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Post by teaman on Nov 29, 2016 14:41:47 GMT -5
It's certainly good to see nothing changing on the lounge. I was extremely excited when I saw the specs on this unit, and as I read through the posts my excitement turned to dismay.. Then I got to Dan's post about not having a dog in the fight, being someone who owned an xmc-1 and about 7 emo amps and 2 previous gen processors... When I posted my opinion on it I was told the same thing because by that time I had taken Dan's advice("if you don't like it buy something else") and sold all my emo gear and moved on... Thus my signature not having emo gear in it.. I understand it's a business and you "are doing the best you can" but the condescending attitude ("we don't need your business") towards potential customers is disgusting. It drives new clientele away as well as old.. I'm sure the lounge would have twice as many members as it does if it weren't for the bickering between fanboys and poohboys. Having differing opinions isn't all that bad guys, you just need to relax and maybe try the shoe on the other foot. Anyway, glad I checked in today..LOL.. Regards, Ivor.. Thanks for stopping in Ivor, nice seeing you....and no, the forum hasn't changed! Tim |
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Post by monkumonku on Nov 29, 2016 15:22:14 GMT -5
It's certainly good to see nothing changing on the lounge. I was extremely excited when I saw the specs on this unit, and as I read through the posts my excitement turned to dismay.. Then I got to Dan's post about not having a dog in the fight, being someone who owned an xmc-1 and about 7 emo amps and 2 previous gen processors... When I posted my opinion on it I was told the same thing because by that time I had taken Dan's advice("if you don't like it buy something else") and sold all my emo gear and moved on... Thus my signature not having emo gear in it.. I understand it's a business and you "are doing the best you can" but the condescending attitude ("we don't need your business") towards potential customers is disgusting. It drives new clientele away as well as old.. I'm sure the lounge would have twice as many members as it does if it weren't for the bickering between fanboys and poohboys. Having differing opinions isn't all that bad guys, you just need to relax and maybe try the shoe on the other foot. Anyway, glad I checked in today..LOL.. Regards, Ivor.. Thanks for stopping in Ivor, nice seeing you....and no, the forum hasn't changed! Tim Fattykid Ivor hasn't changed either!  |
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Post by Gary Cook on Nov 29, 2016 15:28:42 GMT -5
It's certainly good to see nothing changing on the lounge. I was extremely excited when I saw the specs on this unit, and as I read through the posts my excitement turned to dismay.. Then I got to Dan's post about not having a dog in the fight, being someone who owned an xmc-1 and about 7 emo amps and 2 previous gen processors... When I posted my opinion on it I was told the same thing because by that time I had taken Dan's advice("if you don't like it buy something else") and sold all my emo gear and moved on... Thus my signature not having emo gear in it.. I understand it's a business and you "are doing the best you can" but the condescending attitude ("we don't need your business") towards potential customers is disgusting. It drives new clientele away as well as old.. I'm sure the lounge would have twice as many members as it does if it weren't for the bickering between fanboys and poohboys. Having differing opinions isn't all that bad guys, you just need to relax and maybe try the shoe on the other foot. Anyway, glad I checked in today..LOL.. Regards, Ivor.. I strongly disagree Ivor, if a forum is full of fanboys and all the talk about is the good things, with only positive spin on everything, then it becomes very boring and no one actually learns anything. The visitors don't get to learn about work arounds because the problem itself is not discussed, can't have any negativity. The hosts don't find out about issues that their bench testing didn't reveal, issues that only manifest themselves when in the field with a large range of gear and options and user preferences. They don't know about the issues so they can't fix them with hardware and/or software upgrades. New product development is a continuous process and some relevance can be given to what the customer wants, what the current range doesn't offer. Of course it's not the only input, but it is a useful part of the process. If the forum is full of only how perfect the current range is then the continuous improvement process is deficient. Striking the balance is the tricky part, go too far towards censorship (which is what is is) and we lose a goodly portion of why we visit. Conversely get too open and it can become a slanging match. That's why moderators have a difficult task, and my personal view is that this forum is better than most. Cheers Gary |
