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Post by bluemeanies on Aug 26, 2018 9:38:33 GMT -5
Hey guys I thought this was an interesting read. Warning it is long but informative especially if you are considering purchasing HI-END speaker cables. The lore is out there for esoteric cables and some pontificate reasons of ownership. I myself like looking at a nice well made attractive cable in my system but not at an expense of thousands of dollars but of course the word "relative" is in our vocabulary and therefore money is no object to some people and there is NOTHING wrong with that if you are so fortunate. Dilly -Dilly. Myself I like to do things in moderation and I now think more than ever of the value in return for my $$ then any time before in my life. A smarter consumer attitude in my opinion. Looking forward to hearing return thoughts on this article. www.soundandvision.com/content/speaker-cables-can-you-hear-difference |
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Post by 405x5 on Aug 26, 2018 9:52:42 GMT -5
Only two things matter.
The wire gauge for the proper resistance given length/load.
Care when routing/ hiding the wire, as not to short it with nails or tacks.
Bill
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DYohn
Emo VIPs 
Posts: 18,487
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Post by DYohn on Aug 26, 2018 10:00:19 GMT -5
Like many things in audio, a genuine effect - needing large enough gauge speaker wire to carry the amplifier power and to avoid adding significant resistance to the circuit - gets blown out of proportion and turned into a marketing opportunity for those trying to create and sell expensive products. The only scientifically valid reason to use anything other than standard copper zip cord is aesthetics and a user's choice.
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Post by 1960broookwood on Aug 26, 2018 10:22:43 GMT -5
Back when Classic Stereo in West Michigan was one of the largest high end retailers in the Midwest they hosted a speaker wire comparison event on a regular basis. Mark Levinson electronics through a switcher feeding multiple pairs of identical speakers with the wires being the variable.
With options from crazy expensive esoteric stuff to zip cord you could draw your own conclusions--IMHO there are definite differences. With that said they literally sold tons of a product "super sound by Saxton" 10 gauge fine strand 100% copper wire for about a buck a foot which I still use 30 some years later.
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Post by 405x5 on Aug 26, 2018 10:39:41 GMT -5
Like many things in audio, a genuine effect - needing large enough gauge speaker wire to carry the amplifier power and to avoid adding significant resistance to the circuit - gets blown out of proportion and turned into a marketing opportunity for those trying to create and sell expensive products. The only scientifically valid reason to use anything other than standard copper zip cord is aesthetics and a user's choice. what he said...……... |
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Post by 405x5 on Aug 26, 2018 10:53:56 GMT -5
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Post by Bonzo on Aug 26, 2018 11:00:53 GMT -5
😴
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Post by 405x5 on Aug 26, 2018 11:04:06 GMT -5
I keep telling myself...…….NO, then I answer anyway (just a glutten for punishment I guess! Bill |
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Post by Jean Genie on Aug 26, 2018 11:23:05 GMT -5
While researching speaker wire, I came across, and am confused by, this from a company called Knukonceptz:
"... tin contributes to a better sound quality by minimizing the skin-effect (lowering the current jumps between the wire surfaces). "
Can anyone explain "skin-effect" and/or "current jumps" to me, an admitted non-audiophile, please? 🙉😕
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Post by 405x5 on Aug 26, 2018 11:28:56 GMT -5
While researching speaker wire, I came across, and am confused by, this from a company called Knukonceptz: "... tin contributes to a better sound quality by minimizing the skin-effect (lowering the current jumps between the wire surfaces). " Can anyone explain "skin-effect" and/or "current jumps" to me, an admitted non-audiophile, please? 🙉😕 The company name here is actually, misspelled.....it's supposed to be: Knucklehead. Bill |
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DYohn
Emo VIPs
Posts: 18,487
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Post by DYohn on Aug 26, 2018 12:29:26 GMT -5
Again, finding a genuine effect in electricity and mis-applying it to audio. Skin effect occurs at high RF frequencies, orders of magnitude times higher than any audio frequency. At audio frequencies it is moot.
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Post by socketman on Aug 26, 2018 12:31:08 GMT -5
I just put my equipment up higher than my speakers so the electrons run right into them.
