KlineMJ's Sonore microRendu/Roon Review
Jul 18, 2018 15:47:31 GMT -5
DYohn, sahmen, and 2 more like this
Post by klinemj on Jul 18, 2018 15:47:31 GMT -5
UPDATES IN RED BOLD!
After all the discussion on Roon and audiophile music players, I made the statement that if someone had a microRendu I could borrow - I'd be happy to try it. Next thing I knew, sahmen PM'd me offering to lend me one for a month. I decided - what the heck...might as well! And, along with that, since it is a Roon Ready endpoint - I figured I would also try Roon while I was at it.
So, today I got a UPS delivery with a MicroRendu and an Ultracap LPS-1 power supply. I hooked it up to make sure all powered up fine, and it did. So, I went to Roon and started a 14 day Roon trial period.
My first impression was that, despite knowing the dimensions of the MicroRendu (MR for short), it's still a shock to see how tiny it is relative to the LPS-1 power supply. It's tiny! If I didn't know better, I'd guess it was the power supply - it's maybe 20% of the power supply's size. Net, truly "micro".
Both the MR and Roon were easy to set up. Total time from unpacking the shipment to having it all running was maybe 30 minutes and during that time I walked around the house a bit to talk to my daughter. Roon was able to be easily directed to my folder with my music and get its little library all set up. And, it was easy to add Tidal. I put the Roon Core on the PC next to my critical listening stereo so I could switch between the MR and my PC easily.
Then I started listening. For the setup, I had the MR going USB out to my Geek Pulse xinfinity DAC, XLR out to my XMC-1 in reference stereo (but wired so I can have sub signal, per another thread), then to my PrimaLuna tube amp and Maggies and Rythmik F25 sub.
I started with Steely Dan's "Black Cow" from Aja, then went to Grateful Dead's "Ripple" from American Beauty (last remaster), Miles Davis' "So What" from Kinda Blue, and Oscar Peterson's "You Look Good to Me" from We Get Requests. I listen to these tracks a lot so I know them well.
My initial reaction to the sound was very positive. I thought I was hearing more clarity across the full spectrum of music. Bass work seemed tighter and even deeper. Cymbals seemed clearer with more details revealed. Vocals on "Ripple" were much more detailed...subtle variations in Jerry's voice were more evident, and the part where multiple voices sing in harmony was much more clear. Overall, everything sounded more real, less "recorded". Oscar's piano work made me recall my Dad playing his concert grand at home for so many years.
I was pretty sure I was hearing the differences noted, but to make sure - I reverted back to my usual system by moving the USB cable from the MR to the PC. I started off by listening to the exact same tunes (all on my NAS) via Roon. At first, I thought I heard the same improvements from the MR/Roon combo. So, I spent time playing short segments of each tune with Roon and then with jRiver - each on the PC. I ultimately concluded that the sound was identical between Roon and jRiver...so, the only difference was the interface I was using.
And, I felt like the sound wasn't as good as what I heard through the MR.
So...satisfied that the difference was not Roon, I put the USB cable back into the MR. Once again, I was hearing the same positive impressions I'd heard on the first listen.
Net, I think the MR is making a positive difference in sound...perhaps as big as when I moved from the DC-1 to the Geek (which was big and surprising to me).
Before I'm fully done concluding that, I will give it another week or so then switch back to "the old way" to see if I regret the move back to the old way.
As far as Roon...well, I'm a bit mixed on it. Positives are:
- The setup was easy and it found the MR and my PC's output with no effort on my part.
- It quickly scanned the folder I told it to and added all the metadata it could find (less than 15 minutes).
- The interface is intuitive and easy to use.
- There is a certain "cool factor" to being able to see all the extra info it brings in - right down to the lyrics and other information about the album.
- Being able to play Tidal and off my NAS from 1 software is nice.
The negatives of Roon are:
- Once I find an artist I want to listen to, if there are a lot of albums - they overfill the screen view and you have to select "view all". And, once you do that, you have to scroll to the right (not down) - which is not intuitive. And, when scrolling, I would scroll right and it would often "jump back left" on me. Not cool. UPDATE: I did find the little "dots" I can click...they are not obvious. But, each "dot" advances a page to the right or left. Not ideal but better than it jumping back to the left.
- It seems set up for touch-sensitive use vs. for using a Mouse because there's no scroll bar on the right that I could find. If I clicked the mouse on the screen and "swiped" it would scroll, but...not visible scroll bar.
