides the 8db bass boost without the need for increasing sub levels manually or with the remote. Dirac Full will also allow you to design a curve that fits what you like best relative to bass boost around the crossover point, but that is another point for discussion. |
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Post by bolle on Jul 17, 2016 9:39:31 GMT -5
You can also measure manually and use the PEQ...
Btw. the measurements with the new mic on page 5 Show up to almost 30dB difference between your Speakers while generally being equally loud. DIRAC is good but can´t do wonders. So in your case it tries to linearize as much as possible which leads to muss less Maximum Output possible.
Did you do any acoustical optimization in your room?
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Post by dkaudio on Jul 17, 2016 12:10:00 GMT -5
Thanks for the ideas, I do not have the expertise to manually measure and set EQ's, although it would be fun to learn!
I have paid some attention to room treatment but have no traps, diffusers or panels. This is in my living room, my house doesn't have a theater unfortunately. I did things like place thick shades over my bay window, put a thick wool rug over my hardwood floor between the listening spots and drivers. I also did the mirror trick for first reflections and my second couch is in one spot and my bay window treatments are in the other. That's about the extent of it.
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Post by dkaudio on Jul 21, 2016 9:42:08 GMT -5
Here's a thought, can I take what Dirac did and load the results as Preset 1 or 2 and then manually adjust things in the XMC EQ settings? That would take care of the issue right?
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Post by geebo on Jul 21, 2016 9:54:32 GMT -5
Here's a thought, can I take what Dirac did and load the results as Preset 1 or 2 and then manually adjust things in the XMC EQ settings? That would take care of the issue right? No, you can't do that. Even if you could extract what Dirac created, the filters are entirely different from what the PEQ creates and not at all compatible with each other. |
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Post by dkaudio on Jul 21, 2016 10:13:04 GMT -5
Shoot, can I do a cut off in the iNuke of 200hz or so and rerun Dirac? Then Dirac should theoretically bring in the curtains more right? Would that prevent this clipping protection that limits my volume?
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Post by geebo on Jul 21, 2016 10:18:48 GMT -5
Shoot, can I do a cut off in the iNuke of 200hz or so and rerun Dirac? Then Dirac should theoretically bring in the curtains more right? Would that prevent this clipping protection that limits my volume? The best way is Dirac Full. But what you suggest would be worth a try. |
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Post by dkaudio on Jul 23, 2016 0:36:13 GMT -5
Ok, spent all night working on this again. I played with my iNuke DSP and REW to get my subs flat and also cut them off with a 24db LPF at 130hz. Turned out pretty great, look at how close I got the two independent channels!..  I then ran Dirac again and it brought in the curtains, hopefully this will help with the clipping and give more headroom. Fronts  Center  Surrounds  Sub 1  Sub 2  I have not had a chance to listen yet but this looks promising, right? |
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Post by geebo on Jul 23, 2016 0:46:25 GMT -5
Ok, spent all night working on this again. I played with my iNuke DSP and REW to get my subs flat and also cut them off with a 24db LPF at 130hz. Turned out pretty great, look at how close I got the two independent channels!.. I then ran Dirac again and it brought in the curtains, hopefully this will help with the clipping and give more headroom. Fronts Center Surrounds Sub 1 Sub 2 I have not had a chance to listen yet but this looks promising, right? Wow! Much better. Anxious to hear how it sounds to you. |
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Post by dkaudio on Jul 23, 2016 14:55:28 GMT -5
I used a HPS filter of -8db starting at 20hz. It's basically a way to trick it to setting a subsonic to 12hz or so. The iNuke can only go down to 20hz so this is a work around. I read a thread about it so credit goes elsewhere. My boxes are tuned to around 16hz, I heard to take 1/2 octave below tuning and divide by 2, subtract that from the tuning frequency and that should be where the subsonic filter should go...12hz
I then played in the PEQ of the iNuke to try and flatten it, it was really fun to change a setting then play a tone through REW and see the changes.
One thing though, Windows keeps checking AGC again and putting the gain to 0 for the mic, it was like this when testing the subs but I fixed it before running Dirac again, does it matter for REW?
Also looks like Dirac put a curtain of 15hz for the subs, why? I want them lower than that. Does the curtain mean anything below 15hz is completely cutoff or is it a HPF essentially?
Hopefully I'll get some time to listen this weekend and see how it is now.
