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Post by Ruiner46 on Mar 23, 2017 14:27:19 GMT -5
I bet Emotiva would love for harlan to just return this and stop complaining. I am tired of him complaining and I bet most people here are tired of him complaining. Do you even own an MC700? |
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Post by Axis on Mar 23, 2017 14:33:08 GMT -5
I bet Emotiva would love for harlan to just return this and stop complaining. I am tired of him complaining and I bet most people here are tired of him complaining. Do you even own an MC700? I owned the Fusion 8100 for 30 days before the HDMI board went out then I gave it to a board member after it was repaired. Thought you had me !  The Fusion 8100 was of the same design. I knew when I bought the Emotiva receiver that had the same chips as the MC-700 that there may be some glitches. I did not have any problems myself but others had bugs and still do with the Fusion 8100. When the HDMI board went out I decided to move on. Did not complain like a snowflake. We are supposed to be tuff in this hobby. There is all kinds of gear and some do things and some don't. You don't see a bunch of grown Men crying over gear like harlan is doing. Grow up ! |
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Post by Ruiner46 on Mar 23, 2017 14:38:57 GMT -5
My point is, you know nothing about the problems that the buyers of the MC700 are experiencing. You are just in this thread trolling like a fanboy when you have no knowledge of the product we are talking about. We finally got an update from Dan today about the manual and the firmware thanks to harlan's persistence. The last update from Dan was at the beginning of February, which is nearly two months without any communication at all.
Now I understand how difficult it is to work out these problems on hardware this complicated. I work on electronics in my career, so believe me, I understand. What I don't like is promising something and then failing to communicate about it when the promise isn't met.
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Post by teaman on Mar 23, 2017 14:42:39 GMT -5
I don't own the MC-700 and probably shouldn't even chime in....although this thread is rather amusing and depressing all at the same time. I am obviously an Emotiva fan as anyone can tell by my signature however there are several warning signs I saw coming before the launch of this latest windfall of products. All you have to do is go on Youtube and search Emotiva CES to see the crazy high product launches coming down the pipeline.
To me the writing was on the wall that there were going to be bumps in the road for the next two years. They are launching three completely new lines of technology in there products, from Atmos to ICE amps. Throw in the fact that they are probably tripling their in house engineering and production areas and I think we can agree this is an almost overwhelming task at hand. Like so many new car launches with epic design changes they usually come along with quite a few bugs and tweaks to be made to get to where they need to be. I can understand why people are upset or feeling let down by goals that have not reached fruition. I think it comes with the territory. New ideas, new engineering and designs are going to take time mastering. I remember when Dirac launched and Tony was in here all day posting help to those getting frustrated by the lack of knowledge anyone had with this. You can't blame a customer for buying something from you that has been hyped by everyone inside and outside the company as SOTA and not feel let down once things encounter rough patches.
From Dirac to Atmos, from ICE amps to new switching power supplies Emotiva has tried a whole hell of a lot of change in direction in a very small time frame. To top it off they are now producing and assembling in house what they once outsourced is going to be a heavy load. Combine that with selling in B&M stores with partners and you add another layer of burden. You cannot please everyone all of the time and I totally get that but to me the writing was on the wall that changes were abound. I went back and forth with several people including Dan that the prices would have to escalate upwards if a middle man was going to be introduced into the sales chain and I was told by several that this would not be the case...well you tell me? Look at the product pricing now and where it was two years ago, things have increased in price for most offerings.
The BasX line seems to offer a helluva lot for the money and will probably keep most people satisfied, especially those coming from the Best Buy line of gear so many of us got accustomed to. We still have an entire line of Emersa products that outside of the CES videos few of us no what to expect. After we read reviews and write ups about the gear coming down the line we get excited. Most of us equate Emotiva to competitive upscale gear at affordable prices and we are willing to wait until the bugs get worked out. I also understand this may be a first venture into this company and for those people they are going to feel disappointed with the thought of an under performing processor or what have you. I don't think it helps anyone's cause by belittling the company, nor the upset customer. To me this transition period is going to have lots of ups and downs and for me personally I am willing to wait on the sidelines and watch the growing pains, because for now I am content with what I have. Not sure if the constant bickering and back and forth in the forum is going to improve brand loyalty or entice new shoppers to stick around.
