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Post by jra on Oct 3, 2021 19:16:02 GMT -5
I recently got hold of a second-hand pair of Emotiva PA-1 monoblocks - the first (to my knowledge) digital amp Emotiva has created. Wow ! Talk about spectacular. I used them to replace the L/R channels of a pair of Onix Reference 2 floorstanders I was previously driving from an Emotiva BasX A-5. The A-5 sounded fine, but I wondered what monoblocks would do to the sound. They are a *BIG* improvement ! Now I know what the reviewer meant when he quoted Dan as saying: "the very first affordable class-D amplifier that’s good enough for audiophile use". hometheaterhifi.com/reviews/amplifier/power-amplifier/emotiva-pa-1-balanced-class-d-power-amplifier-review/ Improved soundstage is the start. Amazing dynamic range. I found another second hand pair for sale and bought them too ! I want more :-). Of course, these things are discontinued and selling second hand for *more* than the original price Emotiva offered them for :-(. As I said in the title, I'm always late to the party. Why bring this up now ? Emotiva - please. Pretty please - make more monoblock class D amps. that sound like the PA-1's. I'm asking nicely. Don't make me get on my knees and beg. You don't want to see a grown man cry :-) :-). |
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Post by AudioHTIT on Oct 3, 2021 19:26:11 GMT -5
Yes, the PA-1 is an excellent little amp, I have several. One correction, Class D doesn't mean 'digital', but many make that mistake. Personally I'd like to see a Class D version of the multichannel XPA series (and hints say something like that might be coming), though that could also include a mono block!
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Post by Boomzilla on Oct 3, 2021 20:02:19 GMT -5
Hi jra - First, I'm glad you liked my review of the PA-1 amplifiers. Second, I'm glad that you agreed with my review. Yes, unfortunately, the PA-1 amps are discontinued (but maybe Emotiva will make some Class D replacements). I've also heard some other Class D modules that I thought competed with the PA-1 amps. The ones I most recently liked used modules made by a company called "Hypex." The PA-1 modules were made by Bang & Olufsen. Happy shopping! Boomzilla (aka Glenn Young) |
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Post by jra on Oct 3, 2021 21:16:43 GMT -5
Hi jra - First, I'm glad you liked my review of the PA-1 amplifiers. Second, I'm glad that you agreed with my review. Yes, unfortunately, the PA-1 amps are discontinued (but maybe Emotiva will make some Class D replacements). I've also heard some other Class D modules that I thought competed with the PA-1 amps. The ones I most recently liked used modules made by a company called "Hypex." The PA-1 modules were made by Bang & Olufsen. Happy shopping! Boomzilla (aka Glenn Young) Oh wow. I didn't know you were the reviewer. I often follow your posts to lean something ! Emotiva were selling the PA-1's for $299. Cheapest I've been able to find them second hand is $320 each. The Hypex modules seem to be $900 and up :-). If I had a time machine to go back and buy a bunch of them new... Just goes to show the value Our.Friends.In.Franklin bring to the table :-). |
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Post by thezone on Oct 3, 2021 22:43:17 GMT -5
The PA-1's are such awesome amps, such incredible control over my Dynaudios. Completely transformed my HT and 2ch system. I bought two and loved them so much I bought three more. Then I went to buy 2 more for atmos and they were all gone  But these came to my rescue. XTZ Edge A2-300. Very similar to the PA-1's same B&O ICE power modules. Actually better value than the PA-1's because they are packaged as a stereo amp rather than monoblock but only downside is they don't have fully balanced inputs. I don't think you would be disappointed if you like the PA-1's. The case has a really quality feel to it, it's heavier and feels more expensive than the PA-1's which are much lighter and look a bit more budget when sitting next to the Edge. That is all aesthetics though. |
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Post by AudioHTIT on Oct 3, 2021 23:18:54 GMT -5
… Actually better value than the PA-1's because they are packaged as a stereo amp rather than monoblock but only downside is they don't have balanced outputs. I think you mean balanced inputs, on a power amp there’s not really such a thing as a balanced output. But the PA-1s don’t just have a balanced input, they are fully balanced, or differential, so really quite a difference from a single ended amp. This takes nothing away from the XTZ, they just chose to turn the two modules into a stereo amp, rather than a fully balanced one. |
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Post by thezone on Oct 4, 2021 3:46:31 GMT -5
… Actually better value than the PA-1's because they are packaged as a stereo amp rather than monoblock but only downside is they don't have balanced outputs. I think you mean balanced inputs, on a power amp there’s not really such a thing as a balanced output. But the PA-1s don’t just have a balanced input, they are fully balanced, or differential, so really quite a difference from a single ended amp. This takes nothing away from the XTZ, they just chose to turn the two modules into a stereo amp, rather than a fully balanced one. Ah yes of course my bad, I have corrected my hastily written post above! Thanks. |
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Post by garbulky on Oct 4, 2021 8:12:22 GMT -5
jra @theozone I think the PA-1 amps are outright fantastic. They pair beautifully with a Emotiva DC-1. I love that they are fully balanced amps. Where can you get a fully balanced monoblock that sounds this good for $300 right?
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Post by audiobill on Oct 4, 2021 9:12:45 GMT -5
Salvation Army?
