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Post by qdtjni on Jan 21, 2017 7:26:30 GMT -5
They have lost almost all sales in Sweden i think for all price increases under the last years. And i have heard that countries that got resellers in store are more expansive then shop directly from Usa with Taxes and Shipping. With a Msrp on 2999 Usd they go up directly against Anthem AVM-60 Processor. But i dont have the need of all that channels that RMC-1 uses so hope the XMC-2 will be a killer processor To be fair, a big chunk of the price increase has to do the with the USD re-gaining against the SEK (and CHF, GBP & EUR) plus the products are better and/or different. Even with FX rate driven price increase, Emotiva still offers a great value and many of the products not only have a great value, they're really top class at any price, well almost any price. Looking at the new Arcam AVRs/AVPsm they are priced more aggressively than Arcam used to be. Although, they miss quite a few features, USB DAC input & Balanced in to mention some. AFAIK, Sweden and most/all European countries are not affected by being forced to by local (like in Oz), so not an issue. If the local shops are more expensive, you have the choice to order direct from Emotiva. Besides, Emotiva can hardly be blamed for ridiculous high VAT in Sweden (and EU in general), can they? The XMC-1 is already a killer processor with a very good stereo DAC, excellent analogue pre-amp, Dirac, etc. It would be great though with an XMC-2 that has all the features of the RMC-1, only with less channels.  |
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emovac
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Post by emovac on Jan 21, 2017 12:53:01 GMT -5
As a bargain brand, Emotiva will have some trouble with continued price increases on models performing similar features/ functions. Competition is out there when the price creeps up. Other major brands don't jump the price for every new year's model variation. They have lost almost all sales in Sweden i think for all price increases under the last years. And i have heard that countries that got resellers in store are more expansive then shop directly from Usa with Taxes and Shipping. With a Msrp on 2999 Usd they go up directly against Anthem AVM-60 Processor. But i dont have the need of all that channels that RMC-1 uses so hope the XMC-2 will be a killer processor The Anthem is a nice machine. I'd kind of like to stick with Dirac, and the Arcam competes there, but the reviews favor the Emotiva over the Arcam AVR from what I'm reading online. Do any of the regulars here have an idea of when the XMC-2 is being released. Seems like it's been pushed back behind the RMC-1 a bit. The reason for the XMC-2 vs XMC-1 is for the better Dirac. |
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Post by Casey Leedom on Jan 21, 2017 13:03:48 GMT -5
I think that the XMC-2 is a long ways beyond the RMC-1. The RMC-1 is in the final stages of production. I think the XMC-2 is mostly a statement of intension at this point. Certainly there haven't been any solid statement of features beyond things like Fully Differential on Left/Center/Right channels, all Balanced Outputs, Full Dirac Live at 96kHz. I think Emotiva has its hands full right now with the set of products it's already said it's coming out with and showed at CES 2017.
Casey
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emovac
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Post by emovac on Jan 21, 2017 13:11:51 GMT -5
I think that the XMC-2 is a long ways beyond the RMC-1. The RMC-1 is in the final stages of production. I think the XMC-2 is mostly a statement of intension at this point. Certainly there haven't been any solid statement of features beyond things like Fully Differential on Left/Center/Right channels, all Balanced Outputs, Full Dirac Live at 96kHz. I think Emotiva has its hands full right now with the set of products it's already said it's coming out with and showed at CES 2017. Casey Thanks Casey. The DIRAC Live 96 is what I'm chasing. Seemed like when it was Gen3 XMC-1 it looked closer, but that was just my impression. The DIRAC 48 is probably fine, but if the XMC-2 were close to release I would certainly wait. |
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Post by Casey Leedom on Jan 21, 2017 13:16:25 GMT -5
Just remember: I don't speak for Emotiva and I'm just guessing. It's guessing based on my own extensive experience in electronics/software manufacturing, but still just guessing.