Tim
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Post by Axis on Mar 23, 2017 14:49:00 GMT -5
My point is, you know nothing about the problems that the buyers of the MC700 are experiencing. You are just in this thread trolling like a fanboy when you have no knowledge of the product we are talking about. We finally got an update from Dan today about the manual and the firmware thanks to harlan's persistence. The last update from Dan was at the beginning of February, which is nearly two months without any communication at all. Now I understand how difficult it is to work out these problems on hardware this complicated. I work on electronics in my career, so believe me, I understand. What I don't like is promising something and then failing to communicate about it when the promise isn't met. Wrong Ruiner46, I know because I read all the problems people have here. I read all about it. I am not trolling and your attempt to say I am bias is just silly to me. You are fighting the wrong fight about poor little harlan. His problems are silly to me because he could have solved this problem by returning the unit. These issues have been around long before this childish attitude of attack to destroy the bad business man mentality came the popular thing to do. |
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Post by brutiarti on Mar 23, 2017 15:08:58 GMT -5
I doubt Emotiva appreciates all of you just telling people to return their product. You're not helping anyone by suggesting that we just give up. Reporting these problems and pushing Emotiva to fix things is the only way that we will get all of this stuff worked out, and turn the MC700 into the great product it should be. I personally have no problem being a "beta tester" as long as the reported bugs get attention. Actually it is the opposite. Having returns because of defective products pushes a company more to find a solution that a few people complaining on a forum. |
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Post by Ruiner46 on Mar 23, 2017 15:11:07 GMT -5
Wrong Ruiner46, I know because I read all the problems people have here. I read all about it. I am not trolling and your attempt to say I am bias is just silly to me. You are fighting the wrong fight about poor little harlan. His problems are silly to me because he could have solved this problem by returning the unit. These issues have been around long before this childish attitude of attack to destroy the bad business man mentality came the popular thing to do. I don't really understand your logic. Not sure how returning the unit would solve the problem of lack of communication, or input names disappearing, or audio dropouts, or any of the other bugs that have been reported. I'm glad there are people who are vocal about the issues so Emotiva works to fix them. If we all just returned our units and gave up, then Emotiva would suffer from the lost sales and nothing would get fixed. Anyway, I think I've made my point and I'm not a fan of arguing on the internet, so this will be my last post on this issue. If you are annoyed by reading people's complaints about problems, then maybe you shouldn't be reading threads where that is the exact purpose of the thread. |
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nrde
Minor Hero
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Post by nrde on Mar 23, 2017 15:15:13 GMT -5
Asking unhappy customers to return faulty product doesn't make the problem go away. I.e., don't shoot the messenger even if the messenger is annoying to you or your community. Of course the problem doesn't go away returning the unit, but if the team at emotiva is working hard to fix the issues you have two options, have patience or return the unit for your good mental health. I wasn't questioning Emotiva's commitment to fix issues, but how communication about those issues has been handled, and the response to an ever more annoyed customer's feedback. Sometimes just a "ping" to customers direction is enough. Sometimes it's vise to be silent like when you don't know if you have serious enough HW (design) flaw or something equally serious to halt the production or sale of a product. But not to return at least 1 call of 3 isn't a situation like that. I'm getting my first Emotiva product and I'm at the same time pleased and frustrated with this community. Clearly Emotiva has many loyal and satisfied customers, knowledgeable and passionate. At the same time I find a lot of fanboyism that doesn't help Emotiva to better itself or its processes. I wasn't here when there were issues with MC-700's siblings, but I know there were problems mainly with software, they had teething problems etc. But instead of relying to the same method of product delivery, Emotiva should have tried to improve the process to be able to ship a better product from the start I think? (and most likely they did if I understood correctly) "The same thing happened with UMC-200" isn't really a convincing reason for a buggy product launch - or it shouldn't be. I hope they have learned at least something and the problems with MC 700 are not just the "company way". Also, as an international customer - if I had a serious problem with the unit - to return the unit and get refund would cost me something closer to 400$ counting postage and customs fees. 150$ to pay for the postage to me, customs fees around 80$ and 150$ postage back + 20$ paypal crappy exchange rate. I would get back 599$ of course, but clearly returning it isn't clever financially. So at least I'm willing to wait any possible fix Emotiva is doing in case the unit had a problem. Also touching the subject of CEO and owner replying in forums. It can be wonderful, it's like one big family, where customers get the feeling (rightfully) that they are part of the company and the company cares about them, their products etc. But when you are the owner you may also get protective and don't necessarily see the forest from the trees, sometimes a frog or two may come out of your mouth even. There's valid reasons why there's people specialized in customer support and community management... Customer isn't always right, but you should have a very good reason to tell them that. |