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Post by geebo on Jul 23, 2016 19:53:18 GMT -5
I used a HPS filter of -8db starting at 20hz. It's basically a way to trick it to setting a subsonic to 12hz or so. The iNuke can only go down to 20hz so this is a work around. I read a thread about it so credit goes elsewhere. My boxes are tuned to around 16hz, I heard to take 1/2 octave below tuning and divide by 2, subtract that from the tuning frequency and that should be where the subsonic filter should go...12hz I then played in the PEQ of the iNuke to try and flatten it, it was really fun to change a setting then play a tone through REW and see the changes. One thing though, Windows keeps checking AGC again and putting the gain to 0 for the mic, it was like this when testing the subs but I fixed it before running Dirac again, does it matter for REW? Also looks like Dirac put a curtain of 15hz for the subs, why? I want them lower than that. Does the curtain mean anything below 15hz is completely cutoff or is it a HPF essentially? Hopefully I'll get some time to listen this weekend and see how it is now. I would think AGC is not good for REW, either. The curtains for Dirac is just where it stops adjusting. It just won't try to correct outside of them. No rolling off as far as I know. Not sure why Dirac chooses a 15Hz curtain for you but not baing able to change it is a limitation of LE. |
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Post by dkaudio on Jul 23, 2016 23:09:40 GMT -5
Thanks, do you think I should redo my subs again then with 100% and no AGC?
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Post by geebo on Jul 24, 2016 9:26:53 GMT -5
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Post by dkaudio on Jul 25, 2016 20:43:54 GMT -5
I did listen to music again and if in a Dirac mode it does still adjust the speaker volume if I up the sub output on the remote. The speaker volume also stops increasing at around reference even if I go all the way to +12, it gets no louder.
If I play in Direct it can go way louder and I can adjust the sub output with the speakers remaining really loud (I know it's because Direct does not use Dirac).
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Post by dkaudio on Aug 5, 2016 12:06:21 GMT -5
I'm enjoying the quality, I find my self listening to music in "All Stereo". If a friend wants a demo where I'll be playing it loud I use Direct, still very disapointed in the lack of volume/impact when using Dirac. Hopefully I can get a license for full someday if that will even make a difference.
Anyways, I see on the display it almost always just says "Surround". Is there any way to change it so it tells you the actual format (Dolby, DTS, etc)?
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Post by geebo on Aug 5, 2016 12:50:43 GMT -5
I'm enjoying the quality, I find my self listening to music in "All Stereo". If a friend wants a demo where I'll be playing it loud I use Direct, still very disapointed in the lack of volume/impact when using Dirac. Hopefully I can get a license for full someday if that will even make a difference. Anyways, I see on the display it almost always just says "Surround". Is there any way to change it so it tells you the actual format (Dolby, DTS, etc)? In the setup is a selection for what you want displayed on screen. You can select format there if you choose. Requires the latest firmware, 3.1a. Status Display can now be set to show the normal full three-line display, or one of several
large single-line displays ( Setup | Preferences | Status Display; choices are FULL STATUS,
INPUT, SURROUND MODE, VOLUME, and BITSTREAM). |
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KeithL
Administrator 
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Post by KeithL on Aug 5, 2016 13:39:22 GMT -5
You don't have to "request" the firmware.... Just download it from the RESOURCES tab at the bottom of the XMC-1 product page, extract it onto a USB stick, pop it into the XMC-1's USB port, and select UPDATE FIRMWARE on the menu. I'm enjoying the quality, I find my self listening to music in "All Stereo". If a friend wants a demo where I'll be playing it loud I use Direct, still very disapointed in the lack of volume/impact when using Dirac. Hopefully I can get a license for full someday if that will even make a difference. Anyways, I see on the display it almost always just says "Surround". Is there any way to change it so it tells you the actual format (Dolby, DTS, etc)? In the setup is a selection for what you want displayed on screen. You can select format there if you choose. Requires the latest firmware, 3.1a. Status Display can now be set to show the normal full three-line display, or one of several
large single-line displays ( Setup | Preferences | Status Display; choices are FULL STATUS,
INPUT, SURROUND MODE, VOLUME, and BITSTREAM). |
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Post by geebo on Aug 5, 2016 14:04:50 GMT -5
You don't have to "request" the firmware.... Just download it from the RESOURCES tab at the bottom of the XMC-1 product page, extract it onto a USB stick, pop it into the XMC-1's USB port, and select UPDATE FIRMWARE on the menu. In the setup is a selection for what you want displayed on screen. You can select format there if you choose. Requires the latest firmware, 3.1a. Status Display can now be set to show the normal full three-line display, or one of several
large single-line displays ( Setup | Preferences | Status Display; choices are FULL STATUS,
INPUT, SURROUND MODE, VOLUME, and BITSTREAM).I said Requires 3.1a, not Request 3.1a.  |
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