And who knows, it may be worth waiting to compare the RMC-1 and the XMC-2. It's not like there's a gun pointed at any of our heads ... :-)
Casey
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Erwin.BE
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Post by Erwin.BE on Jan 22, 2017 9:16:09 GMT -5
Since upgrading my XMC-1 to Atmos capability would cost me almost €1,000, I am certainly also considering selling it and get a XMC-2 instead.
Scenario 1 - upgrading XMC-1:
*shipping EU>USA guessing $150
*upgrade $500 (almost €500 currently)
*shipping USA>EU guessing $120
*VAT + duties on upgrade and shipping to EU (30%) $186
total: $956 (say €925)
Scenario 2 - selling XMC-1 and purchase XMC-2
*sell XMC-1 guessing €1,000 at least
*purchase XMC-2 at list-25% $2,250
*shipping $120
*VAT+duties on XMC-2 and shipping: $711
total purchase: $3,081 (+/- €3,000)
total net: €2,000
What exactly are the known benefits of the XMC-2 vs the final XMC-1 anyway? Do we know this?
BTW this has nothing to do with the RMC-1 for me, as the XMC sits in the living room of our current house, which we keep after completing the hometheatre including RMC-1 new build.
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sveb
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Post by sveb on Jan 22, 2017 9:46:15 GMT -5
Since upgrading my XMC-1 to Atmos capability would cost me almost €1,000, I am certainly also considering selling it and get a XMC-2 instead. Scenario 1 - upgrading XMC-1: *shipping EU>USA guessing $150 *upgrade $500 (almost €500 currently) *shipping USA>EU guessing $120 *VAT + duties on upgrade and shipping to EU (30%) $186 total: $956 (say €925) Scenario 2 - selling XMC-1 and purchase XMC-2 *sell XMC-1 guessing €1,000 at least *purchase XMC-2 at list-25% $2,250 *shipping $120 *VAT+duties on XMC-2 and shipping: $711 total purchase: $3,081 (+/- €3,000) total net: €2,000 What exactly are the known benefits of the XMC-2 vs the final XMC-1 anyway? Do we know this? BTW this has nothing to do with the RMC-1 for me, as the XMC sits in the living room of our current house, which we keep after completing the hometheatre including RMC-1 new build. I live in Norway and are thinking like you. Better to sell my Xmc-1 and buy Xmc-2 or even the Emersa. Have a Atmos/Dts-x setup and upgraded to 4K after christmas. |
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Post by dwaleke on Jan 22, 2017 9:55:31 GMT -5
What exactly are the known benefits of the XMC-2 vs the final XMC-1 anyway? Do we know this? Different audio board, different dsp board, different hdmi board, different case (at least rear to support additional XLR connections for 7.2.4). I think the only thing common between the unit is the base operating system. And no doubt that will be updated too. I would sell and buy the xmc-2. Just too many enhancements not to (even for USA customers). |
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Post by adam631 on Jan 22, 2017 13:01:19 GMT -5
And 24/96 Dirac  |
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Erwin.BE
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Post by Erwin.BE on Jan 22, 2017 14:16:24 GMT -5
Oh yeah, I didn't even bother to upgrade to Dirac Live yet. Which is standard on the XMC-2, correct? That's another reason.
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Post by Casey Leedom on Jan 22, 2017 14:49:39 GMT -5
Oh yeah, I didn't even bother to upgrade to Dirac Live yet. Which is standard on the XMC-2, correct? That's another reason. Yes, according to Dan's note from late November: "Full Dirac Live will operate at 96K on this model and it will be standard with purchase." Casey |
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Post by adam631 on Jan 22, 2017 14:54:13 GMT -5
Sure would be nice to know when the xmc-2 gen3 will be available... Maybe Dan can chime in?
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Post by Casey Leedom on Jan 22, 2017 15:05:33 GMT -5
Emotiva (and other manufacturers) have gotten burned by publishing product schedules and then having to revise them when unexpected issues arise[1]. Some customers are understanding, but others get irritated when this happens. And there's always the issues of disturbing sales of current shipping products. As a result, most manufacturers (Emotiva included) won't publish product schedules till very late in the development process.