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Post by Axis on Mar 23, 2017 15:15:20 GMT -5
Wrong Ruiner46, I know because I read all the problems people have here. I read all about it. I am not trolling and your attempt to say I am bias is just silly to me. You are fighting the wrong fight about poor little harlan. His problems are silly to me because he could have solved this problem by returning the unit. These issues have been around long before this childish attitude of attack to destroy the bad business man mentality came the popular thing to do. I don't really understand your logic. Not sure how returning the unit would solve the problem of lack of communication, or input names disappearing, or audio dropouts, or any of the other bugs that have been reported. I'm glad there are people who are vocal about the issues so Emotiva works to fix them. If we all just returned our units and gave up, then Emotiva would suffer from the lost sales and nothing would get fixed. Anyway, I think I've made my point and I'm not a fan of arguing on the internet, so this will be my last post on this issue. If you are annoyed by reading people's complaints about problems, then maybe you shouldn't be reading threads where that is the exact purpose of the thread. I read only the first sentence. To bad. Sorry ! |
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Post by harlan on Mar 23, 2017 15:24:33 GMT -5
Axis,
I was just starting to strike a conciliatory tone. I even thanked you for your background synopsis. I dont remember calling you out, I dont recall trying to belittle you personally yet you feel empowered behind a computor screen to call me names. Feel free to friend me on facebook so you can learn a little more about who I am and my life experience. I'm pretty sure you will find Im not some little cry baby as you described me.
I doubt they just want me to return it. Thats bad business. That would be the easy way out. I have confidence in Emotiva. I am a return customer. I do not intend to return it. I have always maintained it sounds fantastic and once they fix the issues it will be exactly what I was hoping for.
IM me for my full name so we can be off line friends. You may find Im not who you think I am and I may find the same in reverse.
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Post by foggy1956 on Mar 23, 2017 16:55:56 GMT -5
Of course the problem doesn't go away returning the unit, but if the team at emotiva is working hard to fix the issues you have two options, have patience or return the unit for your good mental health. I wasn't questioning Emotiva's commitment to fix issues, but how communication about those issues has been handled, and the response to an ever more annoyed customer's feedback. Sometimes just a "ping" to customers direction is enough. Sometimes it's vise to be silent like when you don't know if you have serious enough HW (design) flaw or something equally serious to halt the production or sale of a product. But not to return at least 1 call of 3 isn't a situation like that. I'm getting my first Emotiva product and I'm at the same time pleased and frustrated with this community. Clearly Emotiva has many loyal and satisfied customers, knowledgeable and passionate. At the same time I find a lot of fanboyism that doesn't help Emotiva to better itself or its processes. I wasn't here when there were issues with MC-700's siblings, but I know there were problems mainly with software, they had teething problems etc. But instead of relying to the same method of product delivery, Emotiva should have tried to improve the process to be able to ship a better product from the start I think? (and most likely they did if I understood correctly) "The same thing happened with UMC-200" isn't really a convincing reason for a buggy product launch - or it shouldn't be. I hope they have learned at least something and the problems with MC 700 are not just the "company way". Also, as an international customer - if I had a serious problem with the unit - to return the unit and get refund would cost me something closer to 400$ counting postage and customs fees. 150$ to pay for the postage to me, customs fees around 80$ and 150$ postage back + 20$ paypal crappy exchange rate. I would get back 599$ of course, but clearly returning it isn't clever financially. So at least I'm willing to wait any possible fix Emotiva is doing in case the unit had a problem. Also touching the subject of CEO and owner replying in forums. It can be wonderful, it's like one big family, where customers get the feeling (rightfully) that they are part of the company and the company cares about them, their products etc. But when you are the owner you may also get protective and don't necessarily see the forest from the trees, sometimes a frog or two may come out of your mouth even. There's valid reasons why there's people specialized in customer support and community management... Customer isn't always right, but you should have a very good reason to tell them that. Very well stated |