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jenix
Minor Hero
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Post by jenix on Nov 29, 2016 15:29:06 GMT -5
In case anybody missed this.... Hi kids, Lets keep it simple.. XMC-1 even with all of its upgrades is a Gen 2 product. We have no intention of discontinuing it as long as there is demand for it. Not everyone cares about Atmos and DTS-X!! The upcoming XMC-2 G3 will have 7.2.4 capability wth all outputs balanced. There will be other small additions too, but basically it's the same as the XMC-1 with a new main audio board. "Differential Reference" circuitry on the 3 main front channels! Upgraded DACs and DA conversion, etc, etc. The RMC-1 G3 is the flagship AVP. 9.3.4 with all channels fully balanced. This unit has our "Differential Reference" audio path on all 16 channels! It uses the latest AKM 32 bit 768k AD's and DAC's. It's a monster. Everything is no holds barred. This is going to be the one to beat at ANY price. There you go! Peace out, Big Dan Also OK, OK... Let me make this clear... The XMC-1 will upgrade to 7.2.4, but it will re-purpose some of the RCA outputs to achieve this functionality. We've discussed this before. That's why it remains the G2 XMC-1. We'll continue to enhance and support this platform for the long run. Dirac Live will be implemented on all new outputs. But even with the upgrades, it will always be G2. The NEW XMC-2 G3 will have ALL balanced outputs. Full Dirac Live will operate at 96K on this model and it will be standard with purchase. Unlike the XMC-1 which has the L & R channels "fully balanced", the XMC-2 will have L,R,& C "fully balanced" This is what we refer to as "Differential Reference". In Differential Reference mode, there is no single ended to balanced conversion. It's FULLY DIFFERENTIAL from input to output. Including volume controls, DAC's, everything! The RMC-1 G3 wil have Full Dirac Live on all outputs and it will most likely operate at 192k. We're checking MIP's requirements at the moment, but we should be OK. Again, it will be standard with purchase. And all 16 outputs will operate in Differential Reference mode with the finest components available. OK? Cheers, Big Dan From what I gather : XMC-2 gen 3 will have all XLR (no using an RCA for atmos) and the front three channels are balanced. Dan or Keith can you please answer this very simple question. I have one of the original XMC-1s. This summer I purchased a new OLED TV which is HDMI 2.0A capable as well as a UHD bluray player. Is there any current plan for offering an upgraded HDMI board for the XMC-1 which will add 2.0A capability for HDR content? Hopefully for more than one input.
I know the HDMI upgrade board now offered does NOT but it has not been clear if there will be a 2.0A board for the XMC-1 and a timetable for its availability. Thanks so much. |
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Post by Fatty on Nov 29, 2016 16:14:39 GMT -5
It's certainly good to see nothing changing on the lounge. I was extremely excited when I saw the specs on this unit, and as I read through the posts my excitement turned to dismay.. Then I got to Dan's post about not having a dog in the fight, being someone who owned an xmc-1 and about 7 emo amps and 2 previous gen processors... When I posted my opinion on it I was told the same thing because by that time I had taken Dan's advice("if you don't like it buy something else") and sold all my emo gear and moved on... Thus my signature not having emo gear in it.. I understand it's a business and you "are doing the best you can" but the condescending attitude ("we don't need your business") towards potential customers is disgusting. It drives new clientele away as well as old.. I'm sure the lounge would have twice as many members as it does if it weren't for the bickering between fanboys and poohboys. Having differing opinions isn't all that bad guys, you just need to relax and maybe try the shoe on the other foot. Anyway, glad I checked in today..LOL.. Regards, Ivor.. I strongly disagree Ivor, if a forum is full of fanboys and all the talk about is the good things, with only positive spin on everything, then it becomes very boring and no one actually learns anything. The visitors don't get to learn about work arounds because the problem itself is not discussed, can't have any negativity. The hosts don't find out about issues that their bench testing didn't reveal, issues that only manifest themselves when in the field with a large range of gear and options and user preferences. They