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Post by mdanderson on Nov 28, 2016 20:53:17 GMT -5
With the mention of the xmc-2 gen3, the original xmc-1 with the 1.4hdmi would be perfect for my needs right now because I would like to go back to a separates setup with 7.1 analog inputs to use with my Oppo 105. The discounted price of the hdmi 1.4 version would be great if I could use my 25% ugfl.
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Lsc
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Post by Lsc on Nov 28, 2016 22:29:31 GMT -5
I got smashed for thinking that when a new product was announced that maybe they could, I don't know put it in its own thread instead of making a vague announcement in the RMC1 thread. They obviously don't want to hurt sales of the XMC1 but to people who obviously follow the company enough to be on their forum it would have been nice if they just were up front about when the new XMC2 is due for release. I questioned if I should wait and basically got ridiculed for it. The XMC2 sounds perfect for Atmos and DTS X and I think I will wait rather than spending AU$3600 (US$2700) on an XMC1 which now appears to be on a runout sale in the USA. The main selling point of the XMC1 to me is its upgradeability, I question anybody who thinks its a good idea to be on the old frame. Ive seen it with Sony as soon as a new frame is developed parts for the old one aren't made anymore, as the new XMC2 will have different boards with different DACs some parts from the XMC1 will eventually be in short supply. Yes, in your case you got roasted for no reason but that's typical here. And if you try to defend your valid position, it just gets worse. I agree with you 100% that if I was in your shoes, I would wait. How long? That's the million dollar question  . Especially from Australia, you definitely should wait for the XMC-2. |
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Post by Dan Laufman on Nov 29, 2016 0:01:05 GMT -5
The gen 3 makes total sense. First the XMC-2 is considered different from the one but that doesn't make it gen 1. It's part of the entire gen 3 line. This includes the XPA gen 3 monoblocks. For instance the XPA-1 is not part of the gen 3 line though it is hanging around (and rightfully so!). It is gen 2. The 1.3 a, b, c though helpful would require us to know what is what. Same goes for firmware upgrade. Thankfully since the XMC-1 can handle all the firmware upgrades, it doesn't really matter what firmware it is. I can't say it any quicker than to say we will have to agree to disagree, because I don't agree with your logic regarding the nomenclature. The Gen speak in terms of these processors causes confusion, plain and simple. No debate; it does. Maybe not for all, but for many that's for certain. A recent quote from Dan in the other thread. "If you purchased a G2 XMC-1, we've kept it up to date, far beyond our original intent..." Far beyond our original intent. Hmmmm.... Interesting. This is the first time I've heard such a statement out loud. So he once said the 15 - 20 year thing you mention. Now he says not? Hmmmmm. Another simple Emotiva mind change? Sales bull schiit? Being over zealous? I'll keep my thoughts to myself here because I'm sick of blue cool aide and I'm tired of arguing about it. It's interesting you can say this now and get away with it, because not too long ago I got bashed for it. Yeah, "to their good credit". Please. ONLY with some major pushing from us, and especially me and a handful of others. For which I was called outright names and basically an @$$ hole. Again, mouth shut. I agree. On one hand Dan says otherwise, but in this statement he certainly hints at it. "We've changed a model designation, that's all. If I called the new XMC-2 G3 an XMC-1 G3, it would be ok??" It's a hypothetical so I assume he was just talking so to speak, but you never know with Emotiva. I have said it before and I'll say it again; the one thing you can always count on with 100% certainty with Emotiva is for them to change their mind. Reasons vary, but they change their mind like the wind. Know this and all will be good. Assume otherwise and be prepared to have questions/issues/disappointments. JMO. For the record I think people comparing this to waiting on the next model car is "okay" at best, but it's not a truly equal comparison, and simply doesn't work for the most part, at least not for many. For a guy that doesn't have a dog in the fight, you sure have a lot of opinions... most of which I disagree with. |
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Post by Gary Cook on Nov 29, 2016 2:06:49 GMT -5