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Post by foggy1956 on Mar 23, 2017 17:04:41 GMT -5
Do you even own an MC700? I owned the Fusion 8100 for 30 days before the HDMI board went out then I gave it to a board member after it was repaired. Thought you had me ! The Fusion 8100 was of the same design. I knew when I bought the Emotiva receiver that had the same chips as the MC-700 that there may be some glitches. I did not have any problems myself but others had bugs and still do with the Fusion 8100. When the HDMI board went out I decided to move on. Did not complain like a snowflake. We are supposed to be tuff in this hobby. There is all kinds of gear and some do things and some don't. You don't see a bunch of grown Men crying over gear like harlan is doing. Grow up ! I appreciate your viewpoint on many issues axis, but in this instance I believe you are incorrect. My .02 only |
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Post by foggy1956 on Mar 23, 2017 17:08:40 GMT -5
I agree that Emotiva could do a better job of communicating when problems arise with a new product. With that being said, I also believe that with patience you will be very happy with your new product. Glitches got through the vetting process, be patient, the product will be all it is advertised to be. Hello, they are communicating. They are saying stay tuned to future updates. They are saying they are working on it but it is not going to happen on a certain date. They do not know when the updates will be ready because they do not have it figured out yet. They are working on it and want it to be ready as soon as it can be but if they say tomorrow and it is not ready tomorrow then you will cuss them out for it. There are people at work at Emotiva working on these problems. They have a job and everybody is counting on them to figure it all out and make it work right. I do not think they are out back smoking pot and not doing there job. Let's cut them some slack and give it some time and they will do there best to work the problems out. Most here are rooting for Emotiva to get it right. For the most part they are. I say Emotiva is doing good, but I would like to see Emotiva move on from this platform. Just catching up here Axis, definitely agree this platform seems awfully glitchy. Love my xmc-1, the umc-200 sounded awesome but it was flakey |
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Post by frraksurred on Mar 23, 2017 17:23:53 GMT -5
Can we get an Admin in this thread to scrub it of everything that doesn't pertain DIRECTLY to troubleshooting the problems with the MC-700?
This is ridiculous.
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Post by hilodb1 on Mar 24, 2017 0:59:55 GMT -5
Since we are talking about thermal issues with the unit a couple of pics of my MC 700 after about 30 minutes of use.    Its funny that my A 500 doesn't have any hot spots on it as high as the MC 700 albeit I am not pushing it hard. |
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Post by gzubeck on Mar 24, 2017 1:41:56 GMT -5
Axis, Thanks for the background info. I can respect that. No where in the marketing literature, the teasers in industry publications did it say people buying were beta testors. We are all here now and I am waiting just like everyone else. I just feel strongly that the communications could be better. Its a unique experience for some of us to buy a product that doesnt work as advertised then be told by folks on a forum to shut up and wait. I guess I'm naive to the Emotiva way. My LPA has been nothing but awesome the entire 10 years I have owned it. Im looking forward to my MC700 giving me equally stellar performance and value. In this case early adopters..if the product is so buggy for your day to day use maybe returning it is an option...all I can say is that Ive had buggy products from major manufacturers like Marantz...my sony xbr55850c took about a year to get the bugs out of its software...just the other day my HP laptop was overheating due to some software glitch for a couple of weeks and now after a software update its working within proper thermals...technology is a *bleep*! |
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Post by GTPlus on Mar 24, 2017 7:34:35 GMT -5
Since we are talking about thermal issues with the unit a couple of pics of my MC 700 after about 30 minutes of use. Its funny that my A 500 doesn't have any hot spots on it as high as the MC 700 albeit I am not pushing it hard. If I am looking at this correctly that "warm" spot in the second pic is the HDMI board. |
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mhoran
Seeker Of Truth
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Post by mhoran on Mar 24, 2017 9:53:14 GMT -5
I received my MC-700 last week and got around to setting it up on Tuesday. I seem have the latest firmware (2.8.7), which I can confirm does resolve at least the rename bug. However, I'm encountering a few issues and am wondering if others have had similar problems.