Casey
[1] Which is the source of the famous and variously quoted: "Take your schedule estimate, round up to the next time unit, double that, and then round up to the next time unit." E.g. "I can do that in one week!" turns into "one month", then "two months", and finally "a year". As an engineer myself, I feel comfortable saying that we generally fall into two broad categories: "sure, we can do that!" and "we're all gonna die!" :-)
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Post by adam631 on Jan 22, 2017 15:18:26 GMT -5
Emotiva (and other manufacturers) have gotten burned by publishing product schedules and then having to revise them when unexpected issues arise[1]. Some customers are understanding, but others get irritated when this happens. And there's always the issues of disturbing sales of current shipping products. As a result, most manufacturers (Emotiva included) won't publish product schedules till very late in the development process. Casey I agree, however i seem to remember a post(can't find it now) saying the Rmc-1 might be available late 2nd quarter 2017, so i assumed they might give a timetable for the Xmc-2  |
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hemster
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Post by hemster on Jan 22, 2017 15:19:15 GMT -5
I can absolutely guarantee it'll be released on a day ending with a "y". You heard it here first folks! |
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Post by adam631 on Jan 22, 2017 15:22:26 GMT -5
I can absolutely guarantee it'll be released on a day ending with a "y". You heard it here first folks! Now if you could just change it to month instead of day, that would be great!!!  |
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hemster
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Post by hemster on Jan 22, 2017 18:38:43 GMT -5
I can absolutely guarantee it'll be released on a day ending with a "y". You heard it here first folks! Now if you could just change it to month instead of day, that would be great!!! My offer is valid in all participating months. |
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Erwin.BE
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Post by Erwin.BE on Jan 22, 2017 18:40:35 GMT -5
Grazie hemster! Alora Sabato non dobbiamo aspettare questa machina!
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hemster
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Post by hemster on Jan 22, 2017 18:48:28 GMT -5
Grazie hemster! Alora Sabato non dobbiamo aspettare questa machina! Mamma Mia!  |
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Post by onetallguy on Jan 29, 2017 13:08:54 GMT -5
Here's probably the most succinct comments we've heard from Dan in the RMC-1 thread on what the XMC-2 is likely to look like: OK, OK... Let me make this clear... The XMC-1 will upgrade to 7.2.4, but it will re-purpose some of the RCA outputs to achieve this functionality. We've discussed this before. That's why it remains the G2 XMC-1. We'll continue to enhance and support this platform for the long run. Dirac Live will be implemented on all new outputs. But even with the upgrades, it will always be G2. The NEW XMC-2 G3 will have ALL balanced outputs. Full Dirac Live will operate at 96K on this model and it will be standard with purchase. Unlike the XMC-1 which has the L & R channels "fully balanced", the XMC-2 will have L,R,& C "fully balanced" This is what we refer to as "Differential Reference". In Differential Reference mode, there is no single ended to balanced conversion. It's FULLY DIFFERENTIAL from input to output. Including volume controls, DAC's, everything! The RMC-1 G3 wil have Full Dirac Live on all outputs and it will most likely operate at 192k. We're checking MIP's requirements at the moment, but we should be OK. Again, it will be standard with purchase. And all 16 outputs will operate in Differential Reference mode with the finest components available. OK? Cheers, Big Dan No mention of which DACs or DSPs will be used in the XMC-2. I'd guess the same as the RMC-1 simply because of reduced engineering development cost (being able to share the development/maintenance costs between the two), but that's purely a guess based on my own engineering experience. But I'll also guess that since there was no mention of the XMC-2 at CES, that it's a "bit" further out than the RMC-1 and it's description above is likely to change somewhat over time. We'll have to see. I'm personally desperately trying to convince myself to wait for the XMC-2 because I really don't need the power offered by the RMC-1, but I'll probably lose that argument with myself ... :-) Casey I have two questions from this discussion. 1) What is the need for and/or result of using 192/24 vs 96/24 in Dirac in RMC-1 vs XMC-2? Does any other manufacturer use 192/24 in HT analysis in any brand of analyzer? 2) What is the "power offered by the RMC-1" that Casey alludes to in the above article? |
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