don't know about the issues so they can't fix them with hardware and/or software upgrades. New product development is a continuous process and some relevance can be given to what the customer wants, what the current range doesn't offer. Of course it's not the only input, but it is a useful part of the process. If the forum is full of only how perfect the current range is then the continuous improvement process is deficient. Striking the balance is the tricky part, go too far towards censorship (which is what is is) and we lose a goodly portion of why we visit. Conversely get too open and it can become a slanging match. That's why moderators have a difficult task, and my personal view is that this forum is better than most. Cheers Gary Very well said, however when I problem is addressed(example, the clicks and pops introduced from dirac) and we're told nothing we can do if you don't like it buy another product... That's where the issues of the back and forth come to light. You have more than a few people who've posted about it.. Then you get the opposite side that says we don't have this issue and it becomes a back and forth for pages. Or another example. The xmc will "never" support atmos. Because we don't think it's important. Same advice given from company. You get a few guys who strongly oppose this, myself included.. We voice our opinions sometimes too loudly or in my case speak before we think and get angry. Well then you've got the other side again that I'm sure if in the podcasts company brass could be skinning kittens and they would defend the actions.. Fast forward a bit... Low and behold now atmos is important? Important enough to even cancel upcoming processor releases at that.. I do believe I'm not the only one who should think before they speak...cough cough Dan... Cough.. Had the problems been addressed instead of played off like they don't matter or dismissed because someone didn't want to share the bucket at the sandbox.. I know of a few people who would still own emo gear and participate regularly in discussions here. Miss ya Tim glad you're still around buddy.. Ricky not so much.. But glad all is well anyway, no malice intended now or in the past. We all let our emotions rule us every now and then. |
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Post by Jim on Nov 29, 2016 16:36:40 GMT -5
Anyone want to talk about a potential XMC-2 without all the trolling?
Maybe talk about any information that Dan might have mentioned in passing... or what the XMC-1 doesn't have - but people want?
Perhaps theorize on what might be different between an XMC-2 and RMC-1.
I'll even take pure speculation. It's more fun than rehashing the past.
Edit: Why does the lounge allow unregistered guests to post? Did that change?
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Post by Gary Cook on Nov 29, 2016 16:37:19 GMT -5
The xmc will "never" support atmos. Because we don't think it's important. This is rather relevant. At the time Dan posted that I agreed completely with him. The so called "minimum" Atmos requirements were completely beyond the capabilities of my room and there was next to zero content available. With the recent failure of 3D it was entirely possible that Atmos would go the same way. I'd call it the right decision at the time. But time has ticked by, DTSX has been released for HT and there is a gradual increase in the content available (although the prices are still ridiculous). The suppliers have seen fit to publish more detailed specifications that better align with what I can achieve. Personally I have also experienced a 5.1.2 set up and found it worth the small investment and well able to physically fit my room. In addition the hardware to carry out updates has become available at more accessible prices. Things change and hence revisiting previous decisions should not be discouraged. What's the alternative, sticking by the original statement and ignoring the facts? It's all very well for us to be smart afterwards and say "shouldn't have said that", when it should be judged against the information available at the time. My view is that it was the right call back then and changing the call was also the correct decision. Cheers Gary |
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Post by Jim on Nov 29, 2016 16:46:37 GMT -5
The NEW XMC-2 G3 will have ALL balanced outputs. Full Dirac Live will operate at 96K on this model and it will be standard with purchase. Unlike the XMC-1 which has the L & R channels "fully balanced", the XMC-2 will have L,R,& C "fully balanced" This is what we refer to as "Differential Reference". In Differential Reference mode, there is no single ended to balanced conversion. It's FULLY DIFFERENTIAL from input to output. Including volume controls, DAC's, everything!