For the record I think people comparing this to waiting on the next model car is "okay" at best, but it's not a truly equal comparison, and simply doesn't work for the most part, at least not for many. A car comparison is interesting; An old example, a good friend of mine was courier and he wanted a Ford Escort Van, a 2 litre one, but they only came out at the time with a 1.6 litre. He asked the local Ford Dealer and then called Ford and they both said that we will only be getting the 1.6 litre. So he ordered the 1.6 litre and by the time it arrived (UK build) the 2 litre was available, but they made him take the 1.6. Did they flat out lie? Or at the time were they telling the truth and it was changed by external circumstances. In this case it was external circumstances, the 1.6 litre failed the new emissions test and they had no choice but to go with the 2 litre. A recent example, the MY2016 VW Polo Gti, where the European versions came with adjustable dampers from day 1 and Apple CarPlay. But the Australian versions came with non adjustable dampers and no Apple CarPlay. I was advised by the dealer and VW that they weren't licensed for Australia and would never be coming here. Some 6 months after they were launched adjustable dampers and Apple Car Play were standard fitment. Did the Dealer and VW flat out lie? Maybe, a mater of opinion, but what happened was that they bowed to customer pressure. i.e.; sales with those items missing weren't as good as expected so they didi the necessary work and got them licensed. So it's easy to blame the manufacturer for changes in spec when most frequently it isn't their fault, circumstances beyond their direct control change and the market never stands still. Cheers Gary |
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Post by cwt on Nov 29, 2016 5:23:18 GMT -5
Bonzo ; when the XMC1 was variously described in the past as gen 2 or gen 3 ; I just took it as an easy descriptor for what was envisaged at the time[with upgraded hdmi and object decoding ]. Now those plans have solidified into a separate pre pro with different main boards ; gen 3 is appropriate as its still based on the xmc1 chassis as was envisaged from the start .. It all makes sense if you don't take things too literally I reckon. One thing Ime sure you will agree with ; what other company would share this information so far out from production - its a nice headache to have when you have a choice to make The XMC-2 GEN 3 uses the GEN 3 moniker just to distinguish itself from the XMC1 previous generation . This has the happy coincidence of identifying what gen is what for people upgrading under the UGFL ; is how I look at it . This also assists with the RMC 1 Gen 3 . "If you purchased a G2 XMC-1, we've kept it up to date, far beyond our original intent..." When I read that I referenced the many comments about it being a 7.2 only processor and limited to such - no atmos . Maybe its a left brain hemisphere thing I dunno  ; I should be more critical possibly C'mon Bonzo ; all those cassette and reel to reel tapes are shedding oxide ; more choice now than ever before  |
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Post by Jim on Nov 29, 2016 6:21:58 GMT -5
I like how excited people get about naming schemes and generation labels and "phrasing" (i.e. Semantics)
It's almost as if any of that matters.
I wish people made constructive criticisms about naming if they're going to say anything at all. Normally it's a "burn it to the ground - it's all horrible" 'mentality. It doesn't actually matter THAT much.
I have a Honda Pilot. Is it a plane? Can it fly? Can it fly for me?! Do I need a pilots license to drive it?!? Why is it called that? It doesn't make any sense! Can it function as a harbor pilot? I have to know! Honda - the name is confusing and makes no sense!!! Change it!
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Post by vneal on Nov 29, 2016 7:39:46 GMT -5
I like how excited people get about naming schemes and generation labels and "phrasing" (i.e. Semantics) It's almost as if any of that matters. I wish people made constructive criticisms about naming if they're going to say anything at all. Normally it's a "burn it to the ground - it's all horrible" 'mentality. It doesn't actually matter THAT much. I have a Honda Pilot. Is it a plane? Can it fly? Can it fly for me?! Do I need a pilots license to drive it?!? Why is it called that? It doesn't make any sense! Can it function as a harbor pilot? I have to know! Honda - the name is confusing and makes no sense!!! Change it! You are going to wish you did not buy that Honda Pilot. For 2019 they will have a new platform. LOL |
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Post by Jim on Nov 29, 2016 8:14:04 GMT -5
You are going to wish you did not buy that Honda Pilot. For 2019 they will have a new platform. LOL Well, actually 2016 is a new platform! I think its at least the third "generation"... but it doesn't have a label!  |
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Post by Bonzo on Nov 29, 2016 9:59:53 GMT -5
For a guy that doesn't have a dog in the fight Some of us can't afford to buy new processors every 2 years as I'm sure you would like. Some of us must be frugal with our hard earned money. Since the old one ain't broke and does a reasonable job, I can afford to wait until there is a dog that works for my needs. Emotiva is now on that track thanks to people here on this forum twisting your arm, and you, who took the time to figure it out. Thanks for that. By the way, I have bought 5 or 6 of your products. At what point exactly do you start considering me a valuable customer that has rights to add input to a discussion? Again, some of us aren't super techno geeks or professionals in this business who can provide all the mundane details on the minutia of it all. After that, there are a few other things, sure, but they are basically headed up by opinions. Just opinions. So I guess it's a good thing to get myself as informed as I can be on this forum so I can have a lot of the best well informed opinions. Well at least we feel the same way. There's something we can agree on. And if I had to guess I'd say our general opinions of each other are probably the same. As General Patton is portrayed saying in the movie, "Damned it, I don't want these guys to like me, I want them to fight for me." Just because we don't share love for each other or our opinions doesn't mean we can't be mutually beneficial for each other. |
