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Post by steelman1991 on May 13, 2020 17:45:07 GMT -5
Can anyone confirm whether "cross upmixing" has been included in this release. Never used either DTS or Dolby upmixers, but since I had my system calibrated the upmixers are sounding amazing. Was always a "native" guy, this has changed my mind.
Watching The Fast & Furious (a DTS-HD MA track) and chose DSU from the menu. Don't know if it's actually using DSU (and I don't know of a way to test) or if it's defaulting to Neural:X, but whatever it's doing is downright amazing.
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Lonnie
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Post by Lonnie on May 13, 2020 18:53:39 GMT -5
So here is a question.... Lonnie Hair Nick KeithL How is Dirac on the RMC-1 going to handle multiple sub outputs? (3 in my case) With manual PEQ, I can change the distance on the three outputs independently so they all become time aligned before I apply PEQ. Will Dirac Live 2.0 see thee subs channels? or see it only as 1? a. If it sees it as three outputs - Will it time align all three together before EQ and then EQ them as a combined single output? Or Will it measure each independently and EQ each separately? b. If it sees it as a single output - Can we time align the subs with distance first before we run Dirac? Or will it ignore the distance settings altogether, and try to EQ the subs with no time alignment to each other? (Incorrect calibration as a result) Dirac simply looks at each sub individually. That is it knows its a sub, sets the time alignment and EQ for each one as it goes. Lonnie
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Post by megash0n on May 13, 2020 19:10:44 GMT -5
I had to go back and forth. For a minute, I thought it was the same, but there were more moments than not that I noticed surround having more presence, "horsepower", etc. I do think the gap is closing. This was the 4k version of The Dark Knight Rises.
Just watched the opening sequence and nope there is no difference in volume levels between the 2 modes - clearly there will be differences, one is upmixing after all, but in terms of loudness levels, there is none of the quietness that plagued the processor previously. I always listened to "native" tracks - might need to re-visit this ideology.
Shame monsieural isn't around - he'd have loved this update
I'll test some more soon. I had about a 2 db difference on dialogue. It was definitely closer because it used to be a difference of roughly 6 db.
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Post by SOWK on May 13, 2020 19:29:52 GMT -5
So here is a question.... Lonnie Hair Nick KeithL How is Dirac on the RMC-1 going to handle multiple sub outputs? (3 in my case) With manual PEQ, I can change the distance on the three outputs independently so they all become time aligned before I apply PEQ. Will Dirac Live 2.0 see thee subs channels? or see it only as 1? a. If it sees it as three outputs - Will it time align all three together before EQ and then EQ them as a combined single output? Or Will it measure each independently and EQ each separately? b. If it sees it as a single output - Can we time align the subs with distance first before we run Dirac? Or will it ignore the distance settings altogether, and try to EQ the subs with no time alignment to each other? (Incorrect calibration as a result) Dirac simply looks at each sub individually. That is it knows its a sub, sets the time alignment and EQ for each one as it goes. Lonnie Do you know if the Dirac Live Bass Management Add-On will work with your implementation of Dirac Live 2.0 on the RMC1 series of processors?
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Post by KeithL on May 13, 2020 20:21:35 GMT -5
THE LATEST STATUS ON DIRAC LIVE BASS MANAGEMENT - in case anyone missed it...
Dirac simply looks at each sub individually. That is it knows its a sub, sets the time alignment and EQ for each one as it goes. Lonnie Do you know if the Dirac Live Bass Management Add-On will work with your implementation of Dirac Live 2.0 on the RMC1 series of processors?
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Post by SOWK on May 13, 2020 20:27:26 GMT -5
THE LATEST STATUS ON DIRAC LIVE BASS MANAGEMENT - in case anyone missed it...
Do you know if the Dirac Live Bass Management Add-On will work with your implementation of Dirac Live 2.0 on the RMC1 series of processors? Awesome guys!!! Things are looking up for sure!
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Post by SOWK on May 13, 2020 20:44:22 GMT -5
Did we get confirmation of the final resolution of the Dirac? Or can we if it was not revealed? 48khz/96khz/192Khz?
Thanks in advance
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Post by SteveH on May 13, 2020 20:45:41 GMT -5
I have an RMC-1 and have a question. Does the RMC-1 volume go to +11 to emulate the movie 'This Is Spinal Tap'? Just a thought.
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Post by KeithL on May 13, 2020 21:02:16 GMT -5
The Dirac Live processing will be performed at 48k - at least initially. (This may be upgraded in the future.)
Did we get confirmation of the final resolution of the Dirac? Or can we if it was not revealed? 48khz/96khz/192Khz? Thanks in advance
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Post by LCSeminole on May 13, 2020 21:05:44 GMT -5
Just watched the opening sequence and nope there is no difference in volume levels between the 2 modes - clearly there will be differences, one is upmixing after all, but in terms of loudness levels, there is none of the quietness that plagued the processor previously. I always listened to "native" tracks - might need to re-visit this ideology. Shame monsieural isn't around - he'd have loved this update
I'll test some more soon. I had about a 2 db difference on dialogue. It was definitely closer because it used to be a difference of roughly 6 db. I've been comparing the levels by ear. Method is using an Oppo UDP-203 and switching back and forth between "LPCM" and "Bitstream" while using several DTS-HD MA 2.0/5.1/6.1/7.1 movies. LPCM engages DSU, while the bitstream is obviously engaging DTS Neural:X. While DSU and Neural:X have there own DSP nuances, the levels appear to be at very similar if not the same decibels. I'll do a bit more testing on this with an SPL tomorrow night when I have much more time to play.