1) There is a terrible popping/screeching noise when the input encoding changes (PCM-> Dolby Digital, etc.) This seems to happen with any connected device -- Roku, PC, Xbox, etc.
2) When playing content with my Roku, sometimes the audio does not play. The OSD may show that there is no audio, but other times it correctly displays Dolby Digital but is silent. Switching to another input and back resolves the issue.
3) The Roku input sometimes just goes black. I'm fairly certain that the device is not going to sleep, as I can hear the navigation sounds when using the remote. I typically have to changes inputs or cycle the entire system to get video back.
4) My PC (2011 vintage) is quite glitchy when connected to inputs 4-6. It works fine when connected to inputs 1-3. I saw a similar post about this further back in the forum, so I believe this may be a wide spread issue. I've resolved the issue for now by using the 3rd HDMI input, but of course that means there's no OSD when using my PC. Also, given the PC doesn't support HDMI 2 this all seems a bit counterintuitive.
I contacted support about these issues and their only response was that there was a known thermal issue and that I could either send back my device or request a heatsink be sent to me. However, many of these issues seem software based, not thermal based, especially as they happen at any time, not just after prolonged use.
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Post by BroncoAZ on Mar 24, 2017 10:18:50 GMT -5
If heat is now the big issue should Emotiva revisit not having any vent holes in the top of the case? Adding a stick on heat sink to the processor will dissipate heat from that specific component, but the heat is still trapped in the unit.
The heat issue does explain why adding 5 fans to my rack on a thermal controller fixed my audio drop out issue. The temp measured on top of my MC700 never exceeded 80 degrees F before the fans. I was seeing temps of 110-112 degrees F at the top of the rack without fans (above the XPA-2 and XPA-5) now it never gets over 90 degrees F. From the bottom to the top I have 2 fans on the bottom pulling air in through a furnace filter, 2U blank, 1U power distribution, 2U blank, 2U ventilated shelf with PS3 and Apple TV4, 2U blank, 2U ventilated shelf with Oppo 203, 2U blank, 2U ventilated shelf with MC700 (rack ears didn't have standard spacing, they required mounting between slots leaving uneven gaps I couldn't get blank covers for), 2U blank, XPA-5 on rack ears with single fan on top center, 2U blank, XPA-2 on rack ears with two fans on top center (fans are blowing out of the ventilated top on the rack).
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cawgijoe
Emo VIPs 
"When you come to a fork in the road, take it." - Yogi Berra
Posts: 5,033
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Post by cawgijoe on Mar 24, 2017 10:28:02 GMT -5
I received my MC-700 last week and got around to setting it up on Tuesday. I seem have the latest firmware (2.8.7), which I can confirm does resolve at least the rename bug. However, I'm encountering a few issues and am wondering if others have had similar problems. 1) There is a terrible popping/screeching noise when the input encoding changes (PCM-> Dolby Digital, etc.) This seems to happen with any connected device -- Roku, PC, Xbox, etc. 2) When playing content with my Roku, sometimes the audio does not play. The OSD may show that there is no audio, but other times it correctly displays Dolby Digital but is silent. Switching to another input and back resolves the issue. 3) The Roku input sometimes just goes black. I'm fairly certain that the device is not going to sleep, as I can hear the navigation sounds when using the remote. I typically have to changes inputs or cycle the entire system to get video back. 4) My PC (2011 vintage) is quite glitchy when connected to inputs 4-6. It works fine when connected to inputs 1-3. I saw a similar post about this further back in the forum, so I believe this may be a wide spread issue. I've resolved the issue for now by using the 3rd HDMI input, but of course that means there's no OSD when using my PC. Also, given the PC doesn't support HDMI 2 this all seems a bit counterintuitive. I contacted support about these issues and their only response was that there was a known thermal issue and that I could either send back my device or request a heatsink be sent to me. However, many of these issues seem software based, not thermal based, especially as they happen at any time, not just after prolonged use. I'm sure there are software issues that are being worked, but there is a thermal issue and you should request the heatsink and install yourself if you are comfortable doing it. |
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