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Post by Bonzo on Nov 29, 2016 10:02:35 GMT -5
For the record I think people comparing this to waiting on the next model car is "okay" at best, but it's not a truly equal comparison, and simply doesn't work for the most part, at least not for many. A car comparison is interesting; An old example, a good friend of mine was courier and he wanted a Ford Escort Van, a 2 litre one, but they only came out at the time with a 1.6 litre. He asked the local Ford Dealer and then called Ford and they both said that we will only be getting the 1.6 litre. So he ordered the 1.6 litre and by the time it arrived (UK build) the 2 litre was available, but they made him take the 1.6. Did they flat out lie? Or at the time were they telling the truth and it was changed by external circumstances. In this case it was external circumstances, the 1.6 litre failed the new emissions test and they had no choice but to go with the 2 litre. A recent example, the MY2016 VW Polo Gti, where the European versions came with adjustable dampers from day 1 and Apple CarPlay. But the Australian versions came with non adjustable dampers and no Apple CarPlay. I was advised by the dealer and VW that they weren't licensed for Australia and would never be coming here. Some 6 months after they were launched adjustable dampers and Apple Car Play were standard fitment. Did the Dealer and VW flat out lie? Maybe, a mater of opinion, but what happened was that they bowed to customer pressure. i.e.; sales with those items missing weren't as good as expected so they didi the necessary work and got them licensed. So it's easy to blame the manufacturer for changes in spec when most frequently it isn't their fault, circumstances beyond their direct control change and the market never stands still. Cheers Gary Your example is a good one, but I don't think it's really what the comparison was made for in the first place. I could digress but I won't. |
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Post by roadwar on Nov 29, 2016 10:06:23 GMT -5
I think Emotiva is caught in the same situation as any other manufacturer of multichannel processors: the continual changing of standards and technologies which quickly become "must haves" in the eyes of many consumers caught up in the hype. Technology improves and equipment becomes "obsolete" according to the hype. The effort that Emo has made to keep The XMC current is unique in the industry AFAIK. I appreciate it and I had no misconception about it when I bought my unit last month. I know that it is probably impossible to expect a manufacturer to provide a product capable of meeting unknown potential industry "improvements" 10 years out at an affordable price. If you know of such please let us know instead of complaining about what Emo has done or is doing. It's a business. If you like their products, consider buying them, if you don't, shop elsewhere. Life is too short to not enjoy. |
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Post by garbulky on Nov 29, 2016 10:06:56 GMT -5
Well I think Big Dan loves everyone Bonzo including you |
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Post by Bonzo on Nov 29, 2016 10:26:30 GMT -5
I like how excited people get about naming schemes and generation labels and "phrasing" (i.e. Semantics) Please show me where anyone is getting excited. (Well, except for Dan, who mistakenly misread a post and got overly excited, then apologized for it). You are correct, it doesn't, until it starts causing confusion, which it already has, and will continue to do. I'd wager that unless someone is a loyal follower of this forum they would be lost in all the variations of the XMC-1 that are out there or are yet to come. And that's exactly what my post was, constructive discussion. If memory serves I believe it's the very first time I've offered up actual thoughts on the naming topic (I did make a thread one time asking about the logic behind all Emotiva names and it turned out to be very informative), and yet, you feel the need to jump in and act like it's all terrible. You feel joining in saying the discussion itself is basically stupid and pointless, because why does it matter, constructive? Talk about the pot calling the kettle black. Me thinks it's you who usually seems to get overly excited. Perhaps you should take another long break from the relentless angry negative deadly war going on here on the Emotiva forum.  A completely non-constructive waste of time nonsense comparison. |
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Post by qdtjni on Nov 29, 2016 10:29:04 GMT -5
 Can you guys stop bickering about nonsense already?