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hemster
Global Moderator 
Particle Manufacturer
...still listening... still watching
Posts: 51,951
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Post by hemster on Aug 26, 2018 16:54:29 GMT -5
Like many things in audio, a genuine effect - needing large enough gauge speaker wire to carry the amplifier power and to avoid adding significant resistance to the circuit - gets blown out of proportion and turned into a marketing opportunity for those trying to create and sell expensive products. The only scientifically valid reason to use anything other than standard copper zip cord is aesthetics and a user's choice. ^This. |
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Post by petew on Aug 26, 2018 17:28:33 GMT -5
I just put my equipment up higher than my speakers so the electrons run right into them. Oh No, that's all wrong. The electrons have to get back to the amp, so the speaker wires need to be dead nuts on level. Marketing opportunity for adjustable cable lifters with built in laser levels. |
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Post by Boomzilla on Aug 26, 2018 19:49:25 GMT -5
Let's cut to the chase: STATISTICS LIE - and nowhere more than in difference testing.
If you start with a large sample population listening to speaker wires and the majority can hear no difference between Wire A and Wire B, then what you've proven is that the majority of listeners can hear no difference. What you have NOT proven is that there IS no difference.
If, in our sample population of, let's say, 1,000 listeners, there is but one listener who can distinguish with 100% accuracy that A and B sound differently, then THEN A AND B ARE ABSOLUTELY DIFFERENT. The fact that the majority can't hear it is completely academic.
Now were I a manufacturer, would I spend any significant money to make a product incorporating a virtue (let's give the A-B difference the benefit of that particular doubt for purposes of this rant) that 999 out of a thousand couldn't even hear? No sir, I wouldn't. Not a cost-effective choice, and manufacturers live by profit.
Now what I've said above is not valid, statistically, but it is absolutely true on the face of it, and anyone who denies that is deluding themselves. But additionally, let's not all delude ourselves into thinking that we're that one in a thousand either.
Boom
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Post by 26gary26 on Aug 26, 2018 20:04:48 GMT -5
Damn-it I guess wearing Tin Foil on top of your head won't help either.
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Post by Bonzo on Aug 26, 2018 20:08:08 GMT -5
😴
Really?
How many times can we discuss the same F*****G topic?
Analog DIFFERENTCES yes. Better or worse? Only you can decide. Test it yourself.
Digital, not possible. Pure garbage.
Done talking.
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Post by pedrocols on Aug 26, 2018 20:33:58 GMT -5
Let's cut to the chase: STATISTICS LIE - and nowhere more than in difference testing. If you start with a large sample population listening to speaker wires and the majority can hear no difference between Wire A and Wire B, then what you've proven is that the majority of listeners can hear no difference. What you have NOT proven is that there IS no difference. If, in our sample population of, let's say, 1,000 listeners, there is but one listener who can distinguish with 100% accuracy that A and B sound differently, then THEN A AND B ARE ABSOLUTELY DIFFERENT. The fact that the majority can't hear it is completely academic. Now were I a manufacturer, would I spend any significant money to make a product incorporating a virtue (let's give the A-B difference the benefit of that particular doubt for purposes of this rant) that 999 out of a thousand couldn't even hear? No sir, I wouldn't. Not a cost-effective choice, and manufacturers live by profit. Now what I've said above is not valid, statistically, but it is absolutely true on the face of it, and anyone who denies that is deluding themselves. But additionally, let's not all delude ourselves into thinking that we're that one in a thousand either. Boom Gotta be honest with you I only read the first and last word. Specifically the one that reads Boom? For some reason I have been doing that a lot lately...  |
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Post by Ex_Vintage on Aug 26, 2018 21:24:28 GMT -5
When it comes to speaker cable preference, the label of "psychoacoustic effect" best describes the owners response.
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Post by bluemeanies on Aug 26, 2018 22:05:52 GMT -5
😴 Really? How many times can we discuss the same F*****G topic? Analog DIFFERENTCES yes. Better or worse? Only you can decide. Test it yourself. Digital, not possible. Pure garbage. Done talking. WTF..MORE interesting than discussing the 100th rendition of STAIRWAY TO HEAVEN! BTW....DIFFERENCES...is the correct spelling. You definitely from you latest postings have some kind of anger issue. CHILL! |
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