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Post by Boomzilla on Oct 4, 2021 9:18:59 GMT -5
LOL - In your DREAMS! There are ARMIES of professional "pickers" who make their living by identifying high-value items donated to thrift stores and reselling them for profit. No, I'm not one of those, but I'm very aware of their presence. In fact one thrift store clerk told me she had a LIST of people to call if any audio gear got donated. The list people would come immediately to look at / buy any audio donations. The same thing happens with furniture. You'd think the thrift stores would employ some good assessors to identify high value items and maximize their profit, but apparently not... |
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Post by jra on Oct 4, 2021 10:57:54 GMT -5
jra @theozone I think the PA-1 amps are outright fantastic. They pair beautifully with a Emotiva DC-1. I love that they are fully balanced amps. Where can you get a fully balanced monoblock that sounds this good for $300 right? Nowhere anymore :-). Even the second hand sellers are asking for more than $300 :-). |
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Post by BigE on Oct 4, 2021 13:46:30 GMT -5
jra @theozone I think the PA-1 amps are outright fantastic. They pair beautifully with a Emotiva DC-1. I love that they are fully balanced amps. Where can you get a fully balanced monoblock that sounds this good for $300 right? Nowhere anymore :-). Even the second hand sellers are asking for more than $300 :-). Same issue here. Build your own. Lots of YouTube videos. Took longer for board than case from China when I pulled the trigger. Needed amp to power tactile transducer for seat. Amp was an easy weekend build with minimal soldering. Wish auto on/off with input signal worked. Does have balanced input capability. www.parts-express.com/ICEpower-200ASC-Class-D-Audio-Amplifier-with-Power-Supply-Module-1-x-200W-326-208 |
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Post by leonski on Oct 4, 2021 15:08:26 GMT -5
Another 'route' for the DIY inclined? Check out HYPEX NCore. Designed by the same guy.....Bruno Putzeys.....who did some of his first work For B&O. His latest is the Purifi which I link HERE. purifi-audio.com/eigentakt/eval1/You buy the amp, PS, and Case. Aseembly is minimal and directions are said to be clear. Support exists in the appropriate forum. What you get is apparentlly the 'reference board' in the form of the Evaluation Kit. If EMO was thinking this way, it'd start with such a kit than ON to buying a carload. EMO would employ a couple tech-types to assemble / test and in that way Add Value. I'd say a competent tech could assemble 9 amps in an 8 hour day.....with an hour for lunch! This kind of assembly would need some planning...with plenty of 'parts' organized and maybe a parts picker person to go with each assembly ticket. Speed and efficiency are essential. I could personally LOAF thru such an assembly but Not be able to even afford my own labor.... |
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Post by jbrunwa on Oct 4, 2021 15:45:13 GMT -5
Another 'route' for the DIY inclined? Check out HYPEX NCore. I am very happy with my Buckeye 6-channel Hypex NC-502MP amps. They are well assembled and were cheaper than I could have DIY. XLR inputs with optional trigger input and Speakon output connectors. I have only had them for a few weeks so too early to tell long term reliability but by all accounts the NCore modules are very reliable.  |
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Post by thezone on Oct 4, 2021 18:56:54 GMT -5
Those Buckeye amps look interesting, they're not fully balanced though are they, just groups of stereo modules? Hence why they don't come in odd numbers of channels.
So what's better, using the latest Hypex stereo modules or the older Ice modules in a fully balanced mono configuration to match the front LR and Centre fully balanced channels in the XMC-2?
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Post by pedrocols on Oct 4, 2021 19:37:31 GMT -5
Those Buckeye amps look interesting, they're not fully balanced though are they, just groups of stereo modules? Hence why they don't come in odd numbers of channels. So what's better, using the latest Hypex stereo modules or the older Ice modules in a fully balanced mono configuration to match the front LR and Centre fully balanced channels in the XMC-2? I don't see what would be the advantage of fully balanced. |
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Post by thezone on Oct 4, 2021 20:27:19 GMT -5
Those Buckeye amps look interesting, they're not fully balanced though are they, just groups of stereo modules? Hence why they don't come in odd numbers of channels. So what's better, using the latest Hypex stereo modules or the older Ice modules in a fully balanced mono configuration to match the front LR and Centre fully balanced channels in the XMC-2? I don't see what would be the advantage of fully balanced. Serious? Why did I bother buying any of this Emo gear then? Hype? May as well just sell it all and get the new Sony HT-A9 and be done with it. |
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Post by jbrunwa on Oct 4, 2021 21:14:32 GMT -5
Those Buckeye amps look interesting, they're not fully balanced though are they, just groups of stereo modules? Hence why they don't come in odd numbers of channels. So what's better, using the latest Hypex stereo modules or the older Ice modules in a fully balanced mono configuration to match the front LR and Centre fully balanced channels in the XMC-2? There are different models available. The 500 is a single channel amp, the 502 is a stereo amp 350W x 2 @ 8 ohms, 500W x 2 @ 4 ohms, 450W x 2 @ 2 ohms. Maybe there is an advantage in having a dedicated power supply for a channel vs shared, but it wouldn’t be audible in my HT. So there are 3 power supplies in each of my 6-channel amps. www.hypex.nl/documenten/download/912 |
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Post by Boomzilla on Oct 5, 2021 2:36:06 GMT -5
I don't see what would be the advantage of fully balanced. Lower noise Higher external noise rejection Lower distortion Hum rejection Can still be used in unbalanced mode if desired You pays your money, you takes your choice. |
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Post by thezone on Oct 5, 2021 4:49:20 GMT -5
I don't see what would be the advantage of fully balanced. Lower noise Higher external noise rejection Lower distortion Hum rejection Can still be used in unbalanced mode if desired You pays your money, you takes your choice. Lower distortion should apply to fully balanced v unbalanced all other things being equal but then if you look at ASR graph the Unbalanced Buckeye Hypex amp shows less distortion than the PA-1? Hence my initial question. |
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