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Post by skiman1 on May 13, 2020 21:38:01 GMT -5
So here is a question.... Lonnie Hair Nick KeithL How is Dirac on the RMC-1 going to handle multiple sub outputs? (3 in my case) With manual PEQ, I can change the distance on the three outputs independently so they all become time aligned before I apply PEQ. Will Dirac Live 2.0 see thee subs channels? or see it only as 1? a. If it sees it as three outputs - Will it time align all three together before EQ and then EQ them as a combined single output? Or Will it measure each independently and EQ each separately? b. If it sees it as a single output - Can we time align the subs with distance first before we run Dirac? Or will it ignore the distance settings altogether, and try to EQ the subs with no time alignment to each other? (Incorrect calibration as a result) Dirac simply looks at each sub individually. That is it knows its a sub, sets the time alignment and EQ for each one as it goes. Lonnie So 'as it goes' means that Dirac 2.0 during the initial test calibration sends a signal to each sub (up to 3 in the existing RMC-1) one at a time, and therefore no room acoustics' summation or cancellation effects can be addressed once multiple subs are active at the same time. Correct?
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Post by Lonnie on May 13, 2020 21:42:49 GMT -5
I have an RMC-1 and have a question. Does the RMC-1 volume go to +11 to emulate the movie 'This Is Spinal Tap'? Just a thought. Yep, thats where it came from. Your the first person to get it. Lonnie
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Post by Lonnie on May 13, 2020 21:44:31 GMT -5
Dirac simply looks at each sub individually. That is it knows its a sub, sets the time alignment and EQ for each one as it goes. Lonnie So 'as it goes' means that Dirac 2.0 during the initial test calibration sends a signal to each sub (up to 3 in the existing RMC-1) one at a time, and therefore no room acoustics' summation or cancellation effects can be addressed once multiple subs are active at the same time. Correct? That would be correct. Lonnie
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Post by Lonnie on May 13, 2020 21:46:33 GMT -5
I'll test some more soon. I had about a 2 db difference on dialogue. It was definitely closer because it used to be a difference of roughly 6 db. I've been comparing the levels by ear. Method is using an Oppo UDP-203 and switching back and forth between "LPCM" and "Bitstream" while using several DTS-HD MA 2.0/5.1/6.1/7.1 movies. LPCM engages DSU, while the bitstream is obviously engaging DTS Neural:X. While DSU and Neural:X have there own DSP nuances, the levels appear to be at very similar if not the same decibels. I'll do a bit more testing on this with an SPL tomorrow night when I have much more time to play. They should be relatively the same but it all depends on content, speaker configs, etc. But in general, the relative level should be close. Lonnie
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Post by skiman1 on May 13, 2020 22:11:28 GMT -5
That would be correct. Lonnie Thanks you for your straightforward answer Lonnie. I'm hoping that either the 'extra cost' Dirac multiple subwoofer bass management system (software?) and/or Emotiva's upcoming extra channel module can address this more thoroughly, especially for those who have more than 3 subs.
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Post by SOWK on May 14, 2020 0:31:21 GMT -5
I have an RMC-1 and have a question. Does the RMC-1 volume go to +11 to emulate the movie 'This Is Spinal Tap'? Just a thought. Yep, thats where it came from. Your the first person to get it. Lonnie Really? I thought that was common knowledge tbh. LOL
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Post by bblv on May 14, 2020 0:53:53 GMT -5
Loaded up v1.10 and the extra speed in the menus is really appreciated. That alone makes me feel much better about my decision of hanging onto the RMC-1. No issues in my several hours of demoing music and video so far.
Going to get into the PEQ's and new measurements with REW tomorrow.
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Post by steelman1991 on May 14, 2020 2:08:23 GMT -5
I've been comparing the levels by ear. Method is using an Oppo UDP-203 and switching back and forth between "LPCM" and "Bitstream" while using several DTS-HD MA 2.0/5.1/6.1/7.1 movies. LPCM engages DSU, while the bitstream is obviously engaging DTS Neural:X. While DSU and Neural:X have there own DSP nuances, the levels appear to be at very similar if not the same decibels. I'll do a bit more testing on this with an SPL tomorrow night when I have much more time to play. They should be relatively the same but it all depends on content, speaker configs, etc. But in general, the relative level should be close. Lonnie
Lonnie - can you confirm whether "cross upmixing" has been introduced in this firmware upgrade. Hadn't tried them prior to this, so no way of knowing if it is working as expected or not.
Tried a FF title (DTS-HD MA track) and switched on the fly to DSU. The OSD showed DSU and continued to play, creating a great sounding upmix, but not sure whether it was defaulting to Neural:X, but showing DSU on the OSD. Confused? ![???](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/huh.png) ? you will be lol.
Thanks - this is great upgrade - kudos to all.
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Post by steelman1991 on May 14, 2020 2:21:32 GMT -5
Loaded up v1.10 and the extra speed in the menus is really appreciated. That alone makes me feel much better about my decision of hanging onto the RMC-1. No issues in my several hours of demoing music and video so far. Going to get into the PEQ's and new measurements with REW tomorrow. Interested to hear your results. Are you anticipating any major changes, from what, I presume you've already achieved with REW, other than the obvious correction to bass EQ in the RMC-1. Though I'd imagine you've already done that through the miniDSP.
Just had a friend calibrate my set-up (REW and miniDSP) and it sings. Hard to imagine an improvement - though like most in this hobby, I will continue to chase every little improvement I can get
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Post by ttocs on May 14, 2020 4:30:33 GMT -5
I have an RMC-1 and have a question. Does the RMC-1 volume go to +11 to emulate the movie 'This Is Spinal Tap'? Just a thought. Yep, thats where it came from. Your the first person to get it. Lonnie Does he win another toaster?
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