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hemster
Global Moderator 
Particle Manufacturer
...still listening... still watching
Posts: 51,952
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Post by hemster on Nov 29, 2016 16:48:12 GMT -5
The xmc will "never" support atmos. Because we don't think it's important. This is rather relevant. At the time Dan posted that I agreed completely with him. The so called "minimum" Atmos requirements were completely beyond the capabilities of my room and there was next to zero content available. With the recent failure of 3D it was entirely possible that Atmos would go the same way. I'd call it the right decision at the time. But time has ticked by, DTSX has been released for HT and there is a gradual increase in the content available (although the prices are still ridiculous). The suppliers have seen fit to publish more detailed specifications that better align with what I can achieve. Personally I have also experienced a 5.1.2 set up and found it worth the small investment and well able to physically fit my room. In addition the hardware to carry out updates has become available at more accessible prices. Things change and hence revisiting previous decisions should not be discouraged. What's the alternative, sticking by the original statement and ignoring the facts? It's all very well for us to be smart afterwards and say "shouldn't have said that", when it should be judged against the information available at the time. My view is that it was the right call back then and changing the call was also the correct decision. Cheers Gary I agree. Such decisions are made in the light of not only the prevailing industry trends but also market viability of any products planned. And companies do make decisions, then change them when new information surfaces. Kind of similar to airline pilots who plan a route before takeoff, but then make course corrections based on pertinent information that becomes available en route (e.g. bad weather, turbulence, other aircraft in the same air corridor, etc. etc.). After all, we'd be quick to call any vendor who doesn't change with the times a dinosaur. (Anyone remember DEC - Digital Computers, Kodak?) |
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hemster
Global Moderator
Particle Manufacturer
...still listening... still watching
Posts: 51,952
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Post by hemster on Nov 29, 2016 16:51:09 GMT -5
Anyone want to talk about a potential XMC-2 without all the trolling? Maybe talk about any information that Dan might have mentioned in passing... or what the XMC-1 doesn't have - but people want? Perhaps theorize on what might be different between an XMC-2 and RMC-1. I'll even take pure speculation. It's more fun than rehashing the past. Edit: Why does the lounge allow unregistered guests to post? Did that change? AFAIK, it's always been possible for unregistered guests to post. I'll let others speculate on the rest of your points. |
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hemster
Global Moderator
Particle Manufacturer
...still listening... still watching
Posts: 51,952
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Post by hemster on Nov 29, 2016 16:57:12 GMT -5
I like how excited people get about naming schemes and generation labels and "phrasing" (i.e. Semantics) It's almost as if any of that matters. I wish people made constructive criticisms about naming if they're going to say anything at all. Normally it's a "burn it to the ground - it's all horrible" 'mentality. It doesn't actually matter THAT much. I have a Honda Pilot. Is it a plane? Can it fly? Can it fly for me?! Do I need a pilots license to drive it?!? Why is it called that? It doesn't make any sense! Can it function as a harbor pilot? I have to know! Honda - the name is confusing and makes no sense!!! Change it! Hmm. I have a Callaway driver that doesn't drive but is good for bashing a golf ball a long distance. What I'd like is a Callaway that I can drive... fast.    |
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Post by Fatty on Nov 29, 2016 16:59:10 GMT -5
The xmc will "never" support atmos. Because we don't think it's important. This is rather relevant. At the time Dan posted that I agreed completely with him. The so called "minimum" Atmos requirements were completely beyond the capabilities of my room and there was next to zero content available. With the recent failure of 3D it was entirely possible that Atmos would go the same way. I'd call it the right decision at the time. But time has ticked by, DTSX has been released for HT and there is a gradual increase in the content available (although the prices are still ridiculous). The suppliers have seen fit to publish more detailed specifications that better align with what I can achieve. Personally I have also experienced a 5.1.2 set up and found it worth the small investment and well able to physically fit my room. In addition the hardware to carry out updates has become available at more accessible prices. Things change and hence revisiting previous decisions should not be discouraged. What's the alternative, sticking by the original statement and ignoring the facts? It's all very well for us to be smart afterwards and say "shouldn't have said that", when it should be judged against the information available at the time. My view is that it was the right call back then and changing the call was also the correct decision. Cheers Gary I once again concede.. Yes it was. But shouldn't people learn from past mistakes? Instead of continuing with the insanity. Love you too Jim. No trolling or poohboy'ng or spamming or whatever.. Am I not allowed to speak my views? You speak yours.. I was as much an emo fan as you bud.. But my experience was soured.. Keep hoping that it will turn around so I check in for new products time to time, saw this one was on the board for release.. Then also see the same poor attitude to potential customers. |
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Post by Fatty on Nov 29, 2016 17:05:04 GMT -5
Now... Since it's got a bunch of new guts,
Can we expect the clicks and pops to be fixed in the dsp of this new model?