- when viewing via my projector from my PC, if I tried to minimize the Roon window - it kept telling me the resolution was too low to show the smaller screen and that I needed to go back to full screen view. This may have something to do with the scroll bar issue I noted - maybe it's there but in full screen mode was off the right side of my screen. (I was running my PC with VGA out to the projector instead of HDMI for reasons I won't go into...). UPDATE: I increased the screen resolution on my PC that I am using as the core and controlling from, and I can now minimize the window without any issues. That said, there's still no scroll bar to the right - so it's a swiping motion. Once I start controlling with my Surface, that should help.
- When I switched from the PC back to the MR, I powered down the PC and MR. When I powered back up on the MR, Roon couldn't find my library. It appears that Roon just took a while to find the NAS - despite the NAS being hardwired to a PC that's hardwired to the same network as the hardwired PC my Roon core is on. Update: this appears mostly due to the time it took my PC to boot and find everything on the network. So, not a Roon issue.
-And finally, there are albums I KNOW are on Tidal that Roon is not finding. Not cool at all! UPDATE: I dig and I dig and no matter how I try, I can't find certain albums I KNOW Tidal has. I do to my PC, load Tidal, Search for Oscar Peterson, and immediately find what I want..."We Get Requests". When I try Roon, it's not there...whether I look in "Oscar Peterson", "Oscar Peterson Trio", "Oscar Peterson Quartet", or any other variant. It's just not there, even when I expand to "Show All" Can another Roon user see if you can find that Album via Roon? Update to the update! If I have an LP on my NAS, the Roon version of Tidal does not show it as a "Tidal Album". It automatically eliminates duplicates between my NAS library and the Tidal Library. And, once you select the album, there's a "versions" button you can hit and all versions you have access to are shown. And, if there's a different version (remaster, etc.), Roon does show that in the Tidal Albums section.
Net, I'm feeling like the MR may be "worth it", but Roon - I think is "OK" UPDATE: With the updates above, Roon is looking better. I am even liking the "versions" tab more than I thought. Instead of having to compare the version on my NAS to those in Tidal, I can see all in 1 view.
More later once I listen more to the MR then switch back to the PC.
UPDATE: I've come to the conclusion that I need something like the microRendu, and based on reviews and comments from dyohn and others (as well as a difference in form factor) - I decided to buy an UltraRendu. Also, based on the fact that Roon works perfectly with devices like the MR and ultraRendu yet Tidal via jRiver does NOT...I bought a lifetime Roon membership. If Tidal via jRiver worked to devices like the MR/ultraRendu, I'd not worry about Roon. But, it doesn't...so Roon it is.
Mark (and Thanks to Sahmen for the loan...!)
After all the discussion on Roon and audiophile music players, I made the statement that if someone had a microRendu I could borrow - I'd be happy to try it. Next thing I knew, sahmen PM'd me offering to lend me one for a month. I decided - what the heck...might as well! And, along with that, since it is a Roon Ready endpoint - I figured I would also try Roon while I was at it.
So, today I got a UPS delivery with a MicroRendu and an Ultracap LPS-1 power supply. I hooked it up to make sure all powered up fine, and it did. So, I went to Roon and started a 14 day Roon trial period.
My first impression was that, despite knowing the dimensions of the MicroRendu (MR for short), it's still a shock to see how tiny it is relative to the LPS-1 power supply. It's tiny! If I didn't know better, I'd guess it was the power supply - it's maybe 20% of the power supply's size. Net, truly "micro".
Both the MR and Roon were easy to set up. Total time from unpacking the shipment to having it all running was maybe 30 minutes and during that time I walked around the house a bit to talk to my daughter. Roon was able to be easily directed to my folder with my music and get its little library all set up. And, it was easy to add Tidal. I put the Roon Core on the PC next to my critical listening stereo so I could switch between the MR and my PC easily.
Then I started listening. For the setup, I had the MR going USB out to my Geek Pulse xinfinity DAC, XLR out to my XMC-1 in reference stereo (but wired so I can have sub signal, per another thread), then to my PrimaLuna tube amp and Maggies and Rythmik F25 sub.
I started with Steely Dan's "Black Cow" from Aja, then went to Grateful Dead's "Ripple" from American Beauty (last remaster), Miles Davis' "So What" from Kinda Blue, and Oscar Peterson's "You Look Good to Me" from We Get Requests. I listen to these tracks a lot so I know them well.