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KeithL
Administrator 
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Post by KeithL on Nov 29, 2016 10:38:42 GMT -5
THANK YOU!  I guess it all depends on what you mean by current. Is every two year old Mercedes "obsolete" because your kids can't watch two different movies on their tablets in the back seat? And how about every car without "lane keep assist"? Heck, I'll bet there are even a few cars still on the road without built-in GPS units. Technology changes... sometimes gradually... and sometimes in huge lurches. For anyone who is satisfied with 5.1 channels, or 7.1 channels, or even 7.2 channels, the XMC-1 will be all they need for a very long time...... Believe it or not, the majority of people don't consider Atmos to be a "must have"...... (And nobody I know is actually planning to trade in their car because they can't live without lane assist.....) And, for anyone who really wants Atmos, there is an upgrade path for the XMC-1 that will get you there...... It's also interesting to note that technology in many cases moves more slowly at the very top. It's the people with the $20k high-end projectors who aren't going to throw them out next year to get this year's model. (The people who buy a new $500 TV ever two years will always have the latest feature - every year it comes out.) There are always going to be new things that won't fit in the box, or that won't be practical to upgrade. It's the nature of the world... And it's why we'll continue to have both upgrades AND new products. I think Emotiva is caught in the same situation as any other manufacturer of multichannel processors: the continual changing of standards and technologies which quickly become "must haves" in the eyes of many consumers caught up in the hype. Technology improves and equipment becomes "obsolete" according to the hype. The effort that Emo has made to keep The XMC current is unique in the industry AFAIK. I appreciate it and I had no misconception about it when I bought my unit last month. I know that it is probably impossible to expect a manufacturer to provide a product capable of meeting unknown potential industry "improvements" 10 years out at an affordable price. If you know of such please let us know instead of complaining about what Emo has done or is doing. It's a business. If you like their products, consider buying them, if you don't, shop elsewhere. Life is too short to not enjoy.
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Post by bolle on Nov 29, 2016 10:47:03 GMT -5
So will 4K and HDR come to the XMC-1? What is with DIRAC 96kHz? I will be fine with 5.1 for a very long time on the other hand. |
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Post by tchaik on Nov 29, 2016 11:18:14 GMT -5
So will 4K and HDR come to the XMC-1? What is with DIRAC 96kHz? I will be fine with 5.1 for a very long time on the other hand. most of my blurays are still 5.1 although the newer ones show up in 7.1 or 7.2 but i cannot imagine a need or desire to move into atmos. the wife would not allow me to upend the living room to make that work. so…… xmc-1 with upgrades for enhanced video is about all i will need for a long time. even for that i would need a new tv and the upcoming new oppo udp-203 player to make it worth my while, and those are not in the budget for quite a long time. i guess i am one of the many who will never need atmos capability. tchaik……………. |
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Post by Jim on Nov 29, 2016 12:07:05 GMT -5
Bonzo I know you're looking for an argument, but I'm not interested. Either accept the status quo or suggest an improvement. Constantly ranting about everything being broken isn't benefiting yourself or anyone else. Doesn't this look like a nice processor? I think so. 
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Post by Fatty on Nov 29, 2016 14:11:38 GMT -5
It's certainly good to see nothing changing on the lounge.
I was extremely excited when I saw the specs on this unit, and as I read through the posts my excitement turned to dismay.. Then I got to Dan's post about not having a dog in the fight, being someone who owned an xmc-1 and about 7 emo amps and 2 previous gen processors... When I posted my opinion on it I was told the same thing because by that time I had taken Dan's advice("if you don't like it buy something else") and sold all my emo gear and moved on... Thus my signature not having emo gear in it..
I understand it's a business and you "are doing the best you can" but the condescending attitude ("we don't need your business") towards potential customers is disgusting.
It drives new clientele away as well as old..
I'm sure the lounge would have twice as many members as it does if it weren't for the bickering between fanboys and poohboys. Having differing opinions isn't all that bad guys, you just need to relax and maybe try the shoe on the other foot.
Anyway, glad I checked in today..LOL..
Regards,
Ivor..
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Lsc
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Post by Lsc on Nov 29, 2016 14:25:09 GMT -5
Looking past the behavior in the forum, the XMC-2 looks like a nice product. At the end of the day, that's why I come to this forum.
The back and forth is just static noise. The product is what really matters.
Also, I wonder if there will be improvements in bass management on the XMC-2 as well
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. 
; I should be more critical possibly 
Can you guys stop bickering about nonsense already? 