Has there been advancements in the dirac calibration tool to help keep it from crashing on every use?
I expect dirac will be standard on all 11+ channels?
Will it have more than one sub output?
Will it treat them as a single sub during eq as audyssey does? Which is very good btw but Dirac would be nicer..
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Post by Jim on Nov 29, 2016 17:05:16 GMT -5
Fatty - send me a private message and I'll give you a hug. Promise.
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Post by Gary Cook on Nov 29, 2016 17:06:21 GMT -5
But shouldn't people learn from past mistakes? Instead of continuing with the insanity. I'm not sure what you mean, responding to questions from their customers is what Emotiva does, much to their credit despite the risks. What would you have them do when someone asks "will the XMC-1 be upgradable to Atmos"? No Comment? Or should they play even more of the politician and say "maybe yes maybe no" or just fluff around and not answer the question at all? Personally I prefer the honest answer, which BTW I believe it was, an honest answer. Cheers Gary |
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Post by Jim on Nov 29, 2016 17:07:01 GMT -5
Now... Since it's got a bunch of new guts, Can we expect the clicks and pops to be fixed in the dsp of this new model? Has there been advancements in the dirac calibration tool to help keep it from crashing on every use? I expect dirac will be standard on all 11+ channels? Will it have more than one sub output? Will it treat them as a single sub during eq as audyssey does? Which is very good btw but Dirac would be nicer.. LOL. Why are you even asking if you already sold all your Emotiva gear? I mean..... that's hilarious. |
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Post by Fatty on Nov 29, 2016 17:31:39 GMT -5
Now... Since it's got a bunch of new guts, Can we expect the clicks and pops to be fixed in the dsp of this new model? Has there been advancements in the dirac calibration tool to help keep it from crashing on every use? I expect dirac will be standard on all 11+ channels? Will it have more than one sub output? Will it treat them as a single sub during eq as audyssey does? Which is very good btw but Dirac would be nicer.. LOL. Why are you even asking if you already sold all your Emotiva gear? I mean..... that's hilarious. I suppose I can answer Gary here too.. Me potential customer.. Wanting xmc2. Above, rude response. Drives potentials away.. Dan' responses come across the same way, especially if someone isn't already familiar with his shoot from the hip defense of products. If I can consolidate my processor and room correction into one box why wouldn't I be interested? I asked valid questions pertaining to the product at hand and you're being very unruly. That's also hilarious. And sorry. Guests can't send pm's. But I'll give you my warmest wishes anyhow. |
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Post by garbulky on Nov 29, 2016 17:46:10 GMT -5
.....let's talk about the XMC-2? Anybody knows what DACs it's driving? Is it the new AKM DACs?
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Post by hosko on Nov 29, 2016 17:49:08 GMT -5
.....let's talk about the XMC-2? Anybody knows what DACs it's driving? Is it the new AKM DACs? No the only line was they are an improvement on the XMC1 |
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Post by Jim on Nov 29, 2016 17:53:44 GMT -5
Now... Since it's got a bunch of new guts, Can we expect the clicks and pops to be fixed in the dsp of this new model? Has there been advancements in the dirac calibration tool to help keep it from crashing on every use? I expect dirac will be standard on all 11+ channels? Will it have more than one sub output? Will it treat them as a single sub during eq as audyssey does? Which is very good btw but Dirac would be nicer.. I don't think the clicks and pops were a common issue / impacted that many people. I've certainly read very little about it. If it's still an issue that needs to be addressed, I'm curious to see what the "formal" issue is. I don't believe that Dirac crashing was that frequent. And generally it would work on a different laptop - suggesting there was more to the story with regards to the ones where it was failing. The fault doesn't neccessarily lie within Dirac. Dirac writes the software anyway, not Emotiva. I thought Dirac would work on all channels, but maybe that's not been clearly stated yet. "upcoming XMC-2 G3 will have 7.2.4 capability". So 2 sub outs perhaps? Anyone else have thoughts? |
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