My initial reaction to the sound was very positive. I thought I was hearing more clarity across the full spectrum of music. Bass work seemed tighter and even deeper. Cymbals seemed clearer with more details revealed. Vocals on "Ripple" were much more detailed...subtle variations in Jerry's voice were more evident, and the part where multiple voices sing in harmony was much more clear. Overall, everything sounded more real, less "recorded". Oscar's piano work made me recall my Dad playing his concert grand at home for so many years.
I was pretty sure I was hearing the differences noted, but to make sure - I reverted back to my usual system by moving the USB cable from the MR to the PC. I started off by listening to the exact same tunes (all on my NAS) via Roon. At first, I thought I heard the same improvements from the MR/Roon combo. So, I spent time playing short segments of each tune with Roon and then with jRiver - each on the PC. I ultimately concluded that the sound was identical between Roon and jRiver...so, the only difference was the interface I was using.
And, I felt like the sound wasn't as good as what I heard through the MR.
So...satisfied that the difference was not Roon, I put the USB cable back into the MR. Once again, I was hearing the same positive impressions I'd heard on the first listen.
Net, I think the MR is making a positive difference in sound...perhaps as big as when I moved from the DC-1 to the Geek (which was big and surprising to me).
Before I'm fully done concluding that, I will give it another week or so then switch back to "the old way" to see if I regret the move back to the old way.
As far as Roon...well, I'm a bit mixed on it. Positives are:
- The setup was easy and it found the MR and my PC's output with no effort on my part.
- It quickly scanned the folder I told it to and added all the metadata it could find (less than 15 minutes).
- The interface is intuitive and easy to use.
- There is a certain "cool factor" to being able to see all the extra info it brings in - right down to the lyrics and other information about the album.
- Being able to play Tidal and off my NAS from 1 software is nice.
The negatives of Roon are:
- Once I find an artist I want to listen to, if there are a lot of albums - they overfill the screen view and you have to select "view all". And, once you do that, you have to scroll to the right (not down) - which is not intuitive. And, when scrolling, I would scroll right and it would often "jump back left" on me. Not cool. UPDATE: I did find the little "dots" I can click...they are not obvious. But, each "dot" advances a page to the right or left. Not ideal but better than it jumping back to the left.
- It seems set up for touch-sensitive use vs. for using a Mouse because there's no scroll bar on the right that I could find. If I clicked the mouse on the screen and "swiped" it would scroll, but...not visible scroll bar.
- when viewing via my projector from my PC, if I tried to minimize the Roon window - it kept telling me the resolution was too low to show the smaller screen and that I needed to go back to full screen view. This may have something to do with the scroll bar issue I noted - maybe it's there but in full screen mode was off the right side of my screen. (I was running my PC with VGA out to the projector instead of HDMI for reasons I won't go into...). UPDATE: I increased the screen resolution on my PC that I am using as the core and controlling from, and I can now minimize the window without any issues. That said, there's still no scroll bar to the right - so it's a swiping motion. Once I start controlling with my Surface, that should help.
- When I switched from the PC back to the MR, I powered down the PC and MR. When I powered back up on the MR, Roon couldn't find my library. It appears that Roon just took a while to find the NAS - despite the NAS being hardwired to a PC that's hardwired to the same network as the hardwired PC my Roon core is on. Update: this appears mostly due to the time it took my PC to boot and find everything on the network. So, not a Roon issue.
-
Net, I'm feeling like the MR may be "worth it", but Roon - I think is "OK" UPDATE: With the updates above, Roon is looking better. I am even liking the "versions" tab more than I thought. Instead of having to compare the version on my NAS to those in Tidal, I can see all in 1 view.
More later once I listen more to the MR then switch back to the PC.
UPDATE: I've come to the conclusion that I need something like the microRendu, and based on reviews and comments from dyohn and others (as well as a difference in form factor) - I decided to buy an UltraRendu. Also, based on the fact that Roon works perfectly with devices like the MR and ultraRendu yet Tidal via jRiver does NOT...I bought a lifetime Roon membership. If Tidal via jRiver worked to devices like the MR/ultraRendu, I'd not worry about Roon. But, it doesn't...so Roon it is.
Mark (and Thanks to Sahmen for